Newbie to inside growing...Killing Seedlings, Please Help

[Rooki Root]

Hi Guy's, I'm new to using soil less mix and also to indoor growing. I've had good success outdoors but not anything to get wound up about. Anyway, I germinated 3 feminized NL's using the paper towel in a plastic container method for about 36 hours and they all popped. I put them directly into the soil with each of the half inch roots down and covered about 1/4" deep or so. By the next day they were all three protruding up lifting the seed with them and looking good to me. I built a OSB box and sealed it tight with liquid nails 3'X3'X5'. It has two 5" exhaust fans in the top. One in the side and one in the back, three 2-1/2" intake holes with filters in the bottom sides and back. Painted flat white on the inside, put a 9" fan in, two 150W 2700K all purpose Cfl's, one 200W 3500K Cfl. Here comes the fun part. I put the seedlings inside the box on day three and turned on the lights. The plants had been watered with 20% runoff when I planted them and had just started signs of drying on the top. I made the mistake of doing all this research, having everything I thought I needed, planning out each step, sit the plants in the box, close the door and forgot to drop the lights! Well, the next day when I return the seedlings are as long as your middle finger, popping the seeds off the top and going up. I'm moving the lights down to within 3 or 4 inches at this point but the stem two inches up seems flimsy and is starting to narrow. The temperature stayed around 73-83 degrees F all along but the humidity was low. Im saying 39-48, Im hearing that is low anyway. By the next day the tops of the soil was dry again (Im thinking because the heat and fan combo) and when I went to water, two of them just bent a crease in the stem and freaking fell over! Like boom, I was like what the heck? I never gave any nutes, only gave water that was ph'd 6.3 or so. I picked one back up with a piece cut from a straw and the other I dug around it and buried it back up to its leaves. The following day one died, the next day another, and today It looks like the last one is going too. Im reading that it might be damping-off. Maybe I over watered, or the humidity was too low? I am lost with this deal. Also forgot to mention that I had them planted in small plastic pots about 1.5 quarts or so. After the first died I tried to replant the other two in new pots with flushed fresh coco and perlite. The first time it was straight canna coco. Lights have been on 24 hours a day and I thought the last one would make it but the two sets of leaves are small and immature and slouching. It has been buried up to the top now as well and a few minutes ago I picked around the stem with a tooth pick and when I exposed it I see that it has shrunk to nothing and will die before tonight is here. Any suggestions for the other three seeds I have left? I have just soaked one a glass of water over night and am waiting on it to pop. How should I avoid these problems again? I went and bought 4 100W 6500K Cfl's as I heard the 6500k was better for veg stage.

Also I read some people say not to use a dome on your cup or tray for seedlings when planted. Some say humidity should be around 50-60 %. Some say 30-40%. Like I said, Im new to all this and need some solid advice. Can you place your cup in your box with the light after you"ve planted it root down or should you wait until the leaves show?

 

[Rooki Root]

Somebody had got to have some good advice! I'm hoping I can solve some of these issues with a few changes to my process. Any ideas on where I may need to start?

Thanks again!

 

[Richard Richardson]

You are drowning your seeds and then baking your seedlings, dude

12 hours in water is enough, then put the seeds into soil and mist the surface daily.

You can cover the pot with saran wrap until you see a seedling, if you want

Do not get the soil too wet, never let the soil dry out.

Seedlings need a gentle environment.

They only need 1 of your bulbs at the beginning.

Be the seedling

A baby newborn plant.

What would you want?

Warmth, but not too warm.

Moisture, but not too moist.

Light, but not full-on summer sun.

I hope this makes sense to 420Land.

 

[GreatLife4All]

I am not sure where the myth started that seedlings don't need nutrients. But it is killing a lot of plants on this site.

A seedling does, in fact, have a supply of food provided within the seed itself. It is enough to get the plant root initially developed and the initial leaves open - at that point you need photosynthesis... which requires nutrients. If you don't provide nutrients - the seedling runs out of food, gets weak, and dies quickly. The form of death can be any one of a 100 different things... but root cause is what matters.

If you plant a seedling into a soil mix - you should have everything you need for a couple of weeks. Watering only is appropriate.

If you plant a seedling into a soilless mix which has no nutrients... then a different feeding strategy is REQUIRED. Start the plant with 1/4 the nutrients you would feed a plant in veg immediately when you transplant. You can then just water on the next feeding. After a week, feed it 1/2 strength. At the end of two weeks, you should be able to apply full strength veg formulas... though the plant won't consume that much of it and you could save money by going a little lighter... but you also need to be able to recognize nute deficiency when it develops.

I have grown many seeds using this theory. Never killed or toppled one due to a weak stem. Have grown them under CFLs, HIDs, and a T5 without issue. Sometimes the CFLs are a long ways away... other times right on top. Light requirements at this stage are just not that critical from my experience... but feeding is.

If you are going to use a soilless medium with no nutrients... then you take on the responsibility for feeding the plant appropriately. You can't count on getting weak nutrients from the medium.

 

[Rooki Root]

Thanks for a reply. I know exactly what your saying as far as the nurture of the seedling and how it must feel. I guess I'm just really having a problem controlling the conditions in my grow space. The fan cools the temperatures but also drops humidity where on the hand if I cut it off the temps go up to the 90 range and also the plants have lil to no breeze. I put a humidifier in there last night and figured out how to get the a/c vents on in this spare room now temps are around 78F and humidity is 55%. Maybe this will be better for my two new seedlings when they break the surface but my last seedling that was standing has dried completely up and died as of this A.M.

Here is a pic of how she looked yesterday A.M.

 

[Rooki Root]

Sorry guys, that was her sister two days ago that already died yesterday. The plant that died today looked the same as this one but made it a little longer. Here is a pic of it as of yesterday after I buried it up to the leaves!

 

[Rooki Root]

GL4ALL, Thanks for talking about the nutes! You bring up a good point. I've been wondering about it a lot because I read that you shouldnt give your plant any for the first couple of weeks and I know canna coco has nothing much in it. So, your saying when the seedling pops up in the solo cup (which is half the height its supposed to be), just feed it water and then when I transplant into a 1 or 2 gallon pot throw the 1/4 mixed nutes to it? Or nutes in the solo the next time its dry? Also should I spray some water on the surface when feeding seedlings in the cup along with putting some in the bottom or what?

 

[trichomes]

Always good advice from Rod/"R", he forgot to say read some journals and vote for me! he's earned your vote, here's the link to 3 contests that are fun to contribute to. I hope your infants are recovering.

420 Contests

 

[rundmt]

lol my god different sites say different things like lights on 24 come on please no plant on earth is on 24 lights? next nutes i put in half a mil 0.5 theres 100 units in 1ml so of water at 5.8 ph ec dont know lol need help 250ml or 2.5ml per litre of water ok pointer im doing autos there touchy very about nutes i would hold off adding nutes except root stimulator guess what my plants or seeedlings anit grown as someone said growth depends on flowering an flowering depends on growth ive tried white widow by pyramid sold by rhino wont bother again staying with herbie he s the man then tryd again failed got 1 to 40cm and 1 at 15 cm lol all i got was a qauter after drying but hey i was chuffed with meself nutes shouldnt be given untill at least 15 days after sprouting also the white widow was ment to be a 7 weeker all in no shit i said bolllocks and it went to nr 11 weeks thts 4 weeks longer then stated but hey every ones differ im in coco with auto pots 4 2 in a trough no water and 2 in a trough with auto pot connected to water tank so what im doing is watering them in one drying in other 2 days in water 2 days out but all 4 plants a at different stages an state also 2 strains bb.nl autos and 2 afghan kush

 

[Rooki Root]

This is all thats left. She is in damp coco, humidity around 48-52%, Temp between 74-79F, and has one 23Watt 6500K Cfl sitting about 4 inches above. I dont know what else to do. The leaves are turning brown and curling up and the stem is shrinking! Any suggestions on what I done wrong? What not to do again? The other two seeds I have are in Burpee Seed Starter kit now. They had already germinated in a paper towel and are planted 1/4" deep in the starter tray and have the dome on it with heat pad too. Dont want to make the same mistakes I made with the first three but Im just bent on where it all went wrong and what to do to secure these future seedlings!!

 

[Richard Richardson]

Greatlife4all has a very good point with the nutes.

Coco has none to speak of, so you should definitely use a light dosage.

When I used coco, I added cal-mag and Medi-one (organic nutes) before I added water to the block,

so that the Coco had some staring nutrients that are normally in soil.

She looks like she could do with some food.

A picture tells a thousand words...

Can you get any "superthrive"?

 

[Rooki Root]

Here is the visual downfall or my personal Screw UP Reel, whatever you wanna call it. I'm not giving up though, hopefully I will figure this stuff out with a little help.

 

[Rooki Root]

Greatlife4all has a very good point with the nutes.

Coco has none to speak of, so you should definitely use a light dosage.

When I used coco, I added cal-mag and Medi-one (organic nutes) before I added water to the block,

so that the Coco had some staring nutrients that are normally in soil.

She looks like she could do with some food.

A picture tells a thousand words...

Can you get any "superthrive"?

I did add a little nutrients tonight, 1/4 strength of the canna-a/canna-b mix. the stem looks super fragile and weak. If you see the pics you can tell where the lights were up at first, then when I moved them down. I only had 44Watt all purpose bulbs 2700K. I made a lot of mistakes and thats making it hard for me to determine what I did that caused this the most. I did see Superthrive on the shelf at Lowes today. Whats the deal with it??

 

[Richard Richardson]

I did add a little nutrients tonight, 1/4 strength of the canna-a/canna-b mix. the stem looks super fragile and weak. If you see the pics you can tell where the lights were up at first, then when I moved them down. I only had 44Watt all purpose bulbs 2700K. I made a lot of mistakes and thats making it hard for me to determine what I did that caused this the most. I did see Superthrive on the shelf at Lowes today. Whats the deal with it??

We all make a lot of mistakes. They are called experience points

Superthrive is a drop per gallon weak plant stimulator.

It has plant hormones like 1-Naphthaleneacetic acid, which is a rooting stimulant and vitamins like B1

It has to be used very sparingly, but it could make all the difference to your seedlings.

I think it would be worth a try.



I found the thread you need, Rooki : Coco mania

Fatty knows his Coco and he's very friendly and helpful

 

[Rooki Root]

I found the thread you need, Rooki : Coco mania

Fatty knows his Coco and he's very friendly and helpful [/QUOTE]

Thanks, Im gonna see if I can get some help. I really appreciate you taking a little time on this. It's not like you can just talk to anybody about it, ya know?

 

[Richard Richardson]

No problem, buddy

I love 420Land because the people here do take time to help others or answer questions.


and just be patient. Everything will be fine, you will grow marvellous plants

and you will have learned far more than if it had all worked out fine first time

 

[Rooki Root]

Haha, lets hope so but it might have to be these next two seedlings! How do you start your seedlings off anyway?

 

[fatty]

Good morning dude first thing I want you to do is get some domes over them the bottom cut off a pop bottle works great .do you have an ec meter and some root stim also never give superthrive to a seedling in coco they don't like it .coco should never dry out the thin stretchy stems are from the red light we need blue but as you said your on that allready .
Mix up some water with abou 1 mil per litre a&b and half recommended dose of root stim ph 5.8 never over 6 and never under 5.5 water around the edges until you get 10 to 20 % runoff and do this every 2 days hopefully this will sort them but if not give me a shout I've subbed up and we will look into your new 3 beans but please don't use the papper towel method soak over night then straight in coco they don't need a tap root it's to easy to damage

 

[fatty]

Oh and humidity until there 4 or 5 nodes it's good at 70 to 80

 

[Richard Richardson]

How do you start your seedlings off anyway?

I usually soak them for 12 hrs or so.

Last time I just put them in soil without soaking and I had 100% germination rate. 18 seeds!