Living soil, worms and cover clover crops indoors

[falstaffo]

as it says in the title, looking into switching from coco to living soil
found an interesting site that make their own soil,
ingredient list is -

3 part base mix of Laverstoke Park Farm Compost, Applecart Worm Castings, Coco Coir & Buckwheat Hulls, with added natural amendments
Neem Meal, Kelp Meal, Fish Meal & Krill Meal for nutrition plus Gypsum & Volcanic Rock Dust for all other essential minerals.

We also now add Ecothrive Charge to increase diversity of microbes and give the soil an extra boost!

The Ultimate version is improved further by adding Pumice & BioChar to improve structure, aeration and homes for microbes, as well as long term nutrient release and boosted microbial diversity

copy pasted the main info, sound alright? it is intended as a soil for life all ready to go,its not cheap, but then how much is the cost of buying all the base ingredients to blend your own, and add in the ‘cooking’ time...

so they also supply worms and clover crops for a chop and drop mulch

anyone ever tried this with our little weeds here?
curious about it tbh, i guess the worms eventually die, and you just leave em in with everything between grows in that mix?

anyways, i decided the resources, time commitment and bore of mixing nutes and ph’ng crap in coco is a pain in the arse. plus organic is organic so...

in a few weeks il be gearing up to germinate some seeds hopefully and want to make the switch then so looking to get all the info ican in now
peace and health

 

[falstaffo]

guess not then???

 

[falstaffo]

who are the living soil specialists??
@Emilya i know to tag
can youtag any others? wannaget some opinions lol

 

[falstaffo]

@420 could we move this to the organic soil section pls eddy! thanks

 

[Blew Hiller]

I make my own living soil and it is close to the list you posted....I add perlite for aeration and coco for moisture retention.,..never heard/tried buckwheat hulls...I wonder if that is what they use to replace perlite/vermiculite? @bobrown14 is and @Nunyabiz will be able to chime in and discuss. Do you plan on growing indoors? I have had worms live through an entire grow, so it's possible (but doesn't really matter...there should be enough castings to carry the load in the beginning).

What do they charge btw?

Really Living Soil

• Blew Hiller
• Feb 1, 2019
• vermicomposting

Blew Hiller Winter Grow 2019

 

[falstaffo]

I make my own living soil and it is close to the list you posted....I add perlite for aeration and coco for moisture retention.,..never heard/tried buckwheat hulls...I wonder if that is what they use to replace perlite/vermiculite? @bobrown14 is and @Nunyabiz will be able to chime in and discuss. Do you plan on growing indoors? I have had worms live through an entire grow, so it's possible (but doesn't really matter...there should be enough castings to carry the load in the beginning).

What do they charge btw?

Really Living Soil

• Blew Hiller
• Feb 1, 2019
• vermicomposting

Blew Hiller Winter Grow 2019

yep growing indoors, in coco, with height restrictions, but the coco is a drain though lol on water on nutes on time and so the plan is just to swap to this, i wont go over 5 plants really ever, and likely never more than 15-20l pots, they will be 30l ones rolled down to have a wider shallower base to try and help with height but allow soul volume,
i have a couple of 20l black tubs for storing the soil in when needed, i figure after harvest il remove fresh soil for new batch and stick the used in to do what it does..?

you are US right, in your terms $130 for 50l bag
there is 3 versions, the one i pasted is the ultimate and most expensive at that price, there is a pro and a base version each with some less ingredients, the pumice and biochar for example

 

[Blew Hiller]

wider shallower base to try and help with height but allow soil volume

I've seen the shallow wide pots but wasn't aware they kept height down. I did clones lacked a taproot and thus didn't need to go deep (but still went wide)...

$130 for 50l bag

50L as in 13 gallons of soil? (I'm American...I struggle with metric ) If so...not cheap. But, you are correct in that you get what you pay for and that list of ingredients is super solid. For that money I would also inquire what is in their compost since it is the starting point....

Also, at that price you could start your own small vermiculture bin and keep rolling the old soil into that and extending your soil life

 

[falstaffo]

I've seen the shallow wide pots but wasn't aware they kept height down. I did clones lacked a taproot and thus didn't need to go deep (but still went wide)...

50L as in 13 gallons of soil? (I'm American...I struggle with metric ) If so...not cheap. But, you are correct in that you get what you pay for and that list of ingredients is super solid. For that money I would also inquire what is in their compost since it is the starting point....

Also, at that price you could start your own small vermiculture bin and keep rolling the old soil into that and extending your soil life

well i dont know that the shallow wide will help in keeping the actual plants small themselves just means the base of the stem is closer to the ground haha scraping for every inch

50l as in 13 us gallons right, that is liquid gallon not dry gallon though,

the laverstoke compost i checked their website direct and says its green waste,
so basically it means it comes from our green waste bins which residential neighbourhoods put all their food and garden waste..

soil for life by indoororganics is the maker of the soil, i looked at the sohum but says you cannot reuse,

this one is in the name.. lol

so a vermiculture bin, sorry for my lack of knowledge, could you ellaborate lol, will have to look that up.

 

[Blew Hiller]

just means the base of the stem is closer to the ground

:wink got it

50l as in 13 us gallons right, that is liquid gallon not dry gallon though

Yes, hence my confusion...but I think that is how they measure pots in gallons....I run 10x 30-65 gallon pots every summer, so that is more like 200+ gallons (dry)...

it comes from our green waste bins which residential neighbourhoods put all their food and garden waste

good, but having some manure in there would be better....

i looked at the sohum but says you cannot reuse

they only say that so you'll buy more

a vermiculture bin

making your own compost with no smell and you get an amazing soil amendment/base. Get a covert plastic bin, add some shredded newspaper and/or some old dirt, moisten it, throw in some vegetable scraps, coffee grounds, egg shells and a handful of red wriggler worms...they'll convert all that into the best compost you can't buy...worm castings are collected by sifting the worm bins...when you do you own you keep all of it, and that is referred to as vermicompost (VC).

 

[falstaffo]

yeah i did wonder if that was just why they said it lol bit like the nutrient schedules these companies put out lol

have been trying to find out what else is in there, cant see manure anywhere but its a large farm producing buffalo mozzarella mmm amongst other things lol
perhaps il drop them an email and ask.

will defo look into the vc, thanks for that link will watch it shortly

i also like the clover crop ideas as living mulch which dies back into the soil, have found a few threads on here of people doing that now, is that somehing you do??

 

[Blew Hiller]

thanks for that link will watch it shortly

It's 20 seconds and just shows how VC looks when it is done

is that somehing you do??

I don't....green manure (plants) are best used in composts, not on the actual growing area.

 

[Nunyabiz]

I do a version of the Clackamas Coots recipe, basically all buildasoil products.

For aeration there's charged biochar that's been soaked in a microbe tea, pumice and rice hulls.
The rice hulls release silica as they break down.
I use large fabric pots, at least 25 gallon this gives lots of soil for the roots to milk all the nutrients they need.
It also gives a nice home for the worms, I have twice the worms now that I started with.
I grow a cover crop of nitrogen fixers to add nitrogen to the soil and I trim it every single day to keep a mulch layer of green manure for the worms.
I chop it up kinda fine and the worms make wonderful Unicorn Poop out of the cover crop and the Gro-kashi and the sprouted seed teas I dont strain the blended up seeds I add them to soil for the worms.

I also have a massive population of both Rove Beetles and Hyopasis Miles predator Mites so fungus gnats are history.
Also the Gro-kashi gets a nice fungus carpet going which helps break down the amendments in the soil and the bugs and worms love eating also.

 

[falstaffo]

cool thankyou, will read your journal and have a look, have seen the predator mites where im looking at the soil from, hopefully wont need them lol
lots to take in, still so much to learn,

can you recommend any links for any useful pages to read?

i have the revs tlo 2nd edition il read it onhol in a couple of weeks

 

[falstaffo]

after a quick search on gro-kashi, im not sure its available here.

 

[Blew Hiller]

will read your journal and have a look

My journal is fairly long (and varied) so save your time..but feel free to jump in at the current page ...this is a helpful thread that is current today. Otherwise type "vermicompost" in search and see where that leads you.

 

[falstaffo]

had just found it actually and got to theend lol
i think i am getting my head around it, will sleep on the info some and see what i can come up with lol

 

[Nunyabiz]

after a quick search on gro-kashi, im not sure its available here.

Would "here" be Falstaff Arizona?
You can get Grokash shipped damn near anywhere I would think.

Gro Kashi - Probiotic Amendment

POGro Kashi FREE SHIPPING on select Gro Kashi! If you want to add Effective Microorganisms to your soil you could purchase cheap bokashi bran from overseas or you could get an Artisan Crafted United States Made Product with Lot's of extras that put this product on the top shelf and a tremendous...

buildasoil.com

 

[falstaffo]

Would "here" be Falstaff Arizona?
You can get Grokash shipped damn near anywhere I would think.

Gro Kashi - Probiotic Amendment

POGro Kashi FREE SHIPPING on select Gro Kashi! If you want to add Effective Microorganisms to your soil you could purchase cheap bokashi bran from overseas or you could get an Artisan Crafted United States Made Product with Lot's of extras that put this product on the top shelf and a tremendous...

buildasoil.com

not in the US mate
seems it was on amazon here at one point maybe but currently unavailable

 

[Nunyabiz]

not in the US mate
seems it was on amazon here at one point maybe but currently unavailable

Ahh, I am not sure if Buildasoil ships out of the country or not, it might.

You can also make your own, they give you the recipe on the buildasoil site.

 

[bobrown14]

guess not then???

Very very similar to what I run no-till.

Google "Coots Mix and No-till "

Ingredients are cheaper than you think.

The most important input is the humus portion.
Compost or vermi-compost. IF you're a gardener you should be able to either make your own or source that locally.

The only thing I send away for in the Neem Cake and Karanja Cake.

@ 1 cup each per cubic foot of soil (7.5 gal), I have a 10 year supply on hand and it cost me like $40.

What continent are you living on? Likely there's local resources available.

Neem and Karanja come from India, kelp is everywhere same with worm castings and compost. Shouldn't have to go far for any of the ingredients.

Any "meal" like crustacean meal/shimp/crab - you should be able to source that locally at your local "feed" store. Where they sell stuff to "feed" animals.

Lots of the same stuff we feed our animals can be used to feed soil microbes.

There's nothing in that list of ingredients you posted that will require any "cooking". That term "cook" is he same thing a "composting". Just substitute composting for cooking and then it will be more clear.

Lots of folks use amendments like Alfalfa meal - this is a green manure when added to soil. It will cause the microbes to go into overdrive and that heats up the soil.... that's an example of "cooking" soil. Basically I'm "cooking" my kitchen scraps in my vermi-compost bin. The worms move to a cooler spot and the soil heats up for a week or so then worm business as usual. like that

We just made a batch of soil yesterday Coots mix - put into #3 nursery pots and planted lightly rooted currant clones. They are still alive today! woot.