Help! White splotchy plant!

[Shakenbaked]

This is my first grow ever, I’m growing LSD-25. This is a tent grow. 600w king LED in a 36”x22”x60” tent. I’m using Pro-mix HP in 5 gallon pots, seeds started their life in the 5 gallon pots and will die in the 5 gallon pots. I’m running 18/6 light schedule, and am using fox farms bottles in the ratios that other auto-flower growers are using. The temperatures are around 80°F during daylight with the humidity fluctuating but riding around 58 (this is my first grow, took some trial and error working with humidity)..

Today marks the 32 days since they popped the soil. Since around a week and a half one of my plants has been acting funny and looking sick. And has been progressively getting worse.

At first I thought it was a Cal/Mag deficiency, but after feeding nutes, nothing had changed. Then I think it is a temperature problem, but I see people growing up to 85°F and I don’t ever break 80... and I don’t think I’m over watering her either... I’m completely stumped as to what may be wrong with her. It may just be a stupid rookie mistake, and forgive me if it is. Lol.. just don’t wanna see her die. And my performer is starting to show similar symptoms on one of her leaves..

Any help or input would be greatly appreciated

 

[BeanTownFan420]

I think its sick and might not recover your better to cull or remove it.

 

[Old Salt]

to the forum...

Pro-mix is usually considered as a soil. You'll find lots of good information for soil growing in @Emilya's current journal. Her paper, 'The Proper Way to Water a Potted Plant' is considered a must read for soil growing.

I'm not going to comment on the blotchy problem, as I have no experience with ProMix, or the nutrients you are using. I grow in coco/perlite using Mega Crop, and have used General Hydroponics' Flora Trio and supplements.

Let's talk about your light. I have a King X6 Dimmable 1800W COB LED Grow Light that I purchased as my first grow light. I went big, as King claims 'Coverage Area(100%): about 5 x 5.5 ft,' for use in a 2' X 4' tent. You'd think like I did that this would be way too much for a tent that size. I thought I'd be smart and that's why it's dimmable. At full power, I didn't have enough light. That light only drew 315W from the wall. Did you notice that King does not provide this information on their website? I'm certain that your 600W light draws no more than 110W from the wall. Experience in this forum shows that 30W / sq ft is required from the wall for the best lights on the market to get a good harvest. Most experienced growers go for more. The minimum for the King line of lights is probably up in the 40-50W / sq ft. Your tent is 5.5 sq ft. You'd need 165W from top of the line lights, or 220-275W from a manufacturer like King.

 

[Emilya Green]

Hi @Shakenbaked and welcome to the forum!
Many times people think they are not overwatering, but yet they are. I would like to hear more about how often you water and how you determine that it is time to water. Your symptoms definitely fit a plant that is being watered too often.
Secondly, you said you are not following the FF instructions, but are using some mysterious mix that "auto growers use" but I know of no such magic formula. I don't think I have ever heard of this special formula and I suspect this comes from somewhere other than this forum, so I am also curious where you heard of this and what it is. The FF nute line is pretty well thought out, and almost everyone I have ever seen try to roll their own with this mix, gets in trouble.

I suspect that both of these aspects of your grow deserve some attention and could be causes of your problem, but since you seem very sure of yourself in both of these areas, I would like you to tell me what you are doing and why before I even try to tell you how I would fix this. I feel a little unsure of coming right out and telling you what I am seeing because I suspect that you are getting some advice from other quarters, and I want to know what you feel and why so I can try not to step on too many toes.

 

[Shakenbaked]

Hi @Shakenbaked and welcome to the forum!
Many times people think they are not overwatering, but yet they are. I would like to hear more about how often you water and how you determine that it is time to water. Your symptoms definitely fit a plant that is being watered too often.
Secondly, you said you are not following the FF instructions, but are using some mysterious mix that "auto growers use" but I know of no such magic formula. I don't think I have ever heard of this special formula and I suspect this comes from somewhere other than this forum, so I am also curious where you heard of this and what it is. The FF nute line is pretty well thought out, and almost everyone I have ever seen try to roll their own with this mix, gets in trouble.

I suspect that both of these aspects of your grow deserve some attention and could be causes of your problem, but since you seem very sure of yourself in both of these areas, I would like you to tell me what you are doing and why before I even try to tell you how I would fix this. I feel a little unsure of coming right out and telling you what I am seeing because I suspect that you are getting some advice from other quarters, and I want to know what you feel and why so I can try not to step on too many toes.

Hi, thanks for your response! I just read your article that Oldsalt commented. Very informative and will be using that info in the very near future..

I am watering my plants about once a week... I have a moisture meter, it’s old, but I think it still works.. I have been trying to let the soil dry and water only when the plant needs it, just as you have stated. I usually determine it needs water when the meter says it is drying up at the bottom of the pot, not off the plant giving me signs. But reading your post, I realized I’ve been watering them all wrong. I am not patient and just kinda pour the water throughout the pot continuously until container is empty.. as far as the feeding I using the FF trio (grow big, big bloom, tiger bloom) but have read on other forums (none from this site) that ff is “hot“ for autos and to use ff’s feeding schedule just at half strength to keep from burning the plants. And since I’m practically watering once a week, I’m feeding them at the same time.

You’re not stepping on any toes whatsoever. I’m very new to this, and would love to learn as much as I can. Tell it how it is! Lol

 

[Emilya Green]

Hi, thanks for your response! I just read your article that Oldsalt commented. Very informative and will be using that info in the very near future..

I am watering my plants about once a week... I have a moisture meter, it’s old, but I think it still works.. I have been trying to let the soil dry and water only when the plant needs it, just as you have stated. I usually determine it needs water when the meter says it is drying up at the bottom of the pot, not off the plant giving me signs. But reading your post, I realized I’ve been watering them all wrong. I am not patient and just kinda pour the water throughout the pot continuously until container is empty.. as far as the feeding I using the FF trio (grow big, big bloom, tiger bloom) but have read on other forums (none from this site) that ff is “hot“ for autos and to use ff’s feeding schedule just at half strength to keep from burning the plants. And since I’m practically watering once a week, I’m feeding them at the same time.

You’re not stepping on any toes whatsoever. I’m very new to this, and would love to learn as much as I can. Tell it how it is! Lol

This all makes perfect sense then and if we can get you watering based on a wet dry cycle and get you slowly watering the soil to saturation when you do, I think we can solve the watering problem.
The biggest problem here is the bad advice you have been getting. Many of the online forums tend to have a clique of armchair experts who no one on that board is willing to confront. They can say and even pontificate about any stupid thing and call it the truth, and on that board... it becomes the truth.
Here at 420mag we are a little different than most. No one on this board, no matter their experience, writing ability, personality... no one can get rated any higher than anyone else. We are all equal in stature, and only a few numbers in our stats can give you any indication who is the most active, most followed, and most responded to. But even armed with those numbers, there is no way to rate one of our members against another, other than by the weight of their words and how the others interact with them. This makes this board a lot more of a place where an honest open discussion can happen, and although it can sometimes get heated between strong personalities, the truth usually comes out on this board.
So don't trust everything you read on every forum out there... there are some that are just plain putting out bad information, consistently.
So, autos...
They are special and since they are genetically restricted in final size and length of life, some special ways of dealing with them have come into common practice. It is believed that they are so sensitive and growing so fast that it is best to start them in the final container and not have to transplant them. It is believed that you can't train them and that topping them is just silly. It is also believed that they need fewer nutes.
Autos are quite the rage these days, and if they required a special feeding system, you would think that every nutrient company out there would include special instructions just to grow these plants. The fact is that NONE of the nutrient companies do this. Makes you want to go hmmmm.
Let's throw some logic into the discussion... if an auto is actually a plant that is growing at a breakneck speed, faster than a regular cannabis plant, wouldn't it makes sense that it would be able to use MORE nutes than its regular counterpart? Again.... hmmmmm.
The truth is that a plant is a plant is a plant. A plant under bigger lights will have bigger nutrient needs. A bigger plant will have bigger needs than a smaller plant. A young plant needs less than an older more developed plant.
So yes, when an auto, or any other plant is small, it takes less nutes. But, look at the FF nutrient chart and they deal with this for you, since the week 1 dosage rates are completely different than the mix you make up for a 5th week flowering plant. They ramp up the nutes for a while and then at the appropriate time they start backing off on the nutes a bit... the scientists over there at FF really put a lot of work into designing this system for you. If it became clear in the cannabis community that their charts and feeding system didn't work, FF would lose a lot of customers, and they don't want that. I can assure you, the feeding charts are correct. You should be feeding about twice a week. You should be watering about every 3 days, and you should be giving nutes/water/nutes water all through the grow. Being a FF grow, you also should be doing a 3x the container sized flush about every 4 weeks also.
So, just as it looked in your picture, your plant is lacking some vital nutrients because of your unique interpretation of the feeding chart and you are starting to see the effect of that abuse on your leaves. If you continue what you are doing, it will continue to get worse. If your plants do survive till the end, they will likely have deficient buds, having lacked some basic nutrition all through the grow. You can fix this, but you need to work on doing that now because an auto is not going to wait for you. If you starve it now, it is going to remain small all through the grow.
Another factor that we haven't discussed, mainly because you are in promix, is pH. Promix is heavily buffered both high and low, and getting the pH exactly where the FF nutrients want it to be is not nearly so important in this medium. I don't believe pH to be a factor in what is happening here.

My suggestion is to first figure out this watering thing. You have a small struggling plant in large 5 gallon container. If you saturate that soil top to bottom, at best the plant will require a week or more to drain that water. Luckily, you are growing a weed, and there are two sets of roots, the bottom feeder roots and the top spreader roots. While the bottom roots are busy trying to suck up a lake of water, you can keep the upper roots happy too by giving them a light watering every 3 days or so. Water/nutes/water/nutes ... keep it coming in, at least every 3 days. If you are doing a top watering, just give enough water to soak into the first 4 inches, while trying to make the outer edges of the container the wettest spots so as to entice the spreader roots to grow laterally. After a week or so of concentrating on the top roots, the bottom will finally be getting dry, and when your moisture meter can show you that the water table has fallen all the way down into the last inch of the container, soak that entire container again to saturation with a proper watering.

Keep repeating this 2 stage watering until the top and bottom sync up and you can begin to properly water the entire container every 3 days. With this 2 stage system, you will then be able to properly feed your plant the recommended nutes, the plant will not go into hibernation mode between waterings, and that crinkled up look of complaint coming from the lower roots will go away after a couple of complete cyclings of the entire container.

Lastly, one of my pet peeves is that armchair experts are always harping about burning the plants. Egads, show a little bit of tip burn to them in a picture and they will pontificate till the cows come home about the danger of burning your plants and give you 10 reasons why you should immediately move to 1/4 nutes to avoid the burn. I come from a clan of old growers and we have an adage... If you are not at least burning the tips, you are not trying hard enough. Think about that... isn't the whole purpose of nutes to supercharge our plants, or at least make them better than they would have been without the nutes?
By definition, fertilizer is intended to give your plants a bit of a push, and there is a fine line between a push and a bit too much. Even in an organic soil without giving nutes, my soil is so rich that my tips burn just a little bit, all through my grow. It does not hurt a thing to have your plants right on this edge... it means you are getting the most out of your plants as possible. A tip burn is not a crisis... it should be a badge of honor. If you really start over fertilizing your plants, things get a lot uglier than just a little tip burn... the leaves will claw on you, the color will go really whack... or the plant will just get sick... it is obvious when it happens. A little bit of burn is desired in my garden. I guess it just depends on who is giving the advice as to the importance of this. I say this, because if you are doing the FF nutes correctly, you will see just a little triangle of tip burn on your new growth unless you have super powerful lights and are capable of pushing the plants even harder than the nutes were designed for... and this is totally normal.
The Proper Way to Water a Potted Plant (in soil) - STICKY
Emmie's Links, Journals and Tutorials
Berry-D'licious No AACT Organic - Grow Journal
Pineapple Chunk Mega Crop Test - Grow Journal

 

[Shakenbaked]

This all makes perfect sense then and if we can get you watering based on a wet dry cycle and get you slowly watering the soil to saturation when you do, I think we can solve the watering problem.
The biggest problem here is the bad advice you have been getting. Many of the online forums tend to have a clique of armchair experts who no one on that board is willing to confront. They can say and even pontificate about any stupid thing and call it the truth, and on that board... it becomes the truth.
Here at 420mag we are a little different than most. No one on this board, no matter their experience, writing ability, personality... no one can get rated any higher than anyone else. We are all equal in stature, and only a few numbers in our stats can give you any indication who is the most active, most followed, and most responded to. But even armed with those numbers, there is no way to rate one of our members against another, other than by the weight of their words and how the others interact with them. This makes this board a lot more of a place where an honest open discussion can happen, and although it can sometimes get heated between strong personalities, the truth usually comes out on this board.
So don't trust everything you read on every forum out there... there are some that are just plain putting out bad information, consistently.
So, autos...
They are special and since they are genetically restricted in final size and length of life, some special ways of dealing with them have come into common practice. It is believed that they are so sensitive and growing so fast that it is best to start them in the final container and not have to transplant them. It is believed that you can't train them and that topping them is just silly. It is also believed that they need fewer nutes.
Autos are quite the rage these days, and if they required a special feeding system, you would think that every nutrient company out there would include special instructions just to grow these plants. The fact is that NONE of the nutrient companies do this. Makes you want to go hmmmm.
Let's throw some logic into the discussion... if an auto is actually a plant that is growing at a breakneck speed, faster than a regular cannabis plant, wouldn't it makes sense that it would be able to use MORE nutes than its regular counterpart? Again.... hmmmmm.
The truth is that a plant is a plant is a plant. A plant under bigger lights will have bigger nutrient needs. A bigger plant will have bigger needs than a smaller plant. A young plant needs less than an older more developed plant.
So yes, when an auto, or any other plant is small, it takes less nutes. But, look at the FF nutrient chart and they deal with this for you, since the week 1 dosage rates are completely different than the mix you make up for a 5th week flowering plant. They ramp up the nutes for a while and then at the appropriate time they start backing off on the nutes a bit... the scientists over there at FF really put a lot of work into designing this system for you. If it became clear in the cannabis community that their charts and feeding system didn't work, FF would lose a lot of customers, and they don't want that. I can assure you, the feeding charts are correct. You should be feeding about twice a week. You should be watering about every 3 days, and you should be giving nutes/water/nutes water all through the grow. Being a FF grow, you also should be doing a 3x the container sized flush about every 4 weeks also.
So, just as it looked in your picture, your plant is lacking some vital nutrients because of your unique interpretation of the feeding chart and you are starting to see the effect of that abuse on your leaves. If you continue what you are doing, it will continue to get worse. If your plants do survive till the end, they will likely have deficient buds, having lacked some basic nutrition all through the grow. You can fix this, but you need to work on doing that now because an auto is not going to wait for you. If you starve it now, it is going to remain small all through the grow.
Another factor that we haven't discussed, mainly because you are in promix, is pH. Promix is heavily buffered both high and low, and getting the pH exactly where the FF nutrients want it to be is not nearly so important in this medium. I don't believe pH to be a factor in what is happening here.

My suggestion is to first figure out this watering thing. You have a small struggling plant in large 5 gallon container. If you saturate that soil top to bottom, at best the plant will require a week or more to drain that water. Luckily, you are growing a weed, and there are two sets of roots, the bottom feeder roots and the top spreader roots. While the bottom roots are busy trying to suck up a lake of water, you can keep the upper roots happy too by giving them a light watering every 3 days or so. Water/nutes/water/nutes ... keep it coming in, at least every 3 days. If you are doing a top watering, just give enough water to soak into the first 4 inches, while trying to make the outer edges of the container the wettest spots so as to entice the spreader roots to grow laterally. After a week or so of concentrating on the top roots, the bottom will finally be getting dry, and when your moisture meter can show you that the water table has fallen all the way down into the last inch of the container, soak that entire container again to saturation with a proper watering.

Keep repeating this 2 stage watering until the top and bottom sync up and you can begin to properly water the entire container every 3 days. With this 2 stage system, you will then be able to properly feed your plant the recommended nutes, the plant will not go into hibernation mode between waterings, and that crinkled up look of complaint coming from the lower roots will go away after a couple of complete cyclings of the entire container.

Lastly, one of my pet peeves is that armchair experts are always harping about burning the plants. Egads, show a little bit of tip burn to them in a picture and they will pontificate till the cows come home about the danger of burning your plants and give you 10 reasons why you should immediately move to 1/4 nutes to avoid the burn. I come from a clan of old growers and we have an adage... If you are not at least burning the tips, you are not trying hard enough. Think about that... isn't the whole purpose of nutes to supercharge our plants, or at least make them better than they would have been without the nutes?
By definition, fertilizer is intended to give your plants a bit of a push, and there is a fine line between a push and a bit too much. Even in an organic soil without giving nutes, my soil is so rich that my tips burn just a little bit, all through my grow. It does not hurt a thing to have your plants right on this edge... it means you are getting the most out of your plants as possible. A tip burn is not a crisis... it should be a badge of honor. If you really start over fertilizing your plants, things get a lot uglier than just a little tip burn... the leaves will claw on you, the color will go really whack... or the plant will just get sick... it is obvious when it happens. A little bit of burn is desired in my garden. I guess it just depends on who is giving the advice as to the importance of this. I say this, because if you are doing the FF nutes correctly, you will see just a little triangle of tip burn on your new growth unless you have super powerful lights and are capable of pushing the plants even harder than the nutes were designed for... and this is totally normal.
The Proper Way to Water a Potted Plant (in soil) - STICKY
Emmie's Links, Journals and Tutorials
Berry-D'licious No AACT Organic - Grow Journal
Pineapple Chunk Mega Crop Test - Grow Journal

sorry for the late reply, it’s been a very busy week. But I have been improving my watering/feeding skills and following your recommendations. The plants are thanking me for it! The one that was sick has noticeably improved. I think she is going to make it after all. And the growth I’m getting out of the other plant is phenomenal! Thank you for the tips and helping solve some problems. Hopefully I’ll be posting about my first harvest around the new year! Really liking this forum, thanks again!