Where to start - Need some advice - Started outdoor finishing indoor

[DoctorGonzo]

What if I put two of my 600s right next to each other. Would my shitty sativas suddenly become good, Doctor?

1000w Hortilux HPS - 155,000 lumens
600w Hortilux HPS - 95,000 lumens

Using the above numbers, 2x 600w HPS side by side so the footprints intersect into a 190,000 lumen "sweet spot" would be kickass for landrace, tropical sativas.
(Dual bulb hoods tend to cook the fuck out of bulbs.)
Having been at this for thirty+ years, and having run 100s of different cultivars, the empirical data I've gathered says beyond question that the more atomic-blast-grade light true sativas get, the better. Greenhouse growing, for these, is by far the best. And fwiw, most landrace sativas don't do well indoors-which is why The Haze Brothers, Sam, Werner, Neville, and many others invested time in line breeding and refining sativas hybrids that were acclimated for indoor growing.
As to your "sativas being shitty", well, I'm not sure what genetics you're using, but I can offer some suggestions if you're dissatisfied with your results.

 

[Weaselcracker]

Yeah thanks mate. I'll continue to get by somehow.

 

[Gree N]

The only way LED can compare to HID is in grow-specific designs. LED bulbs bought at Home Depot simply do not compare on any level.
The "closer is better" argument doesn't hold water vs. HID unless you're talking COBs, et al.

As for T5's: Been using them for years, and they certainly have their place. They're great for cloning and early, bulk veg. But for flowering? Absolutely not. A single 400w Hortilux HPS HID will out-yield an 8x 50w, 4' T5 light set every. single. time. Better quality, better terps, too.

The Math:
A 600w HPS = 95,000 lumens and will pierce canopy to about 4'. In contrast, a "2000 lumen, 18w LED bulb" produces about 90 lumens/watt and will pierce 12" of canopy at best.

Hortilux 600w HPS HID: 95,000 lumens /600 = 158 lumens/watt, spectrum balanced for plants.

18w, 2000 lumens LED = 111 lumens/watt, but isn't specifically balanced for plant spectrum & w/only 12" of canopy at best is extremely inefficient vs. HID.

158 HID vs. 111 LED = HID lumens/watt is about 50% more efficient/watt, baseline, per your specs.

That said, if you compare a $3000 LED grow light to a Standard, $300, 1000w (non-DE, i.e. Gavita Pro) HID, there are certainly arguable points in the discussion. In five years, we'll all probably be running Pro LED setups-but not now. And other than in spacebuckets, CFLs and Home Depot LED bulbs have little to no place in marijuana horticulture unless you're just fucking around, though I will concede that rooting clones under CFLs is fine.

You also need to take the inverse square law into practice when doing that math, at four feet away the 1000w will only be hitting the plants at 5000lumens. At 1 inch a one 36w flouro tube will be hitting plants with 3000 lumens now for 944w less of energy consumption there is no way you can say a flouro is not efficient...


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[DoctorGonzo]

You also need to take the inverse square law into practice when doing that math, at four feet away the 1000w will only be hitting the plants at 5000lumens. At 1 inch a one 36w flouro tube will be hitting plants with 3000 lumens now for 944w less of energy consumption there is no way you can say a flouro is not efficient...

1) A 1000w light covers 5'x5'x4' (prime) 100 ft3
(Or)
2) A 1000w DE light covers 7'x7'x5' (prime) 245 ft3
vs.
A 16-bulb T5 (800w) covers 4'x3.5'x 6 inches = 7 ft3

Needless to say, the T5's won't be yielding anywhere close to 1g/watt, whereas I've seen nearly 3g/watt from a single plant using Gavita DE lights, and 1g/watt from vanilla HIDs. If you can show me 6 lbs. from 1000w of T5's, then your argument is valid-but you can't.

Bottom Line: Flouros are efficient for lighting offices, but not for growing marijuana. If they were, they'd be in use in production everywhere. LEDs are getting there, but economy of scale prevents their widespread use until the tech improves more & methodology changes to better exploit their strengths.


**Also, at no time is an (non-DE) HID light 4' off of a plant's primary flowering area, at least not the way I'm used to doing things. (Secondaries and lowers are generally pruned before flower, & anything left over that's not prime goes into bubblebags.)

 

[Gree N]

1) A 1000w light covers 5'x5'x4' (prime) 100 ft3
(Or)
2) A 1000w DE light covers 7'x7'x5' (prime) 245 ft3
vs.
A 16-bulb T5 (800w) covers 4'x3.5'x 6 inches = 7 ft3

Needless to say, the T5's won't be yielding anywhere close to 1g/watt, whereas I've seen nearly 3g/watt from a single plant using Gavita DE lights, and 1g/watt from vanilla HIDs. If you can show me 6 lbs. from 1000w of T5's, then your argument is valid-but you can't.

Bottom Line: Flouros are efficient for lighting offices, but not for growing marijuana. If they were, they'd be in use in production everywhere. LEDs are getting there, but economy of scale prevents their widespread use until the tech improves more & methodology changes to better exploit their strengths.


**Also, at no time is an (non-DE) HID light 4' off of a plant's primary flowering area, at least not the way I'm used to doing things. (Secondaries and lowers are generally pruned before flower, & anything left over that's not prime goes into bubblebags.)

I think I will concede to your argument it does seem you've got the math down pat and a lot of experience behind you. I have spent about $100 on my cfl's, led's and fittings, the two duel t5's I had stole from my fish tanks, the HID's are out of question for me because I think the heat would be a major issue aswell as very suspicious energy consumption.
The only reason the plants are indoor is because I had to evacuate them from there home outdoors before they were ripped off as I said earlier, so this has been a very sporadic grow too try and get something off these girls that I've nursed outdoors for 3-4 months.....
I'm limited because of the headroom which is only 4 feet.
I do have some cob led's on the way which after researching I think is going to be most effective for the size of my grow room 6x7x4
Thanks for the constructive feedback Doctor Gonzo.

 

[Gree N]

1) A 1000w light covers 5'x5'x4' (prime) 100 ft3
(Or)
2) A 1000w DE light covers 7'x7'x5' (prime) 245 ft3
vs.
A 16-bulb T5 (800w) covers 4'x3.5'x 6 inches = 7 ft3

Needless to say, the T5's won't be yielding anywhere close to 1g/watt, whereas I've seen nearly 3g/watt from a single plant using Gavita DE lights, and 1g/watt from vanilla HIDs. If you can show me 6 lbs. from 1000w of T5's, then your argument is valid-but you can't.

Bottom Line: Flouros are efficient for lighting offices, but not for growing marijuana. If they were, they'd be in use in production everywhere. LEDs are getting there, but economy of scale prevents their widespread use until the tech improves more & methodology changes to better exploit their strengths.


**Also, at no time is an (non-DE) HID light 4' off of a plant's primary flowering area, at least not the way I'm used to doing things. (Secondaries and lowers are generally pruned before flower, & anything left over that's not prime goes into bubblebags.)

I suppose if I had a DE 1000w light I could grow grass on the floor of my grow room too haha


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[Gree N]

I'm doing the best I can for these girls until my Chinese cobs get here lol, It's my first but definitely not last indoor grow so I am learning and experimenting a lot which is fun

is she looking any good?? getting close??? Maybe a few weeks hopefully the buds will fatten up?????? Lol I wish the grow room had a fast forward button so curious to see what happens next.

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