Winging It In Winter By The Window: Soil Auto Grow

[SoGnotSOG321]

Welcome to the site and good luck or your experiment. Not mussing things up is not my specialty, and I plan to rattle the tree ok. There's no measure to the "what ifs" published about light but if a picture is worth a thousand words I give this essay (see attached photo) as evidence that you absolutely are wasting money running more than 12/12 on flowering autos. This is a GG#4 auto, as soon as pistols showed I pulled the lights way up (1M) and switched to 12/12. So they stretched up so fast. This is 3 months on 12/12. My lights Mars Hydro 3000s, 2 over and 2 angled from the side covering lowers. 6.5 grams of MC per gal, half gallon pd. in 10 gallons of Ocean Forest, this was in a plastic, but I do use air pots as well and got a larger (20%) in net gain than a smaller pot but..its the nutes that produce the best potential after lighting and I see your yield being low using so little power and expecting the window to add much is reaching pretty far. I love soil grows and I've placed faith in plain enriched super soils without nutes and been disappointed every time. I have broken branches off my auto plants and stuck them in perlite and used the same nutes to keep it alive and growing and sprouting roots. Sorry for the hold up I'm so high rn.

 

[Carmen Ray]

I see your yield being low using so little power and expecting the window to add much is reaching pretty far.

Thank you for contributing your expertise 321! That is a bud and a half :mouth hangs open: ! I will know after this grow if I will revert to coco-perlite hydro or not. My mate who gave me the light did very well with it. I still believe this will be more cost effective than buying meds. Please hang out and enjoy being high I think I need to head over to your journaling and see what's up!

 

[Jon]

Welcome to the site and good luck or your experiment. Not mussing things up is not my specialty, and I plan to rattle the tree ok. There's no measure to the "what ifs" published about light but if a picture is worth a thousand words I give this essay (see attached photo) as evidence that you absolutely are wasting money running more than 12/12 on flowering autos. This is a GG#4 auto, as soon as pistols showed I pulled the lights way up (1M) and switched to 12/12. So they stretched up so fast. This is 3 months on 12/12. My lights Mars Hydro 3000s, 2 over and 2 angled from the side covering lowers. 6.5 grams of MC per gal, half gallon pd. in 10 gallons of Ocean Forest, this was in a plastic, but I do use air pots as well and got a larger (20%) in net gain than a smaller pot but..its the nutes that produce the best potential after lighting and I see your yield being low using so little power and expecting the window to add much is reaching pretty far. I love soil grows and I've placed faith in plain enriched super soils without nutes and been disappointed every time. I have broken branches off my auto plants and stuck them in perlite and used the same nutes to keep it alive and growing and sprouting roots. Sorry for the hold up I'm so high rn.

I love when we start talking about light and autos the bold statements come flying! Lol!

Ok, this is a really nice auto bud for sure. Respectfully, however, one plant doesn't prove anything except that you did a great (amazing actually) job on this plant and she got huge for you.

Here's what I suspect, and the only way to test it would be to do a highly controlled side by side with everything identical except in one case you flower 12/12 and the other you go 20/4.

I would bet the harvest from my 5x5 grow that in said experiment the 20/4 buds will win every single time.

Have you done such a side by side by chance? I have not.

 

[InTheShed]

12/12 simply isn't near enough light to max an auto. Regardless of what any science might say, that's the reality.

The science says that too! DLI for the win.

heading towards that one night of 12/12, presumably on 21 June?

12/12 happened back in March (and will again in September). June 21st will be your shortest day of the year.

a highly controlled side by side with everything identical except in one case you flower 12/12 and the other you go 20/4.
I would bet the harvest from my 5x5 grow that in said experiment the 20/4 buds will win every single time.
Have you done such a side by side by chance? I have not.

That's the trouble with autos, can't run clones side by side for a true comparison. Two seeds under the same conditions will often result in completely different plants - even more so with autos because of the need to breed in the ruderalis.

Fewer light hours means lower DLI, which can only be compensated for with more lux/PAR/PPFD (if your light can provide it). At some point the plant will rebel against the higher light reading and burn.

Not many folks want to try that, so they run normal brightness for longer hours.

 

[Carmen Ray]

12/12 happened back in March (and will again in September). June 21st will be your shortest day of the year.

Oh dear, I got that one completely back to front. Thank you for pointing that out lol!
Thank you for the science lesson too, Shed! I have the app on my phone now so once I am up and running, I will try to understand a bit better. I am pooping myself about the space. If you look at my photo of that space, can you tell me if it is likely that I will be able to keep the plants far away enough from the light by training them laterally? It looks too close to me. Is it doable or am I going to have to drop both plants onto the bench, in which case they will get awkward light angle? It's far from ideal, this space... There just is not anywhere else.

 

[InTheShed]

Love the still life with fruit plate!

I am pooping myself about the space. If you look at my photo of that space, can you tell me if it is likely that I will be able to keep the plants far away enough from the light by training them laterally? It looks too close to me. Is it doable or am I going to have to drop both plants onto the bench, in which case they will get awkward light angle? It's far from ideal, this space... There just is not anywhere else.

No need for pooping yet (other than your regular doings of course)! You won't know what kind of training your plants will need until you see how they're growing, and your maximum distance to the light is with the pots on the floor (if that table if moveable).

And now that you have the app working on your phone you can measure the light at different heights and use this from Royal Queen Seeds as a general guide:
HOW MUCH LIGHT DO YOUR CANNABIS PLANTS REQUIRE?

• Clones and seedlings: 5,000–7,000 lux
• Vegetative growth: 15,000–50,000 lux
• Flowering: 45,000–65,000 lux
• Maximum recommended amount of light: 75,000 lux

That will generally tell you how close the tops can get before you're likely to introduce light stress.

 

[Carmen Ray]

with the pots on the floor (if that table if moveable).

It's moveable but there is nowhere to move it to. There's very little room to move in my living room. The furthest I can move the plants is to the bench.

Love the still life with fruit plate!

thank you, it looked good to leave it there

That will generall tell you how close the tops can get before you're likely to introduce light stress.

Thanks, this is a gr8 guide.

other than your regular doings of course)

 

[Jon]

Oh dear, I got that one completely back to front. Thank you for pointing that out lol!
Thank you for the science lesson too, Shed! I have the app on my phone now so once I am up and running, I will try to understand a bit better. I am pooping myself about the space. If you look at my photo of that space, can you tell me if it is likely that I will be able to keep the plants far away enough from the light by training them laterally? It looks too close to me. Is it doable or am I going to have to drop both plants onto the bench, in which case they will get awkward light angle? It's far from ideal, this space... There just is not anywhere else.

As did I. Lol. Thinking in reverse.

 

[Jon]

The science says that too! DLI for the win.

12/12 happened back in March (and will again in September). June 21st will be your shortest day of the year.

That's the trouble with autos, can't run clones side by side for a true comparison. Two seeds under the same conditions will often result in completely different plants - even more so with autos because of the need to breed in the ruderalis.

Fewer light hours means lower DLI, which can only be compensated for with more lux/PAR/PPFD (if your light can provide it). At some point the plant will rebel against the higher light reading and burn.

Not many folks want to try that, so they run normal brightness for longer hours.

Too true. If one wanted to do it I suppose you could get closer at least by popping every seed in a 10 auto seeds pack, growing them identically, and then selecting the two most similar phenos at day x. But yeah, it'll never really be sciency with autos for exactly that reason.

 

[Carmen Ray]

I'm not Trala but here are my bookmarked tutorial links so far:

How to keep buds vertical

How to use CarSticks™

Defoliate for an Even Canopy

I hope you don't mind me cutting and pasting into my journal. It's easier for me to reference like this. Thanks HG!


This is @Carcass training methods.

 

[Carmen Ray]

Both seeds have cracked. Caramel King had a little tap root so I transferred her to a jiffy pellet which was soaked in water and mycorrhyzae solution as per directions on the packet specifically for starting peat pucks. I hope that West Coast OG will have pushed out her tap root by later today. That means they cracked between 24 and 36 hours of paper towel wetting. Into the spreadsheet that goes.

Any advice / criticism at this point will be welcomed

Have a beautiful weekend y'all

 

[Azimuth]

Looking good there, Carmen!

Now a day or two (hopefully) for the seedling to break the surface and you're on your way. Of course, you then enter the trickiest part of the grow, providing enough moisture to a small plant without drowning it.

But so far, so good!

 

[Jon]

Azi beat me to it. You're in good shape man! Btw - you did poke some holes in the bottom of the Dixie cups to allow the water to drain, right?

 

[Azimuth]

Azi beat me to it. You're in good shape man! Btw - you did poke some holes in the bottom of the Dixie cups to allow the water to drain, right?

Ah, those pesky details...

 

[Azimuth]

And one more thought to park in your brain. Some people have had issues with the cover wrapping those peat pellets, like it impedes the root growth, or something. So, once they seedlings come up and the roots can hold the mix together, it might be advisable to cut the cover off before potting them up.

But you've got some time before that decision.

 

[Carmen Ray]

cut the cover off before potting them up

poke some holes in the bottom of the Dixie cups

Thank you Azi and Jon. I did poke holes in the bottoms of the dixie cups and they are sitting in large coffee mugs to keep the developing roots in darkness. I had in mind that I will cut the bottoms of the peat pellets before putting them into the dixies. I have run some dechlorinated water mycorrhyzae solution through the soil in the dixies, so that it will be every so slightly moist when I plant the peated babes into the dixies in a few days from now. I know to water at an angle down the side when it's required. I haven't drowned a plant yet but am used to coco in pots and soil outdoors. I have the perfect watering can... look!

 

[Jon]

Thank you Azi and Jon. I did poke holes in the bottoms of the dixie cups and they are sitting in large coffee mugs to keep the developing roots in darkness. I had in mind that I will cut the bottoms of the peat pellets before putting them into the dixies. I have run some dechlorinated water mycorrhyzae solution through the soil in the dixies, so that it will be every so slightly moist when I plant the peated babes into the dixies in a few days from now. I know to water at an angle down the side when it's required. I haven't drowned a plant yet but am used to coco in pots and soil outdoors. I have the perfect watering can... look!

Lol!!! Good luck using that to water a Dixie cup!

 

[Carmen Ray]

Lol!!! Good luck using that to water a Dixie cup!

huh? it's quite simple surely. Raise the dixie into your non dominant hand and tilt. Carefully pour water through the long spout and down the inner side of the cup? What issues are you seeing? How would you water a dixie cup? The other way I could do it, is leave the dixies to stand in water so that the water is wicked up to the roots, but I am hesitant to do that in cold weather.

 

[Jon]

huh? it's quite simple surely. Raise the dixie into your non dominant hand and tilt. Carefully pour water through the long spout and down the inner side of the cup? What issues are you seeing? How would you water a dixie cup? The other way I could do it, is leave the dixies to stand in water so that the water is wicked up to the roots, but I am hesitant to do that in cold weather.

Wow, sorry @Carmen Ray, I honestly thought you were joking. Lol. My bad. Well, since you're serious, I will give you the same level response as I should have before. I think you are going to find there's a million better ways. Here's a brief list that are all superior to that watering can for a Dixie cup:
- misting from a spray bottle
- using a spray bottle (small one) with the nozzle twisted so it shoots in a stream and use that to target water down the sides of the cup
- the lid off a gallon of milk or something I have used many times
- a large pipette like many of the nute companies provide helps to target water real well
- water from one Dixie cup into your, it's small and easily controlled

That's off the top of my head. That can you have is about the very last thing I would use for a Dixie cup. Just my two cents. Try it the way you described. I'm pretty sure you will discover the downsides pretty quickly.

Hope that helps.

 

[Carmen Ray]

so it shoots in a stream and use that to target water down the sides of the cup

Thanks Jon, those are all good ideas. I still feel confident in my use of the miniature watering can and look forward to trying it out. I'll let you know how it goes