Opioid Tapering With Cannabis: A Regimen

[SweetSue]

Dirtdemon I wish you great success in your reduction to zero program.

I have a couple of comments:

If your Doctor cut you off cold turkey, without a proper reduction plan prescription, to me that is medical malpractice. Have you had a conversation with the Doc about your struggles and the need for such? If (s)he wont help, my next visit would be to a lawyer to discuss suing the poor misinformed soul.

I think its better understood now that high levels of thc can actually cause more pain and unwelcome symptoms than treat them. @SweetSue please let me know if I have this right. This is known to be true with opiates - continued use makes you feel worse, rather than help relieve pain.

You are taking a lot of cannabis and it doesn't sound like its helping as it should.

Do you have an opiates reduction schedule you are following? I think a 20% every couple weeks is common but verify this.

Best wishes ....

I agree Oldbear, and this is why we suggest a balanced ratio, or one higher in CBD rather than THC. With chronic pain you choose your euphoria carefully. DirtDemon is balancing the THC with CBD crystals now, something he wasn’t doing previously. I’m sure he’s into a higher CBD ratio by now, or will be soon.

Withdrawal brings so many stresses into play that sometimes euphoria is the best option available. The focus of a tapering regimen remains creating a schedule of dosing and slowly reducing the opioid dose as you adjust the cannabis dose and ratios.

Unfortunately, it’s a common practice for pain management doctors to toss pain patients to the curb when they test positive for cannabis. It’s one of the huge concerns in the current treatment plans in the States.

Our federal government is holding tight to the false idea that cannabis is a dangerous, addictive drug with absolutely no medicinal value, worthy of its placement at the top of the controlled substances schedule. As long as that lie is being enforced the doctors believe their hands are tied, and if they don’t follow the federal guidelines they run the risk of losing their license to practice medicine.

 

[Dirtdemon]

Dirtdemon I wish you great success in your reduction to zero program.

I have a couple of comments:

If your Doctor cut you off cold turkey, without a proper reduction plan prescription, to me that is medical malpractice. Have you had a conversation with the Doc about your struggles and the need for such? If (s)he wont help, my next visit would be to a lawyer to discuss suing the poor misinformed soul.

I think its better understood now that high levels of thc can actually cause more pain and unwelcome symptoms than treat them. @SweetSue please let me know if I have this right. This is known to be true with opiates - continued use makes you feel worse, rather than help relieve pain.

You are taking a lot of cannabis and it doesn't sound like its helping as it should.

Do you have an opiates reduction schedule you are following? I think a 20% every couple weeks is common but verify this.

Best wishes ....

First I haven’t been back to my family doc since that, you can not sue a doctor in Canada well you can but it never happens. Lawyers won’t touch it.
Second thc doesn’t work that way I am sure. It is not delivered to the system the same way that’s what makes the difference I think.
Thirdly thank you for the best wishes.

 

[SweetSue]

First I haven’t been back to my family doc since that, you can not sue a doctor in Canada well you can but it never happens. Lawyers won’t touch it.
Second thc doesn’t work that way I am sure. It is not delivered to the system the same way that’s what makes the difference I think.
Thirdly thank you for the best wishes.

We suggest the higher ratios of CBD over THC because increased pain perception is very possible DirtDemon, though not in the same way or with the same severity as with opioids. Higher levels of THC than your system can comfortably handle will drive CB receptors off line and you'll have a higher pain perception simply because there won't be as many receptors to stimulate.

This can be rectified with a 72-hour cannabis fast, during which time the receptors revive themselves and you can once again reduce the doses.

Chronic pain is a special case when you set a regimen. Start with a balanced ratio and adjust the CBD higher if you don't get the relief you seek with the balance. Your final med mix will do much more to manage chronic pain if it's higher in CBD than THC.

 

[Dirtdemon]

We suggest the higher ratios of CBD over THC because increased pain perception is very possible DirtDemon, though not in the same way or with the same severity as with opioids. Higher levels of THC than your system can comfortably handle will drive CB receptors off line and you'll have a higher pain perception simply because there won't be as many receptors to stimulate.

This can be rectified with a 72-hour cannabis fast, during which time the receptors revive themselves and you can once again reduce the doses.

Chronic pain is a special case when you set a regimen. Start with a balanced ratio and adjust the CBD higher if you don't get the relief you seek with the balance. Your final med mix will do much more to manage chronic pain if it's higher in CBD than THC.

Good day SweetSue, from your explanation I realize it’s a oversimplification, but I’m a simple guy. Thc and the causing pain, basically it happens because of a built up tolerance to thc. Am I even close in my understanding.
SweetSue I know this wasn’t the plan, and I honestly didn’t plan on doing this. Today just before I started to write this post I realized that I haven’t taken anything this morning. My back is sore but not enough that I went for a PK. I did take my perk and a cbd enriched mother of berry joint. Just before the post because I want to stick to the regiment. But now I think it was a mistake maybe. If my body isn’t screaming for a opiate maybe I should listen to it. What are your thoughts SweetSue.
Just in case you need a hug SweetSue. You are a huge part of any success I am achieving and I thank you.

 

[SweetSue]

Good day SweetSue, from your explanation I realize it’s a oversimplification, but I’m a simple guy. Thc and the causing pain, basically it happens because of a built up tolerance to thc. Am I even close in my understanding.
SweetSue I know this wasn’t the plan, and I honestly didn’t plan on doing this. Today just before I started to write this post I realized that I haven’t taken anything this morning. My back is sore but not enough that I went for a PK. I did take my perk and a cbd enriched mother of berry joint. Just before the post because I want to stick to the regiment. But now I think it was a mistake maybe. If my body isn’t screaming for a opiate maybe I should listen to it. What are your thoughts SweetSue.
Just in case you need a hug SweetSue. You are a huge part of any success I am achieving and I thank you.

It’s tempting to speed the process up, but I encourage you to stick to the regimen.

When you’ve had a few days of tolerable conditions that’s when you cut back on the next opioid dose. Try taking half of what you’d normally take.

Sounds like the CBD is making a difference this time. What are your thoughts on that? Do you have any idea how much you’re using?

You’re correct in your understanding of tolerance to THC. You can stave that concern off by simply switching to another chemovar every once in a while. Variety pays off with a cannabis therapy.

Thanks for the hug. I’m always up for a hug.

Your desire was strong enough this time to allow the solutions to get through. I’m but a partner in the cosmic orchestration to get you to this point. I’m humbled to be able to be here when you needed me to be.

 

[Dirtdemon]

It’s tempting to speed the process up, but I encourage you to stick to the regimen.

When you’ve had a few days of tolerable conditions that’s when you cut back on the next opioid dose. Try taking half of what you’d normally take.

Sounds like the CBD is making a difference this time. What are your thoughts on that? Do you have any idea how much you’re using?

You’re correct in your understanding of tolerance to THC. You can stave that concern off by simply switching to another chemovar every once in a while. Variety pays off with a cannabis therapy.

Thanks for the hug. I’m always up for a hug.

Your desire was strong enough this time to allow the solutions to get through. I’m but a partner in the cosmic orchestration to get you to this point. I’m humbled to be able to be here when you needed me to be.

Yes 100% the cbd is helping. Honestly today is when I realized how much benefit cbd is having. I think it’s because cbd is like glucosamine you need to build it up in your system to feel the effects. I have been mixing about the size of a piece of rice 7 to 10 times daily.
We are in the middle of making CO to mix with 500mg of cbd to 50ml of CO. That should give me the dose that you recommend.
Well I have to get back to my chores. You are humble because you are a big part of my success. Being told the things you said about not failing just going about it wrong way. Helped emensly I was giving up slowly but surely. You changed that.
God Bless
DD

 

[Preston9mm]

And yes I find it hard to stick to my regiment. Mainly because I’m pill sick and the the easiest way to cure it is to do more pills.

Best friends with your worst enemy... I know that cycle & it sucks!

Stick with it buddy! It can be done. I hit my 2 year mark in November.

-P

 

[Dirtdemon]

Best friends with your worst enemy... I know that cycle & it sucks!

Stick with it buddy! It can be done. I hit my 2 year mark in November.

-P

Congratulations ant thank you.

 

[Dirtdemon]

Hi y’all it’s been a very busy day. My neck and back are killing me. So I’m going to keep this short and get to bed before I do something I’ll be ashamed of lol. I made my 1:1 thc cbd CO in 1ml doses today. Just took one and ate a couple cookies and smoked some bubba kush. I’m off to bed y’all have a great night.

 

[SweetSue]

Hi y’all it’s been a very busy day. My neck and back are killing me. So I’m going to keep this short and get to bed before I do something I’ll be ashamed of lol. I made my 1:1 thc cbd CO in 1ml doses today. Just took one and ate a couple cookies and smoked some bubba kush. I’m off to bed y’all have a great night.

Slap some topical on that, if you have it.

 

[SweetSue]

I watched a video over at Green Flower Media last night on getting relief with cannabis without the high. The man made sense, his contention being that if you start with CBD - probably in the neighborhood of 25 mg or so per dose - and then micro dose in THC at the rate of only 1 mg per dose you'll get better relief than you will with the high-THC we've been trained to reach for.

He even had a neat idea for setting up the capsules:
* Make an oil that has approximately 5-10 mg/ml of THC. I'm still working this part out. Assume you'll be getting slightly more than that 1 mg per drop when you fill the capsules.
* Set up your capsules in a jig.
* Fill the capsules with 1 drop, 2 drops, and 3 drops to give you doses of approximately 1.5 mg, 3 mg, and 5 mg respectively.

This gives you multiple dosing options for the THC, but keeps them all at a low dose.

Joe Dolce believes our best approach is to

Start low
Go slow
Stay low​

Considering what we've been learning over here with tapering and CBD I think we've been going at it all wrong up to now. What Bluenoser and DirtDemon have shown, IMO, is that CBD is much more important in the treatment of chronic pain and for tapering off opioids than we suspected.

There still haven't been any trials on the effectiveness of CBD for chronic pain. Once again we're on the cutting edge. Prohibition restricts research.

Incidentally, that Cannabis 101 Summit at Green Flower Media is free for viewing through today.

 

[SweetSue]

The oil would need to be made so it'll be about 1 mg per drop instead of 1 mg/ml. For one thing, you won't get a reliable oil at 1 mg/ml. For another you'd need some mighty big capsules. Lol!

 

[Dirtdemon]

Hey y’all, so it’s been a terrible couple days. Yesterday was spent in bed. But I only took my one perk in morning and one at night. It was really hard I mean really hard. To the point that I made my gf take my pills and lock them in the pickup. She did not budge a inch lol. I am thankful if I would have even took two extra it would have been the beginning of the end. I am sore but not enough to be tempted. Other than yesterday pain control has been helped lots by adding cbd to my thc. Hope everyone had a great weekend.

 

[Preston9mm]

Hey y’all, so it’s been a terrible couple days. Yesterday was spent in bed. But I only took my one perk in morning and one at night. It was really hard I mean really hard. To the point that I made my gf take my pills and lock them in the pickup. She did not budge a inch lol. I am thankful if I would have even took two extra it would have been the beginning of the end. I am sore but not enough to be tempted. Other than yesterday pain control has been helped lots by adding cbd to my thc. Hope everyone had a great weekend.

Good for you! It's fucking miserable but totally worth every forward step!

 

[Dirtdemon]

Good for you! It's fucking miserable but totally worth every forward step!

Thanks P9

 

[SweetSue]

Good for you! It's fucking miserable but totally worth every forward step!

What he said.

There's and end to it. I know you can feel it. Use more CBD if you have it.

And hey..... you're doing really well.

 

[Dirtdemon]

What he said.

There's and end to it. I know you can feel it. Use more CBD if you have it.

And hey..... you're doing really well.

Thank you for all your help.

 

[Preston9mm]

Thank you for all your help.

I wouldn't wish that madness on my worst enemy. I'll always be around here to listen and cheer you on!
I may not know all the science behind this treatment like @SweetSue , but I understand your struggle. Hit me up anytime... I'm happy to share my addiction story and will listen to anyone else who wants to share theirs.

-P

 

[Oldbear]

Hey y’all, so it’s been a terrible couple days. Yesterday was spent in bed. But I only took my one perk in morning and one at night. It was really hard I mean really hard. To the point that I made my gf take my pills and lock them in the pickup. She did not budge a inch lol. I am thankful if I would have even took two extra it would have been the beginning of the end. I am sore but not enough to be tempted. Other than yesterday pain control has been helped lots by adding cbd to my thc. Hope everyone had a great weekend.

]

This update makes me very happy for you

 

[Dirtdemon]

I wouldn't wish that madness on my worst enemy. I'll always be around here to listen and cheer you on!
I may not know all the science behind this treatment like @SweetSue , but I understand your struggle. Hit me up anytime... I'm happy to share my addiction story and will listen to anyone else who wants to share theirs.

-P

Thank you it might sound silly but all y’all support is very helpful.