First Time Marijuana Growers - Northern Lights Closet Grow - DWC

[jonnygreens]

The more I look into this the more I'm convinced its a Nitrogen deficiency. If it was a N toxicity the leaves would have burned and turned brown and crispy as cannasensi stated, so this appears to be the opposite. If you can refer to the book Marijuana Garden Saver by J.C. Stitch you'll notice the example pictures provided look spot on to the yellowing and wilting of your lower leaves. Another thing that leads me to believe that its an N deficiency is that from your pictures the wilting is only on the lower, older leaves. Since N is a mobile nutrient, the N moves to the new growth causing yellowing and wilting to occur on the lower leaves. So with those queues your plant is giving you its stating that the N in your nutrient mixture is too low. You need to go by what the plant shows you and not what's on a chart. I really hope we can help pin this issue down to provide the most vigorous and stress free veg growth to set you up for a nice harvest!

 

[Sasquatch]

Okay. I will move forward under the assumption it is an N deficiency, then. I still feel like my concern from before is valid, though... how would reducing the amount of total nutrients provide more N? Is there some way to add just N? A couple of the top leaves are now yellowing a bit at the tips, FYI. Thanks

 

[Sasquatch]

Day 28

We decided that waiting for answers wasn't advisable when our plant's growth was being stunted at best and dying at worst. Better to go ahead and flush the system and change the dosage - we can always alter that later. That means for our roughly 4 gallons of water we are using 5 ml of micro and 10 ml of bloom. PPM is 272 and PH is 6.4. We have decided to begin foliar feeding with flora micro solution rather than superthrive for the added N. Here are some pictures of the yellowing leaves:

We did go ahead and raise the water level. How concerned should we be about drowning her? We have 3 airstones. Also, a question from way earlier: How beneficial would it be to use a water pump to pump the nutrient water up over the roots?

Thanks for reading!

 

[jonnygreens]

Quite excited to have a reply! It has been pretty dead. Thanks for saying it looks good for a first grow, we love compliments!

My ppm currently reading around 680 (.5 scale) although my water comes out of the faucet at around 80 naturally so I figure I should subtract that, making 600. - that should be the sweet spot (I am using 0-5-10 GH products).

I believe I found the issue with the feeding, Here you stated that your nutrients are 0-5-10 (N-P-K) so its 0 N. If you have the Gro nutes from the 3 part line I would add 1/4 strength to your solution and keep a close eye on the progress of the yellowing. Also exactly which GH line are you using?

Now, for your watering questions, I don't believe you're in any danger of drowning the plant as long as there is oxygen being pumped in to the water. Also I wouldn't bother pumping water from the top seeing how big your plant is, its very close to the roots popping out the bottom of the net pot especially since you raised the water and have 3 airstones churning.

I apologize for not getting back to you in a timely manner since this is a time sensitive matter, but life happens lol good luck friend!

 

[Sasquatch]

Day 29

Big problems today. I came home from work and found a note that read "heat not working, plant cold." All in all the plant has been outside of the 70-80 zone for minimum 4 hours, maximum 8. Will have more accurate information when the girlfriend gets home. I called the emergency mechanic for our complex.. he came and I had to turn off the light the entire time he was here, probably an hour for fear that he would peek where he shouldn't - just make it a little less obvious. Unfortunately he wasn't able to fix the problem. At the lowest, the temperature got down to 57.7. We now have a space heater in there but can't get it closer than 7-8 feet away due to power problems stemming from the same root cause as the heater. It was either the space heater or the light. We will move the space heater to next to the plant once the dark cycle starts.

On a better note, the small amount of yellowing that was occurring on the top leaves has retreated. Hopefully we are on the right track.

I believe I found the issue with the feeding, Here you stated that your nutrients are 0-5-10 (N-P-K) so its 0 N. If you have the Gro nutes from the 3 part line I would add 1/4 strength to your solution and keep a close eye on the progress of the yellowing. Also exactly which GH line are you using?

Now, for your watering questions, I don't believe you're in any danger of drowning the plant as long as there is oxygen being pumped in to the water. Also I wouldn't bother pumping water from the top seeing how big your plant is, its very close to the roots popping out the bottom of the net pot especially since you raised the water and have 3 airstones churning.

I apologize for not getting back to you in a timely manner since this is a time sensitive matter, but life happens lol good luck friend!

Yes, I am using the Lucas Formula, which is supposed to eliminate the need for flora grow. I am using flora micro and flora bloom hardwater. And no worries! You are helping on a completely volunteer basis. I will glean what I can and make the best decisions I can... then see how it turns out.

No pictures tonight... too busy huddling under a blanket. Supposed to get COLD tonight.

 

[Sasquatch]

Day 31

So the plant in the cold for roughly 24 hours. We also lost around 3 hours of light time during that period. We foliar fed her with ph balanced water with a small amount of GH flora micro for help getting Nitrogen. About foliar feeding - we still are trying to figure out exactly what we want to do with that. We had read that it was only supposed to be done once per week, but then earlier I saw a forum entry by ------- who is really the only person at this point I know knows what he is talking about hardcore... he was saying he foliar feeds several times daily all throughout Veg. Add to that our recent discovery of a bottle of Stealth Hydro "Foiler Spray" (it really says foiler, not foliar) we aren't sure if we should change whats in the spray. Anyone have any experience with this product?

The plant doesn't look much worse for wear, except the leaves are a bit droopier. Hopefully we will have smoother sailing from here!

Thanks for reading!

 

[Sasquatch]

Day 32

Just business as usual here, except that we went ahead and used the foilar spray from stealth hydro. The yellowing on the bottom leaves seems like it could be receding a little bit... but if it gets any worse I may just prune off the leaves. Here are some pictures of her:

 

[Sasquatch]

Day 38

Our N deficiency has gone away for the most part, especially after cutting off two of the undersized leaves which had thad the hardest time... they were becoming brittle and I decided they needed to go. This "foiler" spray is working pretty well. We have seen good growth the last week or so, although the last couple of days have shown the leaves paling a bit. We decided today to refresh the reservoir and this time use full strength nutes again. Still no roots through the bottom.

Yesterday we installed a newer, bigger bulb... we are now running a 125 W Full Spectrum grow light. Should put some pep in our step. Here are some pictures:

Thanks for reading!

 

[JokerJohn]

Im in..
Dont really know much about hydros so i wont be much help there but i can help where im able,

 

[JokerJohn]

have you got a fan inside your grow area circulating air and blowing on the plant?

 

[Sasquatch]

No we do not. At the moment we are able to keep the temperature between 72 and 76 degrees... I feel like a fan would bring it too low at times. I will definitely be doing that during any spring, summer or fall grows, though. I am totally open to the possibility that I am wrong to do this, so logic at me.

Anyway, welcome, thanks for the feedback and I hope you enjoy reading!

 

[Green Knight]

Hey Sasquatch, just came across and have been reading through your journal. Looks like you've got on top of the problem you were having and the foliar feed has helped - things are looking good mate.

Out of interest, I noticed in one of your posts you mentioned the pH was set at 6.4, but you've not really mentioned pH other than that post. Is this what you're holding it at? If so there's a good chance that can contribute to problems and might be the reason you got nutrient problems. I'm also a DWC grower and ideally you want your pH at 5.8. 6.4 is a bit too high and can cause lock out of key nutrients which can cause problems, even if the nutrient concentration is where it should be.

I set mine at 5.8 and don't worry too much if it swings between 5.5 - 6 over a few days, but anything outside that range I bring it back to 5.8. PH is really important in hydro, in fact it's probably one of the most important factors to control. If the pH is in where it should be it massively reduces the chance of nutrient problems (unless of course you bang the ppms up to a level the plant can't handle and burn it, but you shouldn't get deficiencies etc)

 

[Sasquatch]

Hey Sasquatch, just came across and have been reading through your journal. Looks like you've got on top of the problem you were having and the foliar feed has helped - things are looking good mate.

Out of interest, I noticed in one of your posts you mentioned the pH was set at 6.4, but you've not really mentioned pH other than that post. Is this what you're holding it at? If so there's a good chance that can contribute to problems and might be the reason you got nutrient problems. I'm also a DWC grower and ideally you want your pH at 5.8. 6.4 is a bit too high and can cause lock out of key nutrients which can cause problems, even if the nutrient concentration is where it should be.

I set mine at 5.8 and don't worry too much if it swings between 5.5 - 6 over a few days, but anything outside that range I bring it back to 5.8. PH is really important in hydro, in fact it's probably one of the most important factors to control. If the pH is in where it should be it massively reduces the chance of nutrient problems (unless of course you bang the ppms up to a level the plant can't handle and burn it, but you shouldn't get deficiencies etc)

That's a very helpful comment. We have been aiming for anywhere between 6 and 7 without worrying too much about fluctuations. We will definitely want to try to aim a little bit lower. Much appreciated! Thanks for reading!

 

[Green Knight]

No worries, I think that's likely to be the root cause of the problem. If you aim for 5.8 but certainly keep within the 5.5 - 6.1 range it should help prevent further issues in the future.

Thank you for the reps mate, much appreciated

 

[JokerJohn]

No we do not. At the moment we are able to keep the temperature between 72 and 76 degrees... I feel like a fan would bring it too low at times. I will definitely be doing that during any spring, summer or fall grows, though. I am totally open to the possibility that I am wrong to do this, so logic at me.

Anyway, welcome, thanks for the feedback and I hope you enjoy reading!

Well there are alot of benefits from having a fan for your plants , one being it increases stem and branch strength, meaning bigger buds. It can also help with diverting the heat to another direction that your lights give off to your plants so your able to move it closer without burning them. Weed plants like most plants also need co2 to grow. Weed plants absorb Co2 with there leafs.
Imagine if you can your plants leafs all surrounded by air bubbles , as time goes by the leafs absorb this bubble untill theres nothing left.. so thats why its a good idea to have air moving your leafs to make sure your plants are always getting fresh air and co2 and not siting in stale air.

 

[VapedOutJoe]

Hey Sasquatch! How are things going? Any roots in the water yet? How is your PH, water temp? Also, I might have missed it, but how are you watering? Do you have a pump dripping water into the cube? Hope you don't mind me asking ?'s I just ran across your thread and it reminded me of old times. See ya

 

[Green Knight]

Well there are alot of benefits from having a fan for your plants , one being it increases stem and branch strength, meaning bigger buds. It can also help with diverting the heat to another direction that your lights give off to your plants so your able to move it closer without burning them. Weed plants like most plants also need co2 to grow. Weed plants absorb Co2 with there leafs.
Imagine if you can your plants leafs all surrounded by air bubbles , as time goes by the leafs absorb this bubble untill theres nothing left.. so thats why its a good idea to have air moving your leafs to make sure your plants are always getting fresh air and co2 and not siting in stale air.

I'll second that- air flow is very important, particularly as the buds develop as good air flow will also minimise crap like bud rot from happening

 

[Sasquatch]

Well there are alot of benefits from having a fan for your plants , one being it increases stem and branch strength, meaning bigger buds. It can also help with diverting the heat to another direction that your lights give off to your plants so your able to move it closer without burning them. Weed plants like most plants also need co2 to grow. Weed plants absorb Co2 with there leafs.
Imagine if you can your plants leafs all surrounded by air bubbles , as time goes by the leafs absorb this bubble untill theres nothing left.. so thats why its a good idea to have air moving your leafs to make sure your plants are always getting fresh air and co2 and not siting in stale air.

This makes quite a bit of sense... we will have to get a small fan going in there. Thanks!

Hey Sasquatch! How are things going? Any roots in the water yet? How is your PH, water temp? Also, I might have missed it, but how are you watering? Do you have a pump dripping water into the cube? Hope you don't mind me asking ?'s I just ran across your thread and it reminded me of old times. See ya

No roots in the water yet, my pH as I have been discovering has been a little too high... (it has been around 6.5, we need to be aiming for 5.8). I do not have a pump dripping water through the cube... at the moment it is pretty much just from submersion and absorbed water from the hydroton. I had asked about the method with the water pump dripping through earlier and people said it wasn't really needed at this point. Do you disagree?

Day 40

Having some more problems with discoloration. We are worried that maybe we burned it when we did so much foliar feeding. It could also be due to our pH, although we haven't had issues like this thus far (note we haven't gotten a chance to lower the pH yet, so it is still 6.5). The top leaves are looking downright perky... the bottom leaves well, see for yourself:

Any suggestions? Thanks for reading!

 

[DocDee]

I would guess it is for sure ph lockout of some sort. Get your ph right then give it a few days to see if anything changes. Nute deficiencys will sometimes not show on the plant for days even weeks. So you could be seeing deficiencys from nutes being locked out due to ph since the beginning. My ph is always between 5.3 and 6.0. Also make sure you get ph 7.0 to calibrate your meters! It's no good if your ph meter says 5.8 but its .5 off either way.

 

[Green Knight]

Agree with Doc - pH really is the single most important thing to get right in hydro in the first instance. There's no point trying anything else until your pH is fixed.

Get your pH down ASAP and hold it within the range or the problems will continue. And as Doc said, make sure your pH meter is calibrated, but in the short term if it's a couple of points out on the calibration that's less likely to be an issue - get the pH down to 5.5/5.6 and that will give you a few points either way in the safe zone if your meter's a bit off until you can calibrate it, but at 6.5 you have very little chance of fixing the issue to be honest. Your no.1 priority above all else should be fixing the pH.