Fully enclosing hoophouse?

[Grandma Weedstein]

So I’ve got a hoophouse that I built this year to avoid rain on the flowers but they got bud rot anyway due to the moisture in the air.

I left the sides of the hoophouse open to improve air circulation but that obviously didn’t do shit to help.

Next year, should I totally cover all sides during shitty weather? Does it matter that I’d still have openings at the bottom? Getting it airtight would be next to impossible.

 

[NuttyProfessor]

such a shame on the bud rot , gorgeous plants too , some BIG fans maybe if you can get power to them . closing it up more will give more humidity i would think from all the leaves
then all the plants beside it will prob blow rain towards them if the winds blowing up between the hedges
if it was bigger i would think there would be better air flow and not between all the other stuff that's growing around there
its a tough one .

 

[TorturedSoul]

Next year, should I totally cover all sides during shitty weather?

I think not. Your plants are still going to transpire moisture and, outdoors, in a confined space, that equates to a relatively significant amount of moisture that'll enter the space and have no exit. Plus, if it rains more than the odd sprinkle, the ground is likely to have an elevated moisture content - and then to release some of that moisture into the air. Which, again, in an enclosed space will have nowhere to go.

Best option is a roofed but open space. The "tunnel" type makes sense, assuming it is aligned so that the worst of the rain (assuming it's not always falling straight down in still air) does not come in at an angle via the openings.

Maybe the fan you used to continuously move air through the space simply wasn't moving enough air?

 

[Grandma Weedstein]

I think not. Your plants are still going to transpire moisture and, outdoors, in a confined space, that equates to a relatively significant amount of moisture that'll enter the space and have no exit. Plus, if it rains more than the odd sprinkle, the ground is likely to have an elevated moisture content - and then to release some of that moisture into the air. Which, again, in an enclosed space will have nowhere to go.

Best option is a roofed but open space. The "tunnel" type makes sense, assuming it is aligned so that the worst of the rain (assuming it's not always falling straight down in still air) does not come in at an angle via the openings.

Maybe the fan you used to continuously move air through the space simply wasn't moving enough air?

I’ve got no way to get a fan or anything electric to that part of my yard. It’s too far from the house and my wife wouldn’t let me use multiple extension cables for something like that — she’d think it would be risky and I wouldn’t feel like arguing about it. She puts up with a lot as it is.

Do you think keeping my plants smaller will help? I sort of let these get away from my this year because I just love watching them grow. But if it can reduce bud rot, I am fine with starting them outdoors later or just really pruning them to a certain size.

 

[NuttyProfessor]

could help to keep them much lower

 

[TorturedSoul]

I’ve got no way to get a fan or anything electric to that part of my yard. It’s too far from the house and my wife wouldn’t let me use multiple extension cables for something like that — she’d think it would be risky and I wouldn’t feel like arguing about it. She puts up with a lot as it is.

Grandma has a... wife? Okie dokie.

Anyway, no, don't string a bunch of extension cords together to make one really long one. Even if the wire is of sufficient gauge and your electrical load is light, each connection point is a possible water entry point. And a lengthy extension cord might be kind of expensive, IDK. 250' roll of 14/2 (with ground if applicable) wire and a couple of ends would probably be cheaper. Or not, IDK, haven't bought wire in years.

I guess I just assumed you had a ventilation fan because just about every commercial greenhouse I've ever been in had one. I guess no access to electricity means no electric heat (aka money vacuum) or dehumidifier, either.

Do you think keeping my plants smaller will help? I sort of let these get away from my this year because I just love watching them grow. But if it can reduce bud rot, I am fine with starting them outdoors later or just really pruning them to a certain size.

Fawk, I don't know. This is one of those things that encouraged me to start growing indoors, lol. Indicas are denser, so wouldn't they be more succeptable to mold/rot? And sativas, well, sativas flower longer, meaning they'll be in the ground a lot longer, so wouldn't they be more succeptable to mold/rot? Growing outdoors like you do, I can see why you drink.

Oh, wait, smaller plants. Smaller = closer to the ground? Isn't that where the damp fog hangs out, lol?

Get a grow light .

 

[NuttyProfessor]

i wonder where all the clouds come from , hmmmmmm all the humidity falling has clouds on the ground and not in the air , humidity rises too as much as it can hover in the cool air , and keeping them lower helps you check the buds better , you might yield more also and have more control and less chance of tops breaking , there will also be more air circulating through the tunnel , the plants almost touching the top well that is where all the humidity is as it rises sticking and dripping on to your buds , have them lower the ton of EXTRA air will help reduce it ,

 

[013]

Hey Gma Weedstein,

I love your hoop house, very cool setup! As I look at the pic there’s not a lot of airspace between top of the canopy and the plastic which means trapped moisture. I think shorter plants would help but being outdoors is all about having ginormous plants... am I right? For next season - is there a way to increase the height of the hoop for more air space?

I recognize that you are using 16 foot hog panels and the arch is about 7 foot tall inside..... maybe put some treated lumber like 4 X 4 posts down to lift the frame off the ground a few more feet to allow for more air space. Another idea would be to get another hog panel and cut it down into smaller sections like 4 feet and use rebar tie wire to splice the hog panels and raise the roof to increase the height

It’s good that you don’t have end cap enclosures, that’s bound to help but at times it may hurt... IDK.
Maybe consider putting plastic sheathing down to stop moisture wicking up out of the ground and lollipopping bottom of plant plus adding sulfur dusting at regular intervals since its a preventative for mites, PM and bud rot too.

 

[NuttyProfessor]

I bet if you go in there rub your hand along the sides about 2/3 feet up its dry , then rub your hand along the roof , i bet its WET ! above the plant , use your RH metre see what the top is like compared to the bottom ,

 

[Konks Dirt Empire]

So I’ve got a hoophouse that I built this year to avoid rain on the flowers but they got bud rot anyway due to the moisture in the air.

I left the sides of the hoophouse open to improve air circulation but that obviously didn’t do shit to help.

Next year, should I totally cover all sides during shitty weather? Does it matter that I’d still have openings at the bottom? Getting it airtight would be next to impossible.

I went googling hoophouse after seeing your set up! That stinks to still have rot, damn.

jjjr, has a greenhouse set up. He too has encountered all that fall has to offer...

Scroggin In The Greenhouse Blueberry OG Kush, WW, Scooby Snacks #1

Hello folks. I got a late start this year due to some delays in the greenhouse construction and health issues but by memorial day I managed to have many wee ones popping up. I will be doing two scrog screens for this grow. It's been many years since I've grown at this level so this should be...

www.420magazine.com

I have more of a hillbilly hack, but lets say sort of like the tunnel idea mentioned above

20201013_.jpg

• Konks Dirt Empire
• Oct 13, 2020

Mostly out of the drizzle

I am on my first run, but more training/lst to keep them open and defoliation with an open side option might make some difference, but it seems everyone outdoors is still at the mercy of the elements. It looks so cool!

 

[Rexer]

Can you raise the hoop house a few feet? The top looks to be just below the growth surrounding it. If the hoop house is aligned to the most prevalent wind and is higher than the surrounding foiliage you may be able to catch some more wind inside, which in turn will lower RH inside (but you'll always be at mother nature's mercy for RH). After raising the hoop house, build or use something to raise the plants from the ground (raised beds etc). Inside around the beds use a mulch like straw to keep RH from ground sourcing inside the hoop house minimal.

Not sure if any of these ideas would help, but maybe it'll spark an idea, either way I hope you can figure a way out.

 

[732002]

What about opening up the sides some, maybe the lower 1/3 or so.

 

[Grandma Weedstein]

I went googling hoophouse after seeing your set up! That stinks to still have rot, damn.

jjjr, has a greenhouse set up. He too has encountered all that fall has to offer...

Scroggin In The Greenhouse Blueberry OG Kush, WW, Scooby Snacks #1

Hello folks. I got a late start this year due to some delays in the greenhouse construction and health issues but by memorial day I managed to have many wee ones popping up. I will be doing two scrog screens for this grow. It's been many years since I've grown at this level so this should be...

www.420magazine.com

I have more of a hillbilly hack, but lets say sort of like the tunnel idea mentioned above

20201013_.jpg

• Konks Dirt Empire
• Oct 13, 2020

Mostly out of the drizzle

I am on my first run, but more training/lst to keep them open and defoliation with an open side option might make some difference, but it seems everyone outdoors is still at the mercy of the elements. It looks so cool!

Are you having fewer issues with bud rot due to the cover? I was disappointed that keeping the rain off hasn’t solved more of the problem.

 

[Konks Dirt Empire]

Are you having fewer issues with bud rot due to the cover? I was disappointed that keeping the rain off hasn’t solved more of the problem.

Maybe or lucky, or the strain is somewhat resistant, or we went from hot humid to cold and sunny versus wet and humid?
These bag ladies get a parade twice a day and have mostly been kept out of the elements. I have nothing to compare it to, but if it is misty or raining they have been covered and they have been brought inside overnight for frost. I do know that I have them in a sweet spot with an aggressive breeze and I attempted to defoliate any overlap when others were talking bud rot.

 

[bobrown14]

Are you having fewer issues with bud rot due to the cover? I was disappointed that keeping the rain off hasn’t solved more of the problem.

Genetics are a big part of it. Bud shape .... bud rot aka Botrytis cinerea sets the spores on the plants early in life of the plant then sits there waiting for good conditions. Those conditions are created by the plants micro-climate at the flowers then the mold starts growing.

There are options. Treat for mold early on before flower with an organic fungicide.

I use 2 types and foliar on in VEG regularly as part of my IPM routine.

The 2 I use are:
Safers Garden fungicide concentrate (sulfur)
Green Cure

I get very mild pm and not much molds at all. Outside this year I didn't get either mold or pm but got a touch of mold on 1 plant indoors last round.

Its got a lot to do with plant shape (genetics). I've found those big fatty colas plants shaped like xmass trees - they are far more likely to get mold than plants with a large inter-nodal space.

Air flow is important. I might go as far as saying to un-cover your hoop house most of the time and late in the season cover at night when night time rh is high and or raining.

 

[SmokingWings]

Excellent thread, even for those who do not have a hoop house. I want one but not be able to have it in this lifetime.

I kicked the search engine on and did a bit of research on hoop houses & green houses and humidity controls. My search started off with:
hoophouse humidity
and the results included a good number of links to university agricultural schools.

One of the big pluses for hoop houses is that they are basic level greenhouses and many people build them with the understanding that they will not be running power to them.

Because of my tinkering with some plants spending the summer outside I have done more looking into things like Powdery Mildew and fungus in general. It seems that fungus and similar release spores when the temps are hot and there is a wind. The spores land and if there is enough moisture they will latch on to the leaf. Then when it rains, fogs or very high humidity the tiny spot of fungus or mildew grows and the gardener notices it.

Based on what I have been reading we can figure that the mold or fungus or mildew was already there and growing by the time the fall rains arrive. And, its growth slows down the cooler it is and speeds back up on warmer fall days.

 

[Grandma Weedstein]

Excellent thread, even for those who do not have a hoop house. I want one but not be able to have it in this lifetime.

I kicked the search engine on and did a bit of research on hoop houses & green houses and humidity controls. My search started off with:
hoophouse humidity
and the results included a good number of links to university agricultural schools.

One of the big pluses for hoop houses is that they are basic level greenhouses and many people build them with the understanding that they will not be running power to them.

Because of my tinkering with some plants spending the summer outside I have done more looking into things like Powdery Mildew and fungus in general. It seems that fungus and similar release spores when the temps are hot and there is a wind. The spores land and if there is enough moisture they will latch on to the leaf. Then when it rains, fogs or very high humidity the tiny spot of fungus or mildew grows and the gardener notices it.

Based on what I have been reading we can figure that the mold or fungus or mildew was already there and growing by the time the fall rains arrive. And, its growth slows down the cooler it is and speeds back up on warmer fall days.

Yeah I am sort of at a loss as to how to deal with the problem, but will probably be veering in a different direction with my breeding.

I really like those huge colas as thick as baseball bats but I’ve noticed a couple varieties (Chocolope and Chem Burn) that are more spread out don’t have the same problems with bud rot.

I will probably focus more on growing progeny from those cultivars (and a couple others mixed in) outdoor for flower, then do the thick-cola stuff in my tent.

 

[NuttyProfessor]

what you need is vents on the roof , , something you can open when its not raining and somewhere the rain cant get in ,
you can cut vents then have flaps you can close and open. have some on the sides that can stay open too , ,
buzz killington has the reputation of leaving pointless snide comments zzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz the most unfunny person in the world ,

something like this lol excuse the work of art but you should catch my drift

 

[Konks Dirt Empire]

what you need is vents on the roof , , something you can open when its not raining and somewhere the rain cant get in ,
you can cut vents then have flaps you can close and open. have some on the sides that can stay open too , ,
buzz killington has the reputation of leaving pointless snide comments zzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz the most unfunny person in the world ,

something like this lol excuse the work of art but you should catch my drift

Nutty for the win!
I love when I "see" what you mean, man!

 

[NuttyProfessor]

Nutty for the win!
I love when I "see" what you mean, man!

thanks ,KDE

i was also thinking next time dig a hole with a big pot too then drag her in and out as you please if it rains puts her in , when its over get her out asap there is a few ways around it that will help slightly