Gator's Cage

[Setting Sun]

Re: Gators' Cage

Your journals keep me grounded in reality. I *really* need that, thanks.

our flights of fancy are no doubt at different altitudes .

I'm not a designer. I look at different designs and then incorporate the parts I like best. Three people can make the same thing, but each individual design will have strengths and weaknesses. Sometimes sifting the chaff from the wheat passes for creativity .

that diversity is one of my favorite things about this place. We bring different things to the table, and there is this symbiotic thing that happens.

spin the crank, turn the wheel
run the road, enjoy the feel
replay facts, create the deal
eyes open, dreaming real

rhythm, and many deals created and sealed while astride those wheels.

beautiful poem, Mr. Gator! makes me wanna go for a spin .

I am already sorry that I'm not 'dug in' with prills in this meter cage.
The pump for the drip line lives in the feed tank, but for how long with the salt?

Cage went inside, guarding the bulb. Fan mount needs an upgrade.
A tiny 11 watt pump fed these eight evenly, but slowly: 10 quarts in three hours. I over-watered for a reason, but looks like this rig can run one hour per day to do good. Pump was $5 at Harbor Freight, and I have others. 3 liters of coco gives me a cushion in case the pump breaks or an emitter clogs. One missed day won't hurt, but will give me a chance to see the problem if/when one happens.

I don't know how those pumps do with that duty, but yeah, they're cheap enough to be disposable if they last at least one grow, or maybe 1/2 grow, lol.

That's a great safety-net with the 3 liters of coco. I think I'll be thanking you for a long time for encouraging me to use it.

I'm very curious about CRF's and coco. From what I've read, coco has some self-adjusting properties that may match up really well with CRF-type nutes.

 

[Propa Gator]

I'm not a designer. I look at different designs and then incorporate the parts I like best. Three people can make the same thing, but each individual design will have strengths and weaknesses. Sometimes sifting the chaff from the wheat passes for creativity .

Designers address goals with tools at hand, as art is created. Art cannot evoke emotion unless there is context for appreciation. A machine designer can borrow tools from other fields, or nature. We all design something, even if that is an evening spent at the tube, remote in one hand beverage in the other.

that diversity is one of my favorite things about this place. We bring different things to the table, and there is this symbiotic thing that happens.

Communication, education, round table participation. Human stuff happens here.

Here is a vertical master, I've seen his work before:

Hello 420mag and welcome to my latest tree grow, the plant is my own Chiesel = Sour Diesel x UK Cheese clone, grown from seed.

The system is recirculating hydroponics

I hope you like, if anyone has any questions, fire away!!

Too many photos to drag over, just click the link.

My four PX are ready for the night. Roots to the bottom, vigorous growth, 12".
Sunrise in 24hr for them.

Roots popping in the tent, two more days of veg.
Dripline is effective. Full installation soon, with the other punch-list items.

GWS on final approach. One week would be nice, I can stretch to two with the following act, but more than that would call for new starts to be cut yesterday, or now

That blaring bulb is only half as annoying in this photo as compared to directly into my squinty eye.

 

[Propa Gator]

I was near but not there, not exactly. TW researched material. I dissipated

 

[Setting Sun]

Designers address goals with tools at hand, as art is created. Art cannot evoke emotion unless there is context for appreciation. A machine designer can borrow tools from other fields, or nature. We all design something, even if that is an evening spent at the tube, remote in one hand beverage in the other.

Communication, education, round table participation. Human stuff happens here.

well, OK, but more human stuff seems to happen here than at any other cannabis forum I've hung out at .

Here is a vertical master, I've seen his work before:

Too many photos to drag over, just click the link.

Yep, I was hoping he would have stayed. I'm a fan too.

You know what those pics made me think of?

A circular light rail at the perimeter with two 250w bulbs 180 degrees apart revolving around one or two plants in the center.

Or maybe a single 400w going in circles.

Guess I'll start having concentric dreams now, lol.

My four PX are ready for the night. Roots to the bottom, vigorous growth, 12".
Sunrise in 24hr for them.

So Mr. Gator, PX is a strain I know nothing about, but may possibly be interested in keeping as a mom.

What can you tell me about it?

Roots popping in the tent, two more days of veg.
Dripline is effective. Full installation soon, with the other punch-list items.

Glad the plumbing works . Can't wait to see them flower.

That blaring bulb is only half as annoying in this photo as compared to directly into my squinty eye.

yes, the fly in the ointment. I think though, with some kind of semi-permanent opaque shield hanging down from right in front of the opening or zipper, I might be able to handle it.

I really do hate that kind of exposure, especially with CMH bulbs, but there's a way.

 

[Propa Gator]

Yep, I was hoping he(Heath) would have stayed. I'm a fan too.

I accept his gifts, as offered. I want to grow trees as he shows, and I'm negotiating for a location with a possible partner. He's from Missouri and needs to be 'shown'.

You know what those pics made me think of?

A circular light rail at the perimeter with two 250w bulbs 180 degrees apart revolving around one or two plants in the center.

Or maybe a single 400w going in circles.

Guess I'll start having concentric dreams now, lol.

M hmmm. So what's new, Mr Symmetrical?

Pineapple eXpress from G13 Labs is a medium yielder of super frosty, aromatic Sativa(IMO) dom buds. Easy to propagate and grow. All three of my boxes will be mono cropped with it. I have other seeds, but feel no need. PX is mighty fine weed. Last year I got one bean as a bonus freebie, such a deal!

Some roots lag, but all have reached visibility. Likely lights out tomorrow to be two days behind the 250w box with these eight with 400w. This is my first use of a 'big' CMH retro.

 

[Propa Gator]

Now that I've given the eight PX their first night, I hope that it's right.
Maybe I could get more from four, it's not a big tent.

I'm dreaming of an 8' square bloom room, with five bushy trees.
They are in the corners and center, with four big bulbs hanging nekkid in between.
A gale of ventilation/carbon scrub, and a reliable waterfall fertigation plan
4 k-watts would drive the nail for sure, but 600s work well in Heaths' world.

 

[The Lurker]

Heath comes and goes like a butterfly these days. The fact that he showed up barely an hour after your (first) post shows he had email notification on and was at home early afternoon in the UK, at least...

I give him about two weeks to mosey back around, then the chances of him responding drop rather precipitously after that. At least he's alive and kickin'. Gettin' ~1.8 g/w while wasting light...whew.

He's not a 'journal as you go' kinda guy...just comes and posts his results, and responds to the occasional question. I generally get the feeling that there're plenty of experiments going on behind the scenes, and he usually only posts the better ones...

...though his failed experiments (fewer these days, to be sure) are probably better than most folks can hope to achieve normally.

Now that I've given the eight PX their first night, I hope that it's right.
Maybe I could get more from four, it's not a big tent.
Too many plants might give you a rent--!

I'm dreaming of an 8' square bloom room, with five bushy trees.
They are in the corners and center, with four big bulbs hanging nekkid in between.
A gale of ventilation/carbon scrub, and a reliable waterfall fertigation plan
4 k-watts would drive the nail for sure, but 600s work well in Heaths' world.

Well at the risk of having more Fun With Fingerpainting:

Each of your Towering Sequoias now has 2 direct sources of illumination, and one plant is an Eco-Conscious Happy Camper, indeed. (Each light shines on three plants non-exclusively. A Hemisphere of Hemp!). A better lights-to-plants ratio than anything else yet. I like it, Propa.

2.4kW sounds better than 4kW to me, too; could run an electric car with the extra juice.
----

Deep within the gloom of night
Reflected from an Eldritch Light
Faeries sprinkle Pixie Dust
Descending on buds swollen with lust



BTW, I really like your PX shots, Gator. Need to try that strain when I get a proper space.

 

[Propa Gator]

Heath comes and goes like a butterfly these days. The fact that he showed up barely an hour after your (first) post shows he had email notification on and was at home early afternoon in the UK, at least...

I give him about two weeks to mosey back around, then the chances of him responding drop rather precipitously after that. At least he's alive and kickin'. Gettin' ~1.8 g/w while wasting light...whew.

He's not a 'journal as you go' kinda guy...just comes and posts his results, and responds to the occasional question. I generally get the feeling that there're plenty of experiments going on behind the scenes, and he usually only posts the better ones...

I think Heath may not suffer fools gladly, ie: he stated that by running two of the three 600s half time each, he used only 900w x 12. 1200 would be correct, and neither I nor anyone else caught it. I cannot presume that he didn't know! I reckon 56 oz from 1200w is more like 1.3g/w. Better'n a sharp stick in the eye, but a bit less special.
I like his style of laying out the grow, with a few answers to worthy questions.

Too many plants might give you a rent-

Nice! I was too lazy to Propa-fy that post, but I doubt I would have found that line. Let' see if I can tear it up!

4 light 5 mini sequoias makes more use of the lights. K watts are nearly twice the price when the air upgrades and cost of juice are figured. Worthy no doubt, but a lot more up-front. Four digi 600s with enough yo-yos to hang them can arrive at my door for under a grand. With small pumps(redundantcy) and drip emitters, Homer buckets and hydroton, a room can be up and running for reasonable $. 6 plants allowed?, you could keep a mom.

could run an electric car with the extra juice.

Electric bicycles run on 1600 watts, or fast RC cars

Three days on 12s, first hairs.

 

[HorseBadoritz]

PG, the more I study your grow, and others with a vertical cmh inclination, the more I think I want to try it.

I've got a 1k MH/HPS, but heck, for almost the price of a replacement bulb, I can put together a 400w cmh show, think I oughta buy it?

I'm thinkin' coco hempy, my head height's for dwarfs.
I'm thinking something espalier, perhaps...
I think I also better learn to measure nutes in litres, not in quarts.

So nuts and bolts... 43"x43"x 68" floor to ceiling. The 68" is fixed... ok more or less... the width is way flexible.

I've seen some plants that Hempy grew that were 9' wide from 600w + 400W in horizontal hoods aimed down... and the buds were admirable, but vertical and sharing all around... the possibilities? May sound greedy, but that's what I'm after.

I'm thinking 4 plants... 2 Jack Herers, 2 Jamaicans, both have some length... I know you're an inventive gator...

 

[Propa Gator]

PG, the more I study your grow, and others with a vertical cmh inclination, the more I think I want to try it.

I've got a 1k MH/HPS, but heck, for almost the price of a replacement bulb, I can put together a 400w cmh show, think I oughta buy it?

Needless to ask, of course I would love to see you grow using elements that I use.
Copy my cage and I will preen, but...
I have not yet demonstrated the superiority of either vertical, or CMH.
We could deal with issues together and learn

vertical and sharing all around... the possibilities? May sound greedy, but that's what I'm after.

I'm thinking 4 plants... 2 Jack Herers, 2 Jamaicans, both have some length...

It's not greed to seek best results from the input that you can manage, but...
If it is greed, I too am guilty indeed

Four biggie bushes in a box that size? Yeah baby
Mixing the medicine everyday/week is not too bad, but TRFs are looking good!

BTW, Mrs Horses' clever guerilla garden magic to produce a green weekend?
Priceless

 

[HorseBadoritz]

Needless to ask, of course I would love to see you grow using elements that I use.
Copy my cage and I will preen, but...
I have not yet demonstrated the superiority of either vertical, or CMH.
We could deal with issues together and learn

Well, I'm seeing a lot more efficiency in your set up than mine. Light usage, heat management, and ventilation. I like what I've seen about CMH, and the 400w scale of economy is quite appealing. I think I'm jumping in the cage

It's not greed to seek best results from the input that you can manage, but...
If it is greed, I too am guilty indeed

Four biggie bushes in a box that size? Yeah baby

Judging from my latest grow, I seem to have a knack for taming giants... now if I can only get them to be wide loads!


Mixing the medicine everyday/week is not too bad, but TRFs are looking good!

I've seen some encouraging things with TRFs and coco

BTW, Mrs Horses' clever guerilla garden magic to produce a green weekend?
Priceless

That's Mrs Horse alright... priceless Now, if I could just keep her from hovering around the scrog with those Fiskars

 

[Tyrone Hamilton]

I finally have fired up the 400 watt CMH bulb, and WOW does that thing put out some light! I could feel radiation from it like I never noticed from the 600 HPS.

I'm going vertical bare bulb in honor of you, Mr. Gator!

Four plants, 3x4 closet - now I just need to make a cage around the light to keep them from frying. Any suggestions on how big to make it?

 

[Propa Gator]

Now, if I could just keep her from hovering around the scrog with those Fiskars

Many would blink their eyes and shake their heads at the amount of vegetation I pruned from my nearly done run of GWS when it was two weeks into flowering! This is the batch that's been fed via water to waste: H&G Cocos @ 5 mls each A&B, and 2mls Pro-TeKt silicon per gallon of tap water, nothing else. A solid wall of bud surrounds the 250 CMH. No luxury consumption here, no Sir!

I finally have fired up the 400 watt CMH bulb, and WOW does that thing put out some light! I could feel radiation from it like I never noticed from the 600 HPS.

Please, PLEASE, my friends: guard your eyes! Dark safeties and a visor, minimum.
Blinded men are less efficient as caretakers, watching out for loved ones.
Bare HIDs are serious.

Depending on what pot, or vessel you are using, you may get by with sticks taped to the back of them and tying branches back as needed. This is my plan in the 30" boxes with 250w and four corner plants. In my 39" tent w/ 400w CMH, the guard screen is 20" diameter. 11" out from the bulb is center of the sweet zone, IMO. The screens' presence complicates access to the back plants, ergo my diy turntable.

 

[HorseBadoritz]

High PG, On that turntable, how do you keep the girls out of the screen?

And, other than a good point guard, what's your plan for the 4 corners access That seems like it's gonna be a mighty tight squeeeeeeeze?

 

[Tyrone Hamilton]

Thanks Gator - I'll tie them up as needed...

... and it looks like I'm hitting the welding section for some eye protection. I ran the 600 HPS bare bulb... but this 400 CMH is so much more intense. Maybe a smaller radiator?

 

[Propa Gator]

On that turntable, how do you keep the girls out of the screen?

While they have not yet reached the screen, they will. The screen turns with the table and pots & all. I unplug the circulation fan and the dripline connection, and make sure the light cord and suspension string are clear, then carefully work it around. Not everyday

 

[Propa Gator]

I'm hitting the welding section for some eye protection

I think the hard white light is just more energetic than yellow HPS'.
Harbor Freight store near me sells $2 wrap-around, very dark safeties.
Their mail-order may have, but you'ld have to order them with other stuff or the shipping negates the price attractiveness.

 

[HorseBadoritz]

I think the hard white light is just more energetic than yellow HPS'.
Harbor Freight store near me sells $2 wrap-around, very dark safeties.
Their mail-order may have, but you'ld have to order them with other stuff or the shipping negates the price attractiveness.

PG, Have you noticed any skin burning? I am a delicate flower according to my dermatologist

 

[Propa Gator]

Have you noticed any skin burning?

No, and I have reached across and near the lit bulbs. SS wears long sleeves when gardening with his CMH, I think he said. If there's UV messing with me, I don't notice injury but do feel a tingly warning and don't linger.
I don't watch my gardens grow, but I don't turn the the light off to work in them either.
I raise the light on its' suspension yoyo string when I do something in there... usually.

 

[Setting Sun]

I accept his gifts, as offered. I want to grow trees as he shows, and I'm negotiating for a location with a possible partner. He's from Missouri and needs to be 'shown'.

Hope things work out and you have a good place to do things vertical.

M hmmm. So what's new, Mr Symmetrical?

Been toying with the idea of growing two larger plants in 4-gallon coco buckets instead of 3-4 smaller plants in the 10-liter buckets in each tent. If that gave me a 10-12 day watering cycle, I could do the entire grow from start to finish watering 5-6 times, lol.

Pineapple eXpress from G13 Labs is a medium yielder of super frosty, aromatic Sativa(IMO) dom buds. Easy to propagate and grow. All three of my boxes will be mono cropped with it. I have other seeds, but feel no need. PX is mighty fine weed. Last year I got one bean as a bonus freebie, such a deal!

thanks for the info PG, it seems like a great candidate for an indoor sativa. I can't wait to grow out and smoke some of my PPP.

Some roots lag, but all have reached visibility. Likely lights out tomorrow to be two days behind the 250w box with these eight with 400w. This is my first use of a 'big' CMH retro.

It's nice that the 400 doesn't cost more than the 250, unlike most other HID bulbs, especially the "horticultural" variety.

thanks again, Mr. Gator