- Thread starter
- #601
Right on. Thanks for all the help man
Turbo Bucket's Take On RADDWC: Grow Room Build-Up
I have one more question.
Are those resistors or connectors on the edges.....I didn't know there were two until I looked at the last picture again.
Are those resistors or connectors on the edges.....I didn't know there were two until I looked at the last picture again.
- Thread starter
- #603
Those are connectors each board has two sets
Also, make sure the mounting screws didn't rub through the solder mask. It's doubtful, but the mounting screws could make a problem too. I didn't even think about it till now.
Any metallic contact could make a problem, even your frame.
Any metallic contact could make a problem, even your frame.
That is just over complicated.
I don't care for the design, for more than one reason.
Can't say that I helped, but I did confirm you have a problem with one of the boards. What that problem is, I have no idea.
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- #607
Ill pop the frame down tomorrow and pull the board out and check for any damage around the mounts
Ohm the frame and screws to both pos and neg before you pop it out. That will tell a story. Takes a few more seconds, but may save a lot of work.
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- #609
Helped me confirm I'm not totally crazy. At this point I'm not either, at all. Thankfully they werent super pricy and I still have another driver I can use for different boards
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- #610
I checked that the first day and didn't get anything
PapaSmurfAU
Active Member
Hello.
I have built many pc,'s and I get the contact thing with metal because its like mounting a motherboard into a case. . Interesting thread guys.
I have built many pc,'s and I get the contact thing with metal because its like mounting a motherboard into a case. . Interesting thread guys.
@TurboBucket , If you checked that since you have had the problem, then you are probably good.
Sorry, The frame should have been the first thing we checked. I was a little distracted. I was hurting from a kidney stone and was trying to focus. Plus I was cooking dinner, which didn't turn out well...... Not your fault, the steaks were not great. They had been frozen, and I hate frozen steaks.
I hope you can find the answer. I would love to know if you ever do.
Sorry, The frame should have been the first thing we checked. I was a little distracted. I was hurting from a kidney stone and was trying to focus. Plus I was cooking dinner, which didn't turn out well...... Not your fault, the steaks were not great. They had been frozen, and I hate frozen steaks.
I hope you can find the answer. I would love to know if you ever do.
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- #613
The frame was a hack job I put together at nap time so I didnt use any isolators. Which is also why it only holds 5 boards. I Just needed a way to get everything hung to start measuring operating temps on everything, which it succeeded in doing.(I'll need minimal make-up air to cool the room) I originally wanted to run some more of these boards in there but I'm going to reserve judgement for a couple weeks until the plants tell me how they feel. I like the diode pattern on them and the 36v Fv is nice. Being able to run them 6-12" from the top of the plant is also nice compared to 18" for the new growmau5/chilLED PCB pucks. (Mfg suggested heights) phobos end up being cheaper no hsinks. Also at 45vfv with the chilLED I would only be able to run 5. And I really want one directly over all 6 plant sites.
Again @Bonsaiweed thanks for giving me a sounding board last night to verify everything.
Again @Bonsaiweed thanks for giving me a sounding board last night to verify everything.
No problem. I'm just sorry it took 50 posts to do it. People will hopefully skip all that.
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- #615
Haha pretty low traffic here, most will appreciate getting to see the troubleshooting process albeit in a slightly convoluted presentation.
It is terribly hard to troubleshoot through a forum. It's hard over the phone but tediously slow this way.
I hate the design of those boards and any similar to them. I'm going to send you privately a website, that if you understand electronics, will explain why I hate those.
They are breaking some basic rules, that create problems. It has to do with array resistance and why you must have resistors onboard to control each series path. Those have no resistors at all as I see. A huge flaw in the design.
I was going to suggest that last night, but I wanted to make sure I had evidence available to back up what I was speaking about.
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- #617
I hear ya. It relies soley on thermal dissipation to regulate current. But aren't pretty much all of these new boards using some sort of mixed wiring to keep Fv down? I have not looked in depth at diode arrangement on the quantum boards. I thought I wanted to avoid doing a strip build to keep things simple. Maybe I need to just bite the bullet?
The problem....you can't use the LEDs themselves to regulate. It just doesn't work well. if you get the right combination there is one single path through a line of LEDs that cause a higher amperage draw than what is designed.
Those boards are 10 led arrays in series with the other 23 sets. Because each LED has a different Fv you may have a chain through those arrays which provide a path with a lower Fv than the rest. You need a 0.5 ohm or some precision resistor at the end of a chain to prevent that from happening. There is NO way to do it in the design that is on that board. It would totally need to be redesigned. That is a chain of arrays, not chains of LEDs.
I'm sure the design was copied from someone else, but the first iteration was wrong (original copied design).
Just my gripe. They may work, but I bet what you have happening, is going to happen a lot with these boards. One board will draw more current than another. That makes the power supply work harder because of that board.
I think that is the root problem of your system. There is no way to accurately "ohm" those boards. They are LEDs, not resistors. They change with power and heat.
This is all my opinion, and I have no way to prove it, other than the reference website I sent you in a private conversation.
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- #619
Those were things I noticed when I started looking at boards. Perhaps my basic understanding was a little too simplistic. I assumed keeping the boards wired in series would eliminate the possibilities of thermal runaway, and while it does on a board level, each array in the parallel configuration on the board itself is still succeptible is that more accurate? If everything were completely in series there should be no way for any portion to receive higher current than any other portion?
Well, it depends on the architecture. A lot of people think if they create a series of arrays the chances go down to have a path that can create a problem, and I agree. But it can still exist.
For example, if you see the example on the left (I didn't connect the two paths but should be connected in arrays of parallel) That is an easy way to be safe with the design. With them in series, if there is one or two low Fv LEDs, the rest will not let a thermal runaway situation.
The example on the right is the way that board is designed, (I believe, by how the copper layer looks in the picture) . This is very bad because if each array has one lower Fv LED, you have now created a path of thermal run away. If D18 and D22 are low, there is a simple path to create a problem. All the current has to do is connect the dots.
I'm basing this on the way the copper layer looks in the picture. If it is truly electrically connected like the example on the right. I would send them back. But I'm extremely anal.
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