Concerned, rather worried about this plant

Wanted you all to see this. This am I just started taking photos. I didnt spin the plant at all since yesterday in the AM when I went to work. The other side of the plant that was facing away from me looks to have improved.

So its right down the middle of the plant.

I checked a chart and It looks like it could have Zinc Nitrogen or Phosphorus deficiencies when I look up the leaves on charts. But on the other side its far less issues.

I throw my hands up. I have no idea.

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it's just slowly eating itself. it might make it but it's super early and has a long ways to go. hope it works out for you.

edit : once they start down that path it's super hard to stop them
 
Aweedtec said:
I will transplant it if it doesn't straighten up. I have the technology
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that will make zero difference now that it's in flower. you could give it a shot. what's happened is the plant has stopped pulling nutrients up through the roots, and has switched to grabbing them from the leaves.

once that starts it usually doesn't stop as the plant would have to send new roots for feeding. when in flower they stop sending new roots to concentrate on building bud. when leaves lose the chlorophyll ( green color ) they stop processing light to convert the nutrients so the plant can use them, so kind it's of a double whammy.

what you can do is make sure your nutes are balanced and available to the plant. that will allow the leaves still working for the plant to continue on for it to make it to finish. let it eat the yellow ones, it won't hurt anything, so long as you get it to stop progressing.
 
bluter said:
that will make zero difference now that it's in flower. you could give it a shot. what's happened is the plant has stopped pulling nutrients up through the roots, and has switched to grabbing them from the leaves.

once that starts it usually doesn't stop as the plant would have to send new roots for feeding. when in flower they stop sending new roots to concentrate on building bud. when leaves lose the chlorophyll ( green color ) they stop processing light to convert the nutrients so the plant can use them, so kind it's of a double whammy.

what you can do is make sure your nutes are balanced and available to the plant. that will allow the leaves still working for the plant to continue on for it to make it to finish. let it eat the yellow ones, it won't hurt anything, so long as you get it to stop progressing.
Click to expand...
I have an idea. I can take another 5 gallon felt pot and fill it with soil and then just cut the bottom of the five gallon bucket off. Then set it in another 5 gallon felt pot 3/4 full with worm castings and other nutrients ready to go. Then water.

OR, I can make a disk in my shop out of quarter inch plywood. Cut a slot in it so it can go around the trunk and so it can hold the entire plant. Wait until its dry and ready to water again and bang it loose around the bucket and then slide the entire plant out upside down and then put it in a 10 gallon pot. Its light as hell when its dry. I mean really lightweight. Shockingly so.

I believe i could do either of these options without disturbing the plant or stressing it much at all.
 
bluter said:
once that starts it usually doesn't stop as the plant would have to send new roots for feeding. when in flower they stop sending new roots to concentrate on building bud. when leaves lose the chlorophyll ( green color ) they stop processing light to convert the nutrients so the plant can use them, so kind it's of a double whammy.

what you can do is make sure your nutes are balanced and available to the plant. that will allow the leaves still working for the plant to continue on for it to make it to finish. let it eat the yellow ones, it won't hurt anything, so long as you get it to stop progressing.
Click to expand...
I see what you're saying here. Basically even if I transplant it you are saying it wont do any good because the roots wont grow anymore anyway?

Getting it balanced is gonna be difficult but I did purchase Humboldts PH up and down as well as some worm castings tea and Cal Mag with Iron.

Can you tell me what else I may need to get? I dont want this plant to suffer anymore than it has and I will do what it takes.
 
Aweedtec said:
I have an idea. I can take another 5 gallon felt pot and fill it with soil and then just cut the bottom of the five gallon bucket off. Then set it in another 5 gallon felt pot 3/4 full with worm castings and other nutrients ready to go. Then water.

OR, I can make a disk in my shop out of quarter inch plywood. Cut a slot in it so it can go around the trunk and so it can hold the entire plant. Wait until its dry and ready to water again and bang it loose around the bucket and then slide the entire plant out upside down and then put it in a 10 gallon pot. Its light as hell when its dry. I mean really lightweight. Shockingly so.

I believe i could do either of these options without disturbing the plant or stressing it much at all.
Click to expand...
I don't think that is necessary as these plants can grow in solo cups, but good thinking 👍
 
Roy Growin said:
Remind me - are you using any kind of PK boost?
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When you say PK boost, do you mean like Dr Earth Bloom Booster? If so yes. But I flushed it yesterday. Probably not like I should have. But I did put 5 gallons through the plant. Then I gave it 1 heaping tablespoon of bloom booster and then 90 more ounces of water through it. Today half the plant is decent or rather doing ok... and the other half is having the yellowing leaves under the flower sites.

But oddly all the lower branches look excellent. Its the canopy that is having issues.

One thing I keep trying to stress but probably not enough is that its backwards from every plant ive ever seen online.

Usually the lighter leaves are new growth and the darker leaves are everywhere else.
But on this plant I noticed the darker leaves under the flowers after feeding it 6 days ago and lighter leaves everywhere else. Now they are yellowing at an alarming rate. I think it has multiple issues.
 
Aweedtec said:
When you say PK boost, do you mean like Dr Earth Bloom Booster? If so yes. But I flushed it yesterday. Probably not like I should have. But I did put 5 gallons through the plant. Then I gave it 1 heaping tablespoon of bloom booster and then 90 more ounces of water through it. Today half the plant is decent or rather doing ok... and the other half is having the yellowing leaves under the flower sites.

But oddly all the lower branches look excellent. Its the canopy that is having issues.

One thing I keep trying to stress but probably not enough is that its backwards from every plant ive ever seen online.

Usually the lighter leaves are new growth and the darker leaves are everywhere else.
But on this plant I noticed the darker leaves under the flowers after feeding it 6 days ago and lighter leaves everywhere else. Now they are yellowing at an alarming rate. I think it has multiple issues.
Click to expand...
My understanding of nutes is that non-mobile elements [Fe, Zn, B, Mb, Cu etc] show deficiencies on the new growth at the tips whereas mobile nutes [N, P K etc] show at the bottom of the plant and work upwards
K in particular often shows as a def in the lower and middle leaves which is what I think you are seeing
A good dose of CaMg & PK plus maybe some kelp/micros would be my go to
 
stop flushing the poor plant. all you are doing is washing the nutes it's looking for away. you don't have nute burn or a lockout. it's underfed.
 
Roy Growin said:
My understanding of nutes is that non-mobile elements [Fe, Zn, B, Mb, Cu etc] show deficiencies on the new growth at the tips whereas mobile nutes [N, P K etc] show at the bottom of the plant and work upwards
K in particular often shows as a def in the lower and middle leaves which is what I think you are seeing
A good dose of CaMg & PK plus maybe some kelp/micros would be my go to
Click to expand...
The very strange thing is all of the branches at the bottom of the plant are very green all over. They actually look great. But they're producing obviously very small flowers. But they did stretch all the way to the outside edge of the plant and grew up so that they're getting light. I later on I'll take full pictures of this plant from all angles so that everyone can see exactly what this plant looks like everywhere.


But basically my issue with it is that the plant is backwards from every other issue that I've heard of.

Right under the flower the leaves are dark green and nice. But then every leaf under those is yellowing until you get down to the lower branches. Then it all dark green again.


So what you're saying could be true because technically that is the center of the plant. The tops of the plant look fine The bottom of the plant looks fine. It is under the flower(but not directly so) and down to the lower branches where everything is yellowing. Now granted there is one or two leaves yellowing on the lower branches but I expected that that is normal.


I'm trying to be as detailed as I can because I don't know anything about this and this is my first grow and this is the best plant I've ever seen in my life and then it starts having issues while my other plants are fine



One question I have is.... If it is the issue that the roots aren't able to support the size of this plant and the fact that it has 33 large colas on it.... Could defoliating it completely with the exception of the cola leaves and the fan leaves Right under them be a good thing when it seems like it would be a really bad thing?
 
Aweedtec said:
One question I have is.... If it is the issue that the roots aren't able to support the size of this plant and the fact that it has 33 large colas on it.... Could defoliating it completely with the exception of the cola leaves and the fan leaves Right under them be a good thing when it seems like it would be a really bad thing?
Click to expand...
At this point I am thinking it could be a very bad thing. If the plant has already started to grab available nutrients from existing leaves instead of from the root system and photosynthesis you are taking its main reserve. Let the plant take everything possible from those leaves and it will drop them when done. Eventually it will be so short of nutrients that will not even be able to form an abscission layer so you can cut off the leaves that have gone from yellow to brown.

As long as there is some green, even yellow-green, then there is still something there for the plant to use. They cannot be replaced.

Aweedtec said:
Wait until its dry and ready to water again and bang it loose around the bucket and then slide the entire plant out upside down and then put it in a 10 gallon pot. Its light as hell when its dry. I mean really lightweight. Shockingly so.
Click to expand...
Your watering plans sound like you are following the watering methods for potted plants as found in the popular thread about Watering a Potted Plant. If so, the methods in that tread are for plants that are in the vegetative stage. Once flowering starts the methods change and the plant's soil should not be allowed to dry out.

Every now and then let the soil just start to get dry at the most. Otherwise, while the plant is flowering keeping the soil moist is best.

Aweedtec said:
I dont want this plant to suffer anymore than it has and I will do what it takes.
Click to expand...
The plant is not suffering. A plant meets humanities definition of being alive but it has no central nervous system and no brain stem.


It is a plant, a living organism, and humans have never found perfection in anything living. Not a perfect human being or a perfect plant or a perfect anything else alive. We look and strive but never get there. Most likely if we ever do create the perfect human they will announce to the world that they are bored ;)and the search for perfection was a waste.
 
bluter said:
stop flushing the poor plant. all you are doing is washing the nutes it's looking for away. you don't have nute burn or a lockout. it's underfed.
Click to expand...
How do the edges of these leaves look? I know the color is a bit messed up. It seems my stupid 1200 dollar phone changes the tone of the color as soon as you snap the photo. But when looking through the lens it looks normal.
I ask because you said I dont have Nute burn. I truly dont know what this is.

But then the reason I flushed it was because If I had lock out of minerals building up from not having proper run off or some other type I thought maybe it would help it.

I know I need to give it more fertilizer now. And I will do it. Over some time to make sure the plant isnt burning up as I go.

The reason I am so concerned is because it appears to be showing multiple issues in multiple locations. Which to me is weird. But I do realize, how can it be nute burn if I missed a fertilizer dose and then just went about its regular schedule. Then again, this is me. and everything is always multi issued to complicate matters with every issue I run into.

I will know more after 8am when the light comes on.

20231031_120607.jpg
 
the whole thing looks underfed. you should be feeding at flower levels.

have a read through this if you haven't yet. it will help get your watering technique correct.

The Proper Way To Water A Potted Plant

The Proper Way to Water a Potted Plant Also covered: the importance of pH and why we successively up-pot How to Water Over the last several years I have put a lot of study into this, and I feel that I can now define the proper way to water a potted plant. Keep in mind that this discussion...
www.420magazine.com
 
Aweedtec said:
lol. I didnt think it actually suffered. I simply meant I want to correct it.
Click to expand...
Some people go overboard with they personification of their plants and end up expecting the plant to react the same as their children.

Its a huge plant and to not see it to the end..... there has to be a way.
Click to expand...
Keep watering so the soil stays moist and maintain the feeding schedule.
 
bluter said:
the whole thing looks underfed. you should be feeding at flower levels.

have a read through this if you haven't yet. it will help get your watering technique correct.

The Proper Way To Water A Potted Plant

The Proper Way to Water a Potted Plant Also covered: the importance of pH and why we successively up-pot How to Water Over the last several years I have put a lot of study into this, and I feel that I can now define the proper way to water a potted plant. Keep in mind that this discussion...
www.420magazine.com
Click to expand...
So you are saying even with the browned leaves (which are few) it can still be just underfed?

I mean, it is an insanely large diameter plant. As stated many places... the closet is 4 foot wide and the plant touches wall to wall on one side. it misses the wall by one inch

But if its just underfed because its so much larger than the other plants then that is an easy fix. I will just give it worm castings tea and more Bloom Booster. That brown edge was on there right before flushing but 5 days after feeding. But all these leaves were yellowing fairly evenly and I could only find one or two leaves that resembled leaves from deficiencies from multiple different types of deficiencies. BUT, only one or two leaves were like that. The rest were yellowing at the same rate right under the nice green leaves right under the flower. Which turned dark green right after I gave it 4 table spoons of Dr Earth Bloom Booster.

I can give it more Bloom Booster. The other plants are doing exceptional. But they are much different plants. Taller but no where near as wide and no where near as many colas. But are on the same dose.

If that is all it is then this is an easy fix.

BUT, This watering issue. I have been told time and time again while in bloom (because I almost always post photos so everyone knew it was in bloom) by people on the forum that I should be letting the soil dry out completely before watering again. And my roommate thinks I am overwatering by allowing ten percent run off. He seems to not understand that watering every few days no matter how much you pour through it may flush out nutrients... but it wont be overwatering as long as you remove the run off and dont let it sit. So I water with 2 and a half gallons and maybe 40 ounces to 60 ounces comes out of the bottom. The rest stays in the bucket and is dry in 3 days. I usually water after one full day and on the next day its clearly dry on top and my meter reads moist about 8 inches into the bucket.
 
SmokingWings said:
Some people go overboard with they personification of their plants and end up expecting the plant to react the same as their children.


Keep watering so the soil stays moist and maintain the feeding schedule.
Click to expand...
How they are doing today. The side that looked better looks even far better today. And the yellowing side looks a little better with the exception that some leaves have completely yellowed out.

This is why I believe some root issue happened. One side of the plant is bushy and full and green. The other side looks stunted and yellowed and light green.

So I have been more and more thinking about cutting the bottom out of the plant and just letting it sit inside a 5 gallon felt pot about 3/4 full of new pro mix just so whatever sits at the bottom of the roots no longer can.

This will guarantee the bottom of the roots dry out at least once and then I can keep the soil moist without concern for the roots sitting at the bottom with nutrients and minerals flushed past them if they are built up.

Think maybe the cal mag is doing it some good. Remember, I haven't removed hardly any leaves from this plant. I stopped removing leaves about a week ago. Unless they are hanging and shriveled up.

I position the plant how I want it to be positioned before I leave for work and every day my roommate, no matter how much I tell him if he moves the plant to make sure he puts it back the way it was oriented, never does it.

So I am trying to orient it under the light and fan so it doesn't always get hit on the same side with the fan. And every day he has the yellow side facing the fan. Even after I ask him to make sure its turned away from the fan. I just want to see if it does better than way. Maybe I just need to lock my door.

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20231103_080740.jpg
 
So everyone knows... This plant is dying. I believe my roommate has been fertilizing it behind my back and spinning it to the yellow side facing the door every day no matter how many times I spin the plant the other way when I get home its spun so you can see MORE of the flower sites. Even after telling him to NOT do that he did it again and I took photos in the am before i left just to be certain I wasnt losing my mind.

Sure enough I got home and the plant was spun so he could see most of the flower sites. Then the PPM was very high on this plant. The EC was WAY too high and I believe he was fertilizing the plant without telling me and now its burning up.

He is here all day long and left the doors open so he could look at them. But he kept spinning the plant and then not spinning it back.
When I proved he was doing it he denied it and because of that lack of honesty, I believe he has also been feeding it when he believes I overwater it... which I dont. He just believed 2.5 gallons of water being put in the 5 gallon bucket is overwatering even if you only do it ever 3 days. He told me I was going to wash all the nutrients out when I flushed it because it looked to have different types of nutrient burn on various leaves while most leaves in the center were turning yellow. He fertilized it while I was at work thinking I was doing the plant harm by flushing it. So he re added the nutrients he believed it needed back and then the plant burned.

Now its screwed and my only option is to cut the bottom of the friggin bucket off and set it on a five gallon felt pot and just let it live that way. My biggest issue is, I cant get a 46 inch plant through a 28 inch opening. No way. So I can only flush it using buckets and cups. It isnt coming out of that closet... if I could get it out of the closet without destroying it(which there is no chance of that) I would take it outside in the cold.... wash all the soil off and replant the nearly 4 foot in diameter plant in flower.

He kept saying he was seeing purple hairs come up. I kept telling him there is no way that is possible at 23 days after the lights were flipped. No chance. Which meant there was a problem. You would think he would just let me work it out. But it kept throwing me off.

The other plants had issues growing and I noticed them all immediately and acted fast and fixed them.

With this plant.... I was baffled because I couldn't figure out why it had so many indications of issues. Well, Now I know.
 

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