Yellowing and curling leaves at canopy

[Liqurd4tay0z]

Hi everyone. I am currently dealing with issues that I thought could be related to PH and I was looking to see what everyone else thinks.

Currently watering w/ tap water Ph'd to 6.2-6.5 and soil PH is sitting around 6.8 and showing around 800ppm doing a slurry test. Is it possible this is from my light being too close? My led is 18" from the canopy. I also may have overwatered about a week ago when this started to show up. I have only given minimal watering since in hopes the pot will dry out a little more thoroughly.

 

[Herby Green]

Nice plants they look great

 

[bobrown14]

How you checking soil pH??

PPMs and soil slurry test is best left to the professionals.

The reason is these things are tested in a LAB.

PH is logarithmic scale. A little off is WAY off.
Sure you can test your input water for pH but not your soil unless you have lab conditions.

Ok that said. Tap water has stuff in it you cannot test for. Do you PPM test on your tap water and tell me what is making up those numbers.

My tap water is well water at +400ppms. It will kill plants in about 3 weeks in a container. Well water is completely fine outside in veggie gardens but not in containers.


Is you tap water from a well or city?

If city water then there is cholormine/chlorine in your tap water. Those 2 mess up the microbes that are in the soil. There are other even more toxic particles in the tap water as well.

Suggest you at the least filter thru a charcoal filter and even look into RO filtration. It will be good for you and your plants.

 

[Liqurd4tay0z]

-Update-

Did a flush and now im seeing runoff of 6.5 so it seems to be a bit better but the ppms are much higher in the runoff sitting around 1400. A few hours after the flush I already noticed leaves were starting to perk back up a bit and uncurl slightly. I also moved my light about another 6" away and elevated my pot a bit more off the ground to allow more air to pass under it. We'll see how she responds to this over the next couple days.

 

[Liqurd4tay0z]

How you checking soil pH??

PPMs and soil slurry test is best left to the professionals.

The reason is these things are tested in a LAB.

PH is logarithmic scale. A little off is WAY off.
Sure you can test your input water for pH but not your soil unless you have lab conditions.

Ok that said. Tap water has stuff in it you cannot test for. Do you PPM test on your tap water and tell me what is making up those numbers.

My tap water is well water at +400ppms. It will kill plants in about 3 weeks in a container. Well water is completely fine outside in veggie gardens but not in containers.


Is you tap water from a well or city?

If city water then there is cholormine/chlorine in your tap water. Those 2 mess up the microbes that are in the soil. There are other even more toxic particles in the tap water as well.

Suggest you at the least filter thru a charcoal filter and even look into RO filtration. It will be good for you and your plants.

Hey @bobrown14 I have only been testing the water going in and the runoff. My water is tap water from a city and it comes out around 7.1 and around 150-200ppm. I fill about a dozen 1 gal containers in advance and let them sit to deplete some of the chlorine in the water before using it. I haven't had any problems thus far and have been growing all sorts of plants and vegetables indoors for many years but im thinking that I got a bit carried away with watering initially after uppotting.

 

[Liqurd4tay0z]

Hey @bobrown14 I have only been testing the water going in and the runoff. My water is tap water from a city and it comes out around 7.1 and around 150-200ppm. I fill about a dozen 1 gal containers in advance and let them sit to deplete some of the chlorine in the water before using it. I haven't had any problems thus far and have been growing all sorts of plants and vegetables indoors for many years but im thinking that I got a bit carried away with watering initially after uppotting.

I have a charcoal filter I am going to start using for my water, at first I thought about using it but didn't ever think I would need to worry about it but now I plan on doing this everytime.

 

[Liqurd4tay0z]

-Update-

Did a flush and now im seeing runoff of 6.5 so it seems to be a bit better but the ppms are much higher in the runoff sitting around 1400. A few hours after the flush I already noticed leaves were starting to perk back up a bit and uncurl slightly. I also moved my light about another 6" away and elevated my pot a bit more off the ground to allow more air to pass under it. We'll see how she responds to this over the next couple days.

 

[Liqurd4tay0z]

Definitely overfeeding and overwatering are the culprits. I am now going to be alot more careful.

 

[Slammy Pajama]

Yea I think that cupping downward you have on some of the leaves is a good sign of overwatering. Plants are looking good though!

 

[bobrown14]

-Update-

Did a flush and now im seeing runoff of 6.5 so it seems to be a bit better but the ppms are much higher in the runoff sitting around 1400. A few hours after the flush I already noticed leaves were starting to perk back up a bit and uncurl slightly. I also moved my light about another 6" away and elevated my pot a bit more off the ground to allow more air to pass under it. We'll see how she responds to this over the next couple days.

Ok so you grow other plants indoors. Do you flush the soil for them like you did with cannabis??

The problem with city water is that 200ppms. What's in those 200ppms??
Usually its not a problem but when it is its very difficult to figure out whats wrong.

Could be your water could be your soil could be anything.

One reason I went to RO water was to eliminate water as one of the possible problems.
After that, all problems went away.

If you're growing in soil, what are we "flushing" away??

Do a read on CEC - cation exchange capacity - it's part of the soil mak up.

Link:
Cations and Cation Exchange Capacity | Fact Sheets | soilquality.org.au


What are you pH testing water run off for? and what do you think you're gaining by testing it?

There's nothing there for you unless you're growing in a soil-less medium. I dont think you are but I could be wrong.

Read the article about CEC I posted. Then you can understand why I say not to pH run off or flush your soil. Sure you can do those things but its not what you think its doing.

For soil pH - soil has the ability to buffer pH changes its what the microbes do. Flushing them doesn't help it makes things worse in actuality.

Better to just water more as the plants get larger. Dont under water and keep fans going on the plants so they can transpire more and uptake more nutrients from the soil.

 

[Liqurd4tay0z]

Ok so you grow other plants indoors. Do you flush the soil for them like you did with cannabis??

The problem with city water is that 200ppms. What's in those 200ppms??
Usually its not a problem but when it is its very difficult to figure out whats wrong.

Could be your water could be your soil could be anything.

One reason I went to RO water was to eliminate water as one of the possible problems.
After that, all problems went away.

If you're growing in soil, what are we "flushing" away??

Do a read on CEC - cation exchange capacity - it's part of the soil mak up.

Link:
Cations and Cation Exchange Capacity | Fact Sheets | soilquality.org.au


What are you pH testing water run off for? and what do you think you're gaining by testing it?

There's nothing there for you unless you're growing in a soil-less medium. I dont think you are but I could be wrong.

Read the article about CEC I posted. Then you can understand why I say not to pH run off or flush your soil. Sure you can do those things but its not what you think its doing.

For soil pH - soil has the ability to buffer pH changes its what the microbes do. Flushing them doesn't help it makes things worse in actuality.

Better to just water more as the plants get larger. Dont under water and keep fans going on the plants so they can transpire more and uptake more nutrients from the soil.

Thanks @bobrown14 I really appreciate the advice. I do grow other plants indoors and I haven't flushed any of them the way I flushed the cannabis plants. You're absolutely right about the ppms. What's in that 200? I did the flush as I had thought perhaps there were excess salt build up around the root zone from not properly watering and feeding when I switched to a larger container. Since doing the flush I have noticed the color on new growth is coming in much better and the leaf curl/ clawing has stopped.

I'm definitely going to start using RO going forward and the link on CEC has got my attention as well.

 

[bobrown14]

A friend of mine pointed these things out to me when I was getting started.

Hope you dont mind me passing it on.

Not everyone needs RO water. We were living in Philly. So think about Flint Michigan and their water issues. Its the same basic thing in all the older cities around the USA. The difference is that the cities use a chemical to keep the lead pipes from leaching off lead.

Yum.... So we started RO water for home use. When I started growing indoors right out of the gate the plants looked like crap and it was getting worse. I switched to RO water and problems solved.

We now live out in the country on a well on a dolomite lime deposit. All our plumbing is plastic for good reason. My tap water is 10.5pH.