How to get started growing indoors organically - No bottles

[COorganics]

Or even less than that. Frankly I don't know what's best. I have been experimenting with doing an ACT at transplant in veg, and another at the beginning of flower, so two ACTs in the plant's entire life cycle. My reasoning is I provide a boost of soil micro life at the 2 most important phases of the plants development. Idk really, I've done ACTs way more frequently in the past and I've also only done one, or none at all. The thing I notice is that the plants respond well to ACTs. Botanical teas such as a kelp tea or kelp alfalfa tea as a soil drench provides similar, visible, results, same with sprouted seed teas [enzyme](or coconut water).

Hope that helps.

 

[DarkGreenGoo]

Sounds good. I am hoping my first run with it is a Water only soil, then I will recycle it, and perhaps begin a no-till for my second organic grow.

I will say this, I have learned more in the past two weeks then I thought I would. It makes me cringe when I see subcool talk about his "super soil". The video of him mixing it up on youtube is terrible and I barely know anything compared to most people.

He dumps all types of random stuff together, he uses bagged nonsense, straight epsome salt etc..

Subcool has always really bothered me. Ever since I found out he doesn't even produce all his own seeds that he sells, then goes around acting like this master grower. Getting paid to do speaking gigs and all sorts of stuff. His soil wasn't even organic until a few months ago, but he has been on "organic" speaking panels for two years now.

 

[Bigjoemeat]

Alright I'm gonna give this a shot. I'm going to purchase the CC nutrient kit from buildasoil. Only one thing, is there any bagged base soils that would mix perfectly with this kit? I'm thinking I'm gonna have a hard time finding each ingredient for the base soil. So buying a bagged base soil with the right or close to right ingredients would help alot.. Any clue anybody?

 

[COorganics]

he hee, subdrool is what some refer to him as.

joe, 1/3 spm, 1/3 humus, 1/3 aeration

 

[Bigjoemeat]

Ok Is there a specific brand of sphagnum you would recommend? And humus is compost and EWC's right? So if I just buy a good bagged compost from homedepo would be good and mix EWC's into it? Hey CO appreciate bro! Thanks for the help

 

[Conradino23]

Ok, peat moss is practically void of nutrients, its biggest benefit is humic acid, but so is compost's. Peat moss has very low PH, around 4 or 5 if I remember well, so I wouldn't use more than 25% of general mix. The rest looks cool as long as you go on it lightly, OZ here and there. Still, I think that adding teas in the process is essential to the success.

 

[Conradino23]

Aaa SubCool's supersoil has a general opinion of being too hot most of the time. It means it doesn't produce equally good results in all the plants. Levels of nutrients here are excessive, and can stumble your growth. I'll repeat, the best results I've seen are these of using light mix with occasional feeding, tea application or drenches like in Doc's method. Let your plants grow in their own rhythm with micronutrients available throughout the grow, and microorganisms doing the job.

 

[DarkGreenGoo]

So I have been hearing people talk about watering with Aloe or Coconut water.

How exactly does that all work? Do you just do an entire watering with them and skip using fresh water?

 

[Conradino23]

Coconut water is gonna have similar function to molasses, stimulating bacterial growth. I don't have anything against it. That's another thing, my teas are usually hyperaccumulators dissolved in water + egg shell powder + inoculant + molasses. I've also used blended cucumber or volcanic rock powder once or twice, and tried piss + wood ash as well. The best results were produced using first one mentioned, but I want to reduce compost in my potting mix by half next year, and use more of my garden soil (loam), and worm castings. A liitle bit of everything without going overboard, which for me is mostly working to achieve cleaner taste, cause I'm already there as far as terpenes production and yield is concerned

 

[COorganics]

Coconut water: we use it like a sprouted seed tea, for growth enzymes. Aloe is used as a wetting agent, for its saponin content. Aloe is also great for cloning too.

 

[COorganics]

Canadian sphagnum peat moss is what you want, joe. Like premier brand or similar. Buffaloam, oly mountain fish compost, premo castings. There are great humic inputs available for sale, although costly.

 

[SweetSue]

I'm expecting the rice hulls to arrive this weekend, Monday at the latest. The rest of my soil mix has been cooking for two weeks. I'm wondering if I can get away with mixing the hulls in and letting it cook another two weeks before planting? If need be I'll give it the whole month, but I sure am chomping at the bit to get those seeds planted.

 

[COorganics]

I think you would be good to go after letting the soil cook for a month (total)
Rice hulls are just for drainage anyway so they aren't gonna mess anything up planting right into them out of the bag. Or am I missing something?

 

[Conradino23]

No, rice hulls are fine. Over the time they'll decompose though. Great replacement for perlite by the way, which is NOT SUSTAINABLE. I use biochar though, which doesn't decompose and stabilizes PH being the best home for microflora and microfauna possible. But might be difficult to get by in bigger cities on your side of the pond I heard, so forget about it.

 

[DarkGreenGoo]

So I would just use some Coconut water and it would act like an already brewed tea, without me needing to brew it? I can get pure coconut water dirt cheap. If it saves me making a sprouted seed tea by hand, I would buy it all the time.

 

[COorganics]

here is a c/p of a post I made (c/p) on the 420mag coconut water thread.
I find natural green coconut water too expensive. Im going with the organic corn sprouted seed tea as my go to enzyme tea (soil soak/drench whatever you wanna call it)

green coconut water is a source of cytokinins, a powerful growth enzyme. here is some information from buildasoil for you to check out.
re: cytokinins
"Cytokinin: A Plant Hormone. (Coconut Water and Corn SST)
March 05 2014, 0 Comments


Cytokinins

Have you been reading about using Coconut Water or Corn SST?

What are these Cytokinins anyways? Check out this detailed information.

Nature of Cytokinins:
Cytokinins are compounds with a structure resembling adenine which promote cell division and have other similar functions to kinetin. Kinetin was the first cytokinin discovered and so named because of the compounds ability to promote cytokinesis (cell division). Though it is a natural compound, It is not made in plants, and is therefore usually considered a "synthetic" cytokinin (meaning that the hormone is synthesized somewhere other than in a plant). The most common form of naturally occurring cytokinin in plants today is called zeatin which was isolated from corn (Zea mays).

Cytokinins have been found in almost all higher plants as well as mosses, fungi, bacteria, and also in tRNA of many prokaryotes and eukaryotes. Today there are more than 200 natural and synthetic cytokinins combined. Cytokinin concentrations are highest in meristematic regions and areas of continuous growth potential such as roots, young leaves, developing fruits, and seeds (Arteca, 1996; Mauseth, 1991; Raven, 1992; Salisbury and Ross, 1992).

History of Cytokinins
In 1913, Gottlieb Haberlandt discovered that a compound found in phloem had the ability to stimulate cell division (Haberlandt, 1913). In 1941, Johannes van Overbeek discovered that the milky endosperm from coconut also had this ability. He also showed that various other plant species had compounds which stimulated cell division (van Overbeek, 1941). In 1954, Jablonski and Skoog extended the work of Haberlandt showing that vascular tissues contained compounds which promote cell division (Jablonski and Skoog, 1954). The first cytokinin was isolated from herring sperm in 1955 by Miller and his associates (Miller et al., 1955). This compound was named kinetin because of its ability to promote cytokinesis. Hall and deRopp reported that kinetin could be formed from DNA degradation products in 1955 (Hall and deRopp, 1955). The first naturally occurring cytokinin was isolated from corn in 1961 by Miller (Miller, 1961). It was later called zeatin. Almost simultaneous with Miller Letham published a report on zeatin as a factor inducing cell division and later described its chemical properties (Letham, 1963). It is Miller and Letham that are credited with the simultaneous discovery of zeatin. Since that time, many more naturally occurring cytokinins have been isolated and the compound is ubiquitous to all plant species in one form or another (Arteca, 1996; Salisbury and Ross, 1992).


Biosynthesis and Metabolism of Cytokinins
Cytokinin is generally found in higher concentrations in meristematic regions and growing tissues. They are believed to be synthesized in the roots and translocated via the xylem to shoots. Cytokinin biosynthesis happens through the biochemical modification of adenine. The process by which they are synthesized is as follows (McGaw, 1995; Salisbury and Ross, 1992):
A product of the mevalonate pathway called isopentyl pyrophosphate is isomerized.
This isomer can then react with adenosine monophosphate with the aid of an enzyme called isopentenyl AMP synthase.
The result is isopentenyl adenosine-5'-phosphate (isopentenyl AMP).
This product can then be converted to isopentenyl adenosine by removal of the phosphate by a phosphatase and further converted to isopentenyl adenine by removal of the ribose group.
Isopentenyl adenine can be converted to the three major forms of naturally occurring cytokinins.
Other pathways or slight alterations of this one probably lead to the other forms.
Degradation of cytokinins occurs largely due to the enzyme cytokinin oxidase. This enzyme removes the side chain and releases adenine. Derivitives can also be made but the pathways are more complex and poorly understood.


Cytokinin Functions
A list of some of the known physiological effects caused by cytokinins are listed below. The response will vary depending on the type of cytokinin and plant species (Davies, 1995; Mauseth, 1991; Raven, 1992; Salisbury and Ross, 1992).
-Stimulates cell division.

-Stimulates morphogenesis (shoot initiation/bud formation) in tissue culture.

-Stimulates the growth of lateral buds-release of apical dominance.

-Stimulates leaf expansion resulting from cell enlargement.

-May enhance stomatal opening in some species.

-Promotes the conversion of etioplasts into chloroplasts via stimulation of chlorophyll synthesis.





The illustration above shows the effect of cytokinin and auxin concentration on tissue culture experiments (Mauseth, 1991)


Source: https://www.plant-hormones.info/cytokinins.htm"


re: sprouted corn seed
"Corn is known to be high in Cytokinins.

"Cytokinins will increase the girth and tinsel strength of the side branches and stronger branches will produce larger and heavier flowers." -Clackamas Coots

Instead of buying an expensive enzyme product in a bottle, you can make your own!

Cytokinin Functions
A list of some of the known physiological effects caused by cytokinins are listed below. The response will vary depending on the type of cytokinin and plant species (Davies, 1995; Mauseth, 1991; Raven, 1992; Salisbury and Ross, 1992).
-Stimulates cell division.

-Stimulates morphogenesis (shoot initiation/bud formation) in tissue culture.

-Stimulates the growth of lateral buds-release of apical dominance.

-Stimulates leaf expansion resulting from cell enlargement.

-May enhance stomatal opening in some species.

-Promotes the conversion of etioplasts into chloroplasts via stimulation of chlorophyll synthesis.

Super Sprouted Tea Version 2.0: (Credit to some old Coot)

56 Grams Corn Seed (2 Ounces)

Soak for 12-24 hours with Clean Water

Sprout seeds until tail is 1/2 inch long or about 1-2 days.

Blend in a food blender or whatever you have with a little bit of water to help it blend.

Add this to 5 gallons water and you have one of the worlds most nutritious Plant Enzyme Teas available for PENNIES"

 

[SweetSue]

I think you would be good to go after letting the soil cook for a month (total)
Rice hulls are just for drainage anyway so they aren't gonna mess anything up planting right into them out of the bag. Or am I missing something?

This was my thinking as well, so I'm glad for the consensus. The cooking schedule is to let all the nutrient additives get acclimated, and rice hulls don't fall into that category.

Conradino, I have mostly pumice as the aeration component, but when I increased the volume I needed more aeration. I just decided that in the interest of variety and diversity, rice hulls were an excellent addition. I need to look further into biochar. At this point I am clueless about it, but I hear wonderful things.

 

[SweetSue]

Enzyme teas need to be used immediately don't they? Five gallons is going to be too much for me. I would need to cut that to a bit less than half, and that would be just right for the size of my planned grow.

 

[COorganics]

Ive been using sprouted corn and clover or coconut water and using immediately. I think it is the addition of fresh aloe gel that makes you want to use it all up immediately, the aloe ferments quickly I believe. Not sure on the "shelf life" of the enzymes were after. I'd have to check through some notes though, I may be off base there.

 

[SweetSue]

A decent compost tea can be nothing more than vermicompost bubbled for 24 hours, strained and used as a soil drench. They really don't have much smell at all. I tried a couple during a partial grow (plants adopted at an awkward stage) because they hadn't been fed anything and I didn't want to go with chemicals, even at that early stage of my education. I was researching teas at the same time I was searching for plants that could add benefit to the plant (this was before I realized the futility of trying to feed the plant instead of feeding the soil). I simply chopped up some comfrey leaves, buzzed it in the blender with a bit of water, mixed the slurry into about a half gallon of water, bubbled it for 24 hours and then added a handful of cheap castings and bubbled for another 24 hours. Then I strained, diluted with another gallon of water and applied to the cannabis and everything else growing in the apartment. It was all simple, quiet and odorless, and the plants all loved it. The petunias on the balcony are still blooming, and we've been down into freezing temps here lately. Imagine if I'd had decent soil and had also been using enzyme teas. Can't wait to try it out.