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- #21
Sensi’s Eagle Bill Gets Its First Grow On 420 Mag
- Thread starter Aroxol
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- #22
Did some major tent rehab and here’s the setup for the eagle grow. 3 buckets was technically doable, but felt too cluttered so I broke out the hacksaw/ glue and decided to run with 2. Once the grow gets underway I’ll see if squeezing in a few autopots is viable.
Had a lot of lessons learned from my previously RDWC run - most notably what the PITA items were - so made all necessary adjustments to make this grow VERY convenient. Almost everything can be controlled fom the outside which means I shouldn’t have to fuss around too much.
Had a lot of lessons learned from my previously RDWC run - most notably what the PITA items were - so made all necessary adjustments to make this grow VERY convenient. Almost everything can be controlled fom the outside which means I shouldn’t have to fuss around too much.
sativuhhh
Well-Known Member
What were the pita lessons? Running out of the tent would be a nice advantage
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- #24
Basically removing every point of control to the outside of the tent. Only reason I want to go inside is defole or take photos in a perfect world.
-No electricity/ cables on the floor
-All timers (for everything) outside the tent
-CO2 controller and tank outside tent
-All air pumps outside tent
-Exhaust fans controlled outside of tent
-Shutoff valves at epicenter (outside tent)
-Every light I may need pre-installed
-Easier height adjustment for all lights
-No clutter
-Towels, gloves and tools at arms reach
-No electricity/ cables on the floor
-All timers (for everything) outside the tent
-CO2 controller and tank outside tent
-All air pumps outside tent
-Exhaust fans controlled outside of tent
-Shutoff valves at epicenter (outside tent)
-Every light I may need pre-installed
-Easier height adjustment for all lights
-No clutter
-Towels, gloves and tools at arms reach
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- #25
Looooooong Update.
Grafts:
Interestingly both of my Incredible Bulk grafts took successfully (with and without clone gel).
Because all of my previous Eagle Bill graft attempts had failed, in an effort to isolate the issue/ failures with the eagle attempts, I took new cuttings, dipped them in gel, placed in RW like I do with all my clones... but instead of putting all of them in my clone dome, I covered half in plastic bags exactly like I had with the grafts... the results:
- 100% success under the high humidity dome.
- 100% failure under the plastic bag.
Seems to indicate my grafting approach isn’t the issue, it’s the lack of humidity. While the bulk and other resilient strains are cool with just a plastic bag, I get the feeling more finicky strains like eagle bill are not. Where I go from here - I ordered a propegator lid that’s fits the autopot containing my donor plant, and then I absolutely hacked it apart plant so the lid will fit once I add graft scions. As soon as it arrives I will reattempt to graft Eagle Bill scion onto the bulk donor plant... so without further adu, here is what I hope will become the foundation for my frankenmom.
Now onto the namesake of the thread...Eagle Bill. Right now I am waiting for clones to beef up so I can move them into the undercurrent system in my main tent (under main lights, CO2, etc.), veg for 2-3 weeks, and then flip to flower.
But while I wait for all of that to happen, I figured why not transplant my 3 original seed phenos into a single autopot and flip to flower in my cabinet under blue spectrum only. Why? I’m bored... but more importantly have a theory that blue spectrum only for first 3 weeks of flower could substantially reduce stretch compared to normal red flowering spectrums.
In my current setup, I can flip these eagle phenos under blue only for 3 weeks and measure stretch. In my other tent (probably 2 weeks behind), I can then flip clones from the same phenos under my normal flowering lights and measure stretch. I will also move the plants I flower under blue only for three weeks into my tent under red lights and see if they shoot up in height or remain in a more compact state. No matter what happens, it’ll be interesting to see what kind of stretch I’m in store for and how these phenos develop early into flowering.
My hypothesis: plants that start the first 3 weeks of flower under blue only will be SUBSTANTIALLY shorter and more compact.
3 Eagle Bill Phenos
Notice the variation in leaf structure across all 3 plants and then specifically the staggered node structure on the last pic compared to the other plants.
The Transplant
I’ll prob give this transplant 4-7 days and then flower under blue.
Grafts:
Interestingly both of my Incredible Bulk grafts took successfully (with and without clone gel).
Because all of my previous Eagle Bill graft attempts had failed, in an effort to isolate the issue/ failures with the eagle attempts, I took new cuttings, dipped them in gel, placed in RW like I do with all my clones... but instead of putting all of them in my clone dome, I covered half in plastic bags exactly like I had with the grafts... the results:
- 100% success under the high humidity dome.
- 100% failure under the plastic bag.
Seems to indicate my grafting approach isn’t the issue, it’s the lack of humidity. While the bulk and other resilient strains are cool with just a plastic bag, I get the feeling more finicky strains like eagle bill are not. Where I go from here - I ordered a propegator lid that’s fits the autopot containing my donor plant, and then I absolutely hacked it apart plant so the lid will fit once I add graft scions. As soon as it arrives I will reattempt to graft Eagle Bill scion onto the bulk donor plant... so without further adu, here is what I hope will become the foundation for my frankenmom.
Now onto the namesake of the thread...Eagle Bill. Right now I am waiting for clones to beef up so I can move them into the undercurrent system in my main tent (under main lights, CO2, etc.), veg for 2-3 weeks, and then flip to flower.
But while I wait for all of that to happen, I figured why not transplant my 3 original seed phenos into a single autopot and flip to flower in my cabinet under blue spectrum only. Why? I’m bored... but more importantly have a theory that blue spectrum only for first 3 weeks of flower could substantially reduce stretch compared to normal red flowering spectrums.
In my current setup, I can flip these eagle phenos under blue only for 3 weeks and measure stretch. In my other tent (probably 2 weeks behind), I can then flip clones from the same phenos under my normal flowering lights and measure stretch. I will also move the plants I flower under blue only for three weeks into my tent under red lights and see if they shoot up in height or remain in a more compact state. No matter what happens, it’ll be interesting to see what kind of stretch I’m in store for and how these phenos develop early into flowering.
My hypothesis: plants that start the first 3 weeks of flower under blue only will be SUBSTANTIALLY shorter and more compact.
3 Eagle Bill Phenos
Notice the variation in leaf structure across all 3 plants and then specifically the staggered node structure on the last pic compared to the other plants.
The Transplant
I’ll prob give this transplant 4-7 days and then flower under blue.
Great work you’ve been busy this last two weeks. Your graft is looking happy to be there ! As usual I’m missing something my Kind led tells me to cut down my blue the last two weeks in flower! There is another grower using California light works he turns his down the whole flower cycle. The blue by itself will make it strech ?
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- #27
West, what’s up man. Yep you’re correct in your approach and that’s the status quo. The way I normally grow are with varying blue/ red ratios that I play around with and/or that I mix up based on guidance from lighting companies about growing for specific outcomes (flowers, resin, hash, etc.) - Example of ratio article here.
I’ve become a true believer in spectrum dimming/ manipulation.
I had a different thread going related to this, so I’m going to be lazy and just copy and paste from there which explains the why and what I’m going for with the blue flowering. All happened because I tripped a timer that sent my bulks flowering under blue only. Previous post, hopefully this adds some color... see what I did there
“Wondering if any of you have flowered the same pheno under red spectrum (traditional) vs blue spectrum only, and what the results were. I accidentally started flower on one of my strains under the veg setting of an LED and the results were basically incredibly compact new growth node spacing and almost no stretch. Looked absolutely nothing like the exact same pheno I was flowering in the tent next to it under more traditional red/ blue flower spectrums.
Because of that I’m left wondering if I/ we can manipulate stretch of sativas using this same accidental approach?
The spectrum chart of the specific light I was using is below (was on veg setting - so my guess is it probably ended where blue meets green).
My interest is mainly related to sativa because I have height limitations (like most folks). Was the ultra compact node and stretch I encountered a fluke or have any of you DRAMATICALLY reduced stretch by leveraging blue spectrum only for first 3 weeks of flower? If so, when you switched over to red did you encounter the traditional growth/ stretch you were trying to minimize in the first 3 weeks under blue or did the plant remain in its compacted state?
I saw such dramatic results by accidental side by side on a pheno I understand, so it has me wondering if anyone has run more of a formal test?”
I’ve become a true believer in spectrum dimming/ manipulation.
I had a different thread going related to this, so I’m going to be lazy and just copy and paste from there which explains the why and what I’m going for with the blue flowering. All happened because I tripped a timer that sent my bulks flowering under blue only. Previous post, hopefully this adds some color... see what I did there
“Wondering if any of you have flowered the same pheno under red spectrum (traditional) vs blue spectrum only, and what the results were. I accidentally started flower on one of my strains under the veg setting of an LED and the results were basically incredibly compact new growth node spacing and almost no stretch. Looked absolutely nothing like the exact same pheno I was flowering in the tent next to it under more traditional red/ blue flower spectrums.
Because of that I’m left wondering if I/ we can manipulate stretch of sativas using this same accidental approach?
The spectrum chart of the specific light I was using is below (was on veg setting - so my guess is it probably ended where blue meets green).
My interest is mainly related to sativa because I have height limitations (like most folks). Was the ultra compact node and stretch I encountered a fluke or have any of you DRAMATICALLY reduced stretch by leveraging blue spectrum only for first 3 weeks of flower? If so, when you switched over to red did you encounter the traditional growth/ stretch you were trying to minimize in the first 3 weeks under blue or did the plant remain in its compacted state?
I saw such dramatic results by accidental side by side on a pheno I understand, so it has me wondering if anyone has run more of a formal test?”
I need to try this next time on my white Widow. I also missed on the programming the light when going to flower . The white light stayed on for 18 hours and the red and blue were 12 hours . My girls have 42” legs from going two weeks like this !
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- #29
Transplant was smooth so I swapped lights and going to start 12/12 tonight.
Sidebar Experiment Summary: Flower 3 Eagle Bill phenos under blue LED spectrum for first 3 weeks of flower to see if stretch is reduced compared to traditional red/ bloom spectrums.
Sidebar Experiment Summary: Flower 3 Eagle Bill phenos under blue LED spectrum for first 3 weeks of flower to see if stretch is reduced compared to traditional red/ bloom spectrums.
- Observation: One of my plants accidentally flowered under LED grow light’s veg setting (~350-500nm) and developed minimal stretch and very condensed node structuring compared to same exact pheno that was flowering in a tent next to it under a different lights traditional bloom settings (red spectrums).
- Question: Why did this happen?
- Hypothesis: Perhaps leveraging blue spectrum only (~350-500nm) for the first 3 weeks of flower can result in decreased stretch plant compared to traditional red (bloom) spectrums.
- Prediction: Plants flowered for 3 weeks under blue will be shorter and have more compact node spacing.
- Test Plan: Flower 3 phenotypes of Eagle Bill under blue spectrum for 3 weeks and measure the height results. In parallel, flower clones of the exact same eagle bill phenos under traditional red (bloom) spectrums and take measurements over the first 3 weeks to compare results. Bonus, measure all plants at the end of flower to see how they stack up.
| PLANT | MEDIAN HEIGHT | DAY |
| B4 | 7.2” | 1 |
| B1 | 7” | 1 |
| B2 | 7” | 1 |
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- #30
Hey guys - I plan to take measurements every week for more formal comparison, but looked at the plant today and wanted to show you guys what I’m seeing. Though still very early, it looks like there’s some signs showing this experiment is working as expected.
Example one: first and second pic are of the same plant. First pic shows the normal node spacing during veg, second pic shows the node spacing after I changed the light and flipped to 12/12 under blue spectrum. Early observations, but dramatically different.
Example 2: different plant, same logic of look at the normal node spacing during veg (indicated by yellow). Now look at the new growth node spacing since light change and flip.
What’s important to understand about these eagle plants is that they didn’t grow in this condensed before. They wouldn’t form a tight node and then stretch, they would stretch and develop a new node and stretch some more. So now we’re in flower and seeing the exact opposite... which is good/ interesting.
Example one: first and second pic are of the same plant. First pic shows the normal node spacing during veg, second pic shows the node spacing after I changed the light and flipped to 12/12 under blue spectrum. Early observations, but dramatically different.
Example 2: different plant, same logic of look at the normal node spacing during veg (indicated by yellow). Now look at the new growth node spacing since light change and flip.
What’s important to understand about these eagle plants is that they didn’t grow in this condensed before. They wouldn’t form a tight node and then stretch, they would stretch and develop a new node and stretch some more. So now we’re in flower and seeing the exact opposite... which is good/ interesting.
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
Hey there @Growca2268 ! You are doing all sort of wild and crazy things in here, and I can't help but have to watch. 
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- #32
Thanks for joining, glad to have you!Hey there @Growca2268 ! You are doing all sort of wild and crazy things in here, and I can't help but have to watch.
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- #33
Here is the first weekly update on stretch measurements, the height values are the median of tallest tops from each plant. I am not tying anything down or training, just letting them grow naturally. All plants definitely show ultra condensed new node growth. I’m pretty well convinced these are not going to stretch very much under this lighting, but will continue to day 21. The next critical part will be what happens on day 21 when I flip them over to traditional red spectrum. Will they explode into the stretch I’ve been restricting them from, or stay compact... time will tell.
If this works, my plan is to veg out my RDWC as tall as I want and then use this light for the first three weeks to manipulate stretch to xx inches and then hammer them with intense red lighting. This really could be a real game changer depending how it plays out. Monster condensed colas, anyone?
If this works, my plan is to veg out my RDWC as tall as I want and then use this light for the first three weeks to manipulate stretch to xx inches and then hammer them with intense red lighting. This really could be a real game changer depending how it plays out. Monster condensed colas, anyone?
| PLANT | Week 0 | Week 1 (Day 7) | Week 2 (Day 14) | Week 3 (Day 21) |
| BL4 | 7.2” | 8.5” | ||
| BL1 | 7” | 8.5” | ||
| BL2 | 7” | 9” |
Strech is my biggest problem, this round the girls have 42” legs . Flood and drain instead of the rdwc . Watching these experiments closely!Here is the first weekly update on stretch measurements, the height values are the median of tallest tops from each plant. I am not tying anything down or training, just letting them grow naturally. All plants definitely show ultra condensed new node growth. I’m pretty well convinced these are not going to stretch very much under this lighting, but will continue to day 21. The next critical part will be what happens on day 21 when I flip them over to traditional red spectrum. Will they explode into the stretch I’ve been restricting them from, or stay compact... time will tell.
If this works, my plan is to veg out my RDWC as tall as I want and then use this light for the first three weeks to manipulate stretch to xx inches and then hammer them with intense red lighting. This really could be a real game changer depending how it plays out. Monster condensed colas, anyone?
PLANT Week 0 Week 1 (Day 7) Week 2 (Day 14) Week 3 (Day 21) BL4 7.2” 8.5” BL1 7” 8.5” BL2 7” 9”
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- #35
I’m working to get detailed specifics of the light for everyone, the issue is the company I believe is out of business. Lot of their links go to 404 or unfunded website hosting pages. Which kind of sucks, because they may have had a unique/ untapped value prop they never even knew about (assuming this works as expected).
AspenCultivator
Well-Known Member
Growca man you have some cool shit going on here, that's for sure. I've never even heard of grafting, so it'll be super cool to follow this and see what it entails. I really like your post setup, and how you mention your queries and tests against your hypothesis. Very nice, and keep it up!
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- #37
Thanks man! What can I say, this forum has really brought out the elementary school student in me
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- #38
Here’s a quick out of the light picture of the eagle phenos. Happy to report the hunt for Red October is over, I know which pheno I will be running in my 2 bucket RDWC setup. She looks the best, smells the best, and I’m very excited to see the type of buds this strain will produce.
A stem rub gives off a very old school genetics pungent earth smell. Think organic Jack Herer meets Thai/ Mexican sativa. Smells nice, better than I was expecting TBH.
Here she is, bottom of main plant is the pheno for RDWC.
A stem rub gives off a very old school genetics pungent earth smell. Think organic Jack Herer meets Thai/ Mexican sativa. Smells nice, better than I was expecting TBH.
Here she is, bottom of main plant is the pheno for RDWC.
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- #39
Damnit damnit damnit. Eagle test plant looks great, but the experiment is shot. I went out of town for 3 days and before I left I swapped out the nutes and must’ve pushed the cabinet into my light timer. When I opened cabinet today the light was off, which tells me it’s been off since Sunday night. Plants all grew ~10”, but I suspect that’s because they were searching for the light. I need to switch away from digital timers, damnit.
I’ll start the test again with a new plant in a bit. Bit unique to find a person so pissed off about an incredibly healthy plant. Sorry folks. Here’s some pics of the plant and 3 phenos. FML.
I’ll start the test again with a new plant in a bit. Bit unique to find a person so pissed off about an incredibly healthy plant. Sorry folks. Here’s some pics of the plant and 3 phenos. FML.
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- #40
Well, actually maybe I can still save this. Here’s the updated stats, and I’ll checm again in 7 days. If we go back to seeing only 2” of growth, that will be a telling sign. Annnnd it will also provide insight that we can manipulate stretch through darkness if we feel like things are too short, then revert to tight/ short growth thereafter.
Maybe this is a blessing in disguise.
Ok so week 2 values start with median height across tops, HT value is highest top. Keep in mind, for week 2 there were 2-3 days of complete darkness (no light), which I believe attributed to doubling of height. Let’s see what happens after the next 7 days.
Maybe this is a blessing in disguise.
Ok so week 2 values start with median height across tops, HT value is highest top. Keep in mind, for week 2 there were 2-3 days of complete darkness (no light), which I believe attributed to doubling of height. Let’s see what happens after the next 7 days.
| PLANT | Week 0 | Week 1 (Day 7) | Week 2 (Day 14) | Week 3 (Day 21) |
| BL4 | 7.2” | 8.5” | 18.5 (HT 19.5”) | |
| BL1 | 7” | 8.5” | 16.5 (HT 17.5”) | |
| BL2 | 7” | 9” | 19.5 (HT 20.5”) |
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