Odin's Ongoing Phototron Experiment

Hello everyone. Names Odin. I am new to the site but not new to pot. :grinjoint:

Been around growing medical marijuana for many years. Worked with many OG 1970s growers who have been working on their genetics for just as long, to this day. I feel blessed with the knowledge and experience they have bestowed up me throughout the years. Thing is, you can read a book about how to kick someone's ass, but doesn't mean you can actually do it without practice. I don't claim to know it all, cuz face it, know one does. I didn't actually grow my own weed until 2 years ago. Up until that point I had a lot of experience helping other people grow pot, but I still fucked up the first year. Lot of mistakes - I won't get into it.

Anyway, second time around I corrected my errors and went overkill on procedure and for what I had to work with (5 hours peak sunlight, outdoors), I am extremely pleased with the results. Blew my pessimistic predictions out the window.

Here are a couple pics from my gallery of of one of my Cotton Candys and one of my Diesel Goos from my outdoor garden, 2009:

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dg2.jpg


Heres the thing. I have a two problems. I just moved from the middle of nowhere, to the middle of the city. Property... to Apartment. Its for a good reason, don't worry. However, a friend hooked me up with a Phototron cuz he knew I wasn't going to be able to grow. Small apartment. He said he had pretty good success with it using the hydro method but thought it could be vastly improved upon. He just didn't want to fuck with it anymore. Bought it in the 90s. Since its better than nothing I gratefully accepted his gift, knowing the poor reputation these things have.

So the first problem is solved. My second problem is that all that growing knowledge I have, is all outdoor. I don't know jack shit about indoor growing, let alone growing in a little box. So here I am. No one I know has any knowledge of these things besides my friend, and he only tried it once and never again. Seems like a few people have been able to be successful with these things on here, so I am going to do my best to document how my attempt at growing in a Phototron goes. I have read through a couple abandoned grows and will be doing further research as I go along.

Currently, I have two plants inside it. It is the smaller model. Not doing that again. Hate being limited to one type of weed to smoke but I'm already feeling that maximizing the space for one plant is the way to go. My friend told me to grow six... :thedoubletake: Probably why his only attempt at indoor failed in this little thing.

So I'll see how these two plants turn out, I'm pissed because one of the clones I got developted spider mites that didn't manifest for about a month after I got them, then quickly spread. So that is my current battle. Been spraying them with Neem oil and its been helping but the war wages on. I don't want to over do it with the Neem oil.

The 3 plants strains I was originally going to grow in the Phototron were as follows:

Cotton Candy - didn't survive the mite invasion, they took it out while I was out of town for a couple days. Couldn't save it. >:(

Unknown F-1 cross. This strain I obtained the only 4 remaining seeds from a line of genetics that goes back 10 years. Friend who it came from got popped and they burned all his plants, confiscated his seeds. I had the only 4 he gave me shortly before they got him. It appears to be EXTREMELY spider mite resistant. They are on there but they ain't slowing it down. I am preparing to clone it shortly here. Need to keep this strain alive. It smokes awesome too. :smokin:

Diesel Goo - struggling with the mites but appears to be overcoming it. Also end of the line genetics, however if it continues to struggle I may have to axe it to provide the best possible chance for this F-1 cross (still working on a name for it) to continue. It is mite resistant, and grows at much more rapid pace than the DG does indoors. If I can pull it off, I will be the only person with this strain and I hope to improve upon it further and cross it down the road with something. :grinjoint:

Knowledge I crave, and reports I will provide.

I need to smoke a :roorrip:. I will do my best to get some pictures going.

Odin
 
Re: Odin's Ongoing Phototron Experiment.

DG hasn't seemed to improve much since the last Neem spray. Just filled a 5 gallon bucket with a neem oil solution and dunked the entire plants into the bucket for about a minute each. Hopefully the nuking will do the trick. If the DG doesn't improve signifigantly, I'm afraid I'm going to give up on it.
 
Re: Odin's Ongoing Phototron Experiment.

Diesel Goo wasn't seeming to improve drastically, and I don't want to grow two plants in this thing anyway. Gave the DG to a friend, he is gonna toss it outside. Maybe it will do okay, who knows. More concerned with getting the F-1 healthy so I can clone it.

F-1 does appear to be recovering. Need to transplant it to a larger bag. Going to get a 10 gallon bag or so and cut it down so it fits in the base of the phototron and transplant. After it appears to be healthy, I am going to make several clones, then shortly thereafter, flower it.

I am concerned with flushing before I harvest. Since its a sealed container I am a little worried about drainage. I figure I will just make sure to cut nutrients a long time before I plan to harvest. Guess thats really my only option. I don't plan to overdo the nutrients anyway. They have been getting bat guano for the last couple weeks.

Any opinions from other Phototron growers? What was your flush plan?
 
Update 7/17/10

My new location appears to be completely devoid of grow stores and pet stores of all things. Not sure what the correlation between the two is, but basically I am SOL in my general area on both fronts. I have to travel back home to obtain what I need in both departments. So basically I have been making due with what I have in my little box of goodies. Used a trash bag since I couldn't find any real "grow" bags. Used some Fox Farms soil I managed to find at a pidly local Ace Hardware, the closest thing I have to a grow store. Transplanted it about 3 weeks ago, definitely had waited a little too long as it took a while for it to get going again.

About 3 weeks ago I made some of my bat guano compost tea. I usually do a combination of bat guano tea and fish emulsion tea throughout my outdoor grow, but because of the indoor situation, I am trying to keep the foul smells to a minimum. Already enraged the gf by accidently stinking up the apartment one day with the guano tea. So for this Phototron Experiment #1, I am only going to be using different bat guanos. Don't remember the NPK on the bat guano itself but its what I have used for vegetative growth in all my grows and others in the past.

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Its pretty simple to make and worked even better than I had hoped. Should have brewed it up sooner. Quanities go according to how much you need.

The ingredients I use for my veg mix are:

veg npk pure bat guano
small amount of neem oil
small amount of orange juice/sugar water
water

I let it sit for 2-3 weeks, shaking it every day or two for a couple minutes. After 2 weeks I open it. You know its good when you almost pass out opening it for the first time :)

I am struggling to find a good balance with the watering. I need to get a better water guage. I also am being very warry with over feeding, since there is no real way to "flush" this closed environment. After my initial feeding I left the plant for 3 days on a business trip. I came back and was blown away by how much growth had occured. So much in fact, that I just set the lights to 12/12. I want to invest in a better light for the bud growth for certain.

Anyway, thats my update for now. If anyone cares. Hah! :grinjoint::roorrip: ;)
 
I do have one problem though that I was hoping to get some advice on. I have never had this problem in my outdoor grows and I am a little uncertain of what the root of the problem is.

Some leaves (I'd venture to guess around 10-20%) start to "curl" while remaining green. They stay green for several weeks, then rapidly over the course of a couple days, yellow and sometimes even brown before falling off on their own, if I don't pluck them. This has been going on to some degree for about a month or two now. Seems to be getting a little worse so I am looking for solutions.

I was thinking that it was perhaps a Nitrogen or Potassium deficiency. Some of my research suggests it might even be a light sulfur deficiency... though I am leaning more towards N or K. I have been very light on my nutrient feeding and this doesn't appear to be the same kind of leaf yellowing typical when a plant is trying to shed extra nutrients. Its a patchy yellowing/browning and the tips almost always end up "burnt".

Any ideas or opinions on this? Here are some pictures that show the progress of the sick leaves. Any help is greatly appreciated!

sickleaf3.jpg


sickleaf2.jpg


sickleaf1.jpg


RooR
 
Well, this grow has been moved because it is over.

Basically, I believe the curling leaves was an indicator of an unnoticed mite infestation that I THOUGHT I had cured a month or so before. I checked regularly and I have no idea where they were other than in the soil or very sparse across the plant. I left for over a week on business and returned to find the plant literally cob-webbed. Too far gone to even bother with. The buds were looking fantastic right up until I left. Either way, I think I was doomed to battle the mites until the end.

So until I learn otherwise, I am going to attribute the curled, yellowing leaves to spider mites. The plant was quite resistant to them, but eventually sucumb to them. That must have been its way of saying it was fighting an unseen battle.

I made a few mistakes in this grow that are largely due to a lack of time, and the fact I moved 100 miles towards the begining of the grow. My mistakes were as follows:

Starting big. Because I was packing/moving/unpacking and living in two towns for a while, I left my clone in a 2 gallon bag for way too long. Stupid, but cost me a lot of time. Next time, I am filling the base of the Tron with dirt and planting directly into that from clone. No gradual bag increases or stunting.

Bleach. I am going to bleach the hell out of the photoron before I use it again. Kill those bastard mites.

Better lighting. Need to go back to my old town (no grow stores at my new location) and get some better lights for this thing.

Flower sooner. Again, due to everything I mentioned, I let the plant get too big.

I am also considering drilling holes in the bottle of the tron that can be plugged. That way, I can place the Tron in my bathtub, unplug the holes, and really flush it. I didn't like the "closed" system. Made me worry too much about how much nutes I was providing.

All in all I feel it was a good learning experience, like every other grow I have done. Biggest thing I learned: Never underestimate the power of the spidermite. Never dealt with them until now as I never had a problem with em out doors.

Seeing as this was a pretty retarded grow, I'm gonna let it fade away only for reference for any poor soul damned to growing in a Phototron. :smokin:
 
damn those buds look great nice job on them. i have saw the phototrons before but never put much thought into them. they look like they do a nice job though.:thumb:+reps
 
Also, does anyone have any recomendations for replacement bulbs for this thing? I am thinking I am gonna have to hack the Phototron up a bit to get some good aftermarket lights going in there.

Pull the top and put a 70-watt or 150-watt HPS on it.

Starting big. Because I was packing/moving/unpacking and living in two towns for a while, I left my clone in a 2 gallon bag for way too long. Stupid, but cost me a lot of time. Next time, I am filling the base of the Tron with dirt and planting directly into that from clone. No gradual bag increases or stunting.

Or set up a micro-DWC. Or use it for a mothership and flower in a closet/cabinet/box.

I am also considering drilling holes in the bottle of the tron that can be plugged. That way, I can place the Tron in my bathtub, unplug the holes, and really flush it. I didn't like the "closed" system. Made me worry too much about how much nutes I was providing.

Be careful as to where you drill the holes for your drain hoses - the ballast is in the base.
 
Greetings Odin...sorry bout ur grow. I know these things r quirky....FLOWER WITH THREE WEEKS VEG...not a minute longer.
Only one plant, start w/ more (3??) till pre flower then leave the alpha gurl
Lights...air flow...drainage...don't overwater. The drainage is a bear....
I thought about pots on top of stones. ( I thought 3 small pots till I have a great gurl....on top of a bed of stones in tub. That way, I can take um out and clean & drain any overflow even mid gro. Never tried it...just a thought. I can use the rice trick to hold the humid down late flower...
Its a shame to have it just sitting down there without putting it to as much use as I can. Mine may becom a mama home...in a pot on the stones to avoid overwatering.
Mama is pulling 4 ya!!!
 
I have been following threads on phototrons for quite a while, a friend once used one and had amazing results. There has been one continuing theme I have seen that separates every thread I have ever seen from my friends experience. Absolutely not one single person has followed the instructions, the tron is a sytem of growing, not purely a light source. Maybe going to their web site and purchasing a germination kit, which has everything you need in it, and following the directions exactly, would achieve surprising results. To get maximum yield, consistent and correct pruning is necessary, your pictures show internodal lengths many times what they should be. And that is just one part of it. Something to consider.
 
I have been following threads on phototrons for quite a while, a friend once used one and had amazing results. There has been one continuing theme I have seen that separates every thread I have ever seen from my friends experience. Absolutely not one single person has followed the instructions, the tron is a sytem of growing, not purely a light source. Maybe going to their web site and purchasing a germination kit, which has everything you need in it, and following the directions exactly, would achieve surprising results. To get maximum yield, consistent and correct pruning is necessary, your pictures show internodal lengths many times what they should be. And that is just one part of it. Something to consider.

I used one for 20 yrs! (more actually) never did very well and followed those inst to the letter. Trimming, one hour puddle, soil tests...the works. Got plenty of acceptable leaf, but not too much in budz. They were light & airy and a lil funny tastin.

the instructions are still with my unit. This ones not as old as some...and I always use the germination kit w/ distilled water. Had a hell of a time with bugs...bought the self watering res, fans, blankets, PL flo's.

Still going to use it as a mama home. My plants always did well in veg....the trouble started in flower for me.

Also had trouble keepin the material off the lights.

I really like my bloombox!:cheer:
 
Yeah, I can agree with some of that, my friend said his buds were small, but the quality good,, I believe the size and temp of the room may have some effect, it is probably better off in a smaller area maybe...Congrats on being the first person I have ever encountered who followed the script! Must not be that bad if ya been using it that long!:smokin:
 
Greetings Odin...sorry bout ur grow. I know these things r quirky....FLOWER WITH THREE WEEKS VEG...not a minute longer.
Only one plant, start w/ more (3??) till pre flower then leave the alpha gurl
Lights...air flow...drainage...don't overwater. The drainage is a bear....
I thought about pots on top of stones. ( I thought 3 small pots till I have a great gurl....on top of a bed of stones in tub. That way, I can take um out and clean & drain any overflow even mid gro. Never tried it...just a thought. I can use the rice trick to hold the humid down late flower...
Its a shame to have it just sitting down there without putting it to as much use as I can. Mine may becom a mama home...in a pot on the stones to avoid overwatering.
Mama is pulling 4 ya!!!

Thanks for the advice. I think I am going to do a removeable pot on top of some stones perhaps. Not sure quite yet. First things first: Bleaching the hell out of the unit to kill any remaining spider mites.

I have been following threads on phototrons for quite a while, a friend once used one and had amazing results. There has been one continuing theme I have seen that separates every thread I have ever seen from my friends experience. Absolutely not one single person has followed the instructions, the tron is a sytem of growing, not purely a light source. Maybe going to their web site and purchasing a germination kit, which has everything you need in it, and following the directions exactly, would achieve surprising results. To get maximum yield, consistent and correct pruning is necessary, your pictures show internodal lengths many times what they should be. And that is just one part of it. Something to consider.

When I got this thing from my friend, he had been using the actual Phototron products and procedure. Like mama, he got great leaf but nothing to rave about in the bud department. He didn't have any of the paperwork, and I looked at their site. I didn't care much for using their system at all. I am an outdoor grower. I know dirt. I dislike indoor period, and am only using this because I can't grow outside for the next few years. I don't have space to do anything beyond the Phototron, otherwise I would do a bloom box or something.

I thought I mentioned it also, but during the last 3 months, I was living in two different cities, 100 miles apart. Half the week in one, half the other. This project as a whole did not get nearly as much care and attention as it should have. The internodal lengths are definitely longer than they should be for this unit. I gave my plant my compost tea and left for a week and the plant literally trippled in size, it was crazy. Next time I am going to be thoroughly consistant and I am now fully moved in, so I can actually focus on getting some results.

I used one for 20 yrs! (more actually) never did very well and followed those inst to the letter. Trimming, one hour puddle, soil tests...the works. Got plenty of acceptable leaf, but not too much in budz. They were light & airy and a lil funny tastin.

the instructions are still with my unit. This ones not as old as some...and I always use the germination kit w/ distilled water. Had a hell of a time with bugs...bought the self watering res, fans, blankets, PL flo's.

Still going to use it as a mama home. My plants always did well in veg....the trouble started in flower for me.

Also had trouble keepin the material off the lights.

I really like my bloombox!:cheer:

Yeah, that was my thoughts reading everyone elses experience with their system. I decided screw the system, I want to do it my own way. Upgrading the lights, air flow, and growing medium. Going to stay small on the next grow. Find out the optimal way to grow with what I've got. If after 2 or 3 more grows I am not getting results, I will consider messing with their system. Your advice/experience has been greatly appreciated though Mama!



Yeah, I can agree with some of that, my friend said his buds were small, but the quality good,, I believe the size and temp of the room may have some effect, it is probably better off in a smaller area maybe...Congrats on being the first person I have ever encountered who followed the script! Must not be that bad if ya been using it that long!:smokin:

Thanks for your thoughts cowtipper. If I can't make it happen with dirt, I will give their system a try.
 
It's worth a try I guess, since you all ready have it. I was not in any way trying to say it could compare to some of the new ways of doing it, it is very vintage, just that it seemed like almost no one was actually using it in the way intended! Good luck!
 
It's worth a try I guess, since you all ready have it. I was not in any way trying to say it could compare to some of the new ways of doing it, it is very vintage, just that it seemed like almost no one was actually using it in the way intended! Good luck!

Yeah, vintage is right! Haha. It was a gift and its all I've got, so we'll see how it goes. I haven't seen too many people try dirt, so thats what I wanted to experiment with. Its basically a zero dollar hobby at this point, costing me only time. Photoron barely puts a dent in the powerbill, so no worries there.

Got several hundred seeds of at least 20-30 different strains (no labeling though, so its always a surprise) so I will germinate a few, get some bleach at the store, and move forward.

If I can get this thing to work and at least produce good weed, I will be happy. Not expecting any kind of impressive yield, just good herb is all I want.
 
I had experience with a phototron years ago and never really cared for it, but I do have some suggestions you may be able to use. I have no clue as to where you can get replacement bulbs for it but I have an idea. Try supplementing the lighting with CFL's in the top, use a standard round metal clip on reflector that you can get in a hardware store, then get an adapter that screws into the socket and takes two bulbs, use the CFL's that are equal to 100 watts or 150 watts if you can find them, use one daylight bulb and one warm white bulb. Now for your growing medium, Find one large pot to fit in the bottom or rather a bucket because you want it to hold water, now find a bucket that is slightly smaller that will fit inside the first and drill small holes all around the bottom of it, find some pea gravel and fill the bucket with holes in it. Now find a good aquarium air pump and an air stone and place the air stone in the bottom of the first bucket and place the second bucket into the first and fill with your nutrient solution, you can fill it until the water comes most of the way up into the second bucket. Just remember to keep your air pump higher than the buckets so water will not back flow into the pump, start your plant or plants in a 50/50 mixture of perlite and vermiculite then just transplant it into the pea gravel, keep the air pump running all of the time and before you know it your roots will fill the bucket and the plant will grow like crazy in the highly oxygenated nutrient solution. Another thing is to not veg the plant at all hardly, put it into 12/12 when they are only about 4-6 inches tall, I know that sounds crazy but the plant will continue to get taller as it goes through it's stretch that it does before it flowers, You will basically end up with a plant that is about two feet tall at finish and will be packed with buds. The more CFL's you can fit around it the better. By the way those two bud pics you had looked delicious great job...I just posted a grow journal titled " Product of years of breeding bagseed". I think you will enjoy checking it out, the pics I have in it are all plants grown under CFL's. Try what I said and you will be amazed at the rate of growth you get...:goodluck:...:roorrip:....By the way the adapter that I am talking about for the lights is shaped like a Y and you can find them in any hardware store...:hookah:
 
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