Same Strain: Different Names?

[Purplehazer]

What's up doc? Good morning to you. I hope this day finds you and yours healthy and happy. I like the talk on the the whole name thing man. The Cannabis business is the same as any I guess, at least when it comes to marketing. Lol! I hope you don't mind if I slip a WW pic in here from a few grows ago. Just plain excellent herbs. Smile and stay stoneder

pfew those widows look mighty fine to my eye

 

[bobrown14]

Green Crack vs Dream Queen.

Keep in mind that once someone starts selectively breeding something, the genetics start changing from what the original strain was. There's at least one group I know of that's starting to define strains in the Emerald Triangle and Humboldt by genetic sampling, allowing breeders to not only own a name, but also a genome.

For the STRAIN A x STRAIN B system and all the aka's...I think lots of breeders are trying to make their own versions of popular strains without misrepresenting themselves and passing off modified cultivars as original or close to original strains. Everyone seems to offer a White Widow but which one is closest to the original?

I'd love to see a comparison done between a plant from some 30 year old mother white widow and modern bred white widow.

Crack Queen .... trademarked... lol

 

[Stoneface Jack]

These are from the Breeder that got banned a few months ago. Teddy said I can't mention them by name so maybe you know who it is. They are in my room so they are on house AC which is at 77 F. Tent runs 77 - 80 F. My shed I keep at 68 - 75 the last few weeks but didn't move this one out there as it was full of plants at the time. She's still pretty Frosty & Sticky & has a pretty good smell coming from her.

Taking forever to get 20% + Amber. I think it's 75 days flower today.

I've got one from the same breeder in my tent right now. Day 36 since flip. I won't post a pic of mine though. I messed up pretty thoroughly on her.

As to trademarks, Gorilla Glue #4, and Girl Scout Cookies are both victims of that kind of dispute.

 

[Purplehazer]

I've got one from the same breeder in my tent right now. Day 36 since flip. I won't post a pic of mine though. I messed up pretty thoroughly on her.

As to trademarks, Gorilla Glue #4, and Girl Scout Cookies are both victims of that kind of dispute.

Yeah your right and the Gorilla glue story is a pretty strange one to me because it was a clone only strain..Clone #4
Now look how many breeders are using the name and none got anything to do with the original Gorilla Glue #4 because nobody knows anything about the original lineage...not even the original grower who got a bunch of clones which he numbered and when he asked the person he got them from, Even that guy had totally forgotten what plant he got it from...And only after flowering the name Gorilla Glue was thought up because she was Sticky as hell

Same story with Granddaddy purple which also was a Clone only strain

 

[Stoneface Jack]

Yeah your right and the Gorilla glue story is a pretty strange one to me because it was a clone only strain..Clone #4
Now look how many breeders are using the name and none got anything to do with the original Gorilla Glue #4 because nobody knows anything about the original lineage...not even the original grower who got a bunch of clones which he numbered and when he asked the person he got them from, Even that guy had totally forgotten what plant he got it from...And only after flowering the name Gorilla Glue was thought up because she was Sticky as hell

Same story with Granddaddy purple which also was a Clone only strain

One of those lines you can only get feminized seeds for because if there were any males they got culled. Like Jack's Cleaner from what I've heard. Interesting story. If you're interested look up the origin story of Jack the Ripper.

 

[Stunger]

Yeah your right and the Gorilla glue story is a pretty strange one to me because it was a clone only strain..Clone #4
Now look how many breeders are using the name and none got anything to do with the original Gorilla Glue #4 because nobody knows anything about the original lineage...not even the original grower who got a bunch of clones which he numbered and when he asked the person he got them from, Even that guy had totally forgotten what plant he got it from...And only after flowering the name Gorilla Glue was thought up because she was Sticky as hell

Same story with Granddaddy purple which also was a Clone only strain

I don't quite understand how a strain is a clone only strain. Isn't it still possible to grow out a clone and reverse it and make seeds?

 

[Purplehazer]

One of those lines you can only get feminized seeds for because if there were any males they got culled. Like Jack's Cleaner from what I've heard. Interesting story. If you're interested look up the origin story of Jack the Ripper.

Arent they offspring of Jack Herer??...i'll certainly look into it

 

[Purplehazer]

I don't quite understand how a strain is a clone only strain. Isn't it still possible to grow out a clone and reverse it and make seeds?

Reverse it?

 

[Stoneface Jack]

I don't quite understand how a strain is a clone only strain. Isn't it still possible to grow out a clone and reverse it and make seeds?

Yes and no. The plants grown from selfed seeds are usually very similar to the parent plant, but not identical due to the possibility of recessive traits showing up. You have to breed the line through quite a few generations to weed those out, and you can never be sure you got them all. This is what differentiates a stabilized genetic line from S1 fem seeds.

 

[Stoneface Jack]

Arent they offspring of Jack Herer??...i'll certainly look into it

Yes, some what. JH is in the lineage, as well as an unknown strain that was bred to a JH male. It really is an interesting story.

 

[Stunger]

Reverse it?

I meant in the sense of reverse sexing a female plant (or a stem) to cause it to produce female pollen, and use it to make seeds.

I have never understood the claim that such and such strain is a 'clone only' strain. But as @Stoneface Jack pointed out it may be like that if there are too many unwanted recessive traits and perhaps that just means that no one has 'worked' on it enough to stabilise the genetics, so until then it remains a clone only strain.

 

[bobrown14]

Yes and no. The plants grown from selfed seeds are usually very similar to the parent plant, but not identical due to the possibility of recessive traits showing up. You have to breed the line through quite a few generations to weed those out, and you can never be sure you got them all. This is what differentiates a stabilized genetic line from S1 fem seeds.

I've grown a lot of S1 seeds they all pretty close to exactly the same as the donor plant.

I get a little more variation with reversed pollen on a different plant but the reverse and pollinate the donor. They are very very close and every seed is like that.

 

[Stunger]

a lot of his seeds have the tendency to have TMV virus which is one of the problems that can occur when Feminising seeds in a certain way.

Wow, that interesting, like a lot of things I never knew that! Can you say the method of feminising that you are referring to? I have tried a couple of times to reverse, unsuccessfully with Colloidal Silver. I am not interested trying any methods that one needs laboratory protection to keep safe, but I would like understand how they approach it.

Yes, some what. JH is in the lineage, as well as an unknown strain that was bred to a JH male. It really is an interesting story.

I have been intrigued with JH and it's reputation, I feel it could be one for me, can I ask what breeder of JH you would personally most seek out?

I've grown a lot of S1 seeds they all pretty close to exactly the same as the donor plant.

I get a little more variation with reversed pollen on a different plant but the reverse and pollinate the donor. They are very very close and every seed is like that.

Yes and no. The plants grown from selfed seeds are usually very similar to the parent plant, but not identical due to the possibility of recessive traits showing up. You have to breed the line through quite a few generations to weed those out, and you can never be sure you got them all. This is what differentiates a stabilized genetic line from S1 fem seeds.

Sorry I am still unclear about this. So does it mean when we read about a clone only strain that it means either, no one has reversed & stabilised it, or the strain is simply too unstable to work with?

 

[Stoneface Jack]

Wow, that interesting, like a lot of things I never knew that! Can you say the method of feminising that you are referring to? I have tried a couple of times to reverse, unsuccessfully with Colloidal Silver. I am not interested trying any methods that one needs laboratory protection to keep safe, but I would like understand how they approach it.


I have been intrigued with JH and it's reputation, I feel it could be one for me, can I ask what breeder of JH you would personally most seek out?



Sorry I am still unclear about this. So does it mean when we read about a clone only strain that it means either, no one has reversed & stabilised it, or the strain is simply too unstable to work with?

The original breeder is not a sponsor, but it's been around for quite a while, and is popular. Any of the seedbanks in the sponsor list should have a good version. Or you can google who bred it.

I didn't mean to give the impression that the selfed pants were inherently unstable, just that there is a possibility. You might never know an undesirable recessive trait is there until you're growing a plant that has it from both parents. And as @bobrown14 has said, it might have fewer undesirable recessives in the first place, and be as close to identical to the parent plants that you'd never know the difference.
If the strain is clone only it likely means the breeder decided to sell clones rather than seeds. It does guarantee that the plants are identical, and it limits availability. Supply and demand.

 

[Purplehazer]

Yes and no. The plants grown from selfed seeds are usually very similar to the parent plant, but not identical due to the possibility of recessive traits showing up. You have to breed the line through quite a few generations to weed those out, and you can never be sure you got them all. This is what differentiates a stabilized genetic line from S1

I meant in the sense of reverse sexing a female plant (or a stem) to cause it to produce female pollen, and use it to make seeds.

I have never understood the claim that such and such strain is a 'clone only' strain. But as @Stoneface Jack pointed out it may be like that if there are too many unwanted recessive traits and perhaps that just means that no one has 'worked' on it enough to stabilise the genetics, so until then it remains a clone only strain.

Wow, that interesting, like a lot of things I never knew that! Can you say the method of feminising that you are referring to? I have tried a couple of times to reverse, unsuccessfully with Colloidal Silver. I am not interested trying any methods that one needs laboratory protection to keep safe, but I would like understand how they approach it.


I have been intrigued with JH and it's reputation, I feel it could be one for me, can I ask what breeder of JH you would personally most seek out?



Sorry I am still unclear about this. So does it mean when we read about a clone only strain that it means either, no one has reversed & stabilised it, or the strain is simply too unstable to work with?

Hi Stunger,

Sorry to say i have lost my Bible over the years but the Method i mentioned is described in that Bible...."The Marijuana Growers guide" By Ed Rosenthal and Mel Franks which is the book that for many is the book that started the whole home growing busyness...it certainly started my understanding of many many things about this Diva we all love

after reading a few threads here on 420 about Colloidal Silver that whole chapter on manipulating seeds that was described in that book came to mind because it sounded very close to the CS method and the writers did have some warnings about their method...But again i lost that book and i'm so sorry i cant help you with this