Brown Spots Into Yellow Leaves, Unable To Remedy And Need Some Guidance

[cbdhemp808]

I'm actually taking time off from the forum, but I'll just respond to several comments above about my outdoor grow here in Hawaii, re: bud rot.

I realize there may be ways to prevent bud rot, but I have decided that my best approach is to use BR resistant genetics. I say genetics because "strain" isn't a great way to describe what I'm saying. I am focusing on breeders who produce stable seed lines, and who also select for BR resistance. I have found that HI-BISCUS from Humboldt Seed Company is amazingly BR resistant. 2nd place is their Humboldt Dream. I'm heading out to harvest an HD today, and I see very limited BR. It'll be a little early, but not bad. (The dominant terpenes in HI-BISCUS are terpinolene, myrcene, and pinene. I see a strong correlation between terpinolene and BR resistance. You can search my threads for "terpinolene" for more info.)

I also really like a Blueberry pheno that I have, and that one's not very BR resistant, but I'm growing it out again in a 15 gal fabric pot, and will dose it up with trichoderma and other microbes.

I see premature senescence as causing stress to the plant, and may be a factor in bud rot, and certainly creates dead material for BR to get started on. So, with some of my phenos ( i.e. some new CBDs) I'll be growing them out again as clones in 15 gal. I recently harvested my legacy CBG pheno, and there was zero bud rot.

Yes, I'm taking a break, so probably won't respond more to this thread.

 

[T0x1x]

Hi All,

I promised I would share a few updates to this thread as things went on - it's turning into a bit of a grow diary, but folks have been very helpful and I'm almost to the end, thanks to a lot of advice and help from the folks on here.

The little gal is limping to the finish line. I think the herm that was sharing a tent with it avoided pollinating it - no sign of swollen calyxs.

For the first time in weeks, I'm seeing yellowing of the bottom leaves again and I'm guessing this is the plant finally starting to give out. This is week 10 (not counting seedling stage), probably week 6-7 of flower. I had a friend growing this same strain from the same seed package (albeit outside) and it's just popping amber trichromes - we both started at the same time (this is an auto). Mine doesn't have any evidence of amber yet, but I'm also still getting crazy pistil growth, whereas his had completely stopped maybe a week or two back:

Almost every budsite still has a lot of white pistils, but the colas themselves are getting quite dense and heavy. I've maintained RH 45% and 77F, so I think that rot is a low probability still.

With a plant that has really been stressed most of it's life, is there some point I just call it, despite white pistils still popping up everywhere?

I'm getting a lot of little 'turrets' that sorta look like small foxtails, but they aren't going to crazy. No other signs of light or heat stress. Bonus Loupe pic of the trichromes.

Thanks all again for keeping up with me, appreciate any final insight

 

[Azimuth]

I don't even start checking trichomes until the pistils all darken and pull in. You've got some time to go yet.

 

[Keffka]

The only time I would harvest a plant early is if it began to herm and started spitting out stamens everywhere.. I wouldn’t pull it early if it was just one or two, it would have to look like the plant is just done growing and is now solely focused on stamens.

Your plants look just like they’re supposed to. Those little towers you’re seeing are perfectly fine. You’ll notice when you’ve dried and cured those little towers will become the larger bumps in your buds and typically they’re pretty strong.

I agree with @Azimuth youre still a ways away from finishing. The white hairs are still numerous and they’re still reaching out into the air to grab pollen. Once the majority of the hairs have browned and crinkled in is when it’s time to start thinking about checking trichomes.. I still see clears in your image

These last few weeks are super important for resin and weight to the buds.. a vast amount of its quality and weight will be put on during this period, you don’t won’t to rush it or stop it early

 

[T0x1x]

Thanks for the insight @Keffka and @Azimuth . I was mainly concerned with the stress the plant had gone through - I read in a couple places that sometimes they never stop putting out white hairs and you just need to pull the trigger at some point.

In other news... I was feeling good about evacuating the herm that shared a tent in here. However now... I might have caught a seed growing. It's surprisingly hard to find images of early seed growth online to compare to and tons of conflicting info about how to check, if you should harvest, etc. This calyx had slightly popped open and seemed to reveal what looked like an early seed inside. I plucked it out with a pick, but it didn't really have enough form to be able to tell if it was an early seed or not - it was pretty soft and REALLY small, maybe 1/10 the size of a full seed. It could just be some green growth inside the calyx? Tough to tell honestly. Would sorta surprise me if the calyx was splitting open this early with a extremely young seed in it - anyone have any experience with that?

 

[Melville Hobbes]

Thanks for the insight @Keffka and @Azimuth . I was mainly concerned with the stress the plant had gone through - I read in a couple places that sometimes they never stop putting out white hairs and you just need to pull the trigger at some point.

In other news... I was feeling good about evacuating the herm that shared a tent in here. However now... I might have caught a seed growing. It's surprisingly hard to find images of early seed growth online to compare to and tons of conflicting info about how to check, if you should harvest, etc. This calyx had slightly popped open and seemed to reveal what looked like an early seed inside. I plucked it out with a pick, but it didn't really have enough form to be able to tell if it was an early seed or not - it was pretty soft and REALLY small, maybe 1/10 the size of a full seed. It could just be some green growth inside the calyx? Tough to tell honestly. Would sorta surprise me if the calyx was splitting open this early with a extremely young seed in it - anyone have any experience with that?

I've never seen one like that before, and I usually find a few seeds on my outdoor plants.

 

[T0x1x]

Hey All!

I think this one will be my last post on this thread. Through all the helpful insight on this forum, I've gotten the plant a lot further than it would have made it without your intervention, but I think we have finally reached the end. The little gal is losing 4-5 leaves a day, and there isn't a single green leaf left as all of them are in some stage of yellowing and then crinkling up to brown. There are still some white pistils being put out, but the vast majority of the hairs are now brown and crinkled - the pictures seem to really highlight the white hairs, not sure if that's my phone doing that to make it 'pop' or what but the photos are a little misleading. I did do some trichrome inspection and there isn't any amber, but there are definitely 50%+ milky.

Unless anyone has strong advice against it (or feels that I should get another 3-5 days out of it), I'm going to plan to chop her down tomorrow! It's day 101 of this little Auto's life. Thank you again for all your insight and help thus far!

 

[Melville Hobbes]

If she's still drinking you still have a chance to ripen those buds a bit.
I've seen plants keep going with no fan leaves left, just the sugar leaves.

 

[Keffka]

Personally I believe you still have 2-3 weeks left at least.. leaves are ALMOST irrelevant for these last few weeks. I say almost because they’re never unimportant, they’re just not having the biggest impact on your grow currently in your stage. Even without fan leaves she can still produce resin and she can still photosynthesize with just the sugar leaves.

You still have noticeable white hairs and they’re almost all still reaching out to grab pollen. This means she’s still budding and producing resin. These last couple weeks are where the real serious weight and quality comes from. You could feasibly double your dry weight with an extra 2 weeks of growth, and you can turn great cannabis into the best you’ve ever had.

Your leaf coloring is still decent as well. There’s life left in them. I see carbon deficiencies more than I see a plant dying in those leaves.

@Melville Hobbes brings up an even better point. If she’s still drinking water she’s still going. You don’t need to worry about letting it go past harvest or letting it mature too much if she’s still drinking. If she’s drinking she’s alive and she’s working.

Ignore the calendar.. ignore how many days it’s grown.. that doesn’t matter.. she’s not concerned with a clock.. some plants take longer to finish than others.. those longer finish plants almost always end up with the best results. I often see autos go 120-130 days easy.

 

[T0x1x]

Personally I believe you still have 2-3 weeks left at least.. leaves are ALMOST irrelevant for these last few weeks. I say almost because they’re never unimportant, they’re just not having the biggest impact on your grow currently in your stage. Even without fan leaves she can still produce resin and she can still photosynthesize with just the sugar leaves.

You still have noticeable white hairs and they’re almost all still reaching out to grab pollen. This means she’s still budding and producing resin. These last couple weeks are where the real serious weight and quality comes from. You could feasibly double your dry weight with an extra 2 weeks of growth, and you can turn great cannabis into the best you’ve ever had.

Your leaf coloring is still decent as well. There’s life left in them. I see carbon deficiencies more than I see a plant dying in those leaves.

@Melville Hobbes brings up an even better point. If she’s still drinking water she’s still going. You don’t need to worry about letting it go past harvest or letting it mature too much if she’s still drinking. If she’s drinking she’s alive and she’s working.

Ignore the calendar.. ignore how many days it’s grown.. that doesn’t matter.. she’s not concerned with a clock.. some plants take longer to finish than others.. those longer finish plants almost always end up with the best results. I often see autos go 120-130 days easy.

Thank you for the insight @Keffka and @Melville Hobbes ! She is still drinking... but maybe 50% the rate as previously. Definitely slower than a week ago. I've pulled some leaves that are crinkling up and completely browned/dead (but not yellowish ones).

I'm not opposed to running it longer! I would love to keep it up and I'm not rushing to chop it. My only true concern is bud rot. I don't know if I've been properly scared of it as a newbie or not, but it seems like this is the point where a lot of advice online is "yeah if you get dead leaves, bud rot is gonna set in. Best chop asap and salvage what you can." I think I am doing a good job with 45% RH, 75-80F temp, and good air circulation... but I would hate to lose it by trying to eke out time when I really shouldn't be.

If it seems a low risk in those conditions, I'm game to keep it going. I appreciate folks correcting me when it's probably easier to just write it off and say "yeah just chop it" - constructive criticism definitely helping to make me a better grower. Seems like the true key is making sure the white hairs are pulled in before evaluating.

 

[Azimuth]

Also if you're only 50% cloudy that means the plant is still filling the trichomes with cannabinoids so yet another reason to wait.

 

[Melville Hobbes]

Thank you for the insight @Keffka and @Melville Hobbes ! She is still drinking... but maybe 50% the rate as previously. Definitely slower than a week ago. I've pulled some leaves that are crinkling up and completely browned/dead (but not yellowish ones).

I'm not opposed to running it longer! I would love to keep it up and I'm not rushing to chop it. My only true concern is bud rot. I don't know if I've been properly scared of it as a newbie or not, but it seems like this is the point where a lot of advice online is "yeah if you get dead leaves, bud rot is gonna set in. Best chop asap and salvage what you can." I think I am doing a good job with 45% RH, 75-80F temp, and good air circulation... but I would hate to lose it by trying to eke out time when I really shouldn't be.

If it seems a low risk in those conditions, I'm game to keep it going. I appreciate folks correcting me when it's probably easier to just write it off and say "yeah just chop it" - constructive criticism definitely helping to make me a better grower. Seems like the true key is making sure the white hairs are pulled in before evaluating.

Without the fans she'll definitely drink slower. Fewer stomata = lower transpiration, that should also help keep your rh lower.
I wouldn't be too worried about budrot with 45% rh and good circulation, as long as you're not getting spikes.
Watch for sugar leaves that start to die close to the buds, progressing towards the tips. That can indicate budrot.

 

[Keffka]

If you have an oscillating fan, point it directly at the plant and let it rip. Make sure it oscillates though, as long as you alternate the airflow from the fans, you can aim directly at the plant. If you can exchange the air in between the colas at a decent rate, which a fan will do with ease, bud rot won’t be an issue. It usually strikes in areas with low to no airflow and creeps out from there.

Areas where lots of leaves are piled in close, and no or extremely limited air is penetrating are where it gets it’s foothold. This is much more common outdoors with large plants, rainy areas, or in grows where a lot of plants are growing pretty close (overlapping) to one another.

 

[BeanTownFan420]

You allow your soil to over dry regardless of what anyone else has told you never dry your cannabis soil past the point of ec flow and nutrient uptake water is required your dry cycles are to long and dry try to keep your soil moist never soaking but never dry below three inches of soil thats why your deficient under watering. Fabric bags dry plenty fast to water till wet daily.

 

[T0x1x]

If you have an oscillating fan, point it directly at the plant and let it rip. Make sure it oscillates though, as long as you alternate the airflow from the fans, you can aim directly at the plant. If you can exchange the air in between the colas at a decent rate, which a fan will do with ease, bud rot won’t be an issue. It usually strikes in areas with low to no airflow and creeps out from there.

Ah it was shortsighted of me not to get an oscillating fan. Might be my next purchase. I have a good little 'vortex' going on in the tent right now, so an additional one may not help a ton, but can't hurt.

Without the fans she'll definitely drink slower. Fewer stomata = lower transpiration, that should also help keep your rh lower.
I wouldn't be too worried about budrot with 45% rh and good circulation, as long as you're not getting spikes.
Watch for sugar leaves that start to die close to the buds, progressing towards the tips. That can indicate budrot.

Most of my sugar leaves are brown at the tips, but it doesn't look like anything is working it's way outward. I haven't found any signs of rot by examining them, so I think I'm OK right now. What do you mean by 'Spikes'? I haven't heard that one before. Not referring to the 'mini-fox-tails' that I have coming out of my buds?

 

[Melville Hobbes]

Spikes in humidity. I usually see them indoors after watering, or if there's a big shift in temps.

 

[T0x1x]

Spikes in humidity. I usually see them indoors after watering, or if there's a big shift in temps.

Ah that makes sense. Here I was scanning my plant for weird spikes coming out of it

Humidity has been steady. Only jumps to low 50's for a bit after watering and then settles back to mid-40's.

 

[T0x1x]

Weekly Check-in

Somehow this thing is still putting out white pistils. I'm amazed at the resiliency of the plant - it's pretty cool to see. I'd imagine all the fan leaves are gonna be gone in the next week. They drop off at the slightest touch and usually 5-6 are gone each day. I am starting to lose sugar leaves now as well. From what I can tell, none of them are browning from the inside out, but it is really tough to say in a couple of cases. I haven't peeled open any buds to check for rot or anything. At this point, if I have it, it's probably too late.

There are a COUPLE (and I mean a couple) amber trichromes I've spotted, so hopefully not far to go yet! If anyone sees anything that screams "cut me down now" let me know - otherwise I'll continue along my way!

 

[Keffka]

Weekly Check-in

Somehow this thing is still putting out white pistils. I'm amazed at the resiliency of the plant - it's pretty cool to see. I'd imagine all the fan leaves are gonna be gone in the next week. They drop off at the slightest touch and usually 5-6 are gone each day. I am starting to lose sugar leaves now as well. From what I can tell, none of them are browning from the inside out, but it is really tough to say in a couple of cases. I haven't peeled open any buds to check for rot or anything. At this point, if I have it, it's probably too late.

There are a COUPLE (and I mean a couple) amber trichromes I've spotted, so hopefully not far to go yet! If anyone sees anything that screams "cut me down now" let me know - otherwise I'll continue along my way!

Ooo boy she’s getting close.. I just looked back over this thread and you were thinking about harvesting at the end of June beginning of July. If you go and look at the images of when you thought you had a week or two left compared to now you will be able to see a massive difference. Hopefully this will really imprint it on you how vital it is to hold on as long as the plant wants before you chop. The coloring, the size, the pistils, etc. You can probably feel a large difference in the chunkiness of the buds too.

You would’ve had a very low yield with pretty poor quality if you would’ve chopped even two weeks ago compared to now. I’m excited for you, the plant looks like it’s gonna be some great smoke.