Pot size?

[aziz]

what pot size should i use for autos? i see a lot of conflicting information. both indoors and outdoors please

are very small rocks good for drainage? basically river sand, so thicker than beach-sand.

when should i UP-pot? when the roots comeout the bottom?

are autos better than femminized seeds when it comes to cost-reward? yeah femminized give bigger yields. but they also require way more time, which translates to more light on the bill. also one plant grows very big, where with autos you can put many in a little space.

 

[TorturedSoul]

I'm growing one in a three-gallon grow bag, and one in a 5.8-quart wastebasket. I've seen one in a tiny cup, and another in a big DWC tub reservoir. Of course "autos" is not a strain, but hundreds. Not everyone uses the same kind and wattage of light, grows via the same method, et cetera. While you can - and probably will - get several "I grow in..." type responses, and likely a generic "one size fits many" suggestion, it might be more helpful to post the strain(s) you are intending to grow, along with a little bit of information about the size of your grow space, type and size (wattage) of your lighting, whether you'll be growing in soil, soilless, hydroponics (active aeration? passive/hand-watered, such as hempy?), et cetera. With luck, the characteristics of your upcoming grow will come reasonably close to someone's past experience, and they'll be able to discuss this question in terms of specifics.

Personally, if I was going to transplant an autoflowering plant into a larger container, I would not want to wait until I saw roots coming out the bottom of the container. I am still unsure of the factors which may influence, somewhat, the time / speed at which one begins to flower. However, I do believe that one which has adequate root space, enough nitrogen, calcium, and other nutrients, and is receiving enough water will tend to perhaps grow more before flowering than another plant of the same strain that is lacking these things. Again, this is my opinion.

Cost-reward? Way more time? This is surely debatable, and much depends on the grower and the setup, methinks. The auto will, at some point, begin flowering regardless of the light schedule. But the photo can be started under a 12:12 light:dark schedule. Although I'd recommend it be started under a traditional vegetative growth schedule (18:6, et cetera) and this schedule maintained for at least three weeks, both because it won't flower, anyway, until it has reached sexual maturity (but neither will the auto ), and because it will then grow more/larger in that time. So it may be possible for the attentive gardener to initiate flowering in the photoperiodic plant at approximately the same time (depending on the respective strains, of course) as the autoflower. In terms of the actual flowering periods... I don't really see a marked difference between the two categories. Some autos have a relatively short flowering period - but so do some photos.

The above is with "plants grown (directly) from seed." The gardener who grows photoperiodic plants does have an advantage or two, though. He/she can decide to keep a mother plant; it really doesn't require much in the way of space, lighting, or other resources. Then, es has the opportunity to produce an almost limitless supply of clones by taking cuttings and rooting them. This not only vastly increases the "cost-reward" of that photoperiodic seed... It also means that the photoperiodic gardener can choose to flower those clones immediately after they have rooted or after a period of time which the gardener decides on (which can be very short). That would seem to negate any "speed in the vegetative growth phase" that the autoflower gardener has - and might just beat it handily, lol.

So... Yes, this subject has room for debate, IMHO. . . .

 

[Emilya Green]

what pot size should i use for autos? i see a lot of conflicting information. both indoors and outdoors please

are very small rocks good for drainage? basically river sand, so thicker than beach-sand.

when should i UP-pot? when the roots comeout the bottom?

are autos better than femminized seeds when it comes to cost-reward? yeah femminized give bigger yields. but they also require way more time, which translates to more light on the bill. also one plant grows very big, where with autos you can put many in a little space.

I will weigh in, since I am sort of known for my knowledge in building containers of soil and watering them properly... beware though, I am also known for my dislike of autos.

First, rock in the bottom do not help drainage, they actually make it worse. Because of capillary action between the rocks and the roots and the bottom and sides of the container, that region will NEVER dry out, and it will stay wetter at the bottom than if it were just plain soil. Do not do this, it is asking for root rot.

The very first task a young seedling has is to "tap" the bottom of the grow space to see what its limits are. I have seen seedlings hit the bottom and through a stroke of luck, hit the drainage hole, on day 3. This is not a sign to uppot. Uppotting is not a race, trying to see how fast we can get it accomplished. Think of soil and the water it can suspend in it as a buffer. At first that soil can provide you a buffer of 3-5 days between needing to water, and as the roots get stronger and better developed, they are able to use up more of that water, more quickly. The time to uppot is when the roots have filled the space and taken your buffer away from you to the point that you have to water every day. Only when you reach this point is it the proper time to uppot.

Autos are regular pot plants that have been crossed with a runty little Ruderalis plant, that barely produces any THC at all. All autos therefore have to be inferior in quality and size to regular photoperiod plants. Photos don't require WAY more time... some can actually finish in about 2 or 3 weeks more than a typical auto. If something goes wrong in the grow, photo plants can allow you to recover, build the plant up to where you want it, and then go to bloom... giving you way more flexibility and ability to survive mistakes with a photo. For me, it is not at all worth my time to grow an auto, when with just a little bit more investment in time, I can grow a much much better plant.

Lastly, pot size. Because of the rapid growth cycle and genetic restrictions on final size, going much larger than a 3 gallon container for an auto is probably a waste of space. Many believe it best to put the auto in its final container and be done with it, thinking that any stress is bad for the plant and will affect your final yield. They are not taking into consideration that unless you throw your plants around, say mean things to them, and plant them sideways, there should be no stress in uppotting a pot plant... simply make a hole the size of the previous container in some new soil and plop it right in there. Easy going, and no stress to the plant. Knowing this, old time ,regular methods of proper container management apply... if you want to build up a solid rootball and maintain control over the watering cycle, it is important to restrict the container size and successively uppot. I would start an auto like any other plant, first in a solo cup, then to a 1 gallon, and only then to my final container. Many many growers of autos will disagree with me here... but I will not back down on this. A plant is a plant is a plant.... the rules don't change just because one has had its non stop growth button permanently turned on... you just have to move faster with that plant, but yet do all the same things that you would normally do to develop a good root system.

 

[Remystemple]

I will weigh in, since I am sort of known for my knowledge in building containers of soil and watering them properly... beware though, I am also known for my dislike of autos.

First, rock in the bottom do not help drainage, they actually make it worse. Because of capillary action between the rocks and the roots and the bottom and sides of the container, that region will NEVER dry out, and it will stay wetter at the bottom than if it were just plain soil. Do not do this, it is asking for root rot.

The very first task a young seedling has is to "tap" the bottom of the grow space to see what its limits are. I have seen seedlings hit the bottom and through a stroke of luck, hit the drainage hole, on day 3. This is not a sign to uppot. Uppotting is not a race, trying to see how fast we can get it accomplished. Think of soil and the water it can suspend in it as a buffer. At first that soil can provide you a buffer of 3-5 days between needing to water, and as the roots get stronger and better developed, they are able to use up more of that water, more quickly. The time to uppot is when the roots have filled the space and taken your buffer away from you to the point that you have to water every day. Only when you reach this point is it the proper time to uppot.

Autos are regular pot plants that have been crossed with a runty little Ruderalis plant, that barely produces any THC at all. All autos therefore have to be inferior in quality and size to regular photoperiod plants. Photos don't require WAY more time... some can actually finish in about 2 or 3 weeks more than a typical auto. If something goes wrong in the grow, photo plants can allow you to recover, build the plant up to where you want it, and then go to bloom... giving you way more flexibility and ability to survive mistakes with a photo. For me, it is not at all worth my time to grow an auto, when with just a little bit more investment in time, I can grow a much much better plant.

Lastly, pot size. Because of the rapid growth cycle and genetic restrictions on final size, going much larger than a 3 gallon container for an auto is probably a waste of space. Many believe it best to put the auto in its final container and be done with it, thinking that any stress is bad for the plant and will affect your final yield. They are not taking into consideration that unless you throw your plants around, say mean things to them, and plant them sideways, there should be no stress in uppotting a pot plant... simply make a hole the size of the previous container in some new soil and plop it right in there. Easy going, and no stress to the plant. Knowing this, old time ,regular methods of proper container management apply... if you want to build up a solid rootball and maintain control over the watering cycle, it is important to restrict the container size and successively uppot. I would start an auto like any other plant, first in a solo cup, then to a 1 gallon, and only then to my final container. Many many growers of autos will disagree with me here... but I will not back down on this. A plant is a plant is a plant.... the rules don't change just because one has had its non stop growth button permanently turned on... you just have to move faster with that plant, but yet do all the same things that you would normally do to develop a good root system.

Yeah you don't like autos lol.
I haven't tried autos for the second reason you mentioned. if something goes wrong you're on the clock and i hate the thought of not having full control over the plant. the only time i'd ever bother with them would be to grow outdoors.

the same reason i don't think new growers would want to run autos. even though it seems like a slick marketing tactic for companies to sell their seeds.

 

[Pbass]

As long as failing means learning and there's not alot of cost or being out of weed involved, I kinda go by just do what I feel like giving a go at, if I eff it up I can always plant more. I might be tempted to try a auto in a big pot from start and a auto in a small one and up pot as needed just to see what works better. I bet you'll find it doesn't matter much if you water it right. Disclaimer...I don't do auto's either but only because I don't own any auto seeds! I really need to branch out...

I learned a ton from applying the information Emilya provided us about watering and up-potting and have done quite a fair amount of up pots in my short foray into gardening weed...I agree it should be virtually stress free. Turn over, tap, plop in new hole. 2 up pots from a starter cup is what seems to work best for me. Cheers!

 

[Remystemple]

As long as failing means learning and there's not alot of cost or being out of weed involved, I kinda go by just do what I feel like giving a go at, if I eff it up I can always plant more. I might be tempted to try a auto in a big pot from start and a auto in a small one and up pot as needed just to see what works better. I bet you'll find it doesn't matter much if you water it right. Disclaimer...I don't do auto's either but only because I don't own any auto seeds! I really need to branch out...

I learned a ton from applying the information Emilya provided us about watering and up-potting and have done quite a fair amount of up pots in my short foray into gardening weed...I agree it should be virtually stress free. Turn over, tap, plop in new hole. 2 up pots from a starter cup is what seems to work best for me. Cheers!

up potting is scary at first when you read about how bad you can mess up and shock the plants. until you actually do it and then you think to yourself, what the hell was i worried about.

the only time i've had scary up pots was in the beginning and i did it too soon. but even then the plants didn't seem to skip a beat even when all the medium fell out on to the floor and i was left with a plant and few strings of root in my hands

 

[Emilya Green]

up potting is scary at first when you read about how bad you can mess up and shock the plants. until you actually do it and then you think to yourself, what the hell was i worried about.

the only time i've had scary up pots was in the beginning and i did it too soon. but even then the plants didn't seem to skip a beat even when all the medium fell out on to the floor and i was left with a plant and few strings of root in my hands

I did that my first time too

 

[aziz]

I will weigh in, since I am sort of known for my knowledge in building containers of soil and watering them properly... beware though, I am also known for my dislike of autos.

First, rock in the bottom do not help drainage, they actually make it worse. Because of capillary action between the rocks and the roots and the bottom and sides of the container, that region will NEVER dry out, and it will stay wetter at the bottom than if it were just plain soil. Do not do this, it is asking for root rot.

The very first task a young seedling has is to "tap" the bottom of the grow space to see what its limits are. I have seen seedlings hit the bottom and through a stroke of luck, hit the drainage hole, on day 3. This is not a sign to uppot. Uppotting is not a race, trying to see how fast we can get it accomplished. Think of soil and the water it can suspend in it as a buffer. At first that soil can provide you a buffer of 3-5 days between needing to water, and as the roots get stronger and better developed, they are able to use up more of that water, more quickly. The time to uppot is when the roots have filled the space and taken your buffer away from you to the point that you have to water every day. Only when you reach this point is it the proper time to uppot.

Autos are regular pot plants that have been crossed with a runty little Ruderalis plant, that barely produces any THC at all. All autos therefore have to be inferior in quality and size to regular photoperiod plants. Photos don't require WAY more time... some can actually finish in about 2 or 3 weeks more than a typical auto. If something goes wrong in the grow, photo plants can allow you to recover, build the plant up to where you want it, and then go to bloom... giving you way more flexibility and ability to survive mistakes with a photo. For me, it is not at all worth my time to grow an auto, when with just a little bit more investment in time, I can grow a much much better plant.

Lastly, pot size. Because of the rapid growth cycle and genetic restrictions on final size, going much larger than a 3 gallon container for an auto is probably a waste of space. Many believe it best to put the auto in its final container and be done with it, thinking that any stress is bad for the plant and will affect your final yield. They are not taking into consideration that unless you throw your plants around, say mean things to them, and plant them sideways, there should be no stress in uppotting a pot plant... simply make a hole the size of the previous container in some new soil and plop it right in there. Easy going, and no stress to the plant. Knowing this, old time ,regular methods of proper container management apply... if you want to build up a solid rootball and maintain control over the watering cycle, it is important to restrict the container size and successively uppot. I would start an auto like any other plant, first in a solo cup, then to a 1 gallon, and only then to my final container. Many many growers of autos will disagree with me here... but I will not back down on this. A plant is a plant is a plant.... the rules don't change just because one has had its non stop growth button permanently turned on... you just have to move faster with that plant, but yet do all the same things that you would normally do to develop a good root system.

how would you improve drainage?

i totally agree with you about the pot size, i've had issues with overwatering when starting with the final pot. now i start them in a small one, and then into the final one. i don't bother with a middle one, since the plant is strong enough so that it uses up a lot of water, and i don't have to worry about giving it too much...

how do you personally up-pot cannabis? my friend once up-potted my weed. and i tho i was gonna get a heart attack, he stripped all of the roots from soil, and then put them into the new container ( the way he was man handling them was brutal)


i usually just take them out of the container with all of the soil, make a hole in the new container, and put em in..





do you think rain water is superior to tap water? i have a huge
water well, or tank, since it doesn't actually get water from below the soil, baisiclly when it rains on the roof of my house, it all goes inside there, get filtred nothing special, just a net.

 

[aziz]

up potting is scary at first when you read about how bad you can mess up and shock the plants. until you actually do it and then you think to yourself, what the hell was i worried about.

the only time i've had scary up pots was in the beginning and i did it too soon. but even then the plants didn't seem to skip a beat even when all the medium fell out on to the floor and i was left with a plant and few strings of root in my hands

i couldn't handle it and probably start crying thankfully all the up-pots i did so far worked grate so far.

 

[aziz]

I did that my first time too

maybe i didn't quite get you, i guess you didn't tell me not to use rocks, but just not to use them on the bottom right? they are not that big tho, they are super fine, and i don't do layers, i just mix everything up, about 30% rocks 70% soil. i'll send pics later.

i saw your guide on watering. i have a quesiton, when i have little seedlings, is it ok to water very little? i've had overwatering issues. (only for when they are very small, first 2 weeks)

 

[SmokingWings]

do you think rain water is superior to tap water?

I do. Rain water has picked up nitrogen and other nutrients that have been floating in the air. Farmers and gardeners look forward to rain providing the water for what they are growing. They have told me that it does more for their plants than the water they get from their wells or irrigation ponds and canals.

 

[Emilya Green]

A few rocks are fine all mixed in with the soil, but having a layer of them on the bottom is not recommended. To improve drainage and to avoid soil compaction, I use 20% perlite or pumice mixed into the soil.
Transplanting does not have to be stressful. Simply take your last container and set it in place in the new container and pack the soil around it. Water it a bit so it holds its shape, and then remove the original container, leaving a neat hole in the new soil exactly the size that is needed. Turn your old plant upside down while supporting the plant in your hand, and work the sides of the container and squeeze the bottom until the old rootball slides right out of the container. Plop this in the premade hole, and water to saturation so as to merge the two soil regions together.
Seedlings, yes, water them carefully. I suggest small amounts of water out to about 3x the plant diameter, and a little bit down the middle. I do this until the plant "establishes" itself, meaning the tap roots have reached the bottom and the plant doesnt try to swim away when you water. Once we are to this point, I water normally.
Lastly, rain water. It is good stuff. Use all of it that you can. It is also cheaper. I am a big fan.

 

[multiVortex]

Lastly, rain water. It is good stuff. Use all of it that you can. It is also cheaper. I am a big fan.

Rain? What's that? Oh, right! That's the stuff that falls from the sky, but always seems to go around us.



I need to get some rain barrels going. Window screen make for a decent pre-filter, just sayin.

 

[Nunyabiz]

The only way you improve drainage is number one always use a fabric pot.
Number two make sure you have proper soil tilth, which usually means about 30% aeration in the form of Rice Hulls, Pumice, precharged Biochar.
And if you're in true LOS then add worms.
Put the fabric pot on a pot elevator and if your soil is right then you wont have overwatering problems.

Autoflowers are IMO very touchy, everything has to be perfect, you do one thing wrong and you might as well just yank it out of the ground because it wont produce squat.
There is no recovery time, if you mess up a photo-period plant you have all the time you need to let the plant recover.

As far as pot size it depends on how you're growing.
If you're feeding salt based synthetic nutrients then use a 5-7 gallon fabric pot water every single day with 1/4 strength nutrients and use coco mixed with about 30% pumice.
If soil, then you could do do a super soil grow in 7+ gallon fabric pots with super soil in bottom 3rd.
Or do a true full organic grow which should be no less than 15 gallon fabric pots with a true Living Organic Soil.

And with autoflowers I wouldn't transplant, in fact I dont ever transplant any of them autoflower or photo-periods.
If your soil tilth is right then theres no problem with watering.
I always just plant a germinated seed right into my 25 gallon fabric pot with zero issues ever.

 

[aziz]

I do. Rain water has picked up nitrogen and other nutrients that have been floating in the air. Farmers and gardeners look forward to rain providing the water for what they are growing. They have told me that it does more for their plants than the water they get from their wells or irrigation ponds and canals.

should i test ph?

 

[Emilya Green]

should i test ph?

if you are running synthetic nutes, they need to be in the proper pH range. Other than that, there is no need to check the pH of your fluids. Checking the pH of your soil is pointless, and most people do not have the equipment necessary to check the base pH of their soil anyway. Knowing that the pH of your soil in the container is different depending on how wet it is and where it is located in the container, makes trying to adjust soil pH even more ridiculous.

 

[aziz]

Rain? What's that? Oh, right! That's the stuff that falls from the sky, but always seems to go around us.



I need to get some rain barrels going. Window screen make for a decent pre-filter, just sayin.

idk where you live, but here it rains really rarely so i'm glad i have the well i would get one of those huge BLUE barrels if i was you, and put a little tap on the bottom

 

[aziz]

The only way you improve drainage is number one always use a fabric pot.
Number two make sure you have proper soil tilth, which usually means about 30% aeration in the form of Rice Hulls, Pumice, precharged Biochar.
And if you're in true LOS then add worms.
Put the fabric pot on a pot elevator and if your soil is right then you wont have overwatering problems.

Autoflowers are IMO very touchy, everything has to be perfect, you do one thing wrong and you might as well just yank it out of the ground because it wont produce squat.
There is no recovery time, if you mess up a photo-period plant you have all the time you need to let the plant recover.

As far as pot size it depends on how you're growing.
If you're feeding salt based synthetic nutrients then use a 5-7 gallon fabric pot water every single day with 1/4 strength nutrients and use coco mixed with about 30% pumice.
If soil, then you could do do a super soil grow in 7+ gallon fabric pots with super soil in bottom 3rd.
Or do a true full organic grow which should be no less than 15 gallon fabric pots with a true Living Organic Soil.

And with autoflowers I wouldn't transplant, in fact I dont ever transplant any of them autoflower or photo-periods.
If your soil tilth is right then theres no problem with watering.
I always just plant a germinated seed right into my 25 gallon fabric pot with zero issues ever.

why does organic require more???

 

[Emilya Green]

why does organic require more???

Organic does not, True Living Organic does not... It's all in the terminology and what it refers to . Living organic such as Nun runs does need larger containers so as to provide more of a buffer so as to keep that soil alive and self sustaining. Regular organic or TLO adds microlife in from outside, so it does not need the whole thing to be its own closed ecosystem.

 

[aziz]

Organic does not, True Living Organic does not... It's all in the terminology and what it refers to . Living organic such as Nun runs does need larger containers so as to provide more of a buffer so as to keep that soil alive and self sustaining. Regular organic or TLO adds microlife in from outside, so it does not need the whole thing to be its own closed ecosystem.

oh i see, is organic fertilizer better? i'd rather use it since i don't need to adjust PH rn i'm using canna vega