I Want Seeds: But Not Too Many Seeds

[Classtime]

Last year, I was lucky to get both a male and a female from my two good Santa Marta Gold. But being new, I didn't recognize the male's advanced stage until I had a billion seeds growing on the female. I'm trying to control the breeding this year.

I was lucky to get three Heirloom Panama Red seeds to take off. I successfully identified by pre-flower one female and two males. The Female is just starting to flower and when I saw the pods (still closed) on the males two weeks ago, I moved them to the other side of the house and downwind. (growing outdoors). My questions: How developed do the male flowers need to be? How many do I need? How developed to the female flowers need to be before I dust some? How long after the dusting/polinating before I can see the seeds forming and know that I've been successful?
I'll get some pictures up in a bit. Thanks.

 

[Classtime]

The female.

Is this enough pollen and I can ditch the males?

 

[SmokingWings]

I have not collected pollen to do any sort of breeding experiments but I have had some experience with pollen from other types of plants.

My questions: How developed do the male flowers need to be? How many do I need?

The male flowers will have to be more mature or developed than what I am seeing in the 2nd photo. It is not a question of how many flowers you need. Instead you should be going for "how much pollen do you need to collect".

There is no point in cutting off and saving the immature flowers or leaves from the plant. Collect the pollen from male flowers that have completely opened. There should be a yellow color to the banana shaped parts of the opened up flower. While the male flowers are still on the plant you can hold a piece of white paper underneath the flower and tap it so the pollen falls onto the paper. The pollen itself will be yellow.

Keep going until you collect way more than you think you need. Some people will mix the pollen with something like kitchen or baking flour to help make it easier to handle. Do not let it get wet. It can be put into plastic film cans or anything similar or any container that can be closed. Store it in the freezer.

How developed to the female flowers need to be before I dust some? How long after the dusting/polinating before I can see the seeds forming and know that I've been successful?

I figure when the female flowers are about the size of a small coin, like a dime or Euro penny, with all the stigma/pistils fully formed and standing out. I figure you should not wait until these stigma/pistils are starting to get wrinkled, are bending over or have started to change color like they do when getting old.

Use a small artist or model painting brush or a q-tip and pick up some of the pollen. Then tap the brush or q-tip over the bud so some of the pollen gently falls onto the pistils/stigma.

There are many threads here with people talking about how they collect pollen and fertilize their female plants or just a few flowers on a plant. The link is to a msg in a thread from just over three weeks ago. The 2nd photo in the msg shows just the yellow pollen without any flower parts.

No idea how long it will take for the seeds to get large enough to show on the female flowers. Maybe contact the member who posted the msg in the link.

https://www.420magazine.com/community/threads/outdoors-iklwa-and-cherries-dubelee-in-ma.531268/post-5825098

 

[bluter]

if all of them are outside there's a good chance the pollen will still make it to the females. a single male will effect an area for a good couple sq miles. some members near hemp farms can't successfully grow outdoor at all.

it all depends on the wind.

 

[Chris Scorpio]

If u keep them close, as mentioned above, once the male spits his pollen, it too late

Move the male in yer garage, house
When it starts popping pollen, tap some on a plate, mirror, tray to collect it

Once you have like a gram or two. Put the male in a garbage bag.

Then use a tiny hobby paint brush and paint a few branches on the female plant

Pollen, with rice, can be frozen and used for well over a year

 

[Classtime]

Thanks for all the advice. I moved the male inside to the far side of the house and let the flowers develop while occasionally tapping the branches onto some copy paper and then into a vial. 6 days ago, I used a small paintbrush and dusted the flowers of three branches of the Panama Red female. When I compared those pollinated branches to the others, I detect some trichomes have turned dark which from what I read, indicates they have been pollinated. Here are some pics. There are some bulbous seed shaped things which were on the plant more than two weeks ago. I don't think they are seeds judging from their positions. What do you think. The first picture is of the pollinated flower, the second is an unpollinated flower, and the third a picture of the seed-shaped things. I wonder when it turns red

 

[Chris Scorpio]

Looks like it

In a few days, well about a week, you'll see the start of seeds forming

Good luck

 

[grayeyes]

Santa Marta AND Panama Red. Sounds like we visited the same seed broker.

Do you have pics of the Santa Marta growing?

As I understand it, some Panama are going to be green. This is a higher head high than the red. Some will be red. It depends on the pheno. In my work on a similar strain I found I could separate the red and green.

When I am finished with my current grow I will pop some Panama Red. Maybe we can trade notes.

 

[Classtime]

Here is the Santa Marta. The tall wide one is growing like the one I had last year from which these seeds came. She is 8 feet tall now. The skinny one is about 5 feet with much larger dense buds and from the same mother. It was multi-trunk and one of the trunks was male. I nipped it in time and got this neat one. Very different growth habits.

 

[grayeyes]

So, were these from seed or "and from the same mother. It was multi-trunk and one of the trunks was male. I nipped it in time and got this neat one."

I don't understand. Usually "from the same mother" refers to cloned plants. The next sentence I also had trouble with.
What did you mean by "multi-trunk"?

Thanks for the pictures.

 

[Classtime]

Sorry for confusion. I had two seedlings last year. A male and a female. The seeds from them produced the two plants this year. One of them branched into two main shoots early on (two trunks). One of those trunks produced male flowers and I cut it off. My wife thought it was two seeds but I only put one paper towel sprouted seed in each pot to start them. There is a third SMG that is from a seed that dropped from last years plant. It is a very scrawny female.

 

[Sativa1970]

Don't forget bugs carry pollen pretty far upwind. Place the male branch tip into a glass jar and tap the branch. Don't cut off the branch. You can see when any pollen that falls off through the glass. Place the lid back on. Paint brush or q tip onto flower hairs. Avoid air blowing the pollen everywhere. Every hair is a potential seed.

 

[Classtime]

I think I was lucky. I had the male indoors, three rooms away from the yard with the females and the last door kept shut except for passing through. Fingers crossed.

 

[Smokey0418]

You can collect open flowers and closed flower that are on the brink of opening to collect pollen.
The unopened ones can be run over a trim bin for example to collect the yellow pollen.
It only takes a micron to make a seed. I would use a qtip and very carefully apply to the white hairs at day 21 on a 60-70 day strain as it take about 40 days to make viable seeds.
I shut fans off , apply pollen to said flower.
30 minutes later I mist down area with water to kill any left overs.

Then 3-4 days later if your hair turns red , you probably did it.

 

[Classtime]

It’s only been 14 days since I pollinated and I had to harvest because bud rot appeared on a couple buds. I left the three pollinated branches and hope they will have a chance to give me good seeds. ( The skinny SMG pictured above was a total loss to bud rot. I’m learning the hard way.)