Some Advice, Pretty Please? AK47 & Jack

[gratefulredhead]

Strain - AK-47 and Jack Herer Auto
# of Plants - 6
Grow Type - Soil (started germination on November 21 with a dip in H2O, planted in jiffy starters on November 22. 100 percent germination. Planted jiffy pots into soil (Black Gold Potting Soil) in peat containers on December 1.
Grow Stage - Vegetative
Bucket Size - 3 inch peat pots. Will move to 3 gal cloth if they make it that far.
Lights - Started with CFL for seedlings. Moved to Viparspectra VA1000, a quick detour to PhatSlim One and now using Vipar XS2000.
Nutrients - Bergman's Plant Food
Medium - Black Gold
PPM - unsure
PH - soil is around 5.5 - 6.0. Water has been around 7.2 - 7.5.
RH - 45 - 65%
Room Temperature - 68 - 78
Solution Temperature - room temp
Room Square Footage - 10' x 15'
Pests - A couple gnats, but nothing significant.

First grow. All was very fine until last week when leaves began to droop a bit. Based on advice and research, best guess was overwatering (I had been watering almost daily.). Cut back on water quite a bit for almost two days, watered well yesterday with spring water, and not much improvement so far. You can see that some leaves are pale, many are drooping still and a couple leaves browned to the point of cracking off.

Thanks so much for your help. As much reading as I've done, nothing beats real time help and conversation.

Peace.

Photos below from 12/1, 12/9, 12/11, 12/16, 12/18, and 12/20.

 

[Weaselcracker]

Based on your description and the appearance, overwatering is the most likely problem.

 

[gratefulredhead]

Thanks for the reply. Should center out with a more balanced watering regime ya think?

 

[Weaselcracker]

It will help -but you probably have a little ways to go. A bit of a rethink maybe. I’m not sure if you’ve read many tutorials on how to water cannabis but basically - you should let it dry out as much as possible before watering again. Which will take quite a few days.

Yes you can dribble a little in the sides or top if that part is drying out way too much before then, but only if you really have to.


But let it dry until they’re just almost starting to wilt a little. it won’t hurt them as long as you’re there to monitor. Then you’ll know how dry they can go. Then water. But do not soak them right down again, at this size and age. IMO. Not till they’re a bit bigger and happier. Just try to get everything moist for the first couple weeks or more.


Then - repeat the cycle Keep doing that. Once they get bigger it’s good to soak them down at the beginning of the watering cycle. Not yet though.


It really helps them to have that wet-dry cycle.

 

[Weaselcracker]

Welcome to the forum by the way

 

[Buds Buddy]

Hi, I'm not familiar with Black Gold Soil. Heard of it but haven't used it. Does it have any nutrients in it ?
3" Peat Cups don't allow for much root growth. You realize you will have to break those peat cups to get the plant out ?
They take too long to disintegrate when you plant the peat cup in soil. Especially with an Auto. You don't have a lot of time to correct issues with an Auto because after day 21 you start flowering most the time.
I'd let those Peat cups dry out & up-pot to the 3 gallon bags as soon as possible. If you do Auto's again start them in their final pot. Do not up-pot. You'll have much better luck. Those little cups would only take about 1/2 oz. of water every 2 - 3 days. The plants look overwatered.
When you up-pot make sure the Black Gold soil has Perlite in it so you water drains well & doesn't keep the soil too wet.
If you'd of started in a larger Solo Cup or your final pot, I don't think you'd have any problem right now. Those peat cups are so small they are probably packed with roots already with no place to go.
When you up-pot water around the outer edge of the pot the 1st few times & not in the center. It will make the roots chase after the water which makes your plant grow bigger. A 3 gallon pot will take about 30 - 36 oz. of water about every 3 - 4 days until you get close to the end. By the end each plant will drink 3/4 - 1 gallon each every 2 - 3 days.

 

[Buds Buddy]

I think someone said you're in AZ. too. I'm over near Surprise. There's at least 10 AZ. growers on here. Welcome to 420 Mag.

 

[gratefulredhead]

It will help -but you probably have a little ways to go. A bit of a rethink maybe. I’m not sure if you’ve read many tutorials on how to water cannabis but basically - you should let it dry out as much as possible before watering again. Which will take quite a few days.

Yes you can dribble a little in the sides or top if that part is drying out way too much before then, but only if you really have to.


But let it dry until they’re just almost starting to wilt a little. it won’t hurt them as long as you’re there to monitor. Then you’ll know how dry they can go. Then water. But do not soak them right down again, at this size and age. IMO. Not till they’re a bit bigger and happier. Just try to get everything moist for the first couple weeks or more.


Then - repeat the cycle Keep doing that. Once they get bigger it’s good to soak them down at the beginning of the watering cycle. Not yet though.


It really helps them to have that wet-dry cycle.

Thanks for the feedback. I have read a number of tutorials (probably too many!) - it is just a new thing to let plants get that dry between waterings. Kinda freaks me out. There is some conflicting information about watering until run off and what you outline above. So, you just change when the plants are bigger and keep the smaller ones pretty damn dry, eh?

 

[gratefulredhead]

Hi, I'm not familiar with Black Gold Soil. Heard of it but haven't used it. Does it have any nutrients in it ?
3" Peat Cups don't allow for much root growth. You realize you will have to break those peat cups to get the plant out ?
They take too long to disintegrate when you plant the peat cup in soil. Especially with an Auto. You don't have a lot of time to correct issues with an Auto because after day 21 you start flowering most the time.
I'd let those Peat cups dry out & up-pot to the 3 gallon bags as soon as possible. If you do Auto's again start them in their final pot. Do not up-pot. You'll have much better luck. Those little cups would only take about 1/2 oz. of water every 2 - 3 days. The plants look overwatered.
When you up-pot make sure the Black Gold soil has Perlite in it so you water drains well & doesn't keep the soil too wet.
If you'd of started in a larger Solo Cup or your final pot, I don't think you'd have any problem right now. Those peat cups are so small they are probably packed with roots already with no place to go.
When you up-pot water around the outer edge of the pot the 1st few times & not in the center. It will make the roots chase after the water which makes your plant grow bigger. A 3 gallon pot will take about 30 - 36 oz. of water about every 3 - 4 days until you get close to the end. By the end each plant will drink 3/4 - 1 gallon each every 2 - 3 days.

Thanks for the detailed advice. The peat cups are 5 inches across and about 5 inches tall - sorry if I made a mistake in my description. So they are a bit bigger than you are thinking. The roots are already coming out of the bottom. If I cut the peat cups on the sides when up-potting will that suffice? I was hoping to avoid the distress of transplantint through the use of peat cups but maybe this was not a good idea in retrospect. Yes, black gold has nutrients.

 

[NOOOBIENOT]

take them out of the cups , the cups will only cause root rot , transplant will only set them back a week if done gently cut gently on both sides of the cup holding the base of the plant in 1 hand and split the sides away with the other hand , if you have a spare cup use it to make the size of the hole need in the new pot before you take the plants out of the smaller pots

 

[StoneOtter]

Welcome Gratefulredhead, Love your autos! I'm on board with everyone so far. Especially the Bunny in regards to getting them into a larger pot. There's an auto link and a watering link in my signature if you'd like.

 

[Weaselcracker]

Thanks for the feedback. I have read a number of tutorials (probably too many!) - it is just a new thing to let plants get that dry between waterings. Kinda freaks me out. There is some conflicting information about watering until run off and what you outline above. So, you just change when the plants are bigger and keep the smaller ones pretty damn dry, eh?

I was just falling asleep when I tried to write that out so it might have been gibberish Just try not to let them get soaking wet while they’re small. Some grow mediums hold more oxygen and can handle soaking. Not soil generally. So don’t worry about runoff when they’re babies.

my usual MO is to premoisten the soil before planting. This can often last them for the first ten days or even two weeks. When I do have to water in the early days I do it by dribbling a bit in. At that stage as long as they’re not in danger of drying out and dying I call it good. The one thing you want to avoid is soaking down young seedlings.


Lots of ways to go about it and it’s hard to write out a complete tutorial covering every possible angle. But those are my main tips


Those sort of pots make it more difficult to manage and I haven’t had much luck with them in the past.

Good luck!

 

[gratefulredhead]

Welcome Gratefulredhead, Love your autos! I'm on board with everyone so far. Especially the Bunny in regards to getting them into a larger pot. There's an auto link and a watering link in my signature if you'd like.

Great links - have been checking them out! If I can find some better soil locally, I'll get them into a larger pot ASAP. having trouble finding decent soil in terms of ph in the box stores...

 

[gratefulredhead]

I was just falling asleep when I tried to write that out so it might have been gibberish Just try not to let them get soaking wet while they’re small. Some grow mediums hold more oxygen and can handle soaking. Not soil generally. So don’t worry about runoff when they’re babies.

my usual MO is to premoisten the soil before planting. This can often last them for the first ten days or even two weeks. When I do have to water in the early days I do it by dribbling a bit in. At that stage long- as they’re not in danger of drying out and dying I call it good. The one thing you want to avoid is soaking down young seedlings.


Lots of ways to go about it and it’s hard to write out a complete tutorial covering every possible angle. But those are my main tips


Those sort of pots make it more difficult to manage and I haven’t had much luck with them in the past.

Good luck!

thanks again! been gingerly giving them a little drink every two days or so. Today one was wilted so that is dry enough! will get them out of those pots as soon as I find another soil option. haven't had luck. I have black gold and Kellogg's organics on hand and both are on the lower side for ph. can i use them if i use ph up or better to wait to find some appropriate soil? thank you a TON!

 

[Weaselcracker]

If that black gold is the same black gold they sell in Canada, I’ve seen people use it as a base. I’m thinking of @The Celt in particular.

 

[gratefulredhead]

If that black gold is the same black gold they sell in Canada, I’ve seen people use it as a base. I’m thinking of @The Celt in particular.

Was this one: Home - Black Gold

 

[The Celt]

Thanks for the shout out @Weaselcracker

The first year I grew I used Promix BX for a base and just straight peat since. From what I see in your link, I would say it’s a peat based mix that has some nutrients in it, but no where near what a cannabis plant with use.

Its got perlite in it and would be buffered, so you could use it as a base but you will at some point have to give it nutrients.

Now I will go back and read the entire thread and see if I even answered your question

 

[Weaselcracker]

I see. I remember years ago when we were discussing soil options in my area you suggested using black gold soil from home hardware as a base. In the end, I couldn’t find it here. Anyway.... that’s what that comment was about.

 

[gratefulredhead]

Thanks for the shout out @Weaselcracker

The first year I grew I used Promix BX for a base and just straight peat since. From what I see in your link, I would say it’s a peat based mix that has some nutrients in it, but no where near what a cannabis plant with use.

Its got perlite in it and would be buffered, so you could use it as a base but you will at some point have to give it nutrients.

Now I will go back and read the entire thread and see if I even answered your question

Thanks for the reply. I could easily get some peat and perlite. I do have a set of nutrients (Bergman’s) for the whole grow cycle. Maybe that is best in a pinch??

 

[The Celt]

Pure peat and perlite is cheaper, but it needs to be buffered which is a hard thing to determine in a non-organic grow. Buffering your own medium when using salt based nutrients can be a struggle. That’s why most who use nutes use a pre-buffered medium like ProMix.

You’d be better served by the Black Gold or Promix. Promix BX is a good buffered medium, with perlite if I remember, and has no nutrients in it.