1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Time for update:
The prolonged cloning in trays idea brought unsatisfactory results - big losses due to rotting clones that already had roots. Two weeks seems to be the magic number for clone propagation. What doesn't meet the criteria at that point should be tossed.
I was amazed by the amount of clone losses during transplantation this time around.
Right now I only have 74 left out of 288, many of which won't make it another week. I estimate only about 50 plants getting to grow up to mature and flower. I will probably have to modify my rig slightly to utilize space for those plants that are going to make it in the most efficient way. Because I managed to raise my light significantly, I should veg the remaining plants longer and train them for the net and do SCROG instead. To get 600 g off 30 plants would mean the average plant must yield 20 gram dry. I need to find a picture of such a plant in order to better understand what I am in for. I still have no idea why sometimes clones are so viable, and sometimes they are not. This is an unfortunate setback, but I am pretty flexible with my setup now, so we'll see what I can do. I will have some bud, that's for sure!


I needed to raise the rail in order to raise the light fixture to allow for better throw and grow space.
But the tent would not handle 11' of a 2x4 on top of it together with the light and the rail for sure, so I had to get creative.
I bought x2 of 8' long steel beams meant to attach commercial sheetrock for $3.20 a piece- they are incredibly light and provide rigidity when screwed together. I put the beam on top of the metal tent structure and bolted the light rail directly to it, leaving tent trusses sandwiched in-between. I also managed to significantly reduce the length of light fixture suspension to the rail drive:

There are only 74 of us left, but we are from SPAAARTAAA!!!!

Flight controls

ph- check
ppm - check

Catch-pan sporting the new level switch (and showing the amount of water draining while spraying):

Four rails (so far) sitting idle

Botanical corner

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

del

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Does switching to MH bulbs really makes a big difference vs. vegging under a Sodium?
I call bullshit

Oh, yeah, I miscalculated the number of clones. There are 104 survivors not 74. But I could count at least ten I could toss this second.
But I believe in slow starters, plus they it doesn't hurt anyone - they want a chance - I give them a chance

It still looks like the final number of plants will be around 60-70. I wonder what to do - go perpetual with three zones by buying equipment all over again and having three sets of everything to take care of, but ditch momming completely? or should I rather modify my smaller rig to grow lots of mothers (15-20) and being able to take only the best clones in abundance utilizing the original 171 plant SOG straight to 12/12 idea to the fullest?

I wonder what modifications the small rig would require to turn 8 rail 74 site SOG rig to make it house only a quarter of that amount of plants. I would probably keep the manifold, but only put every other rail (5) in, and would replace two-sided sprayers with one-side sprayers - this way I won't have to plug empty holes to protect from spray and it is also cheap and easy. This mod would make it a 5x4=20 mom rig. I will train the hell out of them and use the closet I am using to keep moms now strictly for holding trays of clones while rooting.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Changed the res water for the first time yesterday. Discarded nonsense-clones. LST using nuts and bolts. modified manifold - pics coming

 

[Aardvark]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Android, its a real bummer that you are experiencing problems with this batch of clones. I am now in the midst of finishing my first grow and have learned a little about my own cloning experience, which I have gone through several iterations over the past six months. I hope I can add some value to your predicament, since these different scenarios are still fresh in my mind. I wrote up my thoughts, but I felt it was too much to put in your journal, so I'll keep it quick by trying to learn a few details first before declaring myself an expert:

Is the pictured timer for the hydro, and if so, what is the "on" time set for? Too much "water-on" time is a sure way to kill clones within 24 hours or less. But you know that, I assume. Are temperatures decent?

IMHO, MH lamps are superior for vegetative growth. I used to run an electric contractor shop, as well as a big DC-based energy management company and have seen the difference in multiple growing environments and it consistently out-produced HPS - and at a more efficient rate, I might add. This was the same in both crops as well as ornamentals. The GLR was also beneficial, although I don't have as much empirical data on that method. The kicker was that crops were even more fruitful when keeping a small contingent of MH light to augment & complement the HPS after the switch to 12/12. I have also seen reflectors and side-light fixtures (using dual 4' fluorescent tubes), which also provide excellent results - but of course at an added price, which was uneconomical when taken to extreme.

I love your setup; you even use the same RO reservoir that I do, except I own the ugly gray one - these Brute containers are specifically designated as "food grade", as are the grow boxes that I have recently converted to. This is smart thinking; otherwise, the plants' resistance to disease & pests is lowered by plastic off-gassing chemicals. I had also considered using the same square post hardware that you use because of its flexibility in adapting to different types of growing methods, but I was not ready for such an ambitious setup.

I also have a common filter/pump feeding multiple grow containers, with a common drain back for recirculation. This system makes optimum use of the nutrients (which don't need to be changed as often) and the more capacity and quantity there is in the system, the less risk you run of affecting the plants when something goes out of balance in the system ... leading to the weakest link in the system.

That's all the unsolicited wisdom I will inflict on you and hope to hear better news from you soon. I have plenty more fresh rookie advice if you require additional distraction.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

The timer was set to spray for 1 min 20 sec every other 13 minutes or so in the beginning. Now it is sprays every 6 min or something

LST using nuts and bolts:

This is the best tape in the world (the most expensive too! It sticks and it bends:

This is the res water temperature, keep in mind that sterilizer bulb runs 24/7:

These are my moms as they currently sit:

This is the current mamas' closet. I am contemplating on expanding it 2-3 times or leaving it alone and growing mamas in small aero rig

That's the group shot of moms and moms-to-be:

Here is the room for expansion:

You can see my whole ventilation system in this picture. Also note the metal beam above the tent, holding it all together in the air:

Manifold modified for 1 plant per square foot configuration:

The general view of the rig:

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

One day later - 16 days old clones

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Day 17. Plants are finally taking off:

This is the flood alarm I decided to buy after repeatedly spilling 15+ gal during the probational period maybe 6 or 8 times already. I have had enough!:

This is the anti-recoil device I had to manufacture and install to prevent jerking of the whole manifold when the pump goes on. Because if left unchecked- this moves rails and sprayers away from their precisely calculated intended position in regards to two nearby plants and screws up the spraying pattern:

That's it for now. Other than that, I have nothing interesting to report yet.

P.S. Just remembered one more mod I've done: I zip-tied a fish-tank rectangular filter media to the exhaust of UV-Sterilizer which operates 24/7 inside the main res. This helped a lot with filtering out the bark crumbles from the plugs and other suspended junk like different microscopic plants that live on the sides of the res despite the UV sterilizer filtering all the water constantly
I had to do this because the water supplied to the sprayers by the sump pump does not get filtered in-line, due to major problem with flow constriction.



clone survivorship ratio is terrible - you see there are only 56 plants here (instead of 171 this rig was designed for). That corresponds to only 56/288= only 19.4% of the original clones have developed into mature ready-to bloom plants - that's only every fifth. This is unexpectedly low, and I am trying to understand why.

P.S.S: Whose idea was it to use nuts and bolts for LST? It is a great technique - very simple too!

P.S.S.S: In order to beat 600g dry now I need 3/8 off one plant on average. Is it achievable? So I am assuming SCROG would be a good way to do this, right?

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Today is exactly 3 weeks since I populated the big rig to 1/4th of its intended capacity due to inability to produce enough viable clones to go SOG... The upside is that I got to train plants- something I have never done before to any plants besides mothers... Big ups go to the person who invented nut-and-bolt LST technique. I read his journal, but forgot his nickname:

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Anyone still following this? I am just getting started

I want some advise if I should leave one cola per root, or if I should get some trellis netting and go SCROG instead?

 

[00bud87]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

doing good now mate i be watching

00bud87

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Plants are really taking off as we speak - every top branch makes new 1-3 nodes DAILY!!!

Wanted to share one useful tip I discovered recently:
make sure to position wires of ph and ppm sensors so they do not intersect or sit anywhere near power wires and AC/DC converters - they are not properly shielded and give erroneous readings when positioned near strong magnetic fields.

New toy:
I bought an awesome USB digital microscope which is very easy to use for merely $30 on ebay - it captures at 1600x1200 resolution !!
Now I have a reliable tool to tell for sure when is the right time to harvest!!!

pics later

 

[Sky Rocket]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Personally I think round 1 just keep it simple. From the pics scrog seems like it may be a pain with your setup.

 

[JuicySoil]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

I think it coul be a good idea with the trelling net even if you dont scrog, it will help the plants from falling over.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Did a lot of maintenance work today prepping the setup for 12/12, cleaning clogged sprayers, removing casting-shadows-on-nodes leaves, changing water, etc... Enjoy the pics. Let me know if you have any questions.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

For those who are still wondering why aeroponics, I have a couple of pictures explaining the difference:

Here:

Dirt vs Aeroponics:

Dirt:

Aero:

....


OK, for those still not getting the point:

Dirt:

Aeroponics:

----

Any questions?

 

[Sky Rocket]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Questions yes. Did you start the dirt and aero plants at the same time and are they under the same light with the same nutes?

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Yes, they are from the same litter.

Sky Rocket, you have 666 posts lol! (couldn't help it)

 

[Sky Rocket]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

Yes, they are from the same litter.

Sky Rocket, you have 666 posts lol! (couldn't help it)

Lol. I noticed that after my post.

 

[Android]

re: 1G/W - Aero 171 Plant SOG Under 600W w/Mover - Kandy Kush

I was changing the water today and snapped some pics:


This is the part of the return line - you can see the vacuum breaker and the 150 mesh Rainbird(?) filter

This is what recirculates, filtrates and sterilizes the solution in the main res - the pump pushes water through the hose, to the UV sterilizer (not pictured) and back through a fish tank filter medium secured to the exit hose with a zip-tie:

I love this trash can on wheels - when I need to change my water- I just pump out all the water out with a garden hose first, and then I just roll it to the next room (which is basement shower) and dump the remaining water down the drain - so convenient:

This thing right here is an absolute must-have!!!:

No further comment...
Thank you for stopping by

This is what happens when you LST your plants horizontally:

Next up: trellis netting & frame
Stay tuned