Help - identifying deficiency/excesses

[guerrillabalconygrower]

First time grower. All plants growing in well draining potting mix and natural sunlight. Organic fertilisers only. Plants have developed some problems. Need help identifying and correcting.

Soil is mixed with vermi-compost & organic manure. Weekly supplementation using a standard all purpose organic fertiliser for flowering plants. Constituents below.

I do have a small pest problem (tiny white spots on leaves). Have been able to manage it using neem oil. But I think the problems with my plants are beyond just just mites and insects. Please help!

Plant 1: Blueberry Auto. Age 2-3 weeks. Brown spots on lower leaves, burnt tips and a couple wilted.

Plant 2: Sherbet auto. Age 2 weeks. Brown/ grey spotting.

Plant 3: Landrace photoperiod. Age 1.5 months. Everything that can possibly grow wrong, has. Not sure if it’s deficiency or excesses. Leaves have curled over themselves. New leaves and old ones have burnt tips. Lower leaves wilting.

Plant 3: Blueberry auto. Age 3-4 weeks.
Brown/ grey discolouration on leaves. Burnt tips.

 

[VetSmoke85]

I'm no expert but my first thought is bad soil and over watering. The soil looks really compact. How often and how much are you watering? It's easier to manage a good wet/dry cycle starting in smaller pots and transplanting as they get bigger.

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

Once every 2 days. I follow the 2inch dry soil thumb rule. Daytime Temp here is from 26-30 deg C. Enough of surface evaporation.

 

[VetSmoke85]

Once every 2 days. I follow the 2inch dry soil thumb rule. Daytime Temp here is from 26-30 deg C. Enough of surface evaporation.

How much? Small plants really don't need much. Especially in a big pot. Need to let the roots grow and search out the moisture. The 2 inch rule doesn't really work in my experience. Better going by weight of the pot. Have a read of this.

The Proper Way To Water A Potted Plant

The Proper Way to Water a Potted Plant Also covered: the importance of pH and why we successively up-pot How to Water Over the last several years I have put a lot of study into this, and I feel that I can now define the proper way to water a potted plant. Keep in mind that this discussion...

www.420magazine.com

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

How much? Small plants really don't need much. Especially in a big pot. Need to let the roots grow and search out the moisture. The 2 inch rule doesn't really work in my experience. Better going by weight of the pot. Have a read of this.

The Proper Way To Water A Potted Plant

The Proper Way to Water a Potted Plant Also covered: the importance of pH and why we successively up-pot How to Water Over the last several years I have put a lot of study into this, and I feel that I can now define the proper way to water a potted plant. Keep in mind that this discussion...

www.420magazine.com

Average 500ml (0.5L) per pour. Each pot is close to 10L in volume.

Edit: for the sapling, I only water around the main stem (100-200ml, if that)

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

What I’m keen to know is if anyone can identify possible deficiencies/ excesses based on the leaf pics.

My assumption is that nutrient excess is highly unlikely since I’m using organic fertilisers. But happy to be wrong.

 

[VetSmoke85]

Well I asked about watering practices and soil quality as they can be the cause of deficiencies. Need healthy roots to absorb the nutrients. Hopefully someone else will jump in to help you.

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

I in

Well I asked about watering practices and soil quality as they can be the cause of deficiencies. Need healthy roots to absorb the nutrients. Hopefully someone else will jump in to help you.

I understand. Thanks! I doubt the soil to be VERY poor since it’s commercially bought kitchen garden soil, mixed with perlite, sand, vermicompost and organic manure. My hunch though, is towards phosphorous/ magnesium deficiency

 

[CelestialNurseries]

doubt the soil to be VERY poor since it’s commercially bought kitchen garden soil

I'm going to send this to the people at Miracle Grow...they should have a good laugh...in all reality it's just not that easy to take one look and give a diagnosis. Example...to much Nitrogen can cause a lockout of iron...but you will only see yellowing leaves that look like lack of Nitrogen to a newer grower...this is why most growers that come to help need to know everything about the grow.

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

I'm going to send this to the people at Miracle Grow...they should have a good laugh...in all reality it's just not that easy to take one look and give a diagnosis. Example...to much Nitrogen can cause a lockout of iron...but you will only see yellowing leaves that look like lack of Nitrogen to a newer grower...this is why most growers that come to help need to know everything about the grow.

Hence new growers come to expert forums to seek help, right?

 

[Emilya Green]

I in

I understand. Thanks! I doubt the soil to be VERY poor since it’s commercially bought kitchen garden soil, mixed with perlite, sand, vermicompost and organic manure. My hunch though, is towards phosphorous/ magnesium deficiency

Plants of this age don't use a lot of phosphorous or anything else other than Nitrogen. I don't think lack of nutrition or the quality of the soil is your problem. You have confirmed you are an overwaterer with your 2 inch rule. That seems to be the only problem here, you are drowning your roots by watering way too often. Get a moisture meter and learn to use it correctly or learn the lift the pot method, and start employing the wet/dry cycle to help your plant.

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

Plants of this age don't use a lot of phosphorous or anything else other than Nitrogen. I don't think lack of nutrition or the quality of the soil is your problem. You have confirmed you are an overwaterer with your 2 inch rule. That seems to be the only problem here, you are drowning your roots by watering way too often. Get a moisture meter and learn to use it correctly or learn the lift the pot method, and start employing the wet/dry cycle to help your plant.

Ordered a soil moisture meter. Should know if overwatering is the problem by tomorrow

 

[CelestialNurseries]

Hence new growers come to expert forums to seek help, right?

Only if they are willing to listen. If you have top notch soil you should have no nute problems this early.

 

[Emilya Green]

Ordered a soil moisture meter. Should know if overwatering is the problem by tomorrow

When you get your moisture meter you will need to learn to use it... its not as intuitive as you might think. There is only one valid reading on that meter, in all its 3 settings. The pH meter is crap and the light meter is basic and the moisture meter can only show you one thing... where the top of the lake underneath your soil is. When you water, gravity grabs that moisture and pulls it down to the bottom of the container. I suspect that this virtual lake fills 1/3 to 1/2 of your container and every time you water, you raise its level once again so that your lower roots NEVER dry out or see the oxygen that they crave.

Stick your meter probes into the soil and watch as you slowly lower the probes toward the bottom. The meter will read moist... moist... moist... and then suddenly when you hit the top of the water table, it will peg all the way to the right indicating WET. Track where this happens through a few days and watch that water table drop down toward the bottom as the plant uses up that water. It is not time to water until the top of that lake falls down into the bottom inch or two of the container. It won't dry out down there because of capillary action between the roots and the bottom and sides of the container, but as soon as you can see that the water has fallen down that far, it is safe to water.

With water damaged roots, it might take a week or more to dry out your container the first time. Be patient, even if it takes 10 days. Each time you get through a solid wet/dry cycle, your roots will get stronger, and the duration between waterings will diminish. The second time, instead of a week, it might just take 5 days to dry out, and the next time 3 days. Your plant will be getting bigger and healthier as this happens, and eventually, when the plant can dry out your container in a day, it is time to transplant to a bigger container.

Rootballs do not happen by accident. You have to force your plants to work toward that goal and to do that you have to be stingy with their water. A coddled plant will be a weak plant whereas a plant that has been forced to work for its water will be a strong survivor.

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

When you get your moisture meter you will need to learn to use it... its not as intuitive as you might think. There is only one valid reading on that meter, in all its 3 settings. The pH meter is crap and the light meter is basic and the moisture meter can only show you one thing... where the top of the lake underneath your soil is. When you water, gravity grabs that moisture and pulls it down to the bottom of the container. I suspect that this virtual lake fills 1/3 to 1/2 of your container and every time you water, you raise its level once again so that your lower roots NEVER dry out or see the oxygen that they crave.

Stick your meter probes into the soil and watch as you slowly lower the probes toward the bottom. The meter will read moist... moist... moist... and then suddenly when you hit the top of the water table, it will peg all the way to the right indicating WET. Track where this happens through a few days and watch that water table drop down toward the bottom as the plant uses up that water. It is not time to water until the top of that lake falls down into the bottom inch or two of the container. It won't dry out down there because of capillary action between the roots and the bottom and sides of the container, but as soon as you can see that the water has fallen down that far, it is safe to water.

With water damaged roots, it might take a week or more to dry out your container the first time. Be patient, even if it takes 10 days. Each time you get through a solid wet/dry cycle, your roots will get stronger, and the duration between waterings will diminish. The second time, instead of a week, it might just take 5 days to dry out, and the next time 3 days. Your plant will be getting bigger and healthier as this happens, and eventually, when the plant can dry out your container in a day, it is time to transplant to a bigger container.

Rootballs do not happen by accident. You have to force your plants to work toward that goal and to do that you have to be stingy with their water. A coddled plant will be a weak plant whereas a plant that has been forced to work for its water will be a strong survivor.

Thank you. Fingers crossed!

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

When you get your moisture meter you will need to learn to use it... its not as intuitive as you might think. There is only one valid reading on that meter, in all its 3 settings. The pH meter is crap and the light meter is basic and the moisture meter can only show you one thing... where the top of the lake underneath your soil is. When you water, gravity grabs that moisture and pulls it down to the bottom of the container. I suspect that this virtual lake fills 1/3 to 1/2 of your container and every time you water, you raise its level once again so that your lower roots NEVER dry out or see the oxygen that they crave.

Stick your meter probes into the soil and watch as you slowly lower the probes toward the bottom. The meter will read moist... moist... moist... and then suddenly when you hit the top of the water table, it will peg all the way to the right indicating WET. Track where this happens through a few days and watch that water table drop down toward the bottom as the plant uses up that water. It is not time to water until the top of that lake falls down into the bottom inch or two of the container. It won't dry out down there because of capillary action between the roots and the bottom and sides of the container, but as soon as you can see that the water has fallen down that far, it is safe to water.

With water damaged roots, it might take a week or more to dry out your container the first time. Be patient, even if it takes 10 days. Each time you get through a solid wet/dry cycle, your roots will get stronger, and the duration between waterings will diminish. The second time, instead of a week, it might just take 5 days to dry out, and the next time 3 days. Your plant will be getting bigger and healthier as this happens, and eventually, when the plant can dry out your container in a day, it is time to transplant to a bigger container.

Rootballs do not happen by accident. You have to force your plants to work toward that goal and to do that you have to be stingy with their water. A coddled plant will be a weak plant whereas a plant that has been forced to work for its water will be a strong survivor.

What about the small seedling though? It’s root depth may be 3-4 inches from top and the water lake could be a good few inches below it. Will this not dry out the seedling ?

 

[Emilya Green]

What about the small seedling though? It’s root depth may be 3-4 inches from top and the water lake could be a good few inches below it. Will this not dry out the seedling ?

This is why it is NEVER recommended to start seedlings in large containers. What you are not considering is that a seedlings first goal is to find the bottom of the container with its tap root, and this will happen in the first 3 or 4 days above ground. If you can give that seedling a little bit of water down the middle at first, without soaking the entire container, the root will do what it needs to do. Please read my second article on proper watering which addresses this problem.

The Proper Way To Water A Seedling In A Large Final Container

In the beginning, you may even want to start your seed directly in the final container, simply by putting it one inch deep, pointy end down. It is surprising to some how often this works, even though mother nature does it all the time. If you go this route, lightly mist the area around the...

www.420magazine.com

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

This is why it is NEVER recommended to start seedlings in large containers. What you are not considering is that a seedlings first goal is to find the bottom of the container with its tap root, and this will happen in the first 3 or 4 days above ground. If you can give that seedling a little bit of water down the middle at first, without soaking the entire container, the root will do what it needs to do. Please read my second article on proper watering which addresses this problem.

The Proper Way To Water A Seedling In A Large Final Container

In the beginning, you may even want to start your seed directly in the final container, simply by putting it one inch deep, pointy end down. It is surprising to some how often this works, even though mother nature does it all the time. If you go this route, lightly mist the area around the...

www.420magazine.com

But I did not start the seed in its final container. Started it in a jiffy pellet and moved it to the container when it’s taproot had reached the bottom of the jiffy.
Being an auto flower, I went by the logic/ advice of “transplant an auto only once, directly to the final container.”

 

[Emilya Green]

But I did not start the seed in its final container. Started it in a jiffy pellet and moved it to the container when it’s taproot had reached the bottom of the jiffy.
Being an auto flower, I went by the logic/ advice of “transplant an auto only once, directly to the final container.”

Sorry, but you fell into the Auto trap and followed bad advice. The bad advice usually given toward Autos is to NEVER transplant them, by starting them in their final container, so at least you started in a jiffy pot. There is NO LOGICAL REASON to never transplant an Auto, they are simply a plant just like their photoperiod cousins, and have no special rules. I don't generally grow Autos, but when I do, I successively uppot them 2 or 3 times and again contrary to the bro-science advice all over the internet, I feed them heavily.

Transplanting as soon as the tap root hit the bottom of your jiffy pot was also a mistake. Uppotting should not be a race to see how fast you can get it in the next container. Starting in a small pot is your first chance to force your plant to fill up that small space with roots by beginning to train the plant to the wet/dry cycle. You did not do that, you instead leapt into the next container as fast as you could.

 

[guerrillabalconygrower]

Th

Sorry, but you fell into the Auto trap and followed bad advice. The bad advice usually given toward Autos is to NEVER transplant them, by starting them in their final container, so at least you started in a jiffy pot. There is NO LOGICAL REASON to never transplant an Auto, they are simply a plant just like their photoperiod cousins, and have no special rules. I don't generally grow Autos, but when I do, I successively uppot them 2 or 3 times and again contrary to the bro-science advice all over the internet, I feed them heavily.

Transplanting as soon as the tap root hit the bottom of your jiffy pot was also a mistake. Uppotting should not be a race to see how fast you can get it in the next container. Starting in a small pot is your first chance to force your plant to fill up that small space with roots by beginning to train the plant to the wet/dry cycle. You did not do that, you instead leapt into the next container as fast as you could.

Damn. So when is the right time to move from a jiffy to an intermediate container?

Because the tap root starts poking out of the pellet mesh in a week to 10 days and I feared it may start damaging the root due to air exposure. Hence, moved it to the final container after about 10 days of germinating