Yellowing starting a bit too early?

[Virandell]

Hi guys my plants started to yellow abit in some places, it's abit wierd aswell as bottom leafs are fine but popcorn leafs are yellow also it's affecting some top leafs it's kinda looking like nitrogen but I am not sure about it, its also affecting my one right plant you can see one branch is yellow but the rest of the plant looking like it's have even excess nitrogen.
They are in 31 day Flo from showing pistils, I know yellowing is fine but more at the end of the flo this is abit early ? pH of the soil is fine temps are around 21-23C and rh is around 50%. It's also not overwatering as I am watering every 3-4 days and when pot is light.
Sorry for my English guys I hope you will not have any trouble reading that

 

[Slammy Pajama]

Hey mate, nice looking garden! I wouldn't bother with any nitrogen at this stage of flower, I reckon they should have what they need to finish out

Some of the tops on the right even look a little dark like they've gotten a lot of nitrogen for flower, but it could also just be genetics.

I'd just keep watching and waiting, no need to rush into any changes at this stage!

 

[Virandell]

Hey mate, nice looking garden! I wouldn't bother with any nitrogen at this stage of flower, I reckon they should have what they need to finish out

Some of the tops on the right even look a little dark like they've gotten a lot of nitrogen for flower, but it could also just be genetics.

I'd just keep watching and waiting, no need to rush into any changes at this stage!

Thanks alot buddy.
Yep two left plants streched alot more than right ones maybe that's why they are darker, I had to actually supercrop them two times.
I am just not sure is it nitrogen or some other problem with them two left plants ^^

 

[Slammy Pajama]

You definitely get a much lighter coloured green at the centre of new growth during flower, but that's pretty normal and nothing that needs correcting with nutes or anything

This plant is in veg right now, so she is a pretty uniform green colour all over

These plants are about two weeks into flower, and have lighter coloured central growth tips, but nothing to worry about. I probably won't be giving these girls any more nitrogen for the rest of flower, they look just fine and not hungry for it

 

[Emilya Green]

I don't agree that this is nothing and that it is normal. Being only in the top growth we know it is a non-mobile deficiency, so that eliminates N, P and K and also Magnesium, Chlorine, Molybdenum and Nickel. It looks like an iron deficiency to me. It IS something to worry about. Let's review the nutes you are giving and the pH you are giving them at. Something is amiss.

 

[Bill284]

Hi guys my plants started to yellow abit in some places, it's abit wierd aswell as bottom leafs are fine but popcorn leafs are yellow also it's affecting some top leafs it's kinda looking like nitrogen but I am not sure about it, its also affecting my one right plant you can see one branch is yellow but the rest of the plant looking like it's have even excess nitrogen.
They are in 31 day Flo from showing pistils, I know yellowing is fine but more at the end of the flo this is abit early ? pH of the soil is fine temps are around 21-23C and rh is around 50%. It's also not overwatering as I am watering every 3-4 days and when pot is light.
Sorry for my English guys I hope you will not have any trouble reading that

Beautiful girls my friend.
Your English is fine.
Are you feeding any nutrients?
Cut out nitrogen completely from here on in.
You should be feeding every other watering.
Bill

 

[Slammy Pajama]

I don't agree that this is nothing and that it is normal. Being only in the top growth we know it is a non-mobile deficiency, so that eliminates N, P and K. It looks like an iron deficiency to me. It IS something to worry about. Let's review the nutes you are giving and the pH you are giving them at. Something is amiss.

Hey Emilya, glad to see you stopping by!

What is pointing you in the direction of iron deficiency? I'd love to start training my eyes to pick up symptoms like yours!

 

[Emilya Green]

Hey Emilya, glad to see you stopping by!

What is pointing you in the direction of iron deficiency? I'd love to start training my eyes to pick up symptoms like yours!

Hi Slammy! Great question! Each deficiency presents differently when it occurs. potassium for instance is stored in the tips and edges of the leaves, so when it is being used up to supply what is needed for the buds, it is these areas of the leaf that first are affected. Calcium leaves spots in the middle of the upper leaves, magnesium leaves larger spots and ends of leaves damage in the middle and lower part of the plant, and iron presents as a yellowing in the new growth, emanating from the center of the leaves and moving outward. The biggest clue as to what deficiency you are looking at is determining first if you are looking at a mobile deficiency, where the problem starts in the lower leaves and steadily moves upward, or a non-mobile deficiency, where the plant can not move around nutrients that are needed, so the upper (new) growth is affected first, or semi-mobile, where similar symptoms are being seen all over the plant.
Check out this link where these deficiencies are described in terms of mobile and non mobile. The webpage completely changed the way I look at deficiencies.

Knowing nutrient mobility is helpful in diagnosing plant nutrient deficiencies

Nutrients important for plant growth vary in their ability to move within the plant. Knowing how they move can be helpful when diagnosing deficiency problems.

www.canr.msu.edu

 

[Virandell]

I don't agree that this is nothing and that it is normal. Being only in the top growth we know it is a non-mobile deficiency, so that eliminates N, P and K and also Magnesium, Chlorine, Molybdenum and Nickel. It looks like an iron deficiency to me. It IS something to worry about. Let's review the nutes you are giving and the pH you are giving them at. Something is amiss.

Hi Emilya thanks for popping in I am giving biobizz nutes which are "organic" and every second watering I am giving cold pressed seaweed extract pH of the solution after nutes is around 5.9-6 which is maybe abit on a low side.
Deficiency actually started from the bottom up but not from leaves but popcorn buds started going yellow first and later some upper leaves like you can see on the pictures.

 

[Emilya Green]

Hi Emilya thanks for popping in I am giving biobizz nutes which are "organic" and every second watering I am giving cold pressed seaweed extract pH of the solution after nutes is around 5.9-6 which is maybe abit on a low side.
Deficiency actually started from the bottom up but not from leafs but popcorn buds started going yellow first and later some upper leafs like you can see on the pictures.

I have no idea what the cold pressed seaweed extract is doing for you, but 5.9-6 is quite a bit low actually. PH is a logarithmic scale where the difference between even tenths of a point are huge fluxuations... try 6.3 pH. It really can make a difference. Biobizz should not need pH adjusting but something is wrong... let's please give adjusting the pH a try and see if it doesn't cause an immediate greening of the new growth. There are other reasons that Fe can be locked up, but let's try the easy fix first.

Regarding your earlier deficiency, I think you are combining two completely separate issues. That problem started out at the bottom of the plant, most likely because it was due to either a macronutrient issue or a mobile deficiency of some kind. If it has stopped, then you fixed that problem. This thing at the top is new.

A last point, please. If you pH your fluids on one pass to one number, and then come in the next pass with something new and pH adjusted to another number, the resulting pH in the wet parts of the container will be the average of those two pH readings, whereas the dry parts of the container will immediately take up the lower pH of the recent watering. If Fe were available to the plant at a higher pH, that second watering with the seaweed might have been moving the pH of the container down, and from that point made Iron unavailable to the plant. This is a possibility anyway, and something that needs to be considered as we puzzle this out.

 

[Virandell]

I have no idea what the cold pressed seaweed extract is doing for you, but 5.9-6 is quite a bit low actually. PH is a logarithmic scale where the difference between even tenths of a point are huge fluxuations... try 6.3 pH. It really can make a difference. Biobizz should not need pH adjusting but something is wrong... let's please give adjusting the pH a try and see if it doesn't cause an immediate greening of the new growth. There are other reasons that Fe can be locked up, but let's try the easy fix first.

Regarding your earlier deficiency, I think you are combining two completely separate issues. That problem started out at the bottom of the plant, most likely because it was due to either a macronutrient issue or a mobile deficiency of some kind. If it has stopped, then you fixed that problem. This thing at the top is new.

A last point, please. If you pH your fluids on one pass to one number, and then come in the next pass with something new and pH adjusted to another number, the resulting pH in the wet parts of the container will be the average of those two pH readings, whereas the dry parts of the container will immediately take up the lower pH of the recent watering. If Fe were available to the plant at a higher pH, that second watering with the seaweed might have been moving the pH of the container down, and from that point made Iron unavailable to the plant. This is a possibility anyway, and something that needs to be considered as we puzzle this out.

I heard it's quite beneficial its kelp extract basically ^^ I don't think so that would be the problem but it is quite acidic as pH of it is around 5.5.
Maybe I will just leave the seaweed in the future and just water with Biobizz nutes.
Do you think I can top dress some dolomite lime or better buy some pH up ?
Thanks alot for help

 

[Emilya Green]

You should NOT top dress dolomite... I am not at all concerned with your soil pH. Soil base pH is NOT an issue, the issue is the pH of the incoming fluids. You don't have pH up? May I suggest pickling lime at the grocery store? It is insanely strong... use like a 1/2 teaspoon in a gallon of water... and store it in glass... it can melt plastic.

I would be tempted to just trust the Biobizz... I have heard that it is good stuff too. Wouldn't it be ironic if the seaweed was actually the problem?

 

[Virandell]

You should NOT top dress dolomite... I am not at all concerned with your soil pH. Soil base pH is NOT an issue, the issue is the pH of the incoming fluids. You don't have pH up? May I suggest pickling lime at the grocery store? It is insanely strong... use like a 1/2 teaspoon in a gallon of water... and store it in glass... it can melt plastic.

I would be tempted to just trust the Biobizz... I have heard that it is good stuff too. Wouldn't it be ironic if the seaweed was actually the problem?

Thanks for suggestion Emily I don't have pH up but I will buy some, Biobizz have actually pH up with humic acid in it or I will make solution with pickling lime that a good suggestion aswell and money saver . One more question does pH of fluid shouldn't really matter becouse soil should buffer it ? Ofc I am not talking that I can water with pH 5 or pH 9 just wonder ^^
And Yee it would be ironic I will put it away and just water with biobizz

 

[Emilya Green]

it would seem to me that the mere existence of the problem you are having would seem to inform you that this theory that soil will buffer the pH and make it unnecessary to adjust it, is untrue. If this were indeed the case, no one would ever have to worry about pH.

Either the stuff that is now deficient is in your nutrient mix or it is not. Let's assume that it is, in fact, in there and in the necessary amounts. What then is keeping it from your plants, if not pH?

Yes, the buffers in the soil are meant to change the pH of the incoming water... a little bit. It is not like the presence of dolomite lime in the soil is going to magically change the pH of the incoming fluids immediately... it takes time. What actually happens is the pH of the fluids starts to slowly drift upward, toward the base pH of the soil, usually set at the high end. The problem is the slowness of this drift and the large amount of time that the nutes are not in their most mobile state in that soil, because of pH. There can be large sections of time when the nutes simply are not able to be used, unless you immediately come in at the proper pH of 6.3. From that second on, nutes are available. And, from that second on the buffers in the soil start the upward drift, effectively moving your nutes from 6.3 all the way up to 6.8 pH... exactly the RANGE they were designed to be the most active in. PH is not a single number that we are shooting for, it is a range... and the longer you can keep it within that range, the more nutes you are able to pick up.

 

[Virandell]

it would seem to me that the mere existence of the problem you are having would seem to inform you that this theory that soil will buffer the pH and make it unnecessary to adjust it, is untrue. If this were indeed the case, no one would ever have to worry about pH.

Either the stuff that is now deficient is in your nutrient mix or it is not. Let's assume that it is, in fact, in there and in the necessary amounts. What then is keeping it from your plants, if not pH?

Yes, the buffers in the soil are meant to change the pH of the incoming water... a little bit. It is not like the presence of dolomite lime in the soil is going to magically change the pH of the incoming fluids immediately... it takes time. What actually happens is the pH of the fluids starts to slowly drift upward, toward the base pH of the soil, usually set at the high end. The problem is the slowness of this drift and the large amount of time that the nutes are not in their most mobile state in that soil, because of pH. There can be large sections of time when the nutes simply are not able to be used, unless you immediately come in at the proper pH of 6.3. From that second on, nutes are available. And, from that second on the buffers in the soil start the upward drift, effectively moving your nutes from 6.3 all the way up to 6.8 pH... exactly the RANGE they were designed to be the most active in. PH is not a single number that we are shooting for, it is a range... and the longer you can keep it within that range, the more nutes you are able to pick up.

Roghty thanks alot Emilya for help tommorow I am going for pH up and I will set it up to 6.3 hopefully will gonna help something ^^

 

[Virandell]

@Emilya 1 more thing how I will know plants are better ? The slightly yellow top leaves will come back to green color or they will stop going more yellow ?

 

[bluter]

Maybe I will just leave the seaweed in the future and just water with Biobizz nutes.

would start here as well. if running a f/f/w schedule i'd only run the kelp on the water side. biobizz pretty much calls for f/f/f though. would ph for soil as well. 6.3.

I would be tempted to just trust the Biobizz... I have heard that it is good stuff too. Wouldn't it be ironic if the seaweed was actually the problem?

i'm not sold on the nute.

there's loads of growers posting issues with it. it's sold as an entire system here including starter soil. the local shops love it as they keep upping the ante on one component or another $ $ $. plus it's sold as an all out organic, on the same footing as los, which it is not. i look at it more like GF, which i consider superior in application judging by the results posted by folk here.

 

[Emilya Green]

@Emilya 1 more thing how I will know plants are better ? The slightly yellow top leaves will come back to green color or they will stop going more yellow ?

As the needed nutrients become available you should see a rapid greening in the upper growth has the plant gathers in what it needs

 

[Virandell]

As the needed nutrients become available you should see a rapid greening in the upper growth has the plant gathers in what it needs

Amazing thank you

 

[Virandell]

would start here as well. if running a f/f/w schedule i'd only run the kelp on the water side. biobizz pretty much calls for f/f/f though. would ph for soil as well. 6.3.







i'm not sold on the nute.

there's loads of growers posting issues with it. it's sold as an entire system here including starter soil. the local shops love it as they keep upping the ante on one component or another $ $ $. plus it's sold as an all out organic, on the same footing as los, which it is not. i look at it more like GF, which i consider superior in application judging by the results posted by folk here.

I know but there isn't any other good organic nutes in uk I heard oldtimer went shitty aswell I might consider biotabs it's quite expensive but it's water from start to finish basically