Growing & Vaping

[Jackalope]

Now days growers are doing more and more themselves. I know because I am one of them. I make butter oil and shatter all by myself now days. I really don't think it is the little guys like us causing problems out there. Vaping problems are arising out there everywhere now days. I have did some checking into it because I vape both nicotine and THC. What I have found out is lots of the vaping hospitalizations are do to vaping THC products. Not nicotine ones. I don't know if it is shatters or oils but I suspect it is shatter or other BHO products.

Like I said this is all conjecture here. If vaping THC is a problem it is coming from what the vape product was made with not the THC. Early on I had lots of problems getting my shatter to totally purge. I was making wax with my BHO instead of a vacuum purge. When it got warm I always noticed tiny bubbles. Because of this I ordered a vacuum pump. Once I got my vacuum system I really noticed how much butane was still left in the products I was making. I really don't know how bad the stuff I already smoked was. I know now that I did smoke some butane. I really think this or one of the other things people make concentrates out of is causing the lung irritation. We all know it is not THC no matter what the concentrate percentage rates at.

I am just suggesting to make sure any concentrates you are making are clean and well purged. Like I said it is probably not us little guys. Someone out there is making large batches of shatter and oil for the black market and not doing it right. Black market and homemade products are out there for both THC and nicotine. Black market will never be blamed, They will blame the main stream companies. This is going to continue to cause problems for anyone who vapes. They are blaming Vaping not what is being vaped.

There is nothing any of us can do about that. I just wanted to make sure everyone is being safe with the concentrates they are making and consuming.

 

[Greenlizard]

Good write up. I agree. I get a bit ticked when I hear all this vape bashing... The vapes that are for the juice or e-juice is what I understand to be most harmful. Understandably so since it is just chemical based and processed. I never thought of "bad shatter" or other poorly made products related to THC. Makes sense. I don't indulge in anything not made by my own hands for the reason that we can't control what we ingest if we just pickup packaged products off a shelf. I enjoy vaping the flower itself. My wife and I each have a PAX and we only vape raw flower. It never chokes us up or causes any respiratory issues that we can notice.
When it comes to concentrates your safest bet is Rosin I would think.

 

[TurboBucket]

I'm not sure they've decided whether it's the thc/CBD or ejuice. They don't know why half of them are sick, some have pneumonia they are blaming on the vegetable glycerin. One guy claims his lung collapsed after vaping an ecig. But almost every article throws in " most of those effected reported vaping thc or CBD at some point", well shit that's like 40% of the population anymore.

No connections to batches or products yet so I can't see it being a contaminant issue. I wonder if it's similar to the "tattoos poison you" thing it's not the ink itself, it's the abrasiveness of some inks against the needle causing small metal particles to dislodge and enter the bloodstream, basically wetsanding the needle as it pieces the skin.

Maybe the issue is coming from delivery methods? Not every vape is created equal, perhaps certain coils types or wick types? Or over or under powering the ejuice? Idk.

If it was from bad concentrates there should be medical patients (compromised immune systems) getting sick before rec patients and non Cannabis users.

I stopped using my ejuice vape about a week ago. I've had weird feelings in my chest, almost shortness of breath. Kind of innocuous feelings on their own but I've been smoking for along time and never felt this way. The ejuice was a recent addition maybe it's playing into it. Going to try a break for awhile and see if anything changes. I was using a temp controlled mod with stainless steel coils and premium ejuice with 3rd party quality control testing done on every batch. As safe as I could make it I think.

The big problem is no nomenclature difference between inhaling ejuice vapor and Cannabis concentrate vapor, it's all "vaping" but two very different products. So whoever writes the story gets to lump them both together.

The truth is we have no idea what the long-term effects on health are yet.

 

[Remystemple]

Vaping shatter and stuff can be down right HARSH.
so imagine getting used to it and banging more and harsher puffs as you get used to the burn, or as your lungs turn to burnt meat and you can't feel the heat anymore, but keep vaping bigger and bigger puffs because you can handle it. this is how i see myself getting hurt by vaping if i did it regularly.

it's hot, harsh and burns the shit out of me. anyone who's gotten used to it must have some kind of lung damage.

Just a theory

 

[TurboBucket]

Sounds like your talking about hot dabs. Which adds one more variable

 

[Remystemple]

Sounds like your taking bout hot dabs. Which adds one more variable

i've been smoking a long time and never really took to the vaping scene. i vape nicotine in hopes of quitting eventually. I have to defend vaping when i hear these news stories. my lungs were fucked from smoking cigs. i couldn't even enjoy a puff of weed it got so bad. with vaping my lungs have been getting better and better. I even work out a bit now.

so i just think that anyone who hurts themselves like that from vaping is just doing it wrong. modded or whatever.

 

[TurboBucket]

I understand, I quit cigs by vaping as well. Definitely seemed to feel better for a while. But I want the truth, not my knee jerk reaction to the negative media it's getting. Our governor just outlawed flavored ejuice in the state, including online sales

So do you think the new stories all refer to "hot dab vaping" and not ejuice vaping? Because the story I saw yesterday was a girl in a coma from lungs full of fluid/fat from the vegetable glycerin in ejuice. Lies? Or the kids in Texas with a collapsed lung from ecigs? Lies? Or is there some truth to it? The media puts so much spin on stuff there is very little factual reporting done on the subject.

Ecig≠box mod ≠ wax pen ≠ flower pen ≠ dab rig but they are all called vaping

I've dabbed longer than I've Vaped ejuice. I've not used thc/CBD ejuice, only nicotine.

My dabs are not harsh. What's your concentrate? Mine are made from food grade alcohol extraction or pressed hash for rosin.

There's a difference between hot dabs and low temp dabs. Heating your nail too hot is bad. That's where the "waste it to taste it" saying comes from. Low temp dabs are way better than hot dabs. That's why enails have become so popular. Apparently some of the nail materials are hazardous at high temps and burning anything obviously releases some amount of carcinogens.

 

[Remystemple]

I understand, I quit cigs by vaping as well. Definitely seemed to feel better for a while. But I want the truth, not my knee jerk reaction to the negative media it's getting. Our governor just outlawed flavored ejuice in the state, including online sales

So do you think the new stories all refer to "hot dab vaping" and not ejuice vaping? Because the story I saw yesterday was a girl in a coma from lungs full of fluid/fat from the vegetable glycerin in ejuice. Lies? Or the kids in Texas with a collapsed lung from ecigs? Lies? Or is there some truth to it? The media puts so much spin on stuff there is very little factual reporting done on the subject.

Ecig≠box mod ≠ wax pen ≠ flower pen ≠ dab rig but they are all called vaping

I've dabbed longer than I've Vaped ejuice. I've not used thc/CBD ejuice, only nicotine.

My dabs are not harsh. What's your concentrate? Mine are made from food grade alcohol extraction or pressed hash for rosin.

There's a difference between hot dabs and low temp dabs. Heating your nail too hot is bad. That's where the "waste it to taste it" saying comes from. Low temp dabs are way better than hot dabs. That's why enails have become so popular. Apparently some of the nail materials are hazardous at high temps and burning anything obviously releases some amount of carcinogens.

well i think all they do is lie, i think most of us know the news media is always up for sale.
but if there's truth to it i'd blame modding the things. i've only ever vaped stuff that was offered by a buddy so i wouldn't know how it was made but what i found was Smooth going in harsh going out lol and almost die coughing.

 

[TurboBucket]

A mod is a module or power supply, not a modification.

So your opinion is that it's just a big smear campaign against the vaping industry. I can't say I disagree, it certainly smells fishy, but I'm not willing to bet my or my wife's life on it.

Your experience still sounds like dabs, not vaping ejuice. And done in what is considered a less than desired way of doing it. I still use a titanium nail which is frowned on but I use an IR thermometer to verify temps are not too hot. I don't think there's any major health concerns with cool/low temp dabs when using a solvent less product. It's the ejuice delivery that I'm most skeptical of.

 

[KCCO 77]

Hey all just my 2 cents but shatter wax and oil has to be dewaxed or sometime called winterizing or polarizing. Either way if skipping this step shatter will have a very heavy harsh exhale. Example blasting a QP I can get up to say 15 to 20 gram return then after winterized I can pull around 1 to 2 grams of fat and wax out of it and this is the shit you don’t want in concentrate form. Outdoor weed tends to have a higher fat and wax ratio then indoor because the plant uses it for protection against the blazing sun. The fats and wax are fine on flower because it’s not concentrated. If we do not winterize the end product is very heavy on the lungs. Most reputable extraction artists will have something on there packages about de waxed or polarized product. You can see on these packages what I am talking about.

6D609DF4-FCAB-47C5-AB70-E089CA4BB444.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

E80145A9-4D00-40BF-BFAF-A6D7DF3A99B8.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

ADDF5822-FF2C-4336-86E5-514825FDBC96.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

ED6429A2-7262-4D7D-AB7A-0471C600B0BE.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

Bottom left on the packages full dewax. These r not mine but I have been doing extractions for along time and after cleaning your extraction properly it is actually pretty smooth assuming you know the heat of you banger or nail. Play safe and enjoy

 

[KCCO 77]

Now days growers are doing more and more themselves. I know because I am one of them. I make butter oil and shatter all by myself now days. I really don't think it is the little guys like us causing problems out there. Vaping problems are arising out there everywhere now days. I have did some checking into it because I vape both nicotine and THC. What I have found out is lots of the vaping hospitalizations are do to vaping THC products. Not nicotine ones. I don't know if it is shatters or oils but I suspect it is shatter or other BHO products.

Like I said this is all conjecture here. If vaping THC is a problem it is coming from what the vape product was made with not the THC. Early on I had lots of problems getting my shatter to totally purge. I was making wax with my BHO instead of a vacuum purge. When it got warm I always noticed tiny bubbles. Because of this I ordered a vacuum pump. Once I got my vacuum system I really noticed how much butane was still left in the products I was making. I really don't know how bad the stuff I already smoked was. I know now that I did smoke some butane. I really think this or one of the other things people make concentrates out of is causing the lung irritation. We all know it is not THC no matter what the concentrate percentage rates at.

I am just suggesting to make sure any concentrates you are making are clean and well purged. Like I said it is probably not us little guys. Someone out there is making large batches of shatter and oil for the black market and not doing it right. Black market and homemade products are out there for both THC and nicotine. Black market will never be blamed, They will blame the main stream companies. This is going to continue to cause problems for anyone who vapes. They are blaming Vaping not what is being vaped.

There is nothing any of us can do about that. I just wanted to make sure everyone is being safe with the concentrates they are making and consuming.

Love your posts @Jackalope another great conversation piece that more people could benefit greatly from.

 

[KCCO 77]

Hey all just my 2 cents but shatter wax and oil has to be dewaxed or sometime called winterizing or polarizing. Either way if skipping this step shatter will have a very heavy harsh exhale. Example blasting a QP I can get up to say 15 to 20 gram return then after winterized I can pull around 1 to 2 grams of fat and wax out of it and this is the shit you don’t want in concentrate form. Outdoor weed tends to have a higher fat and wax ratio then indoor because the plant uses it for protection against the blazing sun. The fats and wax are fine on flower because it’s not concentrated. If we do not winterize the end product is very heavy on the lungs. Most reputable extraction artists will have something on there packages about de waxed or polarized product. You can see on these packages what I am talking about.

6D609DF4-FCAB-47C5-AB70-E089CA4BB444.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

E80145A9-4D00-40BF-BFAF-A6D7DF3A99B8.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

ADDF5822-FF2C-4336-86E5-514825FDBC96.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

ED6429A2-7262-4D7D-AB7A-0471C600B0BE.jpeg

• KCCO 77
• Sep 4, 2019

Bottom left on the packages full dewax. These r not mine but I have been doing extractions for along time and after cleaning your extraction properly it is actually pretty smooth assuming you know the heat of you banger or nail. Play safe and enjoy

Also we all can imagine the problems with pesticides in a concentrated form being inhaled. Pesticides r a big no no and very dangerous in concentrate.

 

[multiVortex]

The stories I've seen on it have all referred to "vaping", but then mention cartridges/extract from "off the street."

I have yet to see anything referring to legitimate, manufactured products/ejuice. Nothing conclusive on a specific ingredient, style, or device though. (This is aside from the early on issue with the nicotine ejuice ingredient that was also used in microwave popcorn, and caused "popcorn lung", but that's in the past.)

The attack on flavored juice is for shit. If flavored ejuice is attractive to kids, so is flavored alcohol. Guess it's time to ban those flavored alcoholic beverages now, too. If they stopped to think it over, that ejuice has helped a lot of people quit smoking. That of course is the probably the problem, and they're losing money on tobacco taxes.

I can't say I've vaped anything cannabis related that was in a juice/wax/shatter form. I do have a Pax, which is nice, but that uses straight flower (which is why I picked it up.)

 

[TurboBucket]

Yea the ban on flavored liquids is such a weak smoke screen it's not even funny. My state just banned flavored ejuice. Very few people actually vape tobacco flavors. I hated everyone I tried. It wasn't until I tried some of the desert flavors that I was able to stop cigs for vaping and save a few hundred dollars a month.

If they are truly worried about the safety of vaping pull it all. They hide behind the kids thing to get more public support. If it's really names like fruity pebbles and Skittles that they have a problem with people better rename their strains and stop making edibles that are anything except cream of wheat or prune juice. If nicotine is so dangerous adults can't even purchase it anymore how can weed still be sold? Much less flavored alcohol. Just craziness. Every politician is for sale.

 

[multiVortex]

 

[KCCO 77]

I have heard some horror stories about these things and seen some absolute garbage being passed around as shatter/wax. What it comes down to if you ain’t making it or at least know the people who r it’s risky. It can be made pure lab tests prove it but with all the synthetic terps and cutting agents and no de waxing well people want weight. Weight = money and greed trumps all unfortunately.

 

[TurboBucket]

Yea I haven't smoked any but I've seen plenty of junk being passed around. That being said a handful of years ago, maybe 4-5 we were snatching up the early bho as quick as my buddy could blast it. And that was definitely suspect, open blast, no vac Purge. Smoked a couple grams a week and no I'll effects from that.

 

[KCCO 77]

Yea I haven't smoked any but I've seen plenty of junk being passed around. That being said a handful of years ago, maybe 4-5 we were snatching up the early bho as quick as my buddy could blast it. And that was definitely suspect, open blast, no vac Purge. Smoked a couple grams a week and no I'll effects from that.

I personally know people that don’t de wax or purge they just wip and have been doing so for many many years with no I’ll effects. The problem is it’s heavy on the lungs I mean to each their own but I won’t smoke it. Don’t get me wrong I have lol. All my rambling on here is speaking to thc products. I have not tried e juice because I can’t stop f$&@“@& Smoking. Good on you for quitting it’s a horrible habit.

 

[Lowrider72]

Vac purge is King, not doing it, ya kidding yourself. Any extraction method requiring an extraction gas- fluid needs to be purged properly.
Micro bubbles get trapped and release when you smoke it.
No amount of sitting around is good enough. Purge only.

I vape Rosin daily, cleanest way...no chemicals. I have no probs. Yocan pen.

Some people were modding vapes to get huge vape clouds but the extra heat can cause problems, even explosions when modded for too much battery draw to get said clouds. The extra heat on inhale may not help either.

I am against vape fluids. You can vape concentrates so why liquid it up with a non natural unknown.....

 

[multiVortex]

but with all the synthetic terps and cutting agents and no de waxing well people want weight. Weight = money and greed trumps all unfortunately.

It would not surprise me in the least if this was the underlying issue/cause. Cutting to make more weight, and therefore more money.