New Room Coming - Considering Going LED - Recommendations For 4'x8'?

F

Freezy

Well-Known Member
Hey guys,

I read and read and read and I figured I would just ask before I dive into some expensive LED's. I'm no master grower or anything, but I've got about 3 years under my belt and starting to figure out what the hell I'm doing. I just moved so a new room will be underway soon. I'm thinking its going to be a 8' x 10' sealed flowering room running co2. I veg in a tent under t5's. I'm only going to be flowering 6 plants at a time with a footprint of a 4' x 8' scrog. Considering this footprint, and considering I will be replacing (2) 1000w HPS lights, I want to hear recommendations for LED's that will cover this footprint and either match or surpass the (2) 1000w capabilities. I would rather have too much light vs not enough. I feel like this is a leap of faith because I'm still skeptic about using LED's. I apologize because I'm sure this info is here in these forms I just want to ask again because everyone says different things about different lights.

My reasoning behind wanting to stay away from the HPS is really just the overall efficiency and cost to run my room. I am purchasing a new sealed standalone 14000 BTU AC unit instead of spending an additional 2 grand for a mini split. I'm trying to keep the electric bill DOWN. If I can get a good LED setup it will cost less to run. Even if it cost the same as it would to run 2 1000W lights the heat would be less of an issue and that would save me on the cost to run my AC. Please advise!

Peace,
Freezy
 
I'd recommend the high efficiency DIY Cree cob kits for cutting the power bill.

PRODUCTS - DIY GROW LIGHT KITS - Timber Grow Lights

Pre-wired, build a frame out of angled aluminum and good to go. 500-600w of cobs per 1000w replacement. 5 or 6 of the "4 cob kits" would build and spread well over that area. PPF of 1300 -1562(500-600w) on the canopy.

Otherwise look for 1300-1400ppf to safely replace each 1000w SE with LED. 1000w hortilux is 1798 brand new unreflected.
 
I'd recommend only replacing half your room with LED. With 3yrs of HPS, I'd think 1/2 more run of it wont bother you. 32sqf coverage of LED is a big investment. Trust me, you'll have doubts no matter which LED you buy. If you don't, you'll spend your time on here promoting your light to others trying to convince yourself you bought the best one. Buying one and running 50/50 Led/hps reduces risk significantly and let's you introduce yourself to LED. You can replace a 1000W HPS with 600-800W of LED. The coverage footprint will be your struggle.

The white COBs seem to be the latest craze. I haven't seen a journal grown with them yet. I see lots of plant pictures, hear lots of hype, but havent found a journal to watch the evolution of the grow itself. I bet there are a few on here, I just haven't run across one yet. The 50W DIY series from timber is the way I'm leaning for any future changes. I think the higher efficiency will pay for itself in the long run and the 50w COBs (of course more of them) will make it easier to spread your wattage out across your area.

LEDRF is a LED sponsor (perfect sun) here and they claim they can cover a 4x8 with 1 LED light and a light mover. He has all the data on the site. I'd like to give one of these a try someday.

MARS has the best introductory price point out there IMO. There are higher par/efficiency lights out there at a much higher price. They do grow good plants.

I have an Advanced LED xml600. It is perfect for a 4x4 footprint and definitely grows great plants. I've got 2 journals on here somewhere with them. They are spendy though. Would I buy another? Probably not. Probably not because I already own one. I have a handful of RC cars and no two the same (same concept).


I'm sure that was zero help.. Lol. I do recommend you only change lights in half your area though. Replace with 600-800W and give it a whirl. Good luck!
 
Hello Freezy,

My name is Dan and I am with Timber Grow Lights. We make DIY kits that can be suspended from basic angle aluminum frames and feature the Cree CXB3590 COB technology.

This type of LED technology is perfect for covering 1 sf of flowering area at 30-50W per COB (LED) and also is passively cooled (no fans nor additional HVAC required).

For a 4x8' SCROG set up, a total of 32 sf, I would recommend using 1000w of LED power - this can be accomplished with (4) of our 250W (5) COB Kits. You an always increase the power by adding another kit if need be.

You will save money not only on cooling, but also on the general electricity consumption as LEDs generally run 15-20% more efficient than HPS given only electrical consumption. There is little additional HVAC requirements as these COBs can be placed within 18-24" from the canopy with great results and no additional heat issues.

If you have additional questions regarding your particular setup I would be happy to answer them for you.

Best Regards,
Dan
 
I just flowered a male plant under white light it took 3 weeks to get substantial flower growth and the stretch wasn't bad either,the light is a 45 watt actual draw
135f50d103bb95698638387bba456729.jpg
last winter i grew under a Mars hydro 300 and a Illuminator jumbo UFO the whiter light of the Mars was great for veg and flower growth and the UFO was a lot more red and seemed to make more trichomes.
dec262be5faf8d5150f7170ff360a50b.jpg
 
Thanks for the advice here. I don't know why I never really thought of running half my room hps and half led. I suppose I could do a mars 1600 and one of my 1000w and that should work. I wont lie, I'm attracted to the price of the Mars.

As far as the COB's go.. Is there anyone who has a journal of any kind using these? I'm curious about them for sure.

Thanks again! I was half expecting people to yell at me to do my research. I think I did too much research :laughtwo:


Peace!

Freezy
 
When you look at the prices, consider the price per par watt, not the price per wall watt.

Where a Mars may be $1/watt or less, hugely inefficient at maybe 25% wall efficiency. (0.25w per 1w at the wall makes light, the other 75% is direct heat) you end up paying $4+/parwatt.

You may find a commercial fixture for $2/watt for 50% wall efficiency. This comes to the same cost per par watt, $4/parwatt. It looks more expensive at first glance, but you need less wattage for the same amount of light.

Though there's no telling how much light a Mars hydro actually produces until they stick it in a sphere(like they picture on their website lol). Guessing around 1.2umol/j. And when replacing a 1798umol 1000w SE HPS, you need 1.2-1.4umol/j just for a watt for watt equivalent with led(that's giving a huge reflection loss). DE is a better choice over Mars, in a sphere gavita hits 1.5-1.6umol/j on the canopy, and only costs $.50 per watt.


A little web searching will turn up the cob results, including side by side with hps. A little web searching will also turn up blown Mars leds, and the difficulty of actually dealing with their warranty.
 
yeah,you can use LED and HPS together,it also works fine by this way.:high-five:
Freezy said:
Thanks for the advice here. I don't know why I never really thought of running half my room hps and half led. I suppose I could do a mars 1600 and one of my 1000w and that should work. I wont lie, I'm attracted to the price of the Mars.

As far as the COB's go.. Is there anyone who has a journal of any kind using these? I'm curious about them for sure.

Thanks again! I was half expecting people to yell at me to do my research. I think I did too much research :laughtwo:


Peace!

Freezy
Click to expand...
 
Please do not worry,We have return and warranty policy,and we are frank with our warranty policy.If you get any problem,you can contact with us.:high-five:
Mars Hydro is and has been the innovative leader of LED grow light manufacturing since 2009.We are a self-sustaining company so the research, design, development, production and testing are performed by our own teams of experts.:Namaste:
Atulip said:
When you look at the prices, consider the price per par watt, not the price per wall watt.

Where a Mars may be $1/watt or less, hugely inefficient at maybe 25% wall efficiency. (0.25w per 1w at the wall makes light, the other 75% is direct heat) you end up paying $4+/parwatt.

You may find a commercial fixture for $2/watt for 50% wall efficiency. This comes to the same cost per par watt, $4/parwatt. It looks more expensive at first glance, but you need less wattage for the same amount of light.

Though there's no telling how much light a Mars hydro actually produces until they stick it in a sphere(like they picture on their website lol). Guessing around 1.2umol/j. And when replacing a 1798umol 1000w SE HPS, you need 1.2-1.4umol/j just for a watt for watt equivalent with led(that's giving a huge reflection loss). DE is a better choice over Mars, in a sphere gavita hits 1.5-1.6umol/j on the canopy, and only costs $.50 per watt.


A little web searching will turn up the cob results, including side by side with hps. A little web searching will also turn up blown Mars leds, and the difficulty of actually dealing with their warranty.
Click to expand...
 
I have been doing a ton of research and I looked at kind... I have read they are crap and over priced. I would need 2 of the k5 1000 and I'm not going to spend $3300 on lights with a bunch of people saying they are just cheap leds. They don't tell anyone what kind of leds they use and they seem to promote themselves pretty heavy... You would think that they would tell you if they were good leds. If they work for you that's great and I do appreciate the advice don't get me wrong I just don't think they are the right lights for me.

I stumbled upon a guy who goes by the name of growmau5 and he is killin it with his leds that he makes. He is getting upwards of 1.9 gpw and they look amazing. I think I am going to build a ridiculous led with the COB cxb3590 3500k led's. Granted it is expensive as hell because I'm going to build a fixture with 24 cobs so it'll be upwards of $2700 by the time its all said and done but it seems like its well worth the money and its literally the most efficient led's available on the market. All top bin. I didn't even know what a COB was until Atulip mentioned them above so huge shoutout to you and the others who mentioned them I thank you! Ill do a thread when I start the construction of the new room.

Peace
 
Before you pull the trigger on the Crees, look into the Citizen CLU048 and CLU058 series. They're less expensive than Crees with better efficiency, especially at higher power.

COB Series Version5-Lighting LED | CITIZEN ELECTRONICS CO.,LTD.

The CLU048-1212 is a great choice as well as the CLU058-1825. They both make over 50% more lumens per dollar than the CXB3590 in the 160L/watt range at current prices.

The 1212s are ~$13 right now and the 1825s are ~$43.

:Namaste:
 
Graytail said:
Before you pull the trigger on the Crees, look into the Citizen CLU048 and CLU058 series. They're less expensive than Crees with better efficiency, especially at higher power.

COB Series Version5-Lighting LED | CITIZEN ELECTRONICS CO.,LTD.

The CLU048-1212 is a great choice as well as the CLU058-1825. They both make over 50% more lumens per dollar than the CXB3590 in the 160L/watt range at current prices.

The 1212s are ~$13 right now and the 1825s are ~$43.

:Namaste:
Click to expand...

That's interesting. I noticed they run at a higher voltage around.... 50v the cree cobs are 36v. Ill be real honest with you. I know crap about led lighting. I didn't even start looking at it until like 2 days ago as far as the whole diy thing is concerned. From my understanding, the setup I would be running with the cxb3590's wouldn't actually be running at full capacity which makes the efficiency go up quite a bit. While I believe you, I'm skeptic only because I know everything I need to make the lights, and they are proven to work great, with the cxb's. Do you have any more info or links to people who have used these?
 
Then you can check our Mars Pro II Cree256:high-five:
mars hydro led grow light-CREE256S
Freezy said:
I have been doing a ton of research and I looked at kind... I have read they are crap and over priced. I would need 2 of the k5 1000 and I'm not going to spend $3300 on lights with a bunch of people saying they are just cheap leds. They don't tell anyone what kind of leds they use and they seem to promote themselves pretty heavy... You would think that they would tell you if they were good leds. If they work for you that's great and I do appreciate the advice don't get me wrong I just don't think they are the right lights for me.

I stumbled upon a guy who goes by the name of growmau5 and he is killin it with his leds that he makes. He is getting upwards of 1.9 gpw and they look amazing. I think I am going to build a ridiculous led with the COB cxb3590 3500k led's. Granted it is expensive as hell because I'm going to build a fixture with 24 cobs so it'll be upwards of $2700 by the time its all said and done but it seems like its well worth the money and its literally the most efficient led's available on the market. All top bin. I didn't even know what a COB was until Atulip mentioned them above so huge shoutout to you and the others who mentioned them I thank you! Ill do a thread when I start the construction of the new room.

Peace
Click to expand...
 
I've been talking to Mark over at an online store called cutter and he priced me out a cob cxb3590 all top bin kit for 24 cobs with three drivers for $1950 (I thought I was going to be up around $2500+). After some wire and about $100 bucks in aluminum It'll be good to go. I did check out the other lights that were mentioned above but mark is only charging me $35/cxb all top bin and I cannot say no to that. They are located in Australia I believe.
 
Nice price for the 3590s! :thumb:

Are the drivers dimmable? I've heard good things about Cutter. :slide:
 

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