Move To Legalize Marijuana In California Sparks Fears About Drop In Prices

I grow my own. I have no need for dispensaries. When they are all moved to industrial areas and closed it will have no impact on me.
Spend your money at the hydro store. A poster talked about "paying employees" They refer to themselves as "volunteers" and volunteers are not paid. I read that Organica made $5 million in 13 months.
 
Yup and the oporating costs of the red cross is 1.7 billion so what is your point????

Red Cross to Charge More for Blood - ABC News

Come on now... blood is given freely... so why do they charge people and insurance companies money for you to get it and recieve it... come on now people... blood is produced in the human body and should be free... FREE THE BLOOD DAMNIT!

Red cross CEO: McGovern will start June 23, leaving Harvard after six years on faculty. Her salary will be $500,000, plus a $65,000 signing bonus. why no bitching about her making a 6 figure income for a non-profit... come on now.

Corporate Leader Named Red Cross CEO - washingtonpost.com

and this is in 2008

So what the dispensories have money on hand and I am sure some of their people make decent if not really good money... however it is no where compared to other non-profit organizations... Oh and mind you... red cross volunteers get paid for there time.
 
I grow my own. I have no need for dispensaries. When they are all moved to industrial areas and closed it will have no impact on me.
Spend your money at the hydro store. A poster talked about "paying employees" They refer to themselves as "volunteers" and volunteers are not paid. I read that Organica made $5 million in 13 months.

Also if your are growing your own... then why don't you grow for the people in your community and give it to them for free????
 
Yup and the oporating costs of the red cross is 1.7 billion so what is your point????

Red Cross to Charge More for Blood - ABC News

Red cross CEO: McGovern will start June 23, leaving Harvard after six years on faculty. Her salary will be $500,000, plus a $65,000 signing bonus.

Corporate Leader Named Red Cross CEO - washingtonpost.com

and this is in 2008

So what the dispensories have money on hand and I am sure some of their people make decent if not really good money... however it is no where compared to other non-profit organizations... Oh and mind you... red cross volunteers get paid for there time.

Oh yea and for those who do not know... 1 billion is 1000 million and the red cross's oporation cost's is 1.7 billion as compared to organica's measly 5 million.
 
If it causes a drop in the importation of Mexican dirt-weed, which would help to keep this country's money in this country - thereby cutting at least some of the fuel which has long caused violence and deaths in Mexico - I'd vote for it.

Amen...

This thread is truly a very interesting read. Love it! ;-)
 
TorturedSoul said:
If it causes a drop in the importation of Mexican dirt-weed, which would help to keep this country's money in this country - thereby cutting at least some of the fuel which has long caused violence and deaths in Mexico - I'd vote for it.

Funny thing is... you can... go out and buy everything you need to grow and then grow it. Then when you get your harvest in... sell it for 1.00 a pound. Come on now people... lead by example. To think it will stop the violence... you got to be kidding me. Marijuana is one aspect of the drug trade... you have to legalize all of it in order to kill the cartel's and gangs... think people... please.
 
Back in the day, there's was talked of all kinds of crazy government conspiracies and the people thought that the government was withholding information from them, so they passed that act. But that only applies to government agencies and there are exceptions.

One is generally hesitant to post in any thread which contains the phrase "crazy government conspiracies," lol, but in for a penny, in for a pound. The Freedom of Information Act... "Looks good on paper." Of course our fearless leaders run such an intricate set of "double books" that mafia accountants the world over could take lessons.

So Im not sure what this has to do with non-profit organizations.

Is that what this thread is about?


Yup and the oporating costs of the red cross is 1.7 billion so what is your point????

<LINK>

Come on now... blood is given freely... so why do they charge people and insurance companies money for you to get it and recieve it... come on now people... blood is produced in the human body and should be free... FREE THE BLOOD DAMNIT!

Red cross CEO: McGovern will start June 23, leaving Harvard after six years on faculty. Her salary will be $500,000, plus a $65,000 signing bonus. why no bitching about her making a 6 figure income for a non-profit... come on now.

<LINK>

and this is in 2008

So what the dispensories have money on hand and I am sure some of their people make decent if not really good money... however it is no where compared to other non-profit organizations... Oh and mind you... red cross volunteers get paid for there time.

I get the feeling that you are automatically assuming that a person's belonging to a web site such as this one and being willing to bitch about the issue of dispensary-owners and -managers making gross profits from the ills of others somehow prevents that person from being "politically-" (everything is) active about other situations where the same can be said.

Not so, lol. There are plenty who are far more concerned with issues like this on general principles than because it just happens to threaten either their favorite recreational activity or their bottom line.

And because the people that are often tasked to fund the profits and large salaries... are those least able to afford it.

So-called non-profit organizations which are in affect corporations that, instead of paying dividends to shareholders, pay astronomical salaries, benefits, and bonuses to one or a very few principal figures within the organizations is just one of the things that some of your fellow members worry about (and by worry about, I mean addressing their government representatives, writing open letters to print and video news media, trying to inform and educate people in their communities, etc.). As are issues such as the runaway lobbying by organizations that are chiefly (and often solely) concerned with their own profits, the disregard of safety of others for a business' or individual's profit, being able to disregard EPA mandates simply by paying fines that are the smallest fraction of a percentage of one's profit, being able to unduly influence the EPA and other government agencies, the lack of proper testing (or safe-guards) where GM foods and other plant-sourced items, allowing some foods/drugs/etc. to escape testing by the FDA while subjecting others to most rigorous testing, etc., etc., etc....

But such is not really the scope of this thread.

I know... what he should do... is go out... buy all the stuff needed to grow and do everything that a collective, dispensory or delivery service would do and give it all away for free...! Of course he won't as I am sure he does not have the money to do so... and if he does then what is he waiting for????

He should lead by example or be quiet.

Also if your are growing your own... then why don't you grow for the people in your community and give it to them for free????

Funny thing is... you can... go out and buy everything you need to grow and then grow it. Then when you get your harvest in... sell it for 1.00 a pound. Come on now people... lead by example.

It might surprise you to learn that some people do just that (grow for free and give away product). Or, if you are primarily concerned with profit/loss in life, you may choose to disbelieve.

It's kind of sad to stop and consider that this seems to happen most often in the states where there not only are no "recreational" bills being considered, there also aren't any "medical" laws on the books, either. So such people are criminals in the eyes of their local and state LEOs and governing bodies - and the fact that they do what they do out of a desire to help others in no way mitigates the fact that they face the loss of what they have (including personal freedom); therefore, in addition to the usual set of worries comes the one that if they get caught they will no longer be able to help people. People like that also (obviously) do not have legal counsel on retainer (or the funds to hire an attorney if they get arrested). Although they will occasionally be placed into contact with a friendly lawyer.

To think it will stop the violence... you got to be kidding me. Marijuana is one aspect of the drug trade... you have to legalize all of it in order to kill the cartel's and gangs... think people... please.

I try to think all of the time, lol. One of the things that I think is that the average small-time cannabis grower (or even dealer) is not the type of person who uses violence to achieve their goals.

It is the large, commercial grower with hundreds of plants who uses traps, snipers, etc. to protect their profits. So yes, as legalization is the first step in regulation, I do feel that it could decrease drug-related violence.

Add to that the fact that there have been (and continue to be) violent acts carried out by LEO against cannabis growers/consumers in "the name of the law" that legalization would curtail.

Consider the fact that many people who grow, consume, or even sell cannabis are opposed to crack (c0caine), her0in, and crystal meth (and several of the most often abused prescription drugs) because of the violence associated with them and/or the destruction wreaked upon homes, families, and communities by the users and sellers of same. Many of the "cannabis crowd" see things every day that they could be reporting - or directly fighting to stop - but they do no such thing because of either a real or perceived fear that sticking their neck out will cause their activities to be noticed. If their activities were legal, OTOH, such constraints would be removed, yes?

And another thing, lol. The cartel's and gang's profit comes chiefly because there is such a large demand for the more noxious substances. And much of that, you may have heard, comes not from people's desire for recreation, but instead out of a need to escape the hellish life that they live. Or to deaden themselves against the things that they feel the need to do. A far better way to go about tackling the problem than to legalize everything across the board would perhaps be to put more effort into helping the people that are living such lives - and to help stop the situations that bring such lives about in the first place.
 
The price isn't going to matter to the growers because if it becomes legalized they will be priced out of the market by big business. All commercial growing will be done by the large companies that have the money to do it. If you want to grow at home for personal use then fine but the growers that exist now will be gone in a very short period of time. The government will make it impossible to grow unless you are a huge company will lots and lots and lots of money.
 
The price isn't going to matter to the growers because if it becomes legalized they will be priced out of the market by big business. All commercial growing will be done by the large companies that have the money to do it. If you want to grow at home for personal use then fine but the growers that exist now will be gone in a very short period of time. The government will make it impossible to grow unless you are a huge company will lots and lots and lots of money.

And there you have it... large profits with no regard for anyone but the corporation.
 
Originally Posted by MMRC Grower View Post

So Im not sure what this has to do with non-profit organizations.

Is that what this thread is about?

This Thread... Yes. It is indirectly related to this thread. NPO's and there tax returns will be affected by Legalization and price drops, which this thread is about.

You really spent some time on this one. I have ton's to say in response to it..... be back tonight with a spot light to shine on it.
 
the reduction in price is exactly what is expected and wanted after going through the legalization process. the prices will not plummet (already @ $200 per medical ounce) below current prices imho.

the best of weed will ALWAYS get the best dollar & because it won't be sold as medical cannabis the stipulation of "Not for Profit" goes right out the window; add taxation into the equation and you might actually see a very slight rise in price for your 'recreational cannabis' purchases.

Add in the ZERO risk of being arrested (unless you get fed
attn) and the cost/risk/reward/profit makes it a big winner.


in short if you're complaining about legalization then you're
no bro of mine, get off your lazy butt and get a real job.
 
the reduction in price is exactly what is expected and wanted after going through the legalization process. the prices will not plummet (already @ $200 per medical ounce) below current prices imho.

the best of weed will ALWAYS get the best dollar & because it won't be sold as medical cannabis the stipulation of "Not for Profit" goes right out the window; add taxation into the equation and you might actually see a very slight rise in price for your 'recreational cannabis' purchases.

Add in the ZERO risk of being arrested (unless you get fed
attn) and the cost/risk/reward/profit makes it a big winner.


in short if you're complaining about legalization then you're
no bro of mine, get off your lazy butt and get a real job.

Spoken like a true thug who has no idea what it is or like to run a business. It takes money and smarts to insure it runs smoothly and legally. You have no idea why people get into this business. For some it is not about making tons of money.... for some it is what puts food on the table and keeps the lights on and you want big corporate to come in and take that away. It is not about lazyness... what about those who can not work because of injury and for them... this is a new way of life.

Your right you are not my brother... my brother would understand. I know collectives that give all they can for the homeless and other charities as well as give free marijuana to those who need it. So again you are right... you are not my brother. You want to be greedy and give it to the corporate world and the government to take all that away. I sure do not see them caring about charities or the homeless.

So again... there is always to sides to every story.

p.s remember it is not the corporate world that makes the USA float but the small businesses that do... again... you want to take that away and give it to the government and the corprorate world... hear what your saying loud and clear!
 
Let me tell you a little story... there once was a man who worked hard his whole life. One time in his life he was homeless but fought real hard and got back on his feet. Joined the military and served his country well. When he got out he did construction for about 10 years and suffered a back injury... No one would help. On unemployment no one would hire him because of his injury and to top it off... he make 35.00 above the cut off for social assistance. So him and his wife go back to school and are living on finacial aid and trying to ride out the economy. In the midst of all this he and some friends put a collective together to try and put food on the table for there families and help others in there community that need work... especially since the government and the corporate world do nothing for them. He does all he can to insure everyone is treated fairly and is paid well for the work that they do. They give to the homeless, provide for needy children and pay their taxes. His fear... that it will all be taken away once it is legal. He wants it to be legal but he does not want the government or corporate to destroy it for his collective. Why??? not because he is greedy... but because this is all he can do at this time and he is what is helping the people he knows and his community.

This is my brother... the average joe who served his country and is doing the best he can to make the world a better place around him!
 
The price isn't going to matter to the growers because if it becomes legalized they will be priced out of the market by big business. All commercial growing will be done by the large companies that have the money to do it. If you want to grow at home for personal use then fine but the growers that exist now will be gone in a very short period of time. The government will make it impossible to grow unless you are a huge company will lots and lots and lots of money.

How is the government going to do that when they can't do that now?
 
You really spent some time on this one. I have ton's to say in response to it..... be back tonight with a spot light to shine on it.

Not a great deal, actually. Most of it was spent in removing portions of my post before submitting it. I fear that I got "fired up" and my original unedited post simply would not have done.

the reduction in price is exactly what is expected and wanted after going through the legalization process. the prices will not plummet (already @ $200 per medical ounce) below current prices imho.

the best of weed will ALWAYS get the best dollar & because it won't be sold as medical cannabis the stipulation of "Not for Profit" goes right out the window; add taxation into the equation and you might actually see a very slight rise in price for your 'recreational cannabis' purchases.

Add in the ZERO risk of being arrested (unless you get fed
attn) and the cost/risk/reward/profit makes it a big winner.

in short if you're complaining about legalization then you're
no bro of mine, get off your lazy butt and get a real job.

Spoken like a true thug

I will assume that when you stated this you did so not out of a desire to insult a fellow member, but because you actually believe what you stated. So... Which part of his post (I quoted it in its entirety) exactly makes him come across as being a thug?

It's just that I find myself agreeing with that post in many ways and on the chance that it is coloring my perception of it I ask that you point out the thug-like part in case I just happened to miss it.

who has no idea what it is or like to run a business. It takes money and smarts to insure it runs smoothly and legally. You have no idea why people get into this business. For some it is not about making tons of money.... for some it is what puts food on the table and keeps the lights on and you want big corporate to come in and take that away. It is not about lazyness... what about those who can not work because of injury and for them... this is a new way of life.

I know first-hand what it takes to run a business - but not a cannabis-related one. It seems (to me) that the biggest difference is that there is still a chance that the cannabusinessman will at some point go to jail - although it just occurred to me that if one is pulling in higher profits than the "average" business owner does and justifies it by stating that it is because of the legal risk, then one cannot in all fairness make a point about that legal risk (since it is accounted for already at that point) but I digress. What I was going to state was that if the legal aspects (for all practical purposes) are removed from the profession then it would then be more-or-less on an even footing with other businesses. I can't see any problem with that.

I also cannot see one's ability to work (or not) due to an injury or any other reason as having any merit in this argument whatsoever. I mean I can understand why you personally might wish to have a job/profession that you can fully and completely do with whatever physical and mental abilities you happen to have. And don't get me wrong, I wish you continued success in having employment (or self-employment if you are the boss) if you are willing to work. Many people who are physically- and (arguably) mentally-fit do not try to work for a living and instead are willingly making of themselves a burden to the rest of us. So if you are doing the best you can with whatever you've got, you are to be commended for it.

But you are in no way owed a guaranteed position for life as a cannabis collective/dispensary owner. That's just not how life works, lol.

Incidentally, a very good friend of mine finally had to take "early retirement," that is, go on disability because she got to the point where she was having trouble guiding the fork to her mouth even while using both hands to do it, let alone getting herself to work and back five days a week. However, up to that point she had worked the past 21 years from a wheelchair. For the past few years she could not even transfer to/from her 'chair by herself.

So please forgive me if I get a little irate when people use the phrase "can't work because of injury" without going into at least some detail. Because I've seen some real (physical) trainwrecks put in 40+ hour weeks, week after week, year after year.

Your right you are not my brother... my brother would understand.

This is not meant to single you out, but your statement is one that I feel should be addressed. It is at this point that I realize that perhaps all of us have something worthy to state in this discussion. And we might just possibly be misunderstanding the other person's worthy points (some unwillingly, some willingly - that is probably best left to each individual to figure out). And yes, I must include myself in that statement as well; I'm not going to say that I understand everyone's points - although I'm making the effort.

But we are all brothers and sisters so to speak. And like your brother "who would understand," we really need to do the best that we can to understand each other's viewpoints - and if we feel that it is possible that we do not, to ask for clarification. Understanding does not require agreeing with, simply... understanding.

I know collectives that give all they can for the homeless and other charities as well as give free marijuana to those who need it.

That should describe 100% of them. Unfortunately, it does not. I am generally opposed to government regulation on principle. But yet again I am reminded that in this particular industry a strong regulating agency is needed. For that to truly work, the government doing the regulating must not be diametrically opposed to the entire process. Legalization would allow for that to happen; if cannabis in general becomes legal then it becomes quite unlikely that any agency tasked with regulating the medical aspects of it will be operating from the position that medical cannabis should not be.

And if your collectives are operating "legitimately," if they are ran with compassion and a philanthropic pattern of behavior, and if they are scrupulously honest and above-board in all their dealings... Then regulation should not pose any undue hardship.

So again you are right... you are not my brother. You want to be greedy and give it to the corporate world and the government to take all that away. I sure do not see them caring about charities or the homeless.

I do not see his statements as having greed as their motivation. I also do not see them as meaning that he wishes the cannabis industry to become 100% the purvey of "the corporate world."

But I admit that I could of course be mistaken. Therefore, I'll ask for clarification on these points. cinzanoooo, would you be kind enough to address (or readdress?) your post in regards to GanjaAL2's response? I do not wish to misunderstand anyone's points - and I assume that both of you feel the same.

BtW, as far as caring about charities or the homeless... Well, you've certainly got a point there since "government" is not a person per se and therefore cannot be said to have feelings. But if you think about it for a second, you'll realize that "government" (taking state, local, and federal and lumping them all together under the one blanket term) IS the largest single supporter of charities and the homeless in the country. Countless billions of dollars are disbursed every year under one government program or the other to pay for education, health care, food, shelter, clothing, arts & humanities, et cetera.

p.s remember it is not the corporate world that makes the USA float but the small businesses that do... again... you want to take that away and give it to the government and the corprorate world... hear what your saying loud and clear!

I'm still not sure that that is what he meant. In the event that it is not, see what I posted above about all of us making sure that we fully understand the other person's points.

Incidentally: Alcohol. Several billion dollar a year industry, I believe. Regulated by government. Corporate... Well, I cannot state "corporate America" because it's a world-wide industry and there are "giants" in the field that are owned by citizens of many different countries. But many of the real "heavy hitters" are corporations that are either chiefly or at least tangentially concerned with some facet of the alcohol industry. Legal in this country for everyone who is 21 years of age or older. Considered both a drug and a recreational/social item. And...

As of Decemer 31st, 2009 there were 1,551 breweries in the United States (the US is ranked first in the world) - and only 20 of those are considered "large non-craft" breweries.

The point I'm trying to make is that just because an industry is government-related and is one in which there are (very) large corporations operating - and reaping astronomical profits - does not mean that there will be no possibility of smaller - even down to "Mom & Pop" sized - businesses.

Let me tell you a little story... there once was a man who worked hard his whole life. One time in his life he was homeless but fought real hard and got back on his feet. Joined the military and served his country well. When he got out he did construction for about 10 years and suffered a back injury... No one would help. On unemployment no one would hire him because of his injury and to top it off... he make 35.00 above the cut off for social assistance. So him and his wife go back to school and are living on finacial aid and trying to ride out the economy. In the midst of all this he and some friends put a collective together to try and put food on the table for there families and help others in there community that need work... especially since the government and the corporate world do nothing for them. He does all he can to insure everyone is treated fairly and is paid well for the work that they do. They give to the homeless, provide for needy children and pay their taxes. His fear... that it will all be taken away once it is legal. He wants it to be legal but he does not want the government or corporate to destroy it for his collective. Why??? not because he is greedy... but because this is all he can do at this time and he is what is helping the people he knows and his community.

This is my brother... the average joe who served his country and is doing the best he can to make the world a better place around him!

As I stated earlier in this post, I would wish good things for everyone that tries to work (and doubly-so for those who try to help others). However, it is not the obligation of the cannabis industry to support and/or provide a livelihood for any one person - or, indeed, for any person. I just do not feel that this particular argument of yours is meritorious in this discussion. While I hope that "a man," be he you, your friend, relative, or someone you just happened to read about can do well in this industry since it is the one that he has chosen, if he does do well then great; if he cannot continue to survive as a business in the cannabis industry then he should switch to a different industry/field. That's the way that life works, lol. I have changed fields several times in my life because that's what you do if you wish to eat and your current profession no longer supports you. While certain types of learning - for example, learning new languages - are much harder for older adults than they are for young adults and children, learning in general is NOT something that can only be accomplished by the young. It is never too late to learn something new and that includes a new profession. When some of the plants around here that have been closing left and right went under, their former employees were able to qualify for training due to the fact that their professions no longer existed in this area. Most of them took advantage of the opportunity and many of them are gainfully-employed (in different fields) today.

As for the second part of that which I quoted (the part about helping the people in his community), if there is still a need for his business to help after cannabis becomes legal (assuming for the sake of discussion that it does) then he should be able to maintain a healthy business model. If, OTOH, prices drop so much that his help is no longer needed - well, that's a GOOD thing. Isn't it?

Perhaps the collective/dispensary owners, those who grow to sell to them, the doctors who make a profit from the patients that see them in order to "get a card," those businesses that make LOTS of money by "selling" those patients (and their paperwork) to collective/dispensary owners - a practice that I find absolutely reprehensible, BTW - and the traditional illegal growers and dealers... Perhaps all of the aforementioned people should not be allowed to vote on the legalization issue at all. I know that this goes against the tenants of this nation and that it couldn't happen and therefore I'm just "speaking" my thoughts rather than making an attempt to change our entire voting method, lol. But it is obvious from reading this and other threads of this nature that people tend to become very vocal and vote for whichever way pads their personal income/bank account/lifestyle/etc. rather than to vote for whichever way is most likely to allow for and provide the greater good of the society that they live in. So perhaps to help provide at least some semblance of objectivity in the voting arena in general (not speaking of cannabis in particular), might we be better off as a whole if any issue that does not directly involve a majority of the voting public that the principals - on either side - of the issue have to sit that vote out? There are things that I feel strongly about that affect me personally, and while I would LIKE to believe that I at all times would vote for the greater good, how can I say with 100% certainty that my own involvement would not be coloring my judgment?

Once again, I'd like to remind everyone to keep this and all other discussions here at 420Magazine civil and to do the utmost to understand the other person's point of view. Topics like this are going to raise strong feelings on both sides - that is a given. We have an excellent staff here and I'm sure that they are monitoring this thread (along with the other 50,000 threads, lol) to make sure that it doesn't cross the line and require closing so as to maintain order. I thank them for NOT having closed it and hope that it does not have to happen. (And as always, if anyone comes to feel that I cross that line in this or any other thread, please either let me know or ask a moderator to examine my posts - for I am just as "only human" (on a good day;)) as everyone else.)
 
YOur right and I am sorry for the negative responses and insults. I feel as of right now it is a catch 22 right now and should be more thought out. I feel that with legalization it will effect alot of people on both sides of the fence in different ways. Some negative and some possitive. I wish everyone the best on this and hope it works out for everyone involved.
 
I think this law would be GREAT! And California is a great place for the trend to start.

1 - Hopefully it will become like the Micro Brew industry in CA. There are hundreds of them on the west coast. One can still buy a Budweiser cheaper, but there are plenty of folks who like a micro brew and will pay extra for it. CA has a great history and culture of both micro brews and wineries and I hope Cannabis follows the same trends.

2 - The price will be what the market can bear. This is a good thing. The cream of the crop will still rise. There will be higher priced smoke. And small scale operations will have advantages there to keep their prices at the current levels. Things like a hand manicure will become worth something. Also, Sativa strains that take 2x as long and produce lower yield but better high will become more valuable, but also likely more available. There will be commercial grade weed and the micro brewery weed. And the fact that folks can grow it home means the small ops can't go crazy with their prices.

Just like when you go to buy a growing system. You first balance the costs of buying a system vs. what parts should be bought a la carte or DIY. If the final costs or quality of DIY don't provide significant benefit in time, money or function - then you buy it. But by the same token, the manufacturers know they have to base their prices on manufacturing costs and competition, not some magical number they just decide to pull out of the air. Same will be true of cannabis prices.

EDIT: Cause you can be DAMN sure the federal gov't won't be subsidizing any Cannabis farmers any time soon.

3 - It leaves it up to the individual areas to implement and tax as they want. As was mentioned in the article - Humboldt could think in terms of Cannabis tourism. Anyone who's ever done a winery tour will love this way of thinking. This is the kind of cultural and socio-economic step that California is so good at making.


Everyone should be thrilled by ANY new legislation that takes ANY step forward for greater cannabis awareness and re-legalization.

:peace:
 
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