Can you help me with my living soil mix?

[Jungle Joseph]

Thanks for the links azimuth and vegan, I really appreciate everyone's time and experience. I'm starting to see there's a bit more to it than just throwing amendments at the soil.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

Just be sure to note the "cooking time" the organic mixes need before you plant stuff in them. While they are assimilating together the microbes start breaking things down and the mix can get a bit hot for a few weeks which can fry you plants if you plant too early.

Thanks, yeah I knew it would be needing to 'cook' for a while, I just wasn't sure of the amount of amendments to add. I'll be doing some more research by the looks of it. I've got some good advice and some links to check out now.

 

[Stunger]

Just be sure to note the "cooking time" the organic mixes need before you plant stuff in them. While they are assimilating together the microbes start breaking things down and the mix can get a bit hot for a few weeks which can fry you plants if you plant too early.

I think that is an important point, to give the soil time to cook/settle. I feel that if any errors are made, that 'time' can help balance them out. I read of someone who grew his best plant ever in a pile of husky dog poo which had been left for 3 years by which time it had cooked/settled/broken down and by then was apparently great growing.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

I think that is an important point, to give the soil time to cook/settle. I feel that if any errors are made, that 'time' can help balance them out. I read of someone who grew his best plant ever in a pile of husky dog poo which had been left for 3 years by which time it had cooked/settled/broken down and by then was apparently great growing.

Thanks stunger, that story reminds me of Cheech and Chong,

"It's dog shit man",
"I wonder what great Dane tastes like"

I'll definitely be letting the mix cook for a while.

 

[Stunger]

I think as an outdoor grower that if you do your amending early in the 'off season' then by the time several months have passed and Spring has arrived the soil should be pretty nice.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

I think as an outdoor grower that if you do your amending early in the 'off season' then by the time several months have passed and Spring has arrived the soil should be pretty nice.

Yeah, that way it'll have all winter to do it's thing. I was thinking the same thing.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

So, I've decided to make 2 batches of soil.
The first mix is the base soil, to which I have added 3 cups of 4-4-4 premixed amendment. I'll use this mix first and top dress as needed.
The second mix I added separate amendments and followed the instructions from the supplier, it is base soil with the following ingredients,
55 ltrs soil,
5 ltrs peat,
3 cups kelp meal,
2 ltrs worm castings,
3 tsp frass meal,
5 tsp rock dust,
8 cups bio-char,
1 cup fish meal,
1 cup feather meal,
.5 cup molasses meal,
6 cups alfalfa meal,
.75 cup mussel meal,
.5 cup rock phosphate.

I mixed each batch in a kids paddling pool, then I put each separate mix into a container with a lid. I added a couple of ltrs of water to moisten the soil and I'll check the moisture once in awhile and add more water if needed.

I'll let the 4-4-4 mix cook for a few weeks and I'll let the 'hot mix' cook for a few months.
It'll be interesting to see which one is best.
In the future I plan to make a mix using different ingredients, closer to a 'coots mix'.
Thanks again everyone for the help.

 

[bobrown14]

Although with all the stuff you have going on in that mix it reminds me a lot more of VAN STANK'S Soil recipe

This is a good one as well and is reusable like Coots mix

 

[bobrown14]

And, finally, HERE'S A GOOD ARTICLE from Build-A-Soil.

They highlight three approaches including the Coots Mix, but also give you some good background on building your own mix.

Jeremy from BAS started with coots mix before he went pro. Met him way back when. He got his foundation of knowledge from Coots as did I for container gardening.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

This is a good one as well and is reusable like Coots mix

Yeah it's very similar. I figured I'd try a few different mixes and see how each one performs.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

Jeremy from BAS started with coots mix before he went pro. Met him way back when. He got his foundation of knowledge from Coots as did I for container gardening.

Thanks bobrown14, the build a soil page was very helpful to confirm the additives and the quantities I used were in the general area of a good quality mix. Some slight differences, but generally the same.

 

[bobrown14]

Thanks bobrown14, the build a soil page was very helpful to confirm the additives and the quantities I used were in the general area of a good quality mix. Some slight differences, but generally the same.

He dues the 1/3 of the base ingredients plus amendments. As mentioned go easy on the rock phosphate. It doesn't play well with microbes.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

He dues the 1/3 of the base ingredients plus amendments. As mentioned go easy on the rock phosphate. It doesn't play well with microbes.

I used half a cup of rock phosphate in 15 gallons (60ltrs) of soil. I hope it's not too much. I used the lower end of the suppliers suggested amounts.

 

[bobrown14]

That stuff takes a while to become available maybe in your lifetime maybe not depending on the source of which there are a few.

There are better sources of phosphates. Any manure that you compost is a good one.
Also a good compost (Vermi-compost is best) is a good source and why you see that in some of the soil recipes. Green manure is also a good source and you see a lot of growers using green manure aka top dress or grow cover crops. The roots that break down in the soil mix make good sources for nutrients as well and is very popular with growers these days.

I'll grow cover crops in containers not in use to keep the microbes alive and also they amend the soil - fix nitrogen in the roots from the air. Doing these few things you get the idea of a living soil which is best imho.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

That stuff takes a while to become available maybe in your lifetime maybe not depending on the source of which there are a few.

There are better sources of phosphates. Any manure that you compost is a good one.
Also a good compost (Vermi-compost is best) is a good source and why you see that in some of the soil recipes. Green manure is also a good source and you see a lot of growers using green manure aka top dress or grow cover crops. The roots that break down in the soil mix make good sources for nutrients as well and is very popular with growers these days.

I'll grow cover crops in containers not in use to keep the microbes alive and also they amend the soil - fix nitrogen in the roots from the air. Doing these few things you get the idea of a living soil which is best imho.

I'd like to grow a cover crop, I understand clover or alfalfa are good options.

 

[bobrown14]

Can grow both together. Thats how the farmers make hay round these parts.
Grass and clover (alfalfa is a grass) - they are great at sequestering N from the air.

They also grow GREAT tasting beef. Its a primary source of feed for cattle. The farmers also give the cows minerals similar to what we put in our soil mix without it they wont survive because our soils are depleted in those needed minerals.

Round ball - everything tied together in this world.

Hay: "If it was easy everybody would grow it"

 

[Jungle Joseph]

Can grow both together. Thats how the farmers make hay round these parts.
Grass and clover (alfalfa is a grass) - they are great at sequestering N from the air.

They also grow GREAT tasting beef. Its a primary source of feed for cattle. The farmers also give the cows minerals similar to what we put in our soil mix without it they wont survive because our soils are depleted in those needed minerals.

Round ball - everything tied together in this world.

Hay: "If it was easy everybody would grow it"

Yeah, I've seen cattle licking salt blocks, full of good minerals. They love it.

 

[Azimuth]

Hay: "If it was easy everybody would grow it"

 

[bobrown14]

Yeah, I've seen cattle licking salt blocks, full of good minerals. They love it.

They sell rock dust similar to what we use for soil building at the feed store. The farmers grind up corn with the minerals and mix it in with the hay for their nightly cud fix.

Some animals will go to no lengths for salt. Google mountain goats and check some vids. I was watching some today. Saw one goat climb a rock wall that was a man made dam out of local granite that has some salt/mineral content. Crazy stuff got dizzy watching.

 

[Jungle Joseph]

They sell rock dust similar to what we use for soil building at the feed store. The farmers grind up corn with the minerals and mix it in with the hay for their nightly cud fix.

Some animals will go to no lengths for salt. Google mountain goats and check some vids. I was watching some today. Saw one goat climb a rock wall that was a man made dam out of local granite that has some salt/mineral content. Crazy stuff got dizzy watching.

I've seen that, the goats are hundreds of feet up a sheer wall. Pretty impressive. Butterflies and birds in the Amazon jungle extract minerals from the clay, elephants as well, everything needs minerals, including our precious plants.