Big Head - Dead Head OG Heavy Yield!

[jlt1202]

Hey btw i moved them a bit closer when i got transplant finished haha is that alright for you now ; P

Had to add a small 300w equiv CFL hood to fit the plant in without having ton of shadows lol

 

[jlt1202]

Here is my Nute line up at the moment in veg, going to keep with the green planet because it is very soft nute and is hard to 'overdoit' because the plant can break it down very easy, unlike organic.

who here hates spills? i need to find a better way to pour out of these containors haha

 

[mcloadie]

im playing with my atm i have some in there that are almost week old but the roots are not showing up like i was led to believe : / i was told humity is not as important due to the fact it is being hit with water 24/7, so far i have had no luck with rockwool or ezystarter cubes, so i thought i would try this but idk if im doing something wrong.

Here is a link to a video of myn of how myn is set up and me doing one of my clones
Aeroponic Cloning Bucket - how to

Bro, what is the temp of res water?

 

[jlt1202]

I have my 900w equiv hood i built and i added these lights to it that are full spectrum to mix in. right now im not using in my room but i should have it up in a couple weeks making/costing me green ; P

 

[jlt1202]

Bro, what is the temp of res water?

i honestly couldnt tell you but it is warm for sure because the bucket is black it is warm from the lights.....

 

[mcloadie]

i honestly couldnt tell you but it is warm for sure because the bucket is black it is warm from the lights.....

75-80 degrees would be ideal, IDK WTF, they take so long to root, I do em in soil and plant it 12 days.....final pot. I'm just sick of lookin at those sickly lookin cuts, and they look so nice in an aerocloner...LOL

 

[jlt1202]

HAHAHA thats how i feel!!! they look like shit in the dome and will get some roots but look like pros in the aero and never see a root wat a bitch lol we will see hopfully i see somthing in next week

 

[Hiker]

Some strains take time to root. Have you cloned this strain ever?

If I may, I did notice one possible issue with the technique in your video. When you cut the stem, you should immediately put it under water. If an air bubble gets into the stem's 'plumbing', the clone is screwed. Plants use a siphon effect to transport water and nutrient up through the stem to the leaves and flowers. Have you ever siphoned anything? All it takes is one air bubble and you're done.

Something I've been hearing a lot of recently is to leave the cuttings in the water for at least 20 minutes. I'm not sure about this one, but I suppose it really can't hurt. The other tip I got (I think from 420fied) was to leave the stems sitting with the clonex gel for at least 20-30 minutes. In other words, you put them in the cloner, but don't turn it on right away.

I think the problem is either an air bubble or that strain just roots slowly. McLoadie has a good point though too. You really want that cloner water at least 70F. I have a cloner/seedling mat and thermostat that I use. I think it helps.

 

[mcloadie]

HAHAHA thats how i feel!!! they look like shit in the dome and will get some roots but look like pros in the aero and never see a root wat a bitch lol we will see hopfully i see somthing in next week

My machine is runnin, I got a dozen in and will do a comparison before I add the dome and the humidity. After I make my rounds I'm gonna post pics.

 

[denots]

Some strains take time to root. Have you cloned this strain ever?

If I may, I did notice one possible issue with the technique in your video. When you cut the stem, you should immediately put it under water. If an air bubble gets into the stem's 'plumbing', the clone is screwed. Plants use a siphon effect to transport water and nutrient up through the stem to the leaves and flowers. Have you ever siphoned anything? All it takes is one air bubble and you're done.

Something I've been hearing a lot of recently is to leave the cuttings in the water for at least 20 minutes. I'm not sure about this one, but I suppose it really can't hurt. The other tip I got (I think from 420fied) was to leave the stems sitting with the clonex gel for at least 20-30 minutes. In other words, you put them in the cloner, but don't turn it on right away.

I think the problem is either an air bubble or that strain just roots slowly. McLoadie has a good point though too. You really want that cloner water at least 70F. I have a cloner/seedling mat and thermostat that I use. I think it helps.

I have to respectively disagree here.... plants do not siphon water, instead they use a process similar to osmosis, In which cell membranes transfer a higher concertrations of water from the base to the top of the plant. Other wise aerocloners would not would, if your theory were correct no aerocloner would work unless you fill the thing entirely up and just let a pump move water, which is not what you do.

As far as my cloner goes I did have without dome half with and the half with undoubtedly did 300% better in perkiness and root growth. I used root hormone along with 1/16 nutes and teaspoon of super thrive.

Just my 2 cents and opinions are like assholes everyones got one

 

[Hiker]

I have to respectively disagree here.... plants do not siphon water, instead they use a process similar to osmosis, In which cell membranes transfer a higher concertrations of water from the base to the top of the plant. Other wise aerocloners would not would, if your theory were correct no aerocloner would work unless you fill the thing entirely up and just let a pump move water, which is not what you do.

As far as my cloner goes I did have without dome half with and the half with undoubtedly did 300% better in perkiness and root growth. I used root hormone along with 1/16 nutes and teaspoon of super thrive.

Just my 2 cents and opinions are like assholes everyones got one

Hi denots

I'm not offended that you disagree. Unfortunately, mine isn't an opinion about how the transport works. It's the result of taking university level botany courses. Am I claiming to be an expert? No, but I think I'm remembering correctly.

I began to question if I was accurately remembering a course from 20 years ago, so I looked it up.

There are two transport structures in a plant. The Xylem and the Phloem. The Xylem is in the center of the stems and is responsible for transport FROM the roots upwards. I believe you are getting confused by the Phloem transport which is from the leaves to where ever the sugars are needed. Phloem transport DOES operate via osmotic pressure. It would not be impacted much, if at all, by cutting a clone. The Xylem transport however could be. Here is some reading:
Start here to see that there are 2 types of transport in plants:
Plant sap - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
That page leads to a page on Xylem and how it transports water, against gravity, via capillary action.
Xylem - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Skip down and read starting where it says "Main function — upwards water transport".
I believe you are thinking of the Phloem transport which operates on the "Pressure Flow Hypothesis" found here:
Pressure Flow Hypothesis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So based on the above, my theory DOES explain why the clone fails if you don't put it into water immediately.

One other thing to consider... if putting a cutting into water is not necessary, then why is it recommended so frequently? I'm a strong advocate of the "question everything" mindset, so I understand the idea that just because everyone does it that way doesn't mean it's right. This is very true, but it also doesn't mean it's NOT right. More often than not, those tried and true methods for doing things are the way they are because they work. Is this one of those times? I don't know, but I have pretty good success with clones and I've always tried to get cuttings into water as fast as I can, then I make another, hopefully cleaner cut, under water before I put it into the gel.

 

[mcloadie]

I have to respectively disagree here.... plants do not siphon water, instead they use a process similar to osmosis, In which cell membranes transfer a higher concertrations of water from the base to the top of the plant. Other wise aerocloners would not would, if your theory were correct no aerocloner would work unless you fill the thing entirely up and just let a pump move water, which is not what you do.

As far as my cloner goes I did have without dome half with and the half with undoubtedly did 300% better in perkiness and root growth. I used root hormone along with 1/16 nutes and teaspoon of super thrive.

Just my 2 cents and opinions are like assholes everyones got one

Actually, plants move water and nutrients through a process called capillary action, as one molecule exits the plant through respiration and transpiration, another one is taken in through the root hairs located on the hair roots. These molecules are bonded by electrical charges, the same as every thing else that's stuck together in the universe.

 

[denots]

Yes I wasnt claiming its osmosis I said it was a similar process. And I totally agree that its not osmosis. It was just A simple explanation comparing it to osmosis. But air Bubbles will not cause it so stop the process of tranferring the water upwards, it would be impossible to cut a stem unless done underwater to keep air from reaching the Inside of The stem. And it would be impossible to keep air out while it was in the cloner.

And I dont disagree with putting it in water,as I did with mine. I agree that soaking a stem does help a clone. Just disagreeing with an air bubble Causing a plant to stop the transfer of water Or any thing else.

Mcloadie is completely correct I just didnt use the right words most of my responds are from my tablet, so its a little more complicated to Go into full details on my writings.

Ill try To go in more depth when I respond, But osmosis is a similar action to what plants do is what I meant, just because air gets in between the roots doesnt mean its going to stop transferring Nutrients and water. So all I really was implying was that unlike a siphon, An air bubble will not discontinue this process becuase its not cause by a suction. The process is carried out from cell to cell over time, Not in a flow.

But that is great information you supplied, im no botanist so I enjoy learning everything I can.

 

[mcloadie]

Yes I wasnt claiming its osmosis I said it was a similar process. And I totally agree that its not osmosis. It was just A simple explanation comparing it to osmosis. But air Bubbles will not cause it so stop the process of tranferring the water upwards, it would be impossible to cut a stem unless done underwater to keep air from reaching the Inside of The stem. And it would be impossible to keep air out while it was in the cloner.

And I dont disagree with putting it in water,as I did with mine. I agree that soaking a stem does help a clone. Just disagreeing with an air bubble Causing a plant to stop the transfer of water Or any thing else.

Mcloadie is completely correct I just didnt use the right words most of my responds are from my tablet, so its a little more complicated to Go into full details on my writings.

Ill try To go in more depth when I respond, But osmosis is a similar action to what plants do is what I meant, just because air gets in between the roots doesnt mean its going to stop transferring Nutrients and water. So all I really was implying was that unlike a siphon, An air bubble will not discontinue this process becuase its not cause by a suction. The process is carried out from cell to cell over time, Not in a flow.

But that is great information you supplied, im no botanist so I enjoy learning everything I can.

I'm not hardly a botanist, this air bubble also called an embolism, does in fact break the molecular chain and puts a halt to the cappilary action and the plant ceases to metabolize in most ways. Immediately, the pressure inside the plant, I think it's called turgidity falls because the pressure from this cappilary action is gone, and bam....no metabolism.....no life...pwp...permanent wilting point, which there is no recovery. I am awfully sorry that my terminology and spelling isn't the greatest, It's been a long time since I studied this stuff.

 

[denots]

yes I agree With a emoblism forming And it will cause a break in the vascular system of the plant, But its my understanding that its not a instantaneous situation. Normally in plants a embolism forms when a dought is present and the roots can no longer deliver Enough water to the top, which causes the vascular cells to produce a gas in the absence of Water. When this happens a emoblism will form, Where the water lacks.

the plant Does not "suck"air into the plant, You are simply cutting off the supply of its water source( The roots). I didnt mean for this to be about all this, was just pointing out that plants do not siphon, They both Move water but one requires the end point to be lower then the start point(siphoning),which is why air directly effects the stop in flow. Where as in a plant, it is a living cell tranfering watering from one high concentration to a low concentration, so when you cut the living plant, the cells just temporarily stop untill you put them into the water having some emoblism from temporarily bbeing cut off from water, not bbeing interduced to air, because the plant not going to "suck air" like a siphon does.

I understand it does cause Embolism to the plant which is harmful. But it doesnt mean its a siphon, the action of transporting water will still occur in a cuttling if it is exposed to air.... if not we'd have to take. Them under water and never expose them to air which is not true, Again its not healthy for the plants I DO recommend immediately putting into water as fast as you can after taking them. But it was realistically 5mins, from the time I cut till the time the hit water for 20 mins, In between where they were exposed to air duing the stem cutting. And I had a 83% root rate after 7 days.

All I was saying is it doesnt completely stop the process As air will in a siphon. Sorry I Have raambled on way too much im sorry if this came off nasty didnt mean it in any way. I just thoroughly. Love being Medicated and able Have a good debate on something. This Is all in good intentions

Sorry didnt mean to hijack this journal On this topic of siphoning Lol!

 

[mcloadie]

yes I agree With a emoblism forming And it will cause a break in the vascular system of the plant, But its my understanding that its not a instantaneous situation. Normally in plants a embolism forms when a dought is present and the roots can no longer deliver Enough water to the top, which causes the vascular cells to produce a gas in the absence of Water. When this happens a emoblism will form, Where the water lacks.

the plant Does not "suck"air into the plant, You are simply cutting off the supply of its water source( The roots). I didnt mean for this to be about all this, was just pointing out that plants do not siphon, They both Move water but one requires the end point to be lower then the start point(siphoning),which is why air directly effects the stop in flow. Where as in a plant, it is a living cell tranfering watering from one high concentration to a low concentration, so when you cut the living plant, the cells just temporarily stop untill you put them into the water having some emoblism from temporarily bbeing cut off from water, not bbeing interduced to air, because the plant not going to "suck air" like a siphon does.

I understand it does cause Embolism to the plant which is harmful. But it doesnt mean its a siphon, the action of transporting water will still occur in a cuttling if it is exposed to air.... if not we'd have to take. Them under water and never expose them to air which is not true, Again its not healthy for the plants I DO recommend immediately putting into water as fast as you can after taking them. But it was realistically 5mins, from the time I cut till the time the hit water for 20 mins, In between where they were exposed to air duing the stem cutting. And I had a 83% root rate after 7 days.

All I was saying is it doesnt completely stop the process As air will in a siphon. Sorry I Have raambled on way too much im sorry if this came off nasty didnt mean it in any way. I just thoroughly. Love being Medicated and able Have a good debate on something. This Is all in good intentions

Sorry didnt mean to hijack this journal On this topic of siphoning Lol!

Don't be sorry denots, we're learning.

 

[mcloadie]

How fast an embolism could occur is dependent on how fast the plant is metabolizing, so if we take a cut when the plant is outside of it's ideal growing conditions the more time we have before this factor will come into play....REALITY CHECK! I've got thousands of cuts in the mail...ornamentals...same thing....cuts. They moisten em up real good, wrap em in plastic, rush ship. I don't get in a hurry or trip on when my cuts are gonna get am embolism....LOL.....not then, not now. I do cuts different ways....just depends on how I feel like doing it that day, and, where I have a place to set up and do it. If a person ever thought that the cuts had been left out too long before being treated, just make another cut on the material and go! I have trimmed material off my plants to be disposed of, put it in a sealed ziplock, and it lived for two weeks, under the sink, in the dark. I'm sure I coulda taken cuts from that waste bag and they would have survived. Thanks denots for working this subject, I bet somebody will learn from it....I know I did! I just read along boring paper on plant embolisms, it seems that there are two different types of embolizisation in plants, one which occurs inside plants that are being deprived of sufficient water to maintain turgidity, and embolisms that occur when the xylem is interrupted. After the read it appears that these are two differing conditions that must be looked at seperately, as the way they plant deals with each situation is different. Everything in this reality is relevant, and all this info will relate to something we have use for, embolism when making cuttings = bad, how easily this can happen is highly debatable, how easy it can be avoided....easily!

 

[jlt1202]

SOOO i dont let my animals in my grow.....

The dog gets that.....

my CATS HOW EVER ! ALMOST pissed on my girls!

Here the cat was digging a hole to piss in before i caught his lil ass lol lucky me i guess i came in time ahha

 

[mcloadie]

That darn cat!!!!!

 

[jlt1202]

ALL i know is i hope thoes clones will pick up soon, getting tired of seeing an almost empty veg room X (