First Grow - Experienced Advice Needed

V

Versace

New Member
Hello to the 420 Community!

Having began recently smoking fine herbs, I've learnt to really appreciate the beautiful woman that is Mary Jane.

After many years of contemplating and hundreds wasted recently on poor quality bud from seedy people out to make a quick buck, I've decided to go for it and grow!

Carrying out most of the research myself, I just need a few pros with solid experience in growing to guide me along the way - starting here. I aim to start the grow in September, and have listed the equipment I have in mind below. It will be a closet grow - Im aiming for a good size yield with short plants - At least two different strains with high THC content.

Not too sure about closet size just yet as Im moving house and it will be the landlords closet - Hence I dont want to do any irreversible damage! Plus I will have people living with me so I dont want any overpowering noise or smell (A little isnt an issue).

Please take care reading and tell me what I should buy and avoid, as Im sure many of the nutes have the same ingredients and I don't want to risk overfeeding. On top of that, many of them are quite costly over here!

SOIL and NUTES

SOIL: CANNA TERRA 50l - COST: £14.00

FOX FARM - GROW BIG, BIG BLOOM, TIGER BLOOM TRIO PACK - COST: £52.81 (Small size)
FOX FARM - CHA CHING, OPEN SESAME, BEASTIE BLOOMZ TRIO PACK - COST: £23.00 (1 Oz of each powder)
ADVANCED NUTES - OVERDRIVE - COST: £11.50 (250ml)
ADVANCED NUTES - BUD CANDY - COST: £17.00 (250ml)
ADVANCED NUTES - B-52 - COST: £12.75 (250ml)
ADVANCED NUTES - BIG BUD - COST: £7.50 (50g Powder)
BLOOM - CAL MAG - COST: £17.00 (300ml)
BOTANICARE - LIQUID KARMA - COST: £21 (8floz)

Obviously you can see the nutes and soil are very costly - Totalling £170 alone! Considering this is for a closet grow, could I use any alternatives available in England? I dont want to spend more than £50 on nutes!


LIGHTING

I have decided on CFL lightining due to its lost cost, low heat and low running cost. LED was another options but the panels are very expensive. I was initially aiming for 6 plants, but due to size (Most likely I will have minimum 3 square feet closet space and about 6 - 7 feet height) I am happy with 2 - 4 as long as yield and quality is good.

I was thinking of using 6400k CFL Bulbs outputting 5500 Lumens. a pack of 4 is £70 with postage - will this be enough or do I need more? I know I will need 2700k additional for flowering.

In terms of reflective material, I will be using Mylar - 1.25m x 5m is around £14 - Seems reasonable enough.

STRAIN and Air Circulation
I was thinking of using Barneys Strains Vanilla Kush and Red Diesel - Please feel free to suggest alternatives! I prefer talkative highs rather than lazy ones but am limited in space so am stuck with more indica type strains.

Regarding air circulation, I have no clue. Im guessing since CFLS will emit little heat all I need is a source of fresh air and a small fan for my girls, but honestly im new to all this - So please, please throw some suggestions at me :) I dont fancy damaging the cupboard so cant cut any holes unfortunately :(​

Thanks for all your help guys. So far, I like what I see and am proud to say Im a member of 420. Im new and I dont pretend to know much about this - hence I need your guidance! Please make any suggestions where you see fit in regards to nutes, space, air, anything! Peace out! :Namaste:
 
Welcome to :420:!!

The first thing that I'd like to say is DO NOT make the same mistakes that newbies make and use a bunch of different additives expecting to get a bigger plant and bigger yields. It DOES NOT work like that.
I know that some things you can use in conjunction with another but only when they serve a particular small purpose, i.e. if you use several bud enhancer you're gonna smother the plant and get shit buds if the plant doesn't die. Furthermore you'll be battling deficiencies every day which is gonna drive to use more stuff, thus making things increasingly worst.

As I say to everyone, when it comes to nutrients less is always more.

Pick one additive (if it's a two or three part deal still counts as one) and stick with that, you can try different ones with each cycle but DO NOT combine them, I cannot stress this enough.

As for the soil, I grow hydro so I don't know much about it.

As for the lightning, you're good with CFLs for veg but you'll need an HPS for flower. However the listing from ebay you posted seems very expensive, I'd recommend you to go to your local home store and pick up common CFLs in the 6X00K range, but you're good with 2700K if that's the only ones you have access to, I used them and they work great.

As for the strains, indicas actually grow bigger than sativas so if you're worried about the space then you might want to go that way.
I haven't tried many strains since cannabis is very illegal here so getting good weed is practically impossible unless you know a grower. But I've been smoking AK-48 for the past few months and since it's a sativa dominant strain (it's a hybrid) the high is more upbeat and non lazy so I think that might be right up your alley. It's got a high THC content and if you harvest it while the trichomes are still milky/clear (little clear more milky) the high is very energetic and allows you to function great, for me they actually help me concentrate on a single task instead of having my mind working on several things at a time (I'm a recreational user but I also consume for therapeutic purposes, i.e. calm my mind)
It also has a very good yield in a small space if you care for it properly (bigger still in a larger space) so this will be my recommendation to you, but as I said, I've never tried another strain whose name I know.
I don't know any of the strains you have in mind so they might be better than my recommendation but we can only speak of what we know.

For the air circulation, you're good with just a small fan while in veg providing that the temps don't go higher than recommended, but when you switch to flower you will need a lot more moving air so you're gonna have to bust a side of the cabinet you're using and fit an exhaust fan in there. Anything you do can be repaired, a wood side of a cupboard is not an expensive or hard to replace part.

I think I've covered most of your worries but if there's anything else you need to know the community, for the most part, is very willing to help a fellow grower.

I also agree with Giga, start a journal and get help as you need it, no one can cover all the bases at the first shot, although good research and insight is a very good place to start.

Good luck and happy growing!!
 
ok, ive a memory like a goldfish, was waiting to see about a journal but ill just post a couple of thoughts here ;)

cfls make almost as much heat as the other kind of bulbs, make no mistake!

you WILL need a carbon filter and air extractor. unless your living on the moors, you will not be able to get away from the stink of growing and will get grassed up. check out our sponsors for some great equipment.

now, onto uk specifics

bulbs...job done
Buy MiniSun 65W BC B22 Energy Saving Daylight Spiral Bulb 6500K from our Energy Saving Lightbulbs range - Tesco.com

:rofl:

soil

Westland Multi-Purpose Compost 50L - Gardening & Maintenance -Gardens - Wickes
^add in about 30% perlite

nutes. any decent 3 part system and some liquid seaweed.

i know you can grow using these things because i have and i do.

right now im using pure john innes no2 mixed with 50% perlite, but am having drainage issues. i will be mixing in home compost once its mature enough and that should fill in any gaps.

eventually ill just grow in aged home compost with gravel added and stuff buying anything ;)
 
Thanks very much dude, bulbs look awesome! Just a question though - do I use the 6500k CFL for veg and then switch to 2600k CFL for flower or do I have to use HPS for flower? Works out more expensive plus there is far more heat I would have thought! I'm worried about heat because I will be using the air extractor piping out of a window, any helicopters with FLIR go by will my window light up like a Christmas tree? :xmas:

GiGaBaNE said:
ok, ive a memory like a goldfish, was waiting to see about a journal but ill just post a couple of thoughts here ;)

cfls make almost as much heat as the other kind of bulbs, make no mistake!

you WILL need a carbon filter and air extractor. unless your living on the moors, you will not be able to get away from the stink of growing and will get grassed up. check out our sponsors for some great equipment.

now, onto uk specifics

bulbs...job done
Buy MiniSun 65W BC B22 Energy Saving Daylight Spiral Bulb 6500K from our Energy Saving Lightbulbs range - Tesco.com

:rofl:

soil

Westland Multi-Purpose Compost 50L - Gardening & Maintenance -Gardens - Wickes
^add in about 30% perlite

nutes. any decent 3 part system and some liquid seaweed.

i know you can grow using these things because i have and i do.

right now im using pure john innes no2 mixed with 50% perlite, but am having drainage issues. i will be mixing in home compost once its mature enough and that should fill in any gaps.

eventually ill just grow in aged home compost with gravel added and stuff buying anything ;)
Click to expand...
 
No expert here but the advice might help, always good to hear different perspectives. CFL's arent bad and you can flower with them but, don't expect a huge yield. Go for a minimal 100 actual watts per plant. 26 watt CFL's are available and at a descent price and come in multi packs. For veg you need 6500K a good idea is to mix light spectrum. Say you have a surge protector with bulb socket adapters put two 6500K 26 watt CFL's with one 26 watt 2600K bulb in between. That alone gives you 78 watts of light. Rig up maybe 6 or 8 of these around and between your plants and when time to flower, swap the two 6500K cfls with two 2600K with one 6500K in the middle. I would say you could do this for a little under 200 bucks. A bit expensive but, you save on heat and energy costs.
 
Some thoughts or possible suggestions;

In your space, is it possible to build a box in a box? In probably a couple hours, I'll be building a small 25"x29"x16" box for inside of my closet for just one plant to play around with until I am ready to grow bigger with all of the other materials I've been accumulating. If yes, your inner box can be slightly smaller than your closet/cupboard with spaces the size of a 1x1 or 2x4 all around. This will give you less overall space, but will allow you to create innerwall ducts for inlet and exhaust air. as Rodrigo said, you're likely going to have to poke a hole somewhere, but maybe you can poke a hole in the top of the closet, and divide that hole in half, each side for inlet/exhaust. the innerwall ducts can carry the respective air to/from that single hole. Carbon filtration is something you'll have to incorporate down the road, but not immediately. I have 20 LBs. of activated carbon that I picked up on ebay or amazon for about $50. At some point I will be playing around with different ways to make an inline filter as I am not convinced that the can-filter design is the only way hat air can be efficiently cleaned so you will be able to learn from my mistakes or success with that if you follow my ongoing journal.

Also, as these lovely people suggest, make your own ongoing journal so people can easily track your progress and mentally identify who you are and be able to roughly remember where you are at in your grow. Like on Jerry McGuire "help me to help you". we don't want to have the people that are to help us work that much harder to do so.

I have no growing experience shy of the last week or 2, but spacial anatomy and design is a hobby I spend many a waking hour thinking about. I am constantly trying to design the ultimate grow box for my situation that will address every possible issue. This occupies my mind away from over stressing about nute deficiencies and possible over feeding. If there is any way I can help to improve your design of your box, ask and I'd be happy to help mull ideas over.

Start a Journal and go into your settings and edit your signature to link back to it. This will be hyperlinked on every comment or post you make on other threads just like mine is below. Best of luck and karma on your grow!
 
Versace said:
Thanks very much dude, bulbs look awesome! Just a question though - do I use the 6500k CFL for veg and then switch to 2600k CFL for flower or do I have to use HPS for flower? Works out more expensive plus there is far more heat I would have thought! I'm worried about heat because I will be using the air extractor piping out of a window, any helicopters with FLIR go by will my window light up like a Christmas tree? :xmas:
Click to expand...

you switch to the 2700k for the bulk of flowering. however there are some possible improvements to stretch if you remain with the 6500k for the first 2 weeks of flower and apparently they emit some UV so help make resins if used on the last few days of flower.

HPS is much simpler to wire up and flowers great, but its a huge fail if the bulb or ballast goes and you cant really explain away a hps for anything other than growing where as household bulbs could just be a collection from when the energy companies gave them away for free, lol.

also its possible to use a combination of hps and cfls. the only limiting factors are the budget, heat management and when you get a ton of light going, bleaching.
 
Get a complete tent kit if ya got a spare £400 to £500, set it up in any room & pack it up at end of grow and take it to next house if renting on a 6 month to yearly basis depending on contract...


Be tempted to get a dual spectrum HPS sun master & grolux do those and can be used for both veg & flowering...

Rather than fart about with MH/HPS etc

Might want to look at auto flowering strains also which are mildly quicker growing than indica short flower time strains (not including veg time)

Nutrients you can get starter packs & believe HESI & Biobizz do these with a range of nutrients in the starter pack... ya need to shop around for em & less than £50 :thumb:


I'll send ya PM with some UK hydro shops i like using :Namaste:
 
GiGaBaNE said:
sativas grow tall, indica is short and bushy
Click to expand...
Not that I'm correcting you, because you clearly have way more experience than me. But with the plants I have now I've seen the opposite, none is a pure sativa, though, so that might be why. Also wherever you look for this info people always have different opinion, based on poor experience I guess.
Anyway, you can still control the height of a plant up to a certain extent.
I'll be paying close attention to my indica and see how it grows, I'll start the journal in a couple of days.
 
straight from wiki:
220px-Cannab2_new.png


opinions are for people that cant be bothered to google up some facts. ;)
 
If the light is kept too far away, the plant will stretch (3" or more between nodes). All information I have states to keep the lights as close to the plant as possible without burning the tops and the nodes will stay compact (1/2" between nodes).
 
Ok ill start this with the fact that im an uneducated stoner and please correct me if im wrong but Ive read a lot of articles stating that the biggest factor contributing to internodal stretch is frequent watering (not completely relevant to hydroponics unless relating it to available water/nutrient levels etc) but basically a drier medium will create tighter internodes (Im assuming this is also influencing the available nutrients) if your plant has a constant supply of water available it will stretch.

Cell Expansion, Internode Length and Plant Height an interesting article on intermodal stretch in cotton. same principle I guess
Any thoughts.
 
if you guys want to get your head around this properly then you need to understand that the word 'stretch' means several different things.

stretch 1: the unhealthy and suboptimal stretching of a plant due to lack of light. this is bad and should be prevented if possible.

stretch 2: the transition period between veg and flower, this is mostly unavoidable as its primarily to do with the plant wanting to be tall to cast its seeds.

stretch 3: natural healthy growth miscalled stretch ;)
 
SWvoodoo said:
Ok ill start this with the fact that im an uneducated stoner and please correct me if im wrong but Ive read a lot of articles stating that the biggest factor contributing to internodal stretch is frequent watering (not completely relevant to hydroponics unless relating it to available water/nutrient levels etc) but basically a drier medium will create tighter internodes (Im assuming this is also influencing the available nutrients) if your plant has a constant supply of water available it will stretch.

Cell Expansion, Internode Length and Plant Height an interesting article on intermodal stretch in cotton. same principle I guess
Any thoughts.
Click to expand...

Only if the plants share the same family origin... some how i think a cotten plant is some what different to a cannabis plant !


At the end of day stretch is mainly due to light source distance or if vegging under a hps & genetic traits of the strain !
 

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