Live Res PH Control - How do you manage it?

[Far East Buds]

So I will give you a run down of where I am at.


I was running topfeed with timed drip cycles...

I had issues and got pythium. Not really sure still how i did but anyway... Replaced almost everything twice and finally switched to a live res and coco medium. Immediately saw good results. As far as I can tell the pythium is still gone. The plants all rebounded and are growing nice again.

That being said I have to PH down the res almost daily as it wants to keep creeping up. I was told that it is a sign the good bennies need to be replenished. But the foam and bubble that the bennies seem to increase and enhance are all still happening...

What do people do in a DWC res live ? Do you have to keep adding the bennies every few days, Ph ing consistently?

Just curious what others have run into....

Thanks in advance...

FE

 

[Lazarus13]

Whats up FE? Ive been running live since i started 5 weeks ago and havent really had much of a problem. I start at change by pHing my mix to ~5.5 and over the course of 2 weeks it gradually goes up to ~ 6.1 and kind of stays there til the next change out.
I do it the same everytime. Nutes and additives in the rez, great white, voodoo and humic acid through the hydroton.
Ive had some issues with my 2nd rez running 1/4 nutes early veg w benes. It climbs to about 6.2 but really no higher.
How high and how fast is it climbing?

 

[Far East Buds]

Whats up FE? Ive been running live since i started 5 weeks ago and havent really had much of a problem. I start at change by pHing my mix to ~5.5 and over the course of 2 weeks it gradually goes up to ~ 6.1 and kind of stays there til the next change out.
I do it the same everytime. Nutes and additives in the rez, great white, voodoo and humic acid through the hydroton.
Ive had some issues with my 2nd rez running 1/4 nutes early veg w benes. It climbs to about 6.2 but really no higher.

Thanks Laz for responding... i switched to live to battle that pyth and it has seemded to worked. Everything basically got replaced and i run DTW so..

But Its not inadequate air... Res looks healthy.. slight foaming really good bubble dispersment it you get what i mean.. lotsa little bubbles... Just the PH will be 7.0 after I ph it down to 5.8.... 12-24 hours later its back to 7 or close... Growth and plants look great but I worry they are missing stuff on the nute table...

I am running
Great white,
Hygrozyme
Plant sucess
as my bennies... and Cutting edge stuff for base nutes...(very clean stuff)

I am only on day 5 now and i guess i will re add bennies and see how it responds...


Thanks again for the interest...

FE

 

[Papageno]

We talked about this a bunch today but I think the dealio is you recently started. You have pithyum throughout the system like in your pump now. You are probably putting in maintenance levels of bacteria not aggressive go kick some ass levels so you will want to give it some time.

Your plants are fine (except maybe that albino ) so just give it some time.

My res doesn't go up high it is nice and happy... but I never get to the point of having an infection or problems of any kind as I don't run sterile.

Once you let it get pithyum a lot of things change until you get it back in control.

You really need to do one or the other in a very aggressive way at this point.

 

[Far East Buds]

We talked about this a bunch today but I think the dealio is you recently started. You have pithyum throughout the system like in your pump now. You are probably putting in maintenance levels of bacteria not aggressive go kick some ass levels so you will want to give it some time.

Your plants are fine (except maybe that albino ) so just give it some time.

My res doesn't go up high it is nice and happy... but I never get to the point of having an infection or problems of any kind as I don't run sterile.

Once you let it get pithyum a lot of things change until you get it back in control.

You really need to do one or the other in a very aggressive way at this point.

The really odd part though is i cleaned the pyth out of the res in flower and veg 3 times with major strenght h202 and even replaced the pumps and all line etc.. just reused the tubs.. it still came back... So yah probably the case is that I will need to add the bennies more often for a bit to keep the cause at bay.. Doesnt make sense... I definitely dont have a heat issue and dtw flows one way ;/

Things are good yes going in the good direction Just PH concerned... that was all....

FE

 

[Lazarus13]

So VilliageIdiot, the residual pythium in the pumps and stuff are whats driving the ph up? Oh and i just made my second batch of your tea, thanks for the recipe. Its good stuff. Almost the same as i was already using but with a few things that really think make a difference.

 

[Papageno]

The key with running bacteria instead of chemicals is they are bacteria. Wherever bad bacteria goes to live and breed good bacteria goes and takes its place. It kicks them out of all the campsites and takes over.

So that really is a big deal that people overlook.

But I read about this all the time that "I kicked my pithyum with some chems" (could be Chlorimate too) and then a week later right on time they are like "I think it is back".

So just like so many things you have to go well beyond when you think the infection is cleared and that last 5 or 2 % of the problem is substantially harder to beat than the first 95%. So it is very easy to think you have cleaned it out when in reality you have cleaned out 95% of it which is not enough. You have to keep doing it beyond cleaning it out and then just keep doing it at a maintenance level forever. And that is true either way you go.

So yeah bacteria hide all over and depending on the complexity of your system there may be many nooks and crannies for them to get into. I find that my airs tones can build up stuff. Basically anything in there with a surface (so anything) can build up microbes. You can not wash it all and some of it (like the inside of a pump) will never be washed. You either quadruple dose the chems for a long long time...or toss in something that will actually beat it at its own game.

Both work. But people fail to go full speed ahead on one or the other. You have to commit to it.

 

[Far East Buds]

yah I am full speed on the Live.... I never cared live or sterile. Just what was easier... I just assumed sterile was...Seems like once i got over the fact I'd have to ditch alot of money investment, I knew live was the way to go. Rather have the bacteria fighting for me instead of against me...

So yah at this point it is streamlining it or adapting a good regiment.

I'm close...

So I continue to ask stuff Thanks for answering stuff




FE

 

[davetherave00]

The key with running bacteria instead of chemicals is they are bacteria. Wherever bad bacteria goes to live and breed good bacteria goes and takes its place. It kicks them out of all the campsites and takes over.

So that really is a big deal that people overlook.

But I read about this all the time that "I kicked my pithyum with some chems" (could be Chlorimate too) and then a week later right on time they are like "I think it is back".

So just like so many things you have to go well beyond when you think the infection is cleared and that last 5 or 2 % of the problem is substantially harder to beat than the first 95%. So it is very easy to think you have cleaned it out when in reality you have cleaned out 95% of it which is not enough. You have to keep doing it beyond cleaning it out and then just keep doing it at a maintenance level forever. And that is true either way you go.

So yeah bacteria hide all over and depending on the complexity of your system there may be many nooks and crannies for them to get into. I find that my airs tones can build up stuff. Basically anything in there with a surface (so anything) can build up microbes. You can not wash it all and some of it (like the inside of a pump) will never be washed. You either quadruple dose the chems for a long long time...or toss in something that will actually beat it at its own game.

Both work. But people fail to go full speed ahead on one or the other. You have to commit to it.

Yo village, iv been trying to speak to you but cant due to my low posts. Iv came across your bennie recipe before and walk through but can find it anywhere. can you post the link thanks

 

[Lazarus13]

Site search for Tea Bag your DWC. Thats how i found it again

 

[davetherave00]

Site search for Tea Bag your DWC. Thats how i found it again

Thanks bud

 

[Papageno]

My sig has a link to my journal. On page 8 I have a step by step updated recipe. The tea bag you DWC has explanations for most of it.

Use my journal to talk to me directly if you can't PM as that space is really for that. I don't need a journal for me.

 

[Mcjoint]

Just started using VI's tea. Same thing is happening my ph is climbing high and fast. Went from 5.9 at 12.30am to 6.8 by 8 am.

 

[Papageno]

What is your water uptake doing?

How much did you dose per plant and how long did you let the microbes go for?

If the res is bubbling away then they are going to town and breeding in there. When brewed correctly it comes out at 7.0 and about 800PPM. If they get introduced and take off breeding because there is a lot of work to do that can raise it a bit. But what you are describing seems a bit too much. Did you use 4 cups a plant? If the res is bubbling away and you see them breeding like mad in there I wouldn't worry too much.

If it was done correctly you will be fine. It is outside the ideal range but that pH is not bad on the plant and will help Calcium uptake. It will come back down or you can slowly pH it but I would add top off to pH it down. Adding that directly to the res will kill the good stuff.

Was it bubbling good and breeding in the tea brewer? You have to make sure you are getting the aerobic bacteria and killing off the anaerobic bacteria during the process by string it.


If it is bubbling like mad and they are doing there thing I wouldn't pH it for at least a day and let them do their job. Often times the first time this is introduced they have lots of work to do. I added it once to a res and there was no space under the lid. The entire tub was filled with foam for about 2 days while they cleaned up that mess.

 

[Mcjoint]

What is your water uptake doing?

How much did you dose per plant and how long did you let the microbes go for?

If the res is bubbling away then they are going to town and breeding in there. When brewed correctly it comes out at 7.0 and about 800PPM. If they get introduced and take off breeding because there is a lot of work to do that can raise it a bit. But what you are describing seems a bit too much. Did you use 4 cups a plant? If the res is bubbling away and you see them breeding like mad in there I wouldn't worry too much.

If it was done correctly you will be fine. It is outside the ideal range but that pH is not bad on the plant and will help Calcium uptake. It will come back down or you can slowly pH it but I would add top off to pH it down. Adding that directly to the res will kill the good stuff.

Was it bubbling good and breeding in the tea brewer? You have to make sure you are getting the aerobic bacteria and killing off the anaerobic bacteria during the process by string it.


If it is bubbling like mad and they are doing there thing I wouldn't pH it for at least a day and let them do their job. Often times the first time this is introduced they have lots of work to do. I added it once to a res and there was no space under the lid. The entire tub was filled with foam for about 2 days while they cleaned up that mess.

Yes, my res is bubbling like crazy. My ph keeps going back to 7. I lost the green crack b. C of root rot. I added the tea to my remaining plant. Her roots looked healthy on the outside but I suspect in the middle of her root ball she had some rot brewing. I used 4cups or 1000MLs

 

[Papageno]

Yeah so if it is "fermenting" in the res then you have sweet massive microbial activity. There is a lot of cleaning going on. They bring it to 7 when breeding & is not dangerous for the plant. It can lock out nutes but the bacteria work on those too. It will settle in 2 days and then continue as normal and all will be fine. I would not pH it for the first day and let them works their magic. Bringing it down will slow activity by killing the bacteria. This is why I asked about uptake. Monitor the water level. After they clean it up the uptake should zoom. Clean roots work well.

The plants should respond by tomorrow.

 

[Mcjoint]

Yeah so if it is "fermenting" in the res then you have sweet massive microbial activity. There is a lot of cleaning going on. They bring it to 7 when breeding & is not dangerous for the plant. It can lock out nutes but the bacteria work on those too. It will settle in 2 days and then continue as normal and all will be fine. I would not pH it for the first day and let them works their magic. Bringing it down will slow activity by killing the bacteria. This is why I asked about uptake. Monitor the water level. after they clean it up the uptake should zoom. clean roots work well.

The plants should respond by tomorrow.

So let it stay at 7 untill she starts to drink alot?

 

[Papageno]

Honestly it will take care of itself most likely.

When the bacteria are having that kind of orgy there is a lot of food, the temps are right. They are overpowering the res right now. Just like when making it the pH goes to 7 once they take off. In your res when the food runs out they will stop breeding and then start dying. When they die it is no big deal.

So depending on how dirty the res is they will do there thing for a few days. It will be at its peak for maybe 24 hours. It all depends on how much food there is. Then it will gradually die off. Usually the plant naturally cycles pH up and down as it takes up certain nutes. But you can manually adjust once the res starts to look like just the air pump is making turbulence.

There should be enough nutes in there for a while. But likely by day 3 the plants will be drinking good and you will need a good top off. For me like a few days later, if in heavy growth periods I might see more than a gallon per plant. So in my case I can watch the water level and when I get a bit low I can top off with a few gallons of pH'd concentration. Then the rs will land somewhere between the 2 spots and the solution wont shock the plant.

Specifically if you do some math and decide you want to put in solution pH'd to 4 to compensate and get it to 5.8 you will have problems.

More likely you did things right and the plants are staying happy and in a few days it will be down around 6.6 or lower. So you can add a gallon or so of 5.8 and get it to 6.4 or so and back on a decent feed schedule right away. It will suck that up and in 2 days you can top off again and you will be running in a zone that likely you can just leave it for a while. Just top off with 5.8 solution and things will work out from here one. Having a 5 gallon res that can drop 2 gallons before you have to deliver solution makes this much easier. You don't need to wait for 2 gallon but the cushion is nice.

Ganging up many plants on the same res also makes this easier to control. (only do this when all plants are the same or very similar strain, preferably clones)

As an example:

So if you ran say a 30-35 gallon tote (I run a 35), and filled it to about 25 gallons you can let it drop 5 gallons and be able to top off one bucket at a time which is much easier to mix up. You can even let it drop 10 gallons and still effectively run 5 plants without too much labor. 4 Plants in there is real nice. Then it can drop 13 gallons orver roughly 3+ days in heavy growth periods before it must be filled. But topping off daily to somewhere between 20 and 25 is recommended.

* Closer to 20 is more air roots

 

[Mcjoint]

I have ph it down twice it still going up but a little slower now. Hopefully I didn't mess anything up.

 

[Far East Buds]

I still haven't figured my live res out yet.. ;/
Climbs to 7.0 daily even after a couple weeks live... I have tried light... heavy.. medium doses and it still climbs (not VI's mix). I think the climb is slowing but I have had to change the time and start phing it right before a feeding because I am starting to see some leaf deficiencies... I am hoping not to go down that road again.
So I can't help.. just letting you know you are not alone...



FE