First time grow in DWC

[Rexer]

What is it? I thought it was just from the water bubbling. I started putting ice directly on the air pump to cool the air and that seemed to have dropped the temp of my water, it's now cool to the touch. You think I should take it further?

I know that was directed at West, but for some reason I see a bottle with condensation restting against an electric device- the two should not mix.

Put the frozen water bottle(s) in the res

For the mixing of the h202 wait to hear back, I'll tag some members who can hopefully help you there. I don't use it anymore- I personally recommend beneficials.

@TorturedSoul or @bluter - would you be able to recommend how to dilute down a 35% h202 for keeping a sterile res? Sorry to bother you guys, but this is outside my comfort zone

 

[West Hippie]

What is it? I thought it was just from the water bubbling. I started putting ice directly on the air pump to cool the air and that seemed to have dropped the temp of my water, it's now cool to the touch. You think I should take it further?

You have to watch the temp 68 degrees is the lowest , don’t want to shock the girls. Yes it’s growing not a good bacteria . Never rinse it back into your bucket use a empty one and see what you rinsed off .

 

[Brazyy]

I know that was directed at West, but for some reason I see a bottle with condensation restting against an electric device- the two should not mix.

Put the frozen water bottle(s) in the res

For the mixing of the h202 wait to hear back, I'll tag some members who can hopefully help you there. I don't use it anymore- I personally recommend beneficials.

@TorturedSoul or @bluter - would you be able to recommend how to dilute down a 35% h202 for keeping a sterile res? Sorry to bother you guys, but this is outside my comfort zone

I was rapping the bottles in a paper towel and checking it regularly with no moisture issues, it seems like the consensus is to just put it in the reservoir so I'll do that. How long should I have the bottles in the res for, should I be switching them out everytime they melt all the way through? I might just save myself the stress and find a more consistent solution where the temps aren't going to be bouncing back and forth so much. Thanks for the advise as always.

 

[Brazyy]

You have to watch the temp 68 degrees is the lowest , don’t want to shock the girls. Yes it’s growing not a good bacteria . Never rinse it back into your bucket use a empty one and see what you rinsed off .

I got a half gallon milk jug and used that to some tap water over the net bucket and roots. It seemed to wash away the bubbles and brownish color from the roots.

 

[West Hippie]

I got a half gallon milk jug and used that to some tap water over the net bucket and roots. It seemed to wash away the bubbles and brownish color from the roots.

Be careful about putting the girl back in the bucket with the ice bottle. Don’t shock her , keep her hanging in an empty bucket . She doesn’t mind at all you could keep her there a couple hours without any problems . If you have a room temp bottle water flush her through the basket while in the empty bucket . You got this !

 

[Rexer]

I was rapping the bottles in a paper towel and checking it regularly with no moisture issues, it seems like the consensus is to just put it in the reservoir so I'll do that.

I've read about it (and a lot of the same principles apply with my medium), but West and Tok have actually done dwc.

How long should I have the bottles in the res for, should I be switching them out everytime they melt all the way through? I might just save myself the stress and find a more consistent solution where the temps aren't going to be bouncing back and forth so much. Thanks for the advise as always.

The ideal solution is using a chiller. They can be a bit pricey, but are a set and forget solution.
There are members who have used coolers as the bucket, with a hole cut in the lid for the net cup.
You can make your own chiller (DIY), using a small bar fridge, pex line, and a pump.

Tok was playing around with a chiller probe that seems to help.


To help keep temp down in my reservoir I reused some foam that came with various purchases for packaging. It's the thin white Styrofoam sheets, wrapped around the reservoir held in place by tape. Nothing fancy, but helps a bit and was free.

 

[Brazyy]

10/03/2021
Day 33
So I realized that I kinda had the wrong approach with the LST I did initially. I tied some of the biggest leaves together which ultimately restricted them and reduced the total amount of surface area the plant had to collect light. So I went back to the drawing board and this is what I came up with. I started by removing the skewers and running my fingers through her leaves so that they were all in the natural positions. I did this because the plant is very symmetrical and I want to use this to my advantage. I placed the skewers between the 4 main sets of growth like so:

The plant has 6 large leaves that I need to move in a way that will allow for the new growth to be exposed. There happens to be 6 new grow sites I want to expose not counting the top of the main stem. To do this I started by bending the top set of large leaves to right, after she looked like this:

Next I took the remaining leaves and bent them to left, leaving a nice space for the new growth to fill, this took a little persuading on my end. All I did was fold younger leaves over the older ones while leaving as much of the plant exposed as possible. The finished product looked like this:

Until the new branches stretch up a bit more there isn't to much I feel like I can do as far as LST goes. She's only like 6.5 inches at day 33 so she is what I would think to be considered a smaller plant. All things considered I am pretty happy with this change though, all the new growth that can be exposed at this time so now its just time to sit back and let her do her thing. Additionally I was told that I was growing some bad bacteria possibly due to not having a sterile reservoir/temps being to high. As far as the temps go, I plan on getting an additional fan for the tent to hang up by the lights and inline fan so I can reduce the heat that is able to sit stagnant. I currently have the 6" inline fan running at its lowest setting and the 6" "intake" fan - as I will now refer to it, on the half power setting. I'm at a cross roads because I don't want to reduce the light and in fact I want to increase it to 100% in the coming weeks. Now we have an issue though, more light equals more heat. I could take the inline fan off of the lowest setting, but I don't know how that will effect the longevity of my carbon filter and worse yet it will for sure decrease the RH in the tent which I don't want to do with it currently sitting between 48-58%. Every once and while it will be a few percent more or less, like a jump to 65% or drop to 42% isn't super uncommon. I don't know the optimal RH levels for this point in veg but this range seems to be working for me so I want to stay here. I know in flower I'll want to start dropping it but my plan is to keep this lady in veg as long as possible to really drag out upward growth. I'll try increasing the intake fan to full power and see how the environment reacts. Aside from that there isn't anything else to report, hope your high and have a great rest of your day.

Welcome and nice start to your grow journal @Brazyy

I have a couple questions.

Are you using tap water in your reservoir? If so is it hard or soft water?
If you are using tap water are you letting it sit for at least 24 hours before you use it?

Get a quality ppm/ec pen, and a ph pen, you can't do DWC without them.
If you are going to do DWC you have to know what you water is doing all the time.

Are you feeding her yet? If so how much preferably in ppm's or ec. ?

The water should be aerated all the time or is will become stagnant and start to smell.

You need to keep your water temps. below 72 degrees or root rot can start.

What are you doing for circulation?

Sorry for so many questions.

Stay safe, and grow well my friend,

Tok..

Also, increase your cal-mag, you are showing signs of a deficiency.

edit: spelled ph wrong.

Thanks man, welcome!

Yes I am using tap water in the reservoir and tbh I have no idea if it is hard or soft, I tried looking into it but I couldn't find a straight answer. I'm gonna lean towards hard though considering a water filter is a necessity around here if you wanna drink the tap water. I live in a pretty rural area. I do let it sit for 24 hours with an air stone in it before I use it so that the chlorine can dissipate. I don't have a good PPM or PH meter. I cheaped out and paid the price for it so I am having to order new ones. I have a PH testing solution I use and as far as PPM I literally just cross my fingers. The water report for my county says that the PPM of the water is typically around 140, that's pretty much all the info I have to work with in that regard. I am feeding and for my last feed I did 10mL of Cal/Mag, 11.2mL of Flora, 12mL of Micro and 8.2mL of Bloom. When you say aerated what do you mean exactly? Obviously I've got an air pump and air stone to oxygenate the water, should I be doing more? I've got the air pump on full blast by the way. As for air flow, I've got all the vents on the tent closed except for the mesh vent on the left side of the tent. I have my carbon filter and inline fan pulling air out from the right side of the tent and its on the lowest setting, I also have a 6" "intake" fan sitting in front of the open vent to pull air in and its at half power(switching it to full power). I plan on adding 2-3 more small fans as the plant grows and needs the additional air flow. Both fans are running at all times. I'm growing out of the closet in my bedroom. I appreciate you taking interest in the grow and look forward to any insight you might bring, good to have you here!

 

[Brazyy]

I've read about it (and a lot of the same principles apply with my medium), but West and Tok have actually done dwc.

The ideal solution is using a chiller. They can be a bit pricey, but are a set and forget solution.
There are members who have used coolers as the bucket, with a hole cut in the lid for the net cup.
You can make your own chiller (DIY), using a small bar fridge, pex line, and a pump.

Tok was playing around with a chiller probe that seems to help.


To help keep temp down in my reservoir I reused some foam that came with various purchases for packaging. It's the thin white Styrofoam sheets, wrapped around the reservoir held in place by tape. Nothing fancy, but helps a bit and was free.

I'll probably just shell out the $150 bucks and get a chiller. Until then I'm going to use the frozen bottles, although insolating the buckets is a pretty good idea so I might try both. I don't like the idea of the reservoir changing temp so often with the ice eventually melting - raising the temp, and then adding in a new frozen bottle quickly decreasing the temp. Worried it might stress out the plant to much. Anyway, as always you guys are a huge asset and I really appreciate that you give a shit about my grow.

 

[Brazyy]

Be careful about putting the girl back in the bucket with the ice bottle. Don’t shock her , keep her hanging in an empty bucket . She doesn’t mind at all you could keep her there a couple hours without any problems . If you have a room temp bottle water flush her through the basket while in the empty bucket . You got this !

I assume you mean let her hang out in an empty bucket until the water reaches a consistent temp and is no longer dropping rapidly. Am I misunderstanding you? Thanks for the advise as always, you guys are the best!

 

[bluter]

- would you be able to recommend how to dilute down a 35% h202 for keeping a sterile res?

about 1 - 2 ml per gallon. i ran 27% though. i flushed way higher concentrations to get rid of stuff but never left it in the res.

we'd add a 500ml bottle of 3% to a five gallon res when i first started out. the 3% is available everywhere.

 

[bluter]

Yes I am using tap water in the reservoir and tbh I have no idea if it is hard or soft, I tried looking into it but I couldn't find a straight answer. I'm gonna lean towards hard though considering a water filter is a necessity around here if you wanna drink the tap water. I live in a pretty rural area. I do let it sit for 24 hours with an air stone in it before I use it so that the chlorine can dissipate. I don't have a good PPM or PH meter. I cheaped out and paid the price for it so I am having to order new ones. I have a PH testing solution I use and as far as PPM I literally just cross my fingers. The water report for my county says that the PPM of the water is typically around 140, that's pretty much all the info I have to work with in that regard. I am feeding and for my last feed I did 10mL of Cal/Mag, 11.2mL of Flora, 12mL of Micro and 8.2mL of Bloom. When you say aerated what do you mean exactly? Obviously I've got an air pump and air stone to oxygenate the water, should I be doing more? I've got the air pump on full blast by the way. As for air flow, I've got all the vents on the tent closed except for the mesh vent on the left side of the tent. I have my carbon filter and inline fan pulling air out from the right side of the tent and its on the lowest setting, I also have a 6" "intake" fan sitting in front of the open vent to pull air in and its at half power(switching it to full power). I plan on adding 2-3 more small fans as the plant grows and needs the additional air flow. Both fans are running at all times. I'm growing out of the closet in my bedroom. I appreciate you taking interest in the grow and look forward to any insight you might bring, good to have you here!

are you on well water or municipal ? 140ppm isn't too bad depending what is in it.
you would have an easier time on RO.

 

[Rexer]

The chiller is the best route, pair it up with Hydroguard or Orca and you'll be well set

 

[bluter]

The chiller is the best route, pair it up with Hydroguard or Orca and you'll be well set

that's the exact way i'd go if i was gonna make dwc my main grow style.

 

[Rexer]

that's the exact way i'd go if i was gonna make dwc my main grow style.

Yup, I did the h202 to keep a sterile res, but mine was at 27%. I think @KCCO 77 and a few others use h202 to keep a sterile res.

I've since switched to beneficials with a chiller, and prefer it. But it can work and the OP wants to run sterile, and has what's necessary...its just a matter of running the math on using a 35% h202 solution so it doesn't damage the roots.

 

[Brazyy]

10/06/2021
Day 3
The plant is looking great and new growth has started stretching upwards in order to get more light. Yesterday I did a res change. I left 4 gallons of tap water with an air stone and pump out over night , the next day I used it to house the plant while I did the res change. I put half a gallon of tap water in the res and about 3mL of H2O2 35%. Then I grabbed a scrub brush and made sure to go around the entire bucket multiple times, especially closer to the top and the very bottom of the bucket where buildup can occur. I rinsed everything thoroughly multiple times and then filled the bucket with 4 gallons of tap water, I also introduced an airstone and pump at this point. Then I began mixing my nutes. This week she was fed 15mL of Cal/Mag, 16.8mL of Gro, 12.6mL of Bloom and 18mL of Micro. Next week I'll start feeding flower nutes, she's began spitting out these tiny white hairs which lets me know that she is getting ready to flower.

she seems to have responded pretty well to the LST. I've just been continuing to fold the larger leaves over so that the new growth can be exposed. Like I said she has started to stretch up more so I'm pretty happy about that. I'm cheap so I really don't want to shell out a bunch of money for a chiller but also I don't want to put ice so close to my roots. So I decided I would make the my bedroom alot cooler. I also got another much larger oscillating fan blowing cool air towards the vent of the tent, I adjusted the exhaust fan to 35% power as well as switching the 8" fan in the tent to max power. All this along with keeping my house between 69-71 degrees has cooled the tent by about 4.5 degrees on average. Now the temp in the tent sits between 71.5-73 degrees, also I placed 2 frozen 16oz bottles in front of the 8" fan and was pretty surprised by how much cooler the air being blown was. I placed the bottles in the tent just before starting this journal so I'll update y'all on the result. Tent RH has been consistently between 49-59% (+/- 5%). Some of the larger leaves look like they have some weird white coloration to them, I haven't looked into it yet because the plant seems to be pretty happy as of right now.

Thanks for reading the journal, hope you where stoned while you were reading it. As always any advice or pointers are more than welcomed, have a great day.

 

[Rexer]

Hey brazyy

I had lost your journal link, my apologies for not getting back sooner.

Dilution Calculator - for percent solutions

Dilution Calculator: Calculate percent solutions for accurate dilution in chemistry and laboratory work.

www.calkoo.com

I believe what your looking for to keep it sterile is between 3% to 5%. I've copied and pasted an article that should help. It's a long read sorry.

If you want to boost the productivity of your crops, chemistry is your best friend. Learning more about plant and soil biochemistry can give you a decisive edge in the fight against pests and microbes as well.

This is doubly important in hydroponics, where you have complete control over all the inputs in your grow system. And one common household chemical that can make a world of difference in your hydroponic system is hydrogen peroxide.

You are probably wondering what a strong disinfectant/bleaching agent has got to do with growing and nurturing fragile plants in water-based grow areas. There are two major reasons, and a couple of minor ones as well.

One is rather plainly obvious, while the others do not come to mind as easily. Read on to find why some hydroponics experts swear by this simple compound.

What is Hydrogen Peroxide (H2O2)?​

Hydrogen peroxide is a chemical compound with the formula of H2O2. It is the simplest form of “peroxide,” which is a family of compounds in which there is a single bond between two oxygen atoms.

In common usage, we often refer to hydrogen peroxide simply as “peroxide.” It is widely used in industries for its paper bleaching ability. At home, it is found in detergents, hair bleaching products, and disinfectants.

Peroxide was first discovered in 1818 by Louis Thenard, a French chemist. But due to its highly unstable nature, effective industrial production of this substance would only be devised in the 20th century.

In nature, it is fairly common and produced in brief quantities in the human body as well. In concentrated forms, it can be very toxic to humans and animals. But it does have a unique effect on plants which will be dealt with in the next section.

Significance for Hydroponics​

The main significance of hydrogen peroxide in hydroponics arises due to multiple properties of the compound. These include:

Anti-Microbial Action​

Peroxide readily forms hydroxyl radical in acidic conditions. These compounds have a devastating effect on microbes and organic tissues.

And peroxide also releases single oxygen molecules as part of its natural decomposition. These oxygen molecules have a potent anti-microbial action as well.

Peroxide is known to be very effective against many bacteria, viruses, and common pests. It is even considered environmentally friendly by the FDA.

Instability​

Pure hydrogen peroxide is a pale blue liquid, slightly thicker than water. In simple terms, it is just water (H2O), with an extra molecule of oxygen attached to it in a weak single bond.

It tends to gradually decompose into water and oxygen molecules, if not accompanied by stabilizing agents.

And for young roots, the ready availability of oxygen molecules is very important to stimulate growth.

In many hydroponic systems, higher temperatures lead to a reduction in oxygen molecules in water. This process can be counteracted by using peroxide breakdown.

Biological Signaling​

Hydrogen peroxide is acknowledged as a signaling agent in many biological processes. Cell signaling is the constant act of communication between living cells in plants and animals.

Signaling agents are specific compounds that have an impact on these communication processes. They may stimulate the cells to behave in a particular way.

Hormones are the best example of common signaling agents. Peroxide is known to have some effects on plant defense mechanisms, creating catalase at the roots.

The chemical is also thought to increase nutrient uptake by the roots, and other positive cellular effects as well. But research is still ongoing into these aspects.

Anti-Chlorine Action​

In some wastewater treatment processes, concentrated peroxide was shown to be highly effective in removing chlorine from water.

Now, if you have tried your hands at hydroponics, you will already know the significance of pure water. Removing all the chlorine from municipal water can be a difficult process.

But trace levels of peroxide should have at least some positive effects on any small quantities of chlorine still present in the system.

How Peroxide Works In A Hydroponic System​

Generally, hydrogen peroxide is added in small quantities to the central reservoir in your hydroponic system. Once added, here is how it works, in simple words:

1. The molecules break down slowly into water and a single Oxygen atom, a free radical.
2. This free radical is a very volatile agent, which can react in multiple ways.
3. If it comes into contact with an organic cell, like a bacteria or virus, it damages and destroys it.
4. If it comes in contact with another oxygen atom, it forms an O2 molecule.
5. This molecule is healthy essential for the plant roots.
6. The whole peroxide molecule also reacts with any free chlorine in water to form O2 and hydrogen chloride.

Main Advantages of Hydrogen Peroxide for Plants​

In short, the main advantages of using peroxide in your hydroponics system are:

• Kills bacteria and viruses, keeps pests away
• Helps fight root rot and fungi
• Improves oxygen content in water
• Stimulates root growth and nutrient uptake
• Removes chlorine from water
• Boosts overall plant growth and health

Which Type of Hydrogen Peroxide Is Best​

This is a very important question since hydrogen peroxide is commonly available to us in several different forms.

The easiest and probably safest option to handle is diluted hydrogen peroxide solution. It is easily available in drugstores, grocery shops, and supermarkets.

This solution is commonly used for topical application and disinfecting surfaces and tools. It is available in 3%, 5% and 8% strength solutions.

But this may not necessarily be the best solution, for one main reason.

You see, we already mentioned that hydrogen peroxide is a very unstable solution, with a tendency to break down. When diluted to a 3% or 5% solution, manufacturers have to add compounds to keep the solution stable.

One common stabilizer is acetanilide, a synthetic compound used in the past as a painkiller and anti-pyretic medicine. Its use was discontinued when toxic side effects became apparent.

Now, the effects of these stabilizers on plants and their harvest are not well known. They may not have any significant impact.

In fact, in online forums and blog-posts related to hydroponics, you will often find growers reporting no severe side effects to their plants after the use of diluted peroxide solutions bought from drugstores.

But if you are a purist, or want to have complete control over the stuff that goes into your hydroponic grow system, you should stay away from these diluted and stabilized peroxide solutions.

For proper application of pure Hydrogen Peroxide, you should always use food-grade hydrogen peroxide.

What Is Food Grade Hydrogen Peroxide?​

As we already mentioned, diluted peroxide solutions contain additives like acetanilide and phenol. These are not suitable for oral consumption.

If you want to clean or disinfect kitchen surfaces or food containers, you need a purer form of hydrogen peroxide. Food grade peroxide contains 35% hydrogen peroxide, and the rest is water.

It contains no additives and is rated safe for human consumption, but ONLY WHEN DILUTED. For safe use, you have to reduce that 35% solution to 3 or 5% peroxide solutions.

What Are Some Risks Associated With Food Grade Peroxide​

You may have noticed that we mentioned diluted peroxide as “the easiest and safest form of peroxide to handle.” This is because pure and concentrated peroxide is a very dangerous compound, a little bit like acid.

If accidentally consumed, 35% peroxide can severely burn and damage your food pipe and digestive tract. In severe cases, it can even be fatal.

Accidental ingestion into your nose and airways can cause similar damages and injuries. This could result in constriction of airways and severe breathing troubles.

Inside the body, and in the bloodstream, peroxide can cause toxic effects and cell death. The release of vast amounts of oxygen can create an embolism, literally a bubble of oxygen gas inside your body.

Due to these potential dangers, you should take the following precautions while using food grade hydrogen peroxide:

• Always handle the stuff while wearing gloves. Avoid skin contact by reducing the amount of exposed skin.
• Keep the peroxide solution containers clearly labeled. Accidental ingestion commonly occurs when people mistake the solution for water.
• Keep it well out of the reach of kids and pets. This one needs no explanation.

How much hydrogen peroxide in hydroponics​

You should never add a concentrated hydrogen peroxide solution directly to your reservoir. Always reduce the concentration first by mixing one part of the 35% concentrate with eleven parts of water.

So if you take one ounce of food grade peroxide, mix it with eleven ounces of water to get a 3% solution. Always use fresh distilled water if possible for best results.

The recommended amount of 3% solution of peroxide per gallon of water in hydroponics is around 3ml per liter or 2-3 teaspoons per gallon of reservoir water. Please note that we are talking about the diluted solution, NOT the 35% concentrated peroxide.

Just to be safe, when you start the dosage, add a little less than the quantity mentioned above. Your local hydroponics store may have diluted solutions and proper charts and instructions for mixing the stuff.

Each dose should last for around four days. When mixing nutrient solutions, it is best to add the peroxide to one half, and the nutrient to the other and then mix them.

Conclusion​

There are some clear advantages to using hydrogen peroxide in hydroponics. But the purely concentrated solution comes with some risks in storage and handling.

You have to be extra cautious when adding this stuff to the reservoir water as well. Moderation is a valuable virtue here.

But the benefits are in many instances worth the extra effort. Judicious use of peroxide can result in visible improvement in plant growth and yields.

 

[Brazyy]

10/14/2021
Day 44
I haven't updated the journal in some time because I've been swamped with mid-terms. On Tuesday I did a rez change, I used 4 gallons of tap water, 9 teaspoons of 3% H2O2 diluted from 35% food grade H2O2 as well as 20mL Cal/Mag, 22.4mL of Gro, 16.8mL of Bloom and 24mL of Micro. Tent RH has been around 45-60%. My temps have been between 69.8-73.5, this is conjunction with the addition of the H2O2 has eliminated all of the white suds forming on the net cup but the roots are still a bit brownish. She has been exploding with growth and the budsites are starting to develop, but so are some issues. Unfortunately I'm having trouble diagnosing said problems so please help me out here. I'm pretty worried about the browning of the white hairs at the pre-flower sites, I'm also worried about the discoloration and spotting occurring on the leaves, both older and new. As always I appreciate any and all help, have a great day y'all.

 

[Brazyy]

10/30/2021
Day 60
I've made several adjustments to the environment and the plant has responded really well. I was starting to notice some light burn on the upper leaves of the plant. I needed to move my carbon filter and exhaust system so I could raise the lights, but since I have a few days ago I've noticed a big difference in appearance. I have been battling root rot since late veg and really felt the effects in the form of stunted growth. Since using hydroguard root growth has exploded and the plant looks amazing.

 

[Rexer]

I'm so glad to see that you're back on track, and apologize for not seeing your previous post. I'm no pro, but don't be shy to tag me anytime.

Hydroguard and beneficials is personally much better (then sterile). And another thing, I've been told for best results, add the Hydroguard back in every 3-4 days.

Orca is an amazing product as well for roots. Expensive, but worth it in my opinion. The maker of it puts out some good stuff.