FiveToMidnight's First Grow - Coco/Perlite - NL - MarsHydro 300W LED - 2015

[FiveToMidnight]

Yeah, I accidentally got the mixture on a few of my buds but it didn't seem to worry them any. So don't stress too much about it.

I've seen people on YouTube spraying from underneath to avoid the buds, I may try that

 

[Camo420Grow]

Good luck 5, I hope it works brother !

 

[FiveToMidnight]

Good luck 5, I hope it works brother !

Thanks camo.
Think I'm also going to try another flush on the weekend plus I looks like I may need to transplant soon. I just don't want to interupt the stretch. They still seem to be growing a lot even with these issues though

 

[Skybound]

They do look pretty haggard. I was hoping that these problems would have abated by now. You are getting the variables reigned in and the providing for a more stable growing environment. I assume your temps and RH are staying in a good range at all times, you're still working to improve air flow to/from the room and when feeding, you are ensuring that the media gets completely drenched and allowed to thoroughly dry. None the less, make a note that you experienced these deficiencies and the timing of the event so you can better prepare the recipe next grow. I don't mean to imply that you mis-prepared it this time, just that as is, it wasn't adequate enough for the plant(s) and needs a bit of augmentation and tweaking.

You can flip the entire plant over to spray so gravity works with you instead of against. Just hold the root mass in the pot when upside down and it'll be fine.

 

[FiveToMidnight]

They do look pretty haggard. I was hoping that these problems would have abated by now. You are getting the variables reigned in and the providing for a more stable growing environment. I assume your temps and RH are staying in a good range at all times, you're still working to improve air flow to/from the room and when feeding, you are ensuring that the media gets completely drenched and allowed to thoroughly dry. None the less, make a note that you experienced these deficiencies and the timing of the event so you can better prepare the recipe next grow. I don't mean to imply that you mis-prepared it this time, just that as is, it wasn't adequate enough for the plant(s) and needs a bit of augmentation and tweaking.

You can flip the entire plant over to spray so gravity works with you instead of against. Just hold the root mass in the pot when upside down and it'll be fine.

I was hoping we would be past all this too and its very frustrating that its hanging around.
Your assumptions are correct. We did have had a couple of very hot days but wasn't too bad. However due to feeding/watering 2-3 times a day as previously advised, they haven't been drying out completely.

Thanks for the spraying tip. I will give it a go tomorrow night before lights out.

I noted you said it should be safe to transplant after week 2 of bloom. As we are now in week 3, how would I judge if it safe?

 

[GrizzWald]

this is just getting ridiculous....none of that is going to make his plants look like that... Variables, bloody hell. Reigned in?? I can't really see next grow being any different at this stage. What's going to make it so? He has taken no advise, and has changed the advice he was given and is now blaming that... I've read this journal, who advised you to water two times a day? Nobody. But that isn't even cause or concern with these plants... . You were told to allow to dry out, but you consistantly said they couldn't dry out for more than 24 hours, ridiculous... Growers have said they feed 2-3 times a day but nobody told you. I said very early that there's lots of ways to do this.. And no disrespect to skybounds greenthumb, he grows nice plants, but all you did was take advice from somebody that doesn't grow in this medium and ignored the advice from people who do.. And you disrespected a few times when we tried.. Fuck you told me b52 and silica were the same thing bud... I'm not at all surprised that your plants are still looking like this..why did you think adding another freely available mineral would help? But take responsibility, unless somebody can get shit through to you or sky bound can start giving some direction that helps your plants, they are stuffed. I blew up early at skybound for not helping your plants.. And this isn't a go at him, but shit should go off, when you get to topping and closing in on flipping and bud washing is brought up in conversation...there's a lot of that in here. You should read every page again, look at stuff that's been said, by whom, what's been done.... I was here to help not be ignored, made me feel like a tosser. And I couldn't understand it , as I was the first to actually pull you up on killing those seedlings and turned them into plants, firstly by stop watering.. I got you to add food to your water, when you were wondering why they were yellow. Why I left, was wasting my time.. And I've only seen decline since... It's all good to say, yeah all be good next time, we know we'll be right next time, got the problems sorted for next time, but none of the problems have been fixed.. Make a note of his problems and time in grow to be better prepared next grow? Why? You plan on seeing them again? And do what? That's something that should be thought about. Cause If you know the fix, why aren't you doing it now....

 

[Skybound]

Grizz, sorry to jump on your shit but you're out of line in the above post. I admit I don't know coco as my media is rock wool, but let it be noted that those that allege to know coco, continually remain silent. I'll always do my best to help others that struggle and help them assimilate into the WITTBAG frame of mind as this is nothing more than "each one teach one" on a larger scale. 5 is doing the best he can, with what he was able to afford thus far and also what he knows. Expecting him to cater to our "feelings" by following one specific set of instructions is hardly helpful. Consider that until a week ago, your opinion was undocumented as you had not yet started your own journal and demonstrated your skillset. I'm in no way implying that your skills aren't real, just that you hadn't started any threads until very recently. And finally, jumping down 5's back for not knowing the best course of action just aint right. As far as 5 is concerned, we are all just random internet personalities and for him to pick one to follow and purchase things after is a tall enough order in and of itself, but what should he do when some of them conflict with each other? You gotta be more kind if you want others to give value to the things you say.

Edit - Sorry 5, I forgot to answer your question. If you are confident that she's done stretching and you want to see if she can pot up, you can pop the pot off to reveal the root mass and this is when you know if she's ready. The best time to pop the pot off is right before feed time when the root mass is the driest. This aids in keeping the root ball intact. If there is good amount of fine roots circling the bottom, and roughly 2/3 of the root ball has good root growth, it's ready to pot up.

 

[GrizzWald]

No they don't, but you come in and giving a different answer in paragraph form, making the line dealing with the problem, irrelavent... Like earlier in journal, I said it's who says what, and with what confidence they saying it... I deal in short and to the point. I'm a tradesman, not a botanical pharmacist. its also bullshit when saying that part of the problem is something, but it has nothing to do with it. Saying you can't grow a certain way, when others who grow in the medium do just that, is misleading..
Your not teaching him, your slowly getting him to grow as you do, which is fine, but it's not dealing, as I was trying to do, with these particular plants.. Have you told him to grow in rock wool yet?.....
I was invested in this grow to see it succeed, cause it's a coco/perlite same as me, LEDs , again what I grow with, northern lights, I'd stared a northern light x only couple weeks if that, a week earlier. Then I find out he's an aussie, I was all in..
Skybound I know you grow beautiful plants, I'm not having a go at your growing abilities, plants you grow or style/ technique, you use..

 

[Camo420Grow]

5 sending good vibes your way man. I hope your girls are doin better.

 

[FiveToMidnight]

this is just getting ridiculous....none of that is going to make his plants look like that... Variables, bloody hell. Reigned in?? I can't really see next grow being any different at this stage. What's going to make it so? He has taken no advise, and has changed the advice he was given and is now blaming that... I've read this journal, who advised you to water two times a day? Nobody. But that isn't even cause or concern with these plants... . You were told to allow to dry out, but you consistantly said they couldn't dry out for more than 24 hours, ridiculous... Growers have said they feed 2-3 times a day but nobody told you. I said very early that there's lots of ways to do this.. And no disrespect to skybounds greenthumb, he grows nice plants, but all you did was take advice from somebody that doesn't grow in this medium and ignored the advice from people who do.. And you disrespected a few times when we tried.. Fuck you told me b52 and silica were the same thing bud... I'm not at all surprised that your plants are still looking like this..why did you think adding another freely available mineral would help? But take responsibility, unless somebody can get shit through to you or sky bound can start giving some direction that helps your plants, they are stuffed. I blew up early at skybound for not helping your plants.. And this isn't a go at him, but shit should go off, when you get to topping and closing in on flipping and bud washing is brought up in conversation...there's a lot of that in here. You should read every page again, look at stuff that's been said, by whom, what's been done.... I was here to help not be ignored, made me feel like a tosser. And I couldn't understand it , as I was the first to actually pull you up on killing those seedlings and turned them into plants, firstly by stop watering.. I got you to add food to your water, when you were wondering why they were yellow. Why I left, was wasting my time.. And I've only seen decline since... It's all good to say, yeah all be good next time, we know we'll be right next time, got the problems sorted for next time, but none of the problems have been fixed.. Make a note of his problems and time in grow to be better prepared next grow? Why? You plan on seeing them again? And do what? That's something that should be thought about. Cause If you know the fix, why aren't you doing it now....

Wow Grizzy I am really sorry I made you feel that way, I had no intention of that at all and do deeply apologise.
I have gone back through this entire journal several times, it usually takes about 2-3 hours and I have documented much of what everyone has said, including yourself. As you say you are Aussie, growing in coco/perlite and using LED so I do take what you say in to great consideration, not to mention, as you said, you helped saved these girls very early on which I highly credit you for.

I have been allowing to dry out. After 24 hours they are very droopy and look like they are in need of water. Going by what everyone said, this is the point where they need to be watered. They are in small 1.3L pots, so they don't hold a lot of water and dry out quickly. Also, the higher than ideal temperatures I believe are causing them to dry out quicker.
I simply thought when I read the description of b52 and silica that they sounded similar in helping with root and stem growth, helping to take in nutrients and help to deal with harsher climates. I meant no disrespect with what I said.

Many of the suggestions made by people cost money, something I do not have. This makes it difficult when trying to find a solution if most and especially the best solutions cost the most. I'm on a very slim budget and am trying to manage with what I can. I mentioned that I will have more funds before starting the next grow which will allow me to purchase the things needed to either avoid or combat the problems if faced in the future, however unfortunately I have to run with what I have at the moment and try and do the best I can. I've never grown anything before, so everything is new to me. I apologise that I'm not always able to make the correct decisions on what to do on such a limited budget.

I am sorry to see you go Grizzy but I have taken everything you said in the past and just now in to consideration and will try and remedy that as best I can. I again am deeply sorry for making you feel as though you had been disrespected or ignored in any way, it truly was not my intention.
I hope that we can either continue to talk or talk again in the future but I do understand if you feel otherwise and in which case, I do wish you the best of luck.

Thank you again for all your help, it was greatly appreciated.

 

[FiveToMidnight]

Edit - Sorry 5, I forgot to answer your question. If you are confident that she's done stretching and you want to see if she can pot up, you can pop the pot off to reveal the root mass and this is when you know if she's ready. The best time to pop the pot off is right before feed time when the root mass is the driest. This aids in keeping the root ball intact. If there is good amount of fine roots circling the bottom, and roughly 2/3 of the root ball has good root growth, it's ready to pot up.

I have checked the root mass a couple of days ago and it is starting to look quite large. I just wasn't sure when the best time would be during the bloom stage and wanted to try and minimise the harm I've already caused.
They still seem to be growing at quite a decent rate so I'm not sure how to tell if the stretch has stopped. They seem to be growing about 0.5cm a day or there abouts. As it is, one seems to be stretching a bit more than the other. Number 1 is getting thicker, only a little taller and more flower development as well as much thicker stems. Whereas the other is getting taller, only a little thicker and not as much flower development but still has very thick stems.

 

[McCdive]

Just try not to get discouraged, 5. My first indoor grow was started a year ago (close) and was a nightmare! I had no idea what I was getting into, despite having read many journals in here. I too thought I was ready and it nearly beat me. Starting with clones, it still took like 4+ months of HARD lessons to get it done. I would like to help you out, but your feeding techniques are something I know nothing about. I'm learning a bit as you are. My 'for what it's worth' is, don't let this beat you.
Andy.

 

[FiveToMidnight]

Just try not to get discouraged, 5. My first indoor grow was started a year ago (close) and was a nightmare! I had no idea what I was getting into, despite having read many journals in here. I too thought I was ready and it nearly beat me. Starting with clones, it still took like 4+ months of HARD lessons to get it done. I would like to help you out, but your feeding techniques are something I know nothing about. I'm learning a bit as you are. My 'for what it's worth' is, don't let this beat you.
Andy.

Thank you mate, it really helps to know others go through the same situation I am in. I do feel pretty dumb at the moment cause, like you said, I felt ready and like I knew enough to get by, only to find I know nothing and am finding it quite hard at times to understand what people are trying to teach me.
I am trying to learn and really take in all that is being said. I hope one day I can learn enough to get results like you have in your last grow, well done mate it looks awesome!

 

[GrizzWald]

I owe you an apology 5, sorry... Don't let this dick put you off...
Get it into a bigger pot.... Next time put it into a bigger pot, week or two before flip.. No chance of stressing it out during flower then..

Just saw comment passing blame that set me off.. Sky bound says it in his comment back to me. His not a coir grower... How are you meant to know what info to follow if it's conflicting...
That's where we as growers, if the medium isn't our preferred, we should shut the hell up and learn something.. You might see me in indoor h/b soil threads, but I'll be advising on hangers for lights, filters, fans, shit I know about, not soil mixes, teas to brew etc...
So again dude, sorry.....

 

[FiveToMidnight]

I owe you an apology 5, sorry... Don't let this dick put you off...
Get it into a bigger pot.... Next time put it into a bigger pot, week or two before flip.. No chance of stressing it out during flower then..

Just saw comment passing blame that set me off.. Sky bound says it in his comment back to me. His not a coir grower... How are you meant to know what info to follow if it's conflicting...
That's where we as growers, if the medium isn't our preferred, we should shut the hell up and learn something.. You might see me in indoor h/b soil threads, but I'll be advising on hangers for lights, filters, fans, shit I know about, not soil mixes, teas to brew etc...
So again dude, sorry.....

No problems at all mate, I'm sorry it seemed as though I was passing blame. All blame is on myself and no one else. I made all decisions and some, if not many could have been made better.
I do know that, especially early on, I didn't heed all of your advise. Things like light heights and what not, but not due to disrespect or thinking you did not know. It was simply for misunderstanding or just not reading properly being too stoned or something lol. I have gone back several times though and noted your comments regarding lighting, feeding schedules, charging of coir and others. So please don't think you have ever been ignored. The way I will start things is pretty much entirely derived from what you have taught me early on in this journal.

Thank you for the potting advise. I probably should have transplanted before bloom but thought they were too small as the root ball was not as large as I thought it should be. I should have maybe done it anyway but will look to do it on the weekend. I don't have as much time in the evenings and want to be able to do it carefully and not bash them around.

Thanks for sticking around mate

 

[McCdive]

Thanks, 5, it's not been without it's problems, believe me!! I know I've stunted this grow by weeks.
Hang in there!!
Nice post, Grizz.
Sky, much respect for your work as well. Wish we had crossed paths when I started my RW grow!! lol

Andy.

 

[FiveToMidnight]

Took another little peek today and thought you guys might like a look.
I'm going to move them from the 1.3L pots they are in, to 3L pots and will post pics when I'm done

Also, decided to try letting them dry out after going back through this journal once more and so far it has been 38 hours and they don't look too bad. Some of the leaves are a bit droopy but not too much. I have been foliar feeding with RO water mixed with epsom salt (1 gram/1 Gallon for the past 3 nights and since the last feeding they only got a foliar spray last night before lights out.
I will give them a feed when I transplant but may wait a while to see how long the bigger pots take to dry out before feeding again and continue the foliar feeding. Not sure if it's helping or not though as there still seems to be some leaves falling off.
Any thoughts on this?

 

[McCdive]

Hey 5, if I may ask a really dumb question here, maybe you or one of the others can answer. Why is it that you start off in small pots and keep jumping up in size as they outgrow the pot? I mean I don't get why you don't go from something the size of a red solo cup to what ever size you intend to use till the end? Seems like there would be far less stress on both man and plant??? Am I missing something important?

 

[FiveToMidnight]

Hey 5, if I may ask a really dumb question here, maybe you or one of the others can answer. Why is it that you start off in small pots and keep jumping up in size as they outgrow the pot? I mean I don't get why you don't go from something the size of a red solo cup to what ever size you intend to use till the end? Seems like there would be far less stress on both man and plant??? Am I missing something important?

No question is a dumb one unless you already know the answer to it lol.
But I actually asked pretty much the same question earlier in the thread. Unfortunately I can't remember the detailed answers that were given and I had too much wake and bake but basically its to allow the roots to form a tight ball keeping them strong and healthy and also means you don't have to use as much water and nutes early on.
I'm sure others will look at that and say its a terrible explaination but someone will be able to give you a good one. I think OldMedUser had a good explaination in the first few pages of the journal of you want to try and search it

 

[McCdive]

Will do, thanks.