A Few Basic Aero Cloner questions

R

Redoctober

New Member
Since this is is my first time cloning with an aero cloner(Botanicare). The only additive I am using in the water is Clonex at the recommended dilution. I had a few questions that haven't quite been answered by my research:

1. What should the pH of the solution be after it's mixed? I've heard 5.8 is best but people seem to differ on this.

2. Is it all right to use the pH down that I got in a fish tank testing kit? Due to a mishap, I will not have a proper ppm/pH meter or actual plant pH down until next week.

3. I am using a 180 watt LED from GLH at 24" away on a 20/4 light cycle. Is this too much light/too intense, and is the distance and timing correct? If it is too much light, what could I switch to in the way of a CFL or something easily obtainable (maybe home depot or petco)? I don't have access to a grow store and all the CFL's I've checked out in local stores seem to be 2700K which is flowering color temperature.

4. The ambient humidity in the room as about 55% because I have a humidifier and fans going, do I need to mist the clones at all in these conditions?
 
all is within good parameters.

The big thing is making sure the water level is within one inch AND that you have a serious bubbler to fill the air space with lots of oxygen
Click to expand...

Thanks PetFlora! Did you mean the water level within one inch of the bottom of the stems? If that's the case, I think mine might be too low. I just filled the unit until it fully covered the water pump.

I had an bubbler that came with the unit, but it was insanely loud, so I bought a whisper quiet unit from the pet store. Problem is that the one I used to use had 2 air feeds for 2 bubblers, and the one I just bought only has one so I'm currently using only one of the air stones. Is there some sort of splitter or T-junction I could improvise?
 
Sound s like you are using a low pressure sump pump- aerators are not submerged! You could get a splitter but you want as many bubbles oxygenating the air as possible.

My DIY cloner is a shoe box size plastic storage tote from the Dollar Store. I can start/clone 12 plants. I use a twin bubbler with 2 X 10" air stones. Water is kept within an inch of the net pots/roots. The small air space is loaded with fresh oxygen delivered by the twin bubblers.

hth
 
I'm not sure I fully understand your setup. I think we are referring to the same thing but in case we aren't, the aquarium pump I bought is this one:
Product Catalog

It sits outside the tank and the tube from it feeds through the side and into cloner held in place by a rubber plug, where it attaches on the other end to an air stone that sits in the water. Actually I have 2 air stones but only one of them is in use with this new unit.

Is this the same thing as the "bubbler" that you use?
Also, have you set up a mist system with a pump to mist the stems with water (like an ez-cloner) in addition to the air stones, or do I have this wrong?

sorry if I'm misunderstanding
 
I responded to your comment I just filled the unit until it fully covered the water pump."

apparently, you meant 'air stone' when you said 'water pump'.

No matter how much liquid they need to pass through, the O2 bubbles will rise to the surface, the more air space you have between the surface and the net pot or plant root, the less concentration of O2 that is available to the roots. By providing max O2 you give your roots a better chance of developing.

Once plant roots are developed enough, the plants are transferred to the main pod where the roots are misted using a high pressure pump and deep cycle timer.

hth
 
haha, ok, sorry for the confusion. I get what you are saying. Initially I did mean "water pump" when referring to the fill level. When I set the thing up, I was unsure how high to fill it because as in an ez-cloner there is a tube about an inch from the top that follows the perimeter of the unit and it is where the individual mist heads are located that spray the mist on the roots. What feeds that perimeter tube is a submersible pump that sits in the water in the middle of the tank, and it's size is about half the height of the overall tank. I arbitrarily decided that filling the water level such that it just submerged the entire pump was the best way to go until I got professional advice here. In addition to the pump, there are 2 air stones that are submerged in the water as well providing aeration. Now that I get what you are saying about oxygenation, I have filled the tank much higher and closer to the stems so that the O2 level will be higher. I have no roots yet; the clones are only 2 days old, but hopefully will be showing in a week or so (fingers crossed).

Incidentally, I noticed that one of the mist heads must be clogged as there is nothing coming out. What is the best way to clean/unclog it without hurting it?
 
OK, I think you can see why my DIY cloner is simpler. For one thing it only uses a couple gallons of water/dilute nutes. And since the cuttings/seedlings will be in there for a couple weeks you will need to add fresh nutes/water, and correct pH.

Clogged Mist Heads

I used to take them apart and soak them in 3% H2O2, I tried a ultrasonic jewelry cleaner then blasted them with a high pressure air hose.

The only thing that will prevent them from clogging is to have an inline filter with 200 mesh screen. This is an essential element for any hydro set up.

Clogging can also be minimized by switching to a high pressure pump. I did that on my way to where I am now (full HPA system), and it really helped my plants to grow. Switching pumps was my first clue that HPA is the way to go.

hth
 
Yeah totally, I think next time around I'm gonna go the DIY rout because these things are really expensive and can be built for a fraction of the cost! Do you have a thread with plans for how you built yours PetFlora? I'm gonna try soaking the mist head in H2O2 for a bit and maybe try to pick up a filter at some point today or tomorrow, though I have no knowledge of such things.

One concern I have is that my clones have begun to develop tiny white spots on the leaves. My first suspicion is that the light may be too intense for them. I'm gonna try moving it up 12" and see if that alleviates it at all. I'm not sure what this condition is a symptom of but my only other guess would be that the pH is off or that the solution temp is too warm. The clones don't even have roots yet so that rules out any root problems, and there is no sign of any insect problems at all. The stems look fine too, not slimy. Has any one experienced this condition?
 
Tiny white spots could be early signs of PM. Take a q-tip and gently rub. If it comes off it's either PM, or if you are foliar spraying it could be mineral residue, meaning your light is too hot. Move the light farther away until your temp meter reads < 80 degrees.

I didn't know what all the stuff was either. But once I came across HPA, I was determined to teach myself. I would google things like inline filters then find local irrigation wholesalers, but in the end Lowes/HD has most everything.

For your cloner they have the PVC couplers. After you locate them take one to the drill bit area and look for a hole cutter that is barley bigger than the bottom of the coupler, where the threads are. Of course I am assuming you have a drill. If not, they are cheap. Rechargeable 18V from Harbor Freight ($20-30). Lowes/HD may have the small storage totes too, but not likely for $1.00. Oh and when you cut the holes don't push too hard or you will crack the lid. Best if you can support the area around the holes while you are cutting them. Do not cut more than 2 banks of 4 as you need support structure in between each hole. If you need more than 8 cuttings get another storage tote. You will find pics in my journal

hth

hth
 
Well, I think that the white spots might be due to the dreaded spider mite. I found some on the bottom of the leaves. I've never had any problems in the past but I just got some clones from a friend and he must've had em on his plants. They're really small little bastards, hard to see. I think that's what the white spots must be from. Isn't that a typical spider mite symptom?

Additionally, after doing a bunch of reading, I decided to switch from my 180 W GLH LED to a 24 W Zoomed CFL that I had lying around. I though I might be stressing the clones with too much light. Hopefully I will be acquiring a T5 within the next week.

PetFlora, what's PM?
I'm gonna do what you said and head over to Home Depot and see what I can throw together. For now, I think the inline filter is step 2 after dealing with these pestilential mites!
 
Hey Sky, yeah sorry, I kinda sneaked it in the first post. It's a Botanicare 48 site unit that I actually bought off of a friend. He gave it to me with the pump included and a 2 tube air bubbler with 2 stones. I think it's pretty similar to an EZ Cloner so I just call it that.

Just picked up some Neem from a friend. Now the question is do I spray my clones, or make up a solution and dip the clones?

If dipping is the way to go, does anyone know how to make up the proper dilution i.e. how much Neem and how much water?
I assume you don't dip in straight Neem?
 
Redoctober said:
Hey Sky, yeah sorry, I kinda sneaked it in the first post. It's a Botanicare 48 site unit that I actually bought off of a friend. He gave it to me with the pump included and a 2 tube air bubbler with 2 stones. I think it's pretty similar to an EZ Cloner so I just call it that.

Just picked up some Neem from a friend. Now the question is do I spray my clones, or make up a solution and dip the clones?

If dipping is the way to go, does anyone know how to make up the proper dilution i.e. how much Neem and how much water?
I assume you don't dip in straight Neem?
Click to expand...


Add clonex solution (optional). Don't use dipping gel. Its not made for aeroponics more for soil. And ph tap water to 5.8. And let it run. Is the neem to spray for mites?
 
I used the Clonex solution at a dilution of 2 tsp per gallon. Didn't use gel. I've seen people use gel in aero cloners but it intuitively never made much sense to me because the spray from the misters would just wash it right off. Unless the thinking is that the gel seeps into the stem and just serves to get things going hormonally, I don't know. I used filtered water and pH adjusted it down to what I believe is around 5.8 or so (I don't have a meter yet and the kit I bought from PetCo only goes down to 6.0, so I just guestimated a bit). I think the temp is good because the ambient temp in the room is 72 so the water temp should be around there too. I had one or two slimy stems which may be from a day or two when my LED was causing the room to heat up to 81 degrees, but I've since switched to CFL's so the room's much cooler. I transplanted the slimy stemmed clones into a perlite/vermiculite mixture saturated with tap water (no pH adjustment or additives)

Yeah Sky the Neem is for the mites I discovered yesterday. There had been some white spots on my leaves for a few days and upon a cursory inspection, I didn't see anything. However when the problem worsened, I looked with a magnifying glass and I saw these minuscule little bastards running around on the bottom which I can only assume are spider mites. They're so damn tiny, but thankfully not too many of them. I did want to take care of this problem before it got out of control though. I squished as many as I could with my fingers (they're so small, it doesn't really take much, all you have to do is gently rub over them with a clean finger or q-tip and they're history) and then sprayed both top and bottom of all the clones with Neem. Boy does that stuff have an odor! We shall see how things progress from here.

I'm not sure if and when I should reapply another coat of Neem, any suggestions?
 
Sorry man I never had spider mites (at least I don't think) so I never used it. I can do some research if no one chimes in this weekend and help you with your question. Meanwhile you might want to go to tthe "frequently ask question" section and then the sub forum problems pest and disease control. I'm sure some body there with experience will help you better than me.
 
Thanks Sky, that's very generous of you :)
I've been doing as much reading as I can on the subject.
I made a solution of 80% water and 20% neem and dipped each clone.
...and now, we wait.I really don't want these little bastards to spread off of the plants and into the room.
I'm considering buying predator mites if this neem doesn't work.
I may also give Floramite a try, but I've heard it's pretty toxic.
 

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