480W & 720W LED Grow - Land of Clovers

[Grower Z]

Re: Irish Boy's {480w Grow Led Hydro } Land Of Clovers

Your plan for small plants in relatively larger containers sounds good to me.

I tend to do a few gradual transplants and will mix the CRF/TRF in evenly...

 

[IrishBoy]

Re: Irish Boy's {480w Grow Led Hydro } Land Of Clovers

Your plan for small plants in relatively larger containers sounds good to me.

I tend to do a few gradual transplants and will mix the CRF/TRF in evenly...

i always start my plants off in big pots so i dont have to trans plant, i think trans planting puts more stress on me then my plants

ya i am trying to keep them below 30" but i also tried that on my last grow and it defiantly did work out that way.lol. so ill keep a close eye on some Bush Master to keep them girls in check if they want to stretch too high since i am in a tent and less head room then normal.

ya i would have to agree even sounds like a good idea to me, i think they should be just deep enough in hot temps to keep them cooler, but as you can see on my last grow top dressing worked great for me. but having them right above where you put ur clone or seed sounds like the better option when i think about it. some seem to get a N def or something with the TRF and add more to the top or a different brand and it fixes things but i am wondering if the Def was because having the Ferts all scattered around the medium cause the problem? kinda makes sense to me right? so when they top dress with more food it fixes it but maybe that wouldn't be needed if its top dressed. example i went a long long time with the DM purple without any yellowing from a N def when i toped dressed them, but SS had one real quick on his grow when he mixed his DM purple into the medium and fixed things with top dressing some OC+. now it could have been because he flushed his coco with allot of water and that drained allot of N? but it seems it might take allot of water over a long period of time to flush all that N out, because i was feed every 2 days and didnt have that trouble. so maybe just maybe this was caused from scattering the nutes all around the medium instead of just having them in one layer?

love to here others intake on this? what makes sense to me often doesnt to others.

 

[Setting Sun]

Re: Irish Boy's {480w Grow Led Hydro } Land Of Clovers

I think in perlite hempy buckets, it's better to have the prills in one layer an inch or two above the hole, but in soil, it's better to have it mixed in evenly.

 

[IrishBoy]

Re: Irish Boy's {480w Grow Led Hydro } Land Of Clovers

I think in perlite hempy buckets, it's better to have the prills in one layer an inch or two above the hole, but in soil, it's better to have it mixed in evenly.

if you dont mind me asking, why might it make it better mixed in? do you think it makes on seedlings and fresh clones not get enough food until they get a big enough root system to hit the lower parts of the medium? i was just thinking how my fresh clones might not get all the TRF because i am sure allot of them are mixed into the bottom area of the medium, so i was thinking they might start missing out on the TRF. like i just cut my TRF strength down since the roots arnt big enough to hit all the area. just curios to why you think its better to mix them in?

I notice on the DM bottle's it says to shake the DM into the hole near the roots... and the OC+ bottle says for best results mix into the top 1-3" of soil
I would think they have tested this and know whats best for their products? not sure why they dont recommend to mix threw-out the medium instead if that was the best way? this is what really throws me off. i am in no way saying ur way is wrong just wondering what gave you that idea? I know you study things real good so i am sure you have a reason for it that i am missing/not thinking of

as always thinks for the info

 

[hogs]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Hey Irish,
Sorry to hear about your buds...Hope ya can get as much as possible from them.....And this new grow gives ya no problems at all...Wishful thinking I know when it comes to that..But all the best to ya...

Thanks for the info ya gave on my problems.... I just feed my up and coming trees as I like to call em again last night and again just ph 5.9 water

However I still seem to have a problem with them all. I hope you or others that join here could give me some insight on what it may be, and you may be right what you said,but even my others that are in Veg state are similar problems. ( high ppm )

Once again if I am stepping on your thread/post here lmk, Its just you have alot of Experience growers here and yourself, and I thought may help others as well as myself...

I`m growing in them totes 18 Gallons, ( 2 Gals in each ) one inside of the other the bottom one has a 5/8 spout in one end for drainage, the other that fits down inside has like 30 or 40 3/8 holes drilled in the bottom to drain into the outer for for excess water to drain out and for flushing later on....

I put about 2 inches of them Clay hydrotom balls starting then on top of that I mix 60/40 Coir and Perlite... I`m using all Consieur AN ferts. plus all their additives etc.... ( on the lite side )

On the 15 this month I fliped them to 12/12 lights...and gave them a feeding... the 17 20 and 22nd just ph 5.9 water till I got run off...

Now for my Question... When I check the run of water it comes out around 6.3 6.4 ph and the ppms are like 1750 between 1800 Freaks me out... I should say my water going in is ppm around 300 from a well I know thats high as well...

The thing about all this My trees Look healthy except maybe a little Yellowing on the edges of the Lower leaves but not much to speak of..Besides that the Ladies look Great.. but now I worry to give them more nutes instead of just ph 5.9 water First week past into their flowering , and I`m sure they should have more than just WATER ????

Thanks for all that could shed some light on this for me and perhaps for others that may or have run into something similar.....

Like I said they look GReat but why is the ppm so high coming out and the water is 6.4 as well coming out werid...( right now they are about 3 feet in height , White russia, Jamica, Legen, and Health Canada....)

Sorry about the spelling.

 

[Grower Z]

Re: Irish Boy's {480w Grow Led Hydro } Land Of Clovers

On the other hand from my first reply, when all else fails, follow the instructions on the label...

 

[Wingman420]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Subscribed and looking forward to your magnificence!

 

[IrishBoy]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Hey Irish,
Sorry to hear about your buds...Hope ya can get as much as possible from them.....And this new grow gives ya no problems at all...Wishful thinking I know when it comes to that..But all the best to ya...

Thanks for the info ya gave on my problems.... I just feed my up and coming trees as I like to call em again last night and again just ph 5.9 water

However I still seem to have a problem with them all. I hope you or others that join here could give me some insight on what it may be, and you may be right what you said,but even my others that are in Veg state are similar problems. ( high ppm )

Once again if I am stepping on your thread/post here lmk, Its just you have alot of Experience growers here and yourself, and I thought may help others as well as myself...

I`m growing in them totes 18 Gallons, ( 2 Gals in each ) one inside of the other the bottom one has a 5/8 spout in one end for drainage, the other that fits down inside has like 30 or 40 3/8 holes drilled in the bottom to drain into the outer for for excess water to drain out and for flushing later on....

I put about 2 inches of them Clay hydrotom balls starting then on top of that I mix 60/40 Coir and Perlite... I`m using all Consieur AN ferts. plus all their additives etc.... ( on the lite side )

On the 15 this month I fliped them to 12/12 lights...and gave them a feeding... the 17 20 and 22nd just ph 5.9 water till I got run off...

Now for my Question... When I check the run of water it comes out around 6.3 6.4 ph and the ppms are like 1750 between 1800 Freaks me out... I should say my water going in is ppm around 300 from a well I know thats high as well...

The thing about all this My trees Look healthy except maybe a little Yellowing on the edges of the Lower leaves but not much to speak of..Besides that the Ladies look Great.. but now I worry to give them more nutes instead of just ph 5.9 water First week past into their flowering , and I`m sure they should have more than just WATER ????

Thanks for all that could shed some light on this for me and perhaps for others that may or have run into something similar.....

Like I said they look GReat but why is the ppm so high coming out and the water is 6.4 as well coming out werid...( right now they are about 3 feet in height , White russia, Jamica, Legen, and Health Canada....)

Sorry about the spelling.

I am sorry bro i dont know really? the only thing that comes to my mind is not flushing. not only talking about between feedings but not flush ur coco before using it and you have salt build up, even the freshes clones would have that problem. so the question is did you flush the slts from ur coco? what kind of coco you using? besides that i really dont know what to say? maybe some peat moss will help to lower the mediums PH? if these things are not the reason just kick back until someone comes along and answers it, i would also start a thread asking around, i am sure their are some who do like me here and dont click on my threads. so you might get more help that way. also Google can be ur best friend. i am sure ur not the only one who has had this problem? have you searched the web for answers? the only thing i can think of is slats build up from the coco maybe? i dont really check my run off unless something is wrong, so dont know too much about that. Ive never checked my PPM once in my life i dont even own a tester i am too cheap.lol. put i seem to do ok without one.

On the other hand from my first reply, when all else fails, follow the instructions on the label...

Subscribed and looking forward to your magnificence!

as always my friend its a pleasure to have you one here. welcome buddy, pull up a chair and kick back

 

[Marley15]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Your CRF/TRF question is one I am very interested in. For my grow, I mixed in my Dynamite all over the media and right next to the root ball. I had lots of deficiencies in my clones. I ended up mixing in FF Grow Big for a couple of feedings which helped. I also top dressed a few more tblsp of Dynamite right next to the stem..finally I top dressed all over a couple more tblsp of OC+.

This was all done over a 3 week period. They are all green and deficiency free atm at 1 week 12/12. (4 weeks total so far)

Media = %100 perlite.



Marley

 

[IrishBoy]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Your CRF/TRF question is one I am very interested in. For my grow, I mixed in my Dynamite all over the media and right next to the root ball. I had lots of deficiencies in my clones. I ended up mixing in FF Grow Big for a couple of feedings which helped. I also top dressed a few more tblsp of Dynamite right next to the stem..finally I top dressed all over a couple more tblsp of OC+.

This was all done over a 3 week period. They are all green and deficiency free atm at 1 week 12/12. (4 weeks total so far)

Media = %100 perlite.



Marley

well i can say that i think its not a good idea to mix TRF all threw out 100% perlite, better to mix it in a layer a few inches down, top dressing might not be the best idea either since perlite drys out fast. at least a good few inches down into the medium. i think right above the roots is a good place IMO.

As of right now i am not sold of mixing the TRF all threw out a soil medium either. i cant see any benefits by doing so, i am not saying their isnt but i just cant think of any? seems having them buy ur roots in a layer is the best option in my mind or a little above the roots, that way our seedling and clones have food right away and dont have to gig around to find them, then latter on when ur in bloom and the roots are a good size, when u water the nutes will still drain down and cover ur lower medium. IDK just is what just makes sense in my mind, but it dosent mean its the right way.

on this grow i have everything mixed threw out the medium, but if i could go back into time i wouldnt have done it and on my next grow i wont do it that way yet try the way i am seeing and see what happens. theirs only one way to find out and thats trying it. but it just makes logic sense to me to do it that way. i could be alone on thinking that way.lol. i tend to over think things sometimes.

All i want to know is why others think its best to mix threw the whole medium? what benefit does it have? what give the idea its better to do it that way?

allot of grows i am seen where its mixed threw the medium seen to have a def one way or another, i am sure i have missed a few that didnt maybe? but i know once they toped dressed with OC+ it fixed everything, but is it that the OC+ is better? or is it that the DM was mixed threw the medium and it caused this so if it were toped dressed with DM also would it also fix things? its hard to say because everyone i have seen do this throws OC+ on top so its hard to say if the DM would have fixed things also?

 

[hogs]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Hey Irish,
Thanks for the input...
My coco is Canna bags I think that was the right spelling...I never flushed before using as A buddy of mine never does and never had a problem ,and My gals r getting close to 3 feet tall.. well Guess I`ll go with the flow ..Like I said they look Great and all..just wonder Y high ppms and ph coming out...Just got these meters in the last week..maybe I wd. be better of without them LoL...

Thanks and If anyone else has anything to add..wd. be appreciated..>!

 

[IrishBoy]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Heres a new addition to my line up. i like the GF bllom so much i bought their root one. i haven't used it yet but will in a few days when i water. ive heard really good things about it. i like that its organic and made in Holland

Heres some pics of the girls at 3 days veg.

 

[Two Tokes]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Thanks for the pics, Irish.

Also thanks for all the great additional conversations that take place on your threads. I pickup all kinds of great ideas.

 

[dogsnova]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

i like that its organic and made in Holland

Yes, Holland MI... Good ol USA made stuff.. It's made locally to me... They actually stopped making it in the bottles you have shown in the pic.. I just tried to buy some.. They are only selling it in the small concentrated bottles... $50 a bottle for the flower stimulator...

 

[IrishBoy]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Thanks for the pics, Irish.

Also thanks for all the great additional conversations that take place on your threads. I pickup all kinds of great ideas.

thanks for being a part of my grows.

Yes, Holland MI... Good ol USA made stuff.. It's made locally to me... They actually stopped making it in the bottles you have shown in the pic.. I just tried to buy some.. They are only selling it in the small concentrated bottles... $50 a bottle for the flower stimulator...

ive seen those but my hydro store carry only these ones. they make the same amount of gallons i believe? just the metal one is very concentrated. have you used or seen the roots being used? its very hard to find info on the web with the roots one. dudes at the sores told me it treated them good, but who knows, all i know is their bloom stuff works! just want to find as much info as i can on this stuff.

 

[dogsnova]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

I too have only used the flowering stuff... I've heard (the root stuff) works good..

 

[Doc Bud]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Irish asked me to chime in on the TRF/CRF discussion:

These things can be used almost any way you want to use them. Unlike liquid nutes, in which less is often more, with CRF's more is often safer than less. The cautious folks, who made the transition from water soluble nutes to CRF's used less than the recommended dose out of habit, and as far as I know each of them ended up adding more.

It's nearly impossible to burn your plants, even with double, triple the dosage. So, first of all, when using the CRF's, go ahead and add more. No harm will come, and you'll likely avoid some sort of deficiency.

These are made to be used in soil. Mixing in with the medium is certainly fine. That's how I do it. Top dressing is also OK, especially if you end up needing to add more.

However, my first choice is to mix evenly throughout the medium, and that is exactly what I am doing on my current grow, my previous grow, and my next grow, which is about to start.

It's important to water evenly and make sure the soil is completely saturated each time you water. Good soil structure is very important! You can leech out nutes if you flush each and every time you water, but that can be overcome by adding more CRF. That's what I did on my current grow, I watered "monsoon" style during veg....I let them dry out, then on the day I was going to water, I bumped up the RH to about 80 for a few hours...then drenched the pots thoroughly. The CRF's loved this...but I'm convinced I overwatered the organic soil plants, which I ended up top dressing with OC+.

As long as water is moving over and around the prills, nutes are going to be released. Thats all there is to it.

Top dressing should work just fine...just make sure that lots of water washes over them. That water will drag nutrients down into the root zone....but they may have a hard time reaching the bottom of the pot. This can be solved by adding more and watering more....or you can mix them throughout the medium.

It's really just a matter of choice.

I mix mine evenly, watch the plants carefullly and adjust accordingly.

The other thing to keep in mind is that with OC+ especially, temperatures are going to effect the release rate. If it's really hot, you're going to dump lots of nutes. Use less in hot weather! If it's really cool....the nutes are going to lessen.

This is a really good feature in some ways....when it's hot, plants grow faster and use more nutes. The opposite is true when it's cold. However, during late flower, if heat is high, you may be giving more nutes than you'd like.

I guess what I'm saying is that how you add these products isn't that big of a deal. Understanding how they work and having the ability to control the garden environment is far more important.

Having said all that, mixing the prill in the medium will give them a more stable temperature than top dressing will. They will also be in a moister state if mixed in.

But top dressing will work fine too......just add more.

You can add 3-19 times more nutes than is recommended and the plants will still be fine.....it's just a waste of money. You could end up spending like 2 bucks per plant on nutes if you're wasteful.

So...all you AN/House n Garden, expensive nute folks....get some TRF/CRF's and take the thousands of dollars you save and buy good environmental controls and then take your grow to the next level.

Doc

 

[dogsnova]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

I wish these TRF/CRF could be used in a DWC setup...

 

[molotov]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

Heres a new addition to my line up. i like the GF bllom so much i bought their root one. i haven't used it yet but will in a few days when i water. ive heard really good things about it. i like that its organic and made in Holland

Heres some pics of the girls at 3 days veg.

I just got the same product last week Irish. I've watered my clones with it twice so far but to early to tell. I've also heard great things about it.

 

[IrishBoy]

re: Irish Boy's - 480W & 720w Grow LED Hydro - Land Of Clovers

I too have only used the flowering stuff... I've heard (the root stuff) works good..

thanks

Irish asked me to chime in on the TRF/CRF discussion:

These things can be used almost any way you want to use them. Unlike liquid nutes, in which less is often more, with CRF's more is often safer than less. The cautious folks, who made the transition from water soluble nutes to CRF's used less than the recommended dose out of habit, and as far as I know each of them ended up adding more.

It's nearly impossible to burn your plants, even with double, triple the dosage. So, first of all, when using the CRF's, go ahead and add more. No harm will come, and you'll likely avoid some sort of deficiency.

These are made to be used in soil. Mixing in with the medium is certainly fine. That's how I do it. Top dressing is also OK, especially if you end up needing to add more.

However, my first choice is to mix evenly throughout the medium, and that is exactly what I am doing on my current grow, my previous grow, and my next grow, which is about to start.

It's important to water evenly and make sure the soil is completely saturated each time you water. Good soil structure is very important! You can leech out nutes if you flush each and every time you water, but that can be overcome by adding more CRF. That's what I did on my current grow, I watered "monsoon" style during veg....I let them dry out, then on the day I was going to water, I bumped up the RH to about 80 for a few hours...then drenched the pots thoroughly. The CRF's loved this...but I'm convinced I overwatered the organic soil plants, which I ended up top dressing with OC+.

As long as water is moving over and around the prills, nutes are going to be released. Thats all there is to it.

Top dressing should work just fine...just make sure that lots of water washes over them. That water will drag nutrients down into the root zone....but they may have a hard time reaching the bottom of the pot. This can be solved by adding more and watering more....or you can mix them throughout the medium.

It's really just a matter of choice.

I mix mine evenly, watch the plants carefullly and adjust accordingly.

The other thing to keep in mind is that with OC+ especially, temperatures are going to effect the release rate. If it's really hot, you're going to dump lots of nutes. Use less in hot weather! If it's really cool....the nutes are going to lessen.

This is a really good feature in some ways....when it's hot, plants grow faster and use more nutes. The opposite is true when it's cold. However, during late flower, if heat is high, you may be giving more nutes than you'd like.

I guess what I'm saying is that how you add these products isn't that big of a deal. Understanding how they work and having the ability to control the garden environment is far more important.

Having said all that, mixing the prill in the medium will give them a more stable temperature than top dressing will. They will also be in a moister state if mixed in.

But top dressing will work fine too......just add more.

You can add 3-19 times more nutes than is recommended and the plants will still be fine.....it's just a waste of money. You could end up spending like 2 bucks per plant on nutes if you're wasteful.

So...all you AN/House n Garden, expensive nute folks....get some TRF/CRF's and take the thousands of dollars you save and buy good environmental controls and then take your grow to the next level.

Doc

very nice post. thanks!
makes sense about things being cooler mixing them even. but what about just adding it into the transplant hole like the bottle say? that should still be deep enough to keep things cool and moist and the roots would have food right their for them when they come out.

I understand about top dressing and how things might not be as good as the soil drys out faster up top. but the hole should stay cool where we put our clones and seedlings. right?

i am starting to get the idea to do a few plants with OC 14-14-14 mixed with OC+, then a few more with DM purple mixed with DM Red. that would be a good one to watch!!

now mixing threw the whole medium and then throwing a few TRF into the trans plant hole might be a great idea i think. food will be right their for the young plants then when their roots grow they will have cool food all around them. now i am thinking this is the key!!! best of both worlds.

IMO all of these TRF need the aid of each other to grow the best of the best. maybe OC mixed with OC+ DM mixed with DM red, OC+ mixed with DM red. witch i think the key is DM red mixed with OC+ get the best of both worlds and have different things going on in different temps, they can help each other out in hot temps and cold temps maybe.

you right Doc i would hate to waist these TRF nutes, i mean shit i paid a whole penny for a bottle of DM red, i would hate to waist a penny!!! i rather spend $25.00 on watered down nutes.lol witch i have to buy 2-3 of them for the profile to be complete. i paid 5 cents for 5 dom bottle that will last me forever!!

i am wondering if i should throw in more DM red on top of my soil. looks like when i got my girls they were lacking some N what u guys think from the pics? little yellowing on the new growth?

I wish these TRF/CRF could be used in a DWC setup...

yes you would be set if they would work. money in ur pocket and they grow fat ass buds.