1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

[Strickly420]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Gllad you figured out what happenned, but damn how unfortunate *head shake*

Positive vibes
Strickly420

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

The roots are in serious peril - there's only a half left and they are all covered in black residue of Hygrozyme meeting Physan 20. We will see how it goes. I will start working on nuts and steel wire for LST

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

My other smaller setup (see sig) has tipped the scale only at 9 oz dry (250g under 600W bulb per 12 weeks) - that's way lower than 0.5g/w
It's all due to overcrowding and me not being smart enough. I will post some pics of the spartans remaining in the game still (after a week of struggle with oil slicks)

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Me and the girls are back in business, but it is now it's all under question.
I don't think these plants will survive with the root system in such bad shape. But who knows- it' WEED.
How do I apply for oil slick compensation money from BP?

I thought why the hell it felt like I get electrocuted every time I put my hand in the catch pan?!! It turns out that the small 9W sterilizer had water inside the bulb and still worked LOL. Never buy this crap:

 

[Aardvark]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Wow! What a sad story. I have a similar setup with a remote aquarium pump/filter. I had considered buying a UV clarifier used in ponds & aquariums, but have held off to this point. I didn't see any oxygen-enrichment gear in your setup, though - I strongly recommend you putting bubblers in your reservoirs because the root structure thrives on it and makes it resistant to disease and pH/nutrient fluctuations.

What kind of spray heads are you using? if you run a clean or filtered system, you could use a $100 pump that will power fog nozzles, which produce very hairy roots; otherwise mini-sprinklers will do just fine.

Good luck!

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

I am using blue jets 0.04 orifice and 1/2hp utility pump
Works like a charm - I call it belaggio effect

I suppose that the main aero system advantage is that while spraying, droplets get oxygenated and co2ed
Plus the roots are exposed to air at most times - this alone should be enough

This droplet oxygenation is the major difference between NFT and aero, as I can tell. Even though the aero is really important in the beginning of root development, later it unavoidable becomes NFT de-facto. The only difference is this additional gas in the droplets that becomes readily available to roots

I mean I never ran NFT, but aero gains over an inch a day, which is crazy. I hope NFT does the same or better job at this

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Th water now in a much better condition, but there is still some shock adjustment from the plants. Some are developing brand new roots, some using their own covered with oil slick. I am not sure if I am going to keep this batch, or what should I do about it. If there is no explosive growth in a week or so - I will chop it all up for clones and start from a scratch

As you can see here - I am using some nuts-and-bolt LST trying to to get more growth:

 

[Sky Rocket]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Your plants look anorexic and sickly looking. My suggestion is to start fresh with some healthy clones go from there. But if you can bring them back to like more power to you. Good luck.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Thanks sky rocket. It sucks how much time I wasted. Fucken pump failure BP where is my oil slick money?

The cloning problem is something I really struggle with (getting enough of them)
Right now I have four thoughts on how to change my strategy a bit:
1) Dedicate a smaller room to grow trained moms in Aero instead of growing for harvest
2) Reduce a number of plants per rig and grow every other row every other plant (makes it 1 plant per sq ft) - 60 good clones is something I can come up with my mothers right now. That way I would somehow train them for multi-cola plants and flower right after that. This would also allow me dedicate one sprayer per plant (right now two plants share one sprayer)
3) Don't change anything, but go perpetual - so the clones from one room taken right before flowering (together with clones from moms (if I even keep moms in the future) would be enough to populate the bigger rig, and then clones taken from the vegged plants in the bigger rig would be the next generation for the smaller rig. I kind of doubt I could time this very well - I think you need at least three different time zones if you want to go perpetual.
4) re-do the nursery closet and make it 2x bigger so it would accommodate two times the amount of moms (currently 6) and three times the amount of clones (currently 72). So I could harvest armies of clones every time.

P.S. I hate messing with moms and would rather figure something out for perpetual cloning (no moms needed). But that would require me to make at least one more timezone (could be difficult) or take clones from a flowering plant (does this even work good?


What do you guys think?

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

I checked the plants, and the only ones that were showing chances of survival, were the ones that started developing new roots.
So I got that the old roots no longer work, and removed all the old roots.
It is amazing how much abuse some plants could handle and still survive by spawning new roots.
I figured the rest need to realize they need some new roots too, so I removed all the old roots from plants.

I am going to take a new batch of clones today. There won't be many, so I need to start getting creative.

P.S. I smelling my hand after removing the roots and for some reason it smells like mycelium of cubensis species LOL how come?

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Bright green new growth shows deficiencies just like clones without any nutes:

 

[kimmy]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Thanks sky rocket. It sucks how much time I wasted. Fucken pump failure BP where is my oil slick money?

The cloning problem is something I really struggle with (getting enough of them)
Right now I have four thoughts on how to change my strategy a bit:
1) Dedicate a smaller room to grow trained moms in Aero instead of growing for harvest
2) Reduce a number of plants per rig and grow every other row every other plant (makes it 1 plant per sq ft) - 60 good clones is something I can come up with my mothers right now. That way I would somehow train them for multi-cola plants and flower right after that. This would also allow me dedicate one sprayer per plant (right now two plants share one sprayer)
3) Don't change anything, but go perpetual - so the clones from one room taken right before flowering (together with clones from moms (if I even keep moms in the future) would be enough to populate the bigger rig, and then clones taken from the vegged plants in the bigger rig would be the next generation for the smaller rig. I kind of doubt I could time this very well - I think you need at least three different time zones if you want to go perpetual.
4) re-do the nursery closet and make it 2x bigger so it would accommodate two times the amount of moms (currently 6) and three times the amount of clones (currently 72). So I could harvest armies of clones every time.

P.S. I hate messing with moms and would rather figure something out for perpetual cloning (no moms needed). But that would require me to make at least one more timezone (could be difficult) or take clones from a flowering plant (does this even work good?


What do you guys/girls think?

Option# 3 is your best bet. Get on a schedule to add a definite number every week and in 8 weeks it will be full. That is what I do, but I don't do aero yet. I have plans to and like you I will be building my own version of a stink-bud system. I plan on having several smaller pumps and reservoirs though. I think 4 will do the trick so I can use different nutrient combos for every 2 weeks.

 

[Sky Rocket]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Option 3 sounds nice but you would have to do the math to make sure every thing goes right. I did a perpetual but it was pretty simple. Clone for 3 weeks, veg for 3 weeks. And I had 3 flower units had 3 different stages. But you have to have a strain that harvests in 9 weeks or less.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

It appears that the clone factory still produced - I cut 6 trays of clones from the youngings
Right now both rigs sit empty and will continue to do so for another 2-3 weeks. In a meanwhile I have to raise the light rail and the fixture itself - right now it produces a throw that is too narrow. I want my light higher

Okay, I got my lessons learned, plans developed, and efforts doubled:

Ladies and gentlemen, 288 clones (8 full trays of 36 each):

Here are the plans that would hopefully allow me to keep my rigs full and in production at all times
Red arrows show clone movement, Green arrows - harvest

Optimistic plan allows 2 weeks for clone root development and only 6 weeks of 12/12, but would result in harvests every 4 weeks

Pessimistic plan gives 3 weeks for roots to develop and 8 weeks of 12/12, which would result in harvests every 5 weeks:

I hope that strict adhesion to SOG principles should let me use the Optimistic scenario where actions repeat every 8 weeks versus the Pessimistic, which would be 10 week long


If these plans came into effect - it would be 6 cycles each year 2# each
That would require me to dedicate time for cutting 288 / 144 clones and trimming 171 or 80 plants every fourth weekend. Keep in mind, that I have to brew beer every other weekend already. And two keg batches take about the whole day. Plus collecting water and changing it in main reses on a weekly basis (30 and 40 gal) needs to be a habit to establish...

 

[sfttailpaul]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Thanks sky rocket. It sucks how much time I wasted. Fucken pump failure BP where is my oil slick money?

The cloning problem is something I really struggle with (getting enough of them)
Right now I have four thoughts on how to change my strategy a bit:
1) Dedicate a smaller room to grow trained moms in Aero instead of growing for harvest
2) Reduce a number of plants per rig and grow every other row every other plant (makes it 1 plant per sq ft) - 60 good clones is something I can come up with my mothers right now. That way I would somehow train them for multi-cola plants and flower right after that. This would also allow me dedicate one sprayer per plant (right now two plants share one sprayer)
3) Don't change anything, but go perpetual - so the clones from one room taken right before flowering (together with clones from moms (if I even keep moms in the future) would be enough to populate the bigger rig, and then clones taken from the vegged plants in the bigger rig would be the next generation for the smaller rig. I kind of doubt I could time this very well - I think you need at least three different time zones if you want to go perpetual.
4) re-do the nursery closet and make it 2x bigger so it would accommodate two times the amount of moms (currently 6) and three times the amount of clones (currently 72). So I could harvest armies of clones every time.

P.S. I hate messing with moms and would rather figure something out for perpetual cloning (no moms needed). But that would require me to make at least one more timezone (could be difficult) or take clones from a flowering plant (does this even work good?


What do you guys think?

Wow! I have been following your dilemma for quite some time and have empathy for your situation. I was totally at a loss about the cause(s) but kept rooting for you (no pun really).
My set-up has several C.A.P. systems of their "Ebb & Gro". I have a total of 48 sites under 8 @ 600 W HPS on light mover tracks. My reservoirs (x2) are 55 gal drums with aeration machines in each. I change nutes every 2 weeks and sometimes go longer. My "to be flowered plants" come from my "nursery" where I veg. my cuttings, once rooted, for 4-8 weeks and they are flipped mostly due to their growth height. I train while in veg. I take cuts from them 2 weeks before flipping them, and these cuts become the next veg'ing ladies. This is a perpetual system that feeds 6 new plants into flower every month or even less. I typically take around 16 to 18 cuts but only use the 6 healthiest. The balance either veg longer or get tossed; rarely do I give them away. I try to take advantage of the faster to root lower branches, lower in Nitrogen, but will occasionally cut a top and root that; harder to root but oh so nice when they do take. Several times, I have taken a long branch for a cut and gotten two from it. The bottom has already been topped and they grow out fast and very interesting.
My point in all this is that I have no heat or cold things to influence the nutes temps, and have never had slime or mold. I do get spider mites and believe this to be residual eggs that hatch when the conditions are right. My atomizer keeps them at bay. It seems like everyone who has more than a few plants, is plagued by something. To me it doesn't matter what or which plague we get, they are all a major pain, are time consuming, hurt our crop and yield, and plain and simple cause so much trouble that it is a major discouragement. Oh, one last thing... when I take my cuts, I root them in "Rapid rooters" and then once the roots appear, they go into the 2 gal. buckets they'll stay in until harvest. No transplanting, no shock, the rooter plugs dissolve into the medium and I get plants that are a nice 4ft tall if I let them. Depending on the strain, the harvests can be a nice and steady 1 pound ++ per month to 1-1/2 lbs.
I just get pissed at all the problems we all get. AND you aren't stupid (your words); look at what you've accomplished! Man, you are simply human and cannot be expected to know and understand everything, I mean it. Who would have ever thought that the sterilizer would have water in it? That's like the last thing I would have thought. And those freaking pumps! They are expensive but are still built so cheaply. They don't want them to last very long, just a day past their warranty. Planned obsolescence... Goes to show ya', you DON'T get what you pay for... Too bad things don't look so good, but let's all think positive and tell these ladies that they are weeds, are strong, and are descendants of a survivor race of vegetation that has existed on this planet longer than man and has even survived man himself~ Best to you and this time, luck will have something to do with it.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

sfttailpaul did you say you veg for 4 to 8 weeks?


4 weeks of veg in aero rig would be disastrous. 8 weeks - I cannot even imagine. For some reason plants don't stop growing up when you go 12/12 in aero. I guess I should stop feeding them grow compound or something one time

 

[kimmy]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

sfttailpaul did you say you veg for 4 to 8 weeks?


4 weeks of veg in aero rig would be disastrous. 8 weeks - I cannot even imagine. For some reason plants don't stop growing up when you go 12/12 in aero. I guess I should stop feeding them grow compound or something one time

In my case they seem to grow between 3-4 times the height that they were when you put them into flower. After they start setting buds shouldn't they stop stretching, even in aero ? Maybe I am misunderstanding you.

 

[sfttailpaul]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

sfttailpaul did you say you veg for 4 to 8 weeks?


4 weeks of veg in aero rig would be disastrous. 8 weeks - I cannot even imagine. For some reason plants don't stop growing up when you go 12/12 in aero. I guess I should stop feeding them grow compound or something one time

Android,
I said I veg for 4-8 weeks but NOT in Aero. Sorry if I wrote this in a confusing way. They are in a modified C.A.P.'s "Ebb & Gro" system. I too, cannot fathom an 8 week Aero veg... If I could afford it, my entire system would be a series of G.H.'s "Water Farm" units. I own a Water Farm 8-pack that I modified to be a 10-pack system. This is by far, hands down, the best cultivation system I have ever experienced. Produced the most explosive growth and supports a powerful, strong and overwhelming double root systems that is unmatched by anything out there! Of course, this is strictly, IMHO. I no longer use it (was for mothers) because I cannot transplant from a square container into a round one, the roots growing through the holes in the top bucket cannot be released without major surgery which is guaranteed to kill the plant. I start and complete a plant in the same top bucket eliminating any shock from transplanting.

I determine when to flip them based mostly on height. I also train them heavily as they veg, trying to achieve the most bud sites that I can. My subsequent cuttings come from these at +/- 6 weeks allowing a 2 week recovery before the flip and also to ensure that I have viable roots on the newest cuts before flipping.
I grow to produce quality first while striving for as much quantity as I can, but quality is the primary goal.
Appreciate everyone on here, all their experiences, strengths, hopes and encouragements...

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

In my case they seem to grow between 3-4 times the height that they were when you put them into flower. After they start setting buds shouldn't they stop stretching, even in aero ? Maybe I am misunderstanding you.

Misunderstanding again. Maybe I am too high... Are you saying they grow x3 x4 times of their size since the flip? Or is the veg size 3/4 of the complete size? I am not getting it.

I thought they should stop stretching, but they did not. Check my second journal pics (the Jungle) the pictures are dated) I had buds "bending necks" next to the ceiling, because first they've outgrown the lamp, and then the room itself. It all happened after the switch

aero setup allows growth of more than one inch of height per day - I measured

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Here are my baby-flowers (as I tell my daughter):

I usually check after a couple of days to see if I need to gather any replacements. You can tell right away that some of these won't make it:

Please someone comment on my handwritten blueprint plans for perpetual grow - I have not received a single comment in the other thread yet. Will one of them work? If not - why?