I screwed up my new seedlings - that normally doesn't happen

[SmokingWings]

That's what i mean they can't overwater company say.

My German language skill is very minor and the web page wants to dump cookies. I will not let it open. That means I cannot run it through a language program to convert it to English.

The problem was the lid on the tube box stupid move from me but it is what it is.. I am not a beginner growing lot of Herb but damn it...

It does take some experience with gardening. That will help make it easier to do. Sometimes it is better to try to plant other types of flower or vegetable seeds to get basic experience.

 

[Wastei]

Don't ever use a dome for seedlings if you don't have to. Start seedlings in a more aerated medium. That looks way to compacted and way to wet with no perlite for aeration. If you're worried about the direction of the taproot start your seeds in paper towel and place the taproot in a downward position.

Use a pressure sprayer bottle to feed seedlings to easier feed smaller volumes.

 

[SmokingWings]

That looks way to compacted and way to wet with no perlite for aeration.

Definitely too wet but the seed planting material is bought as a pre-made cube or block of either peat moss or shredded tree bark which has been mixed with a plant based glue and then pressed into the cube shape (msgs 15 &16). The product the original poster is using is mentioned in msg 18. It is a German website so either knowing the language or having a way to run it through a translation web page is needed.

The "rapid rooter" that I used several years ago were naturally porous so it only took a short time for excess water to drain out allowing air to enter. I have wandered around several stores looking at these blocks and they all look pretty much the same so I figure that they will all allow a natural aeration to take place without needing anything added.

Yep, the lid on the tote did not help either but I am sure that the original poster has that part figured out now.

 

[Azimuth]

But in coco it's hold normaly enough oxygen for seedlings

Right, but we're not talking about oxygen, we're talking about too wet. Think about seeds in nature. They generally germinate in moist leaf litter, not wrapped up in leaves at the bottom of a puddle.

 

[013]

Ditto on Wastei, domes are for clones to keep rh high while a cutting develops roots, but seedlings have roots from day 1. but there’s 1 caveat worth mentioning… clones struck in plain water typically don’t need a dome either.

yup more moisture (in a rapid rooter or grow media) leads to less available oxygen…

 

[Fietchen]

Ditto on Wastei, domes are for clones to keep rh high while a cutting develops roots, but seedlings have roots from day 1. but there’s 1 caveat worth mentioning… clones struck in plain water typically don’t need a dome either.

yup more moisture (in a rapid rooter or grow media) leads to less available oxygen…

But water first then let it litte dry over the days that's normaly what i have done very much not a problem ore direct in coco

 

[Azimuth]

Ok, you can argue with us if you want. There is a big difference between a seed and a rooted seedling that is able to uptake moisture.

You've had several accomplished growers all tell you the same thing. Too wet. Let it dry a bit. Lose the dome.

It's your grow so do what you want, but many collective years of growing are all saying the same thing, advice you don't seem to want to take.

 

[013]

Weed roots need moisture but they also need oxygen… in fact weed roots love oxygen but will not tolerate exposure to light.

More water does not equal more growth, or more water does not equal faster growth.…

weed plants can develop soil type roots or they can develop water type roots but either way- oxygen must be present (in the substrate or rapid rooter) or the sprout or seedling will die from damping off or lack of oxygen…

easy on the water for babies, maybe use 1 squeeze from a spray bottle and kitchen scales to keep an eye on how much a dry rapid rooter weighs versus what a wet rapid rooter weighs…

 

[Roy Growin]

Weed roots need moisture but they also need oxygen… in fact weed roots love oxygen but will not tolerate exposure to light.

More water does not equal more growth, or more water does not equal faster growth.…

weed plants can develop soil type roots or they can develop water type roots but either way- oxygen must be present (in the substrate or rapid rooter) or the sprout or seedling will die from damping off or lack of oxygen…

easy on the water for babies, maybe use 1 squeeze from a spray bottle and kitchen scales to keep an eye on how much a dry rapid rooter weighs versus what a wet rapid rooter weighs…

This is the reason for adding a tiny amount of H2O2 to the water you soak seeds in - so the moment the seed cracks, it doesn't drown

 

[Azimuth]

This is the reason for adding a tiny amount of H2O2 to the water you soak seeds in - so the moment the seed cracks, it doesn't drown

But the H2O2 also kills off the beneficial microbes the seed brings along with it. Not good for an organic grow, at least.

 

[Roy Growin]

But the H2O2 also kills off the beneficial microbes the seed brings along with it. Not good for an organic grow, at least.

I know that's traditional wisdom and perfectly logical, but I have never witnessed any detriment personally

 

[SmokingWings]

But the H2O2 also kills off the beneficial microbes the seed brings along with it. Not good for an organic grow, at least.

I know that's traditional wisdom and perfectly logical, but I have never witnessed any detriment personally

Not all that long ago someone had posted in one of the messages that the usual chlorinated tap water will kill off some beneficial micro-organisms but there are enough that survive and start reproducing fast enough that the population is back up within a day or so. I am thinking that using H2O2 is the same sort of situation except maybe an extra day or two for repopulating depending on the strength.

Following some links it would seem that the Hydrogen Peroxide dilution of 3% or less does not cause an issue and is still beneficial because of the release of the one Oxygen atom just leaves plain water behind. If the dilution is stronger than 3% the warnings are that the plant tissue on a new seedling can be damaged which seems to be more of an issue than the loss of the microbes.

Also some references regarding using the usual 3% H2O2 to combat Damping Off.

 

[Azimuth]

Not all that long ago someone had posted in one of the messages that the usual chlorinated tap water will kill off some beneficial micro-organisms but there are enough that survive and start reproducing fast enough that the population is back up within a day or so. I am thinking that using H2O2 is the same sort of situation except maybe an extra day or two for repopulating depending on the strength.

I know Emilya has made that comment in regard to using Geoflora nutes with tap water, and that came from the company itself. But in that case they are adding new microbes with every feeding. I'd imagine the tap water would be more detrimental to an organic grow if one weren't also supplementing new microbes at the same time.

Also some references regarding using the usual 3% H2O2 to combat Damping Off.

I'd rather use worm castings against the Damping Off Disease.

 

[SmokingWings]

I know Emilya has made that comment in regard to using Geoflora nutes with tap water, and that came from the company itself. But in that case they are adding new microbes with every feeding. I'd imagine the tap water would be more detrimental to an organic grow if one weren't also supplementing new microbes at the same time.

I remember those conversations but the mention of microbe population reproduction after chlorinated watering was from another long time member....just do not remember who.

The normal population reproduction rate seems to be key. The microbes and micro-organisms are able to reproduce fast enough that their population is back to what it should be and is stable within hours to a day or so. Went back and looked and the big study seems to come from the Colorado State University which is the home university for that state's College of Agricultural Sciences.

This is just for a discussion on chlorinated water:
"Under normal conditions, chlorinated water will not threaten microorganism populations. Microorganisms reproduce rapidly. In one study, researchers continuously applied highly chlorinated water to soil for 126 days. Two days after they stopped, the soil microorganism populations reached pre-treatment levels at all depths of soil."

and a bit further into the university's publication:
"One reason chlorinate water has little impact is that chlorine binds to soil particle surfaces. This immobilizes chlorine and reduces its ability to kill microorganisms. The organisms in the topmost surface of soil or a compost pile may be affected after irrigation but as the water moves downward little chlorine remains. In one study, researchers found that water chlorinated at 5 parts per million killed organisms only in the top half inch of soil. Organisms deeper than one half inch were thriving."

Both above quotes from:
1548 – Impact of Watering Lawns and Gardens with Chlorinated Water – PlantTalk Colorado

As for the Hydrogen Peroxide there is very little mention of unwanted effects on soil life. It is as if the benefits outweigh any detriments such as the killing off beneficial organisms A major study often mentioned is where the peroxide killed off Fusarium and left a still healthy population of several good micro-organisms. And, I definitely get the impression that the breakdown of the H2O2 to H20 and O is so quick that there is little time for it to do a major kill off.

 

[Azimuth]

Interesting. Thanks for that.

 

[Fietchen]

Ok, you can argue with us if you want. There is a big difference between a seed and a rooted seedling that is able to uptake moisture.

You've had several accomplished growers all tell you the same thing. Too wet. Let it dry a bit. Lose the dome.

It's your grow so do what you want, but many collective years of growing are all saying the same thing, advice you don't seem to want to take.

Hey, I let it Dry and i squeeze the new Cube out of moisture i thought the cubes breaks apart but it works well the dome is not on it at the beginning of the new Seeds! I see some Seeds maybe 2 show sign of Tap Root so good sign here.. I use the Dome last grows without problem but i only have 1-2 seeds in it so they coming nicely but now i use more cubes 4-5 so the moisture goes up in the small tube and the holes was not big enough for all the cubes so they dying of to wet and to humidity..

 

[Fietchen]

I remember those conversations but the mention of microbe population reproduction after chlorinated watering was from another long time member....just do not remember who.

The normal population reproduction rate seems to be key. The microbes and micro-organisms are able to reproduce fast enough that their population is back to what it should be and is stable within hours to a day or so. Went back and looked and the big study seems to come from the Colorado State University which is the home university for that state's College of Agricultural Sciences.

This is just for a discussion on chlorinated water:
"Under normal conditions, chlorinated water will not threaten microorganism populations. Microorganisms reproduce rapidly. In one study, researchers continuously applied highly chlorinated water to soil for 126 days. Two days after they stopped, the soil microorganism populations reached pre-treatment levels at all depths of soil."

and a bit further into the university's publication:
"One reason chlorinate water has little impact is that chlorine binds to soil particle surfaces. This immobilizes chlorine and reduces its ability to kill microorganisms. The organisms in the topmost surface of soil or a compost pile may be affected after irrigation but as the water moves downward little chlorine remains. In one study, researchers found that water chlorinated at 5 parts per million killed organisms only in the top half inch of soil. Organisms deeper than one half inch were thriving."

Both above quotes from:
1548 – Impact of Watering Lawns and Gardens with Chlorinated Water – PlantTalk Colorado

As for the Hydrogen Peroxide there is very little mention of unwanted effects on soil life. It is as if the benefits outweigh any detriments such as the killing off beneficial organisms A major study often mentioned is where the peroxide killed off Fusarium and left a still healthy population of several good micro-organisms. And, I definitely get the impression that the breakdown of the H2O2 to H20 and O is so quick that there is little time for it to do a major kill off.

How much h2o2 you would add to seedlings in 3%

I water my cubes with Osmosis Water so no chlorine

 

[Azimuth]

Hey, I let it Dry and i squeeze the new Cube out of moisture i thought the cubes breaks apart but it works well the dome is not on it at the beginning of the new Seeds! I see some Seeds maybe 2 show sign of Tap Root so good sign here.. I use the Dome last grows without problem but i only have 1-2 seeds in it so they coming nicely but now i use more cubes 4-5 so the moisture goes up in the small tube and the holes was not big enough for all the cubes so they dying of to wet and to humidity..

Sounds promising. Honestly I'd only use the dome to keep the puck from drying out but it doesn't seem like you'll have that issue.

Good luck with the new beans!

 

[Fietchen]

Morning guy's wish you a nice sunnday. 3 from 5 seeds showing tap root but 1 not crack open so i place it in a litte jar with 15ml H2O2 and 80ml Osmosis Water. I will let it sit there for 12-24 hours and place it back in a cube and hopefully it will germ maybe the seed is litte to old 3-4 year's but the other strain from that Breeder are pop so hopefully it will pop soon the H2O2 will help.

I made a huge mistake with a lid that's never happen again i shame a bit because i am not a beginner after years of growing lol

 

[Fietchen]

This study here is very interesting Development and Standardization of Rapid and Efficient Seed Germination Protocol for Cannabis sativa

1% h2o2 is the best solution for germinate Seeds old ore new so my recipe with 15ml to 80ml is litte under the 1% but i belive also very good. Let's see what's happening in the next 24 h