Jay's First Time: 3x Lemon Skunk In Coco, With 315W LEC In A 1200x1200 Tent

[Barney86]

19/7
The girls have grown at least an inch since yesterday... it's easier to see now that the tomato ring is in and it gives a point of reference:

Here's another side-by-side of their growth in the last week:

They've gone craaaazy, I think it's going to be time to flip fairly soon... the front girl will be past the trellis tomorrow and I think I'm going to flip when all colas on all plants are level with it, so considering the back two are a little shorter we're probably looking at three to five days before that happens.

The dehumidifier seems to be working well.

Tomato rings will go on the other two plants tomorrow and I might do a little defoliating but I'm still not 100% sure how much I should be doing so I might resurrect my post in the veg forum about that...

I bought a small tub of Great White and mixed a scoop into a new 20 litre nute mix, so they'll get a few feeds worth of that too

Watered 800ml @ 8am
Watered 800ml @ 8pm
Watered 800ml @ 1130pm
Min-max 20.1-24.2, 51-63% RH.

Lookin sweet mate only bit of advise I can give is water more. Because you've just bumped up the strength it'll most likely build up in the Coco if you don't start giving more volume.
Don't be scared to over water them iether . Couldn't damage them with it if you tried.
Looks good though man. Onto a winner first time round

 

[d42zero]

Lookin sweet mate only bit of advise I can give is water more. Because you've just bumped up the strength it'll most likely build up in the Coco if you don't start giving more volume.
Don't be scared to over water them iether . Couldn't damage them with it if you tried.
Looks good though man. Onto a winner first time round

Thanks @Barney86, I've been paying attention to the amount of runoff and it doesn't seem like a lot anymore (girls must be thirsty!) so I was thinking of increasing to 3x 1 litre. I'm currently feeding the GH Flora series "Aggressive Vegetative Growth" schedule (3tsp Gro, 2tsp Micro, 1tsp Bloom per gallon) at 1/4 strength which works out at 20ml/13ml/6.5ml per 20L + 4ml Cal-Mag. I'm going to pull the girls out and empty the containers today so I'll test the runoff and see what it's doing.

I'm going to flip today! They are growing too fast for me to veg them any longer, the front plant is now about 3" above the ring or about halfway up the tent... they're on the boxes but if they double in size they'll start to reach the light even if it's right up against the top of the tent. Note that since I'm flipping my next 20L batch of nutes will be the "Transition to Bloom" schedule (13.5/13.5/13.5ml per 20L) and from the one after that I'll go to "Blooming and Ripening" which is 6.5/13.5/20ml G/M/B per 20L. I have been considering bumping my strength up to 1/2 but things are going well right now so I don't really want to change anything.

I'll post some photos this evening but in the meantime, is there anything I need to do before flipping? I read something about a defloliation a week before flip but I can't let these girls grow another week, I'll run out of headroom! I did add a scoop of Great White mycorrhizae to my current batch of nutes but other than that I've done nothing to prepare :/

Thanks for the kind words mate, I'm really stoked with the way the girls are looking!

 

[Barney86]

Sounds like a good plan mate
The trimming thing, most of us take of some of the big fan leaves before we flip to make sure plenty light can get right into the guts. Then again 2-3 weeks into 12/12 cos they get bushy as hell and light can't really get through the canopy. Some of us lollipop them. Basically removing all the lower growth cos most of it turns out crap anyway.
Maybe trim one and not another so you can see the difference.
We all have our own methods of trimming. There's no right or wrong way to do it really. I just constantly trim small amounts all the way through rather than all at certain times. I find it's easier and less stressful for me.

 

[d42zero]

Sounds like a good plan mate
The trimming thing, most of us take of some of the big fan leaves before we flip to make sure plenty light can get right into the guts. Then again 2-3 weeks into 12/12 cos they get bushy as hell and light can't really get through the canopy. Some of us lollipop them. Basically removing all the lower growth cos most of it turns out crap anyway.
Maybe trim one and not another so you can see the difference.
We all have our own methods of trimming. There's no right or wrong way to do it really. I just constantly trim small amounts all the way through rather than all at certain times. I find it's easier and less stressful for me.

Sweet, thanks for the info. I think I'll trim a bunch of fan leaves tonight... I don't want to trim any of the growth tips right? See this photo:

Am I correct in saying I don't want to remove the bits I've circled, but I can remove the fan leaves that come out below them?

 

[d42zero]

22/7
Watered 800ml @ 8am
Watered 1l @ 615pm
Watered 1l @ 11pm
Min-max 19.2-24.6, 57-90% RH (fan had to be off 6hrs so humidity spiked).

Flipped to 12/12 as of this morning! Here we gooo

 

[d42zero]

23/7
Taller plants grew almost two inches today.. light lifted a few inches, there's only another eight inches or so left before it hits the roof of the tent O_O Plants are still 12-18" away from the light but they might get a little close as they stretch...

Time for defoliation! First up an awful photo of the canopy pre-defo, please excuse the angle (although it does give you a view of how the light is too low and isn't spread properly):

#1 before:

and after:

#2 before:

and after:

#3 after (no before shot, sorry)

I think I need to take more from #1 - it still looks a bit bushy. That being said I've removed all fan leaves bigger than about 2" so all that's left is small stuff.. maybe it'll be OK as it is.

The way the manifolds grew differently has become clear after a trim...

• #1 was topped twice, once to split into two then again to split into four, but on the second topping was done at the 3rd node and the 2nd node growth removed (leaving nodes 1 and 3 to become mains). It was much easier to secure into a flat shape, so it's grown much neater and squatter than the other two. However, it's also shot up secondary mains from the lowest nodes which are at a similar height to the main stems.. I'm unsure whether to trim these off and let the main stems become colas, or treat them as colas themselves. Also #1 is about three inches shorter than the other two, even though it had an extra week of growth (as the others were topped a third time). I'm fairly sure this is due to the mains spreading wider at the base rather than reaching up quickly, and should be easy to fix by putting a couple of 2x4's under its runoff box to lift it up.
• #2 was topped three times to create eight mains, and has turned into the tallest and spindliest plant. The manifold was fatter than #1's when it was given its third topping so the trunks were a bit thicker and harder to train, so it's ended up less neat. It's also shot a bunch of secondaries which I've left for now but may trim off if that's the advice I get here. Finally its mains have grown very unevenly, with five or six really fat ones and two or three much thinner and weaker-looking ones. I almost definitely won't manifold plants this way if I do it again, as #1 looks like it's going to end up much more even.
• #3 is interesting as it was topped the same as #2, but one of the second trunks broke so I lost two mains leaving it with six. It's ended up much neater than #2, possibly as it's had the benefit of the two-tier tomato trellis you can see in the pic.

Also worth noting is #1 has a much stronger smell than the other two, I'm not 100% sure how to describe it but I've read others describe their plants' smells as 'diesel-ey' and that's probably the right word. #2 and #3 have a smell, but when I got #1 out into the living room the smell was intense.

While I had the girls out of the tent I flushed them with 40 litres of plain water each then immediately watered with 2 litres of nute mix. I know the rule is supposed to be flush with weak nutes but in all honesty I can't bring myself to mix up hundreds of litres to just flush it through and watch it go down the shower drain... I feel like over-watering with nutes for the next few waterings will replace the plain water pretty quickly.

Watered 1l @ 830am
Watered 1l @ 715pm
Flushed 40l plain water each @ 830pm
Watered 2l nutes immediately after flush
Watered 1l @ 1130pm
Min-max 20.2-24.6, 57-71% RH

 

[d42zero]

Forgot to mention I almost flooded my entire flat tonight... I use a hose to fill 20 litre drums from the kitchen tap, with the drums on the floor. Went off to move a plant while a drum filled and forgot about it, a few minutes later came back to an inch of water quickly heading from the kitchen to the living room and water actually dripping outside in the carpark.. enough that a lady in another flat came and knocked on my door to see if I was OK after she saw the dripping water when she was parking

I can see how a silly mistake like that could lead to even more unwanted attention (i.e. if the flood is bad enough to do damage or the water went out the front door) so in hindsight I was extremely lucky I caught it when I did. I'm going to build a little portable bunting setup to put the drums in while I fill them so that in the future if I forget about them I've got a little extra time.

Time to chillax

 

[d42zero]

24/7

The difference in height is getting more and more each day, it seems the two spindlier plants are stretching more than #1.. this photo was taken this morning (#1 at front):

Scuse the poor light, my lights are currently set to 7pm-7am and I don't get out of bed til ~0730 so I miss the end bit. Note #2 (back left) is now a good six inches above the tomato ring, she was level with it about three days ago.. she's blowing up

I'm going to bring some timbers home from work today to put under #1 so she's level with the others. A combination of 2x4 blocks and some melamine 'shims' should let me level the top of the canopy pretty easily every few days.

I have tomato rings in the car for the other two; they'll get cut to size at work today and installed tonight after lights on.

Watered 1l @ 730am
Watered 1l @ 715pm
Watered 1l @ 11pm
Min-max not taken

 

[d42zero]

25/7
Watered 1l @ 715am
Watered 1l @ 730pm
Watered 1l @ 11pm
Min-max 22-26.7, 43-59% RH (two days)

26/7
Watered 1l @ 715am
Watered 1l @ 715pm
Watered 1l @ 11pm
Min-max 21.9-26.4, 51-60% RH

27/7
Watered 1l @ 715am
Watered 1l @ 715pm
Watered 1l @ 11pm
Min-max 21.8-26.4, 51-61% RH

 

[Lowrider72]

Going good mate, keep em coming....
Going to get a bit of stretch but its normal. CMH lessens the stretch but it will still happen.
Soldier on mate, top work!

 

[d42zero]

Going good mate, keep em coming....
Going to get a bit of stretch but its normal. CMH lessens the stretch but it will still happen.
Soldier on mate, top work!

Thanks @Lowrider72 !! The plants have stretched proportionally to their size at flip... by that I mean the tallest plant has stretched a lot and the shortest one almost not at all. I guess it could be related to the manifold, as the tallest plant is the one with 6 mains, the 2nd tallest the one with 8 mains, and the shortest is the one with 8 mains but was trained a different way. Or it could just be coincidence and I'm reading into it too much

Anyways the tallest has stretched about 6-8", the shortest only a couple. I've levelled them up so the canopy is even and there's probably still another 6" before I start running into space issues. It's all good, they're all sitting on 30L runoff reservoirs which are about a foot high so worst case scenario I can swap those out for shorter containers and find the space there.

I'm not sure I've trimmed them properly.. I took a ton of fan leaves off before flip but I left the growth tips, some of which are as tall as the mains. After asking in another thread and re-reading a couple of manifolding articles I think I was supposed to remove all the growth tips as well and just leave the preflowers so there's only the 8 mains with no secondaries. I feel like if I remove them after stretch the plant will have wasted a bunch of energy on them so maybe the best thing to do is to leave them. What do you think?

 

[Lowrider72]

Just leave them as is mate.
When stretch stops.. 1-2 weeks, then thin them out a lil in the centres and lower area. All Cmh bud will be tight chunks, even the lower stuff, small, but lovely frosty smoko.
Thats my opinion, and how Id treat my own plants in same situation.

 

[Barney86]

Sorry mate lost your comment there. You certainly never held back anyway lol.
Ive just wrote a big paragraph trying to explain what to do but it didnt really work. Was confusing myself. You have went a bit far but dont worry its not the end of the world.
Few general rules to keep yourself safe when trimming.

Little and often is easier to get right than all at once. Do it over a few days and youll be able to see how the plants responding. Which bits are growing because of it and which bits arent. You'll learn faster.

Dont take both leaves off any node you want to grow and try not to take too many per branch. Gotta mind, the leaves are its power source. Without them they cant absorb the light energy so you need as many as you can keep.

If it isnt blocking light to somewhere that needs it then leave it alone. Also no point trimming most of the outside leaves as they tend to not really block anything useful.

You said something about cutting all the tops off. That's a method of high stress training that you're best avoiding for a couple more grows mate. Whenever you top a plant you divide the size of the buds and multiply the number of them.
Do that at the wrong time and you'll end up having to cut half of it out cos the plant gets too bushy.
I'd go learn some more about it before thinking of doing that again lol. It's not something I'd ever try. Don't really see the point unless it's for filling a scrogg net. In that case it's a great idea but other than that not really.

That'll do for now . Bit long winded already haha

 

[d42zero]

Thanks guys, yeah I did go a bit hard on the two taller ones haha, I trimmed any larger fan leaf bigger than about 2" across. The shorter plant had quite a few smaller ones so it stayed a bit bushy, but the tall ones had pretty much just big ones.

They're definitely stretching though and the taller two (which I trimmed the hardest) stretched the most so hopefully it's all good. In hindsight though if the only real purpose of defoliating is to allow light through then I could've left a bunch of leaves down low on both of those tall ones.

Oh well see how they go, so far these girls have had the hearts of lions so I'm sure they'll come back strong

 

[Lowrider72]

Just think of it this way d420,
the fan leaves are the water pumps and help the plant pump nutes around use to convert light to grow energy, be that veg or flower.
Later the plant will suck nutrients from them and the bracts to make sugars for buds.... So you need them for explosive veg but later....not sooo much...but you need a few water pumps to get shit where it needs to go.
Before 12/12 you can trim the shit out of them, but after flip you have a week, then any trimming after that should be a little at a time.
To reduce stress in flower and avoid hermie-ing.

 

[d42zero]

1/8
So the girls have REALLY grown, they're getting massive!

This pic's deceiving... the pots are all at different heights to keep the canopy as even as possible, and it's not clear in the photo how big the differnce actually is.. heights (from top of pot to tallest point) are:

Back left: 115cm
Back right: 85cm
Front: 65cm

The leaves are getting thick. From this pic I'm definitely going to have to remove some fan leaves tomorrow night, but I don't think I'll go as hard as I did last time. @Barney86 and @Lowrider72 your input as to how much green to remove would be appreciated

White pistils are appearing, ten days have passed since the flip. I've mixed one more batch of 'transition' nutes then I start feeding "Week 1 flower" from the GH chart.

Watered 1l @ 9am
Watered 1l @ 730pm
Watered 1l @ 11pm
Min-max 20.0-26.1, 53-66% RH

 

[Lowrider72]

Come up 1/3 of the plant and trim out everything below that, any upper shade leaves remove from internal areas to allow air flow, or light to inner bud sites be my advice, then leave them be.

 

[Barney86]

Come up 1/3 of the plant and trim out everything below that, any upper shade leaves remove from internal areas to allow air flow, or light to inner bud sites be my advice, then leave them be.

That wouldve taken me about 20 lines lol. Nicely put

 

[d42zero]

Come up 1/3 of the plant and trim out everything below that, any upper shade leaves remove from internal areas to allow air flow, or light to inner bud sites be my advice, then leave them be.

Thanks @Lowrider72, I took a little bit of lower growth off the other night but probably not quite that much, I'll give them another little trim to get rid of some of that lower stuff tonight.

I already took maybe half a dozen fan leaves off each plant and they were mainly upper big ones that were growing over the top of other growth so I should be pretty on the money there. I'll have another look at them tonight when I'm nipping off that lower stuff.

The taller plant is now firmly up against the top of the tent lol, not sure what to do there. I can probably get another container for runoff to make her pot a bit lower but that'll cause other issues with having to empty runoff more often :/ Will try to figure something out over the next couple of days.

EDIT: I just gave them a trim, lower 1/3 fully removed which took away a few of those secondary mains that were really getting in the way and competing with the real mains for space. I managed to break a couple of the taller plant's stems, they're a little fragile.. may have to get a screen or something to tie them to as they bud up because they're long and thin. The smaller/fatter plant's stems seem WAY strong enough for its height though.

We'll see what happens with yield but in terms of the plant's size and easiness to work with the two-step manifolding method really seems to be the better way to go.

 

[d42zero]

2/8
Watered 1l @ 9am
Watered 1l @ 730pm
Watered 1l @ 11pm
Min-max 19.8-25.4, 54-68% RH

3/8
Watered 1l @ 715am
Watered 1l @ 9pm
Watered 1l @ midnight
Min-max not taken