Help with my plants!

[MCalata]

Hey growers, I need your help. I have 2 White Widow and 3 Sour Diesel. I'm at about 50 days far in vege. Growing in peat and perlite (70/30). I feed them at a pH around 5.8 and transplanted them just yesterday, they were getting root bound. I'm running a 600w diy led fixture with Samsung leds 3500k in a 4*8 tent, but gonna be using 4*4 to flower them.
They have been showing multiple signs of deficiency and slow growth but I can't really tell why, what do you guys think?

 

[013]

Hey MCalata,

Welcome to 420! To help we need more info.... They look hungry - What are you feeding them?

Can you tell us more about the soil mix - did you mix peat moss with perlite yourself or did this come pre-mixed in a bag and then you added the 30% perlite? pics or brand name might help

Where in the house do you grow? What kind of floor is under the tent? What are your temps & rh?

 

[MCalata]

Hey 013,

Thanks for the quick response man!
I did fuck up a little before symptoms started appearing and forgot/was waiting for the media to dry out a little bit, and didn't water them for 10 days.
they used to be in 2.5 gallon pot and yesterday got transplanted to 6.6 gallon containers.

I'm running a line of organic fertilizer specific for weed, made by a local guy, its nothing you guys would recognize. As a side note I'm using RO water that comes out at between 40 - 80 PPM cause my tap water comes out at 1200 - 1400 PPM, yeah it sucks.

Yeah, I bought a bag of peat (only peat, no perlite added) and a bag of perlite and mixed them myself, pics or brand wont help either cause I'm not located in the us. I want to say I'm not digging peat, I would rather use coco but i couldn't find enough at the time.

I live in a 1 room apartment so I sleep right by my tent, under the tent i put a 3/4 piece of chipboard/fiberboard (? basically some manufactured wood) the pots are raised from the floor so they shouldn't be sucking cold from the floor. My temps have been ranging from 68f to 75f, RH stays at about 50 to 65 (more on the 60 to 65 this last days)

Appreciate the help!

 

[Emilya Green]

It looks to me like a primarily iron deficiency but with traces of calcium being deficient too. This makes me wonder both if the special nutrients have these elements in there and since you are growing white widow, a traditionally heavy feeder, I wonder if you have been trying to feed lightly. If so, give them the whole load from now on... your plants are hungry.

 

[013]

Ok cool man - no worries! Peat & perlite will hold up a plant but they are inert and have no nutrients to sustain a plant. Homemade or organic ferts are fine hopefully he knows what he is doing. New growth does often come in lighter green but your crew look hungry for more nutes plus if I’m seeing correctly one plant appears to be variegated or the leaf is twisted and is an optical illusion that appears like variegation

 

[Ghostwriter31]

How close are your lights ? They look to be sunburned possibly ?

 

[MCalata]

It looks to me like a primarily iron deficiency but with traces of calcium being deficient too. This makes me wonder both if the special nutrients have these elements in there and since you are growing white widow, a traditionally heavy feeder, I wonder if you have been trying to feed lightly. If so, give them the whole load from now on... your plants are hungry.

Maybe i didn't express my self correctly. The company that makes the fertilizer is from a guy that owns a grow shop and has manufactured many weed related products like the pots im using. I didnt mean he's a random guy making nutrients in his garage. He also shows his own plants grown with his nutrient line and they do look great. I'm wondering if my deficiencies come from the fact im using RO water + soilless. Maybe i should start using CalMag?
I did feed light at the beginning of veg, but I'm feeding full strength now, maybe i should try and feed them a little more than what the bottle says.

 

[MCalata]

Ok cool man - no worries! Peat & perlite will hold up a plant but they are inert and have no nutrients to sustain a plant. Homemade or organic ferts are fine hopefully he knows what he is doing. New growth does often come in lighter green but your crew look hungry for more nutes plus if I’m seeing correctly one plant appears to be variegated or the leaf is twisted and is an optical illusion that appears like variegation

Nice that's one of the things i haven't been able to find in deficiency guides, VARIEGATION, new word for me.

Is this genetics or also some kind of deficiency?(it seems like genetics according to what im reading)

 

[MCalata]

How close are your lights ? They look to be sunburned possibly ?

They are at about 18 inches, runing them at about 50% power

 

[013]

I’ve never used RO personally but I believe you are correct that cal-mag is necessary for RO. Variegation is genetics as far as I know but that looks pretty bizarre... I’m hoping Ms Emilya will swing back thru before signing off for the night

 

[Emilya Green]

Maybe i didn't express my self correctly. The company that makes the fertilizer is from a guy that owns a grow shop and has manufactured many weed related products like the pots im using. I didnt mean he's a random guy making nutrients in his garage. He also shows his own plants grown with his nutrient line and they do look great. I'm wondering if my deficiencies come from the fact im using RO water + soilless. Maybe i should start using CalMag?
I did feed light at the beginning of veg, but I'm feeding full strength now, maybe i should try and feed them a little more than what the bottle says.

Well, you have an iron deficiency. There has to be a reason for it. It cant be from the RO but ask your guy if his nutes were designed to be used with soilless. Tell him that you are using the proper pH for soilless and see if he can explain what is happening. Calmag is only going to help with the calcium part of it, not the iron. You could try feeding them more, but this is a severe and specific deficiency... if it was just underfeeding other deficiencies would be also appearing.

 

[MCalata]

Well, you have an iron deficiency. There has to be a reason for it. It cant be from the RO but ask your guy if his nutes were designed to be used with soilless. Tell him that you are using the proper pH for soilless and see if he can explain what is happening. Calmag is only going to help with the calcium part of it, not the iron. You could try feeding them more, but this is a severe and specific deficiency... if it was just underfeeding other deficiencies would be also appearing.

I think i'm gonna go ahead and try some cal mag to cross it out as one of the possible reasons for the deficiency.
I also bought the peat from him, i actually spoke with him a couple days ago and he was the one that told me I should transplant them to bigger pots.
I was just talking with a friend of mine and he pointed out I should be watering as you would water coco, since peat and coco are soilless.
His nutrients tell me to feed part A once a week and part B 3 times a week. I haven't been really following those directions cause i wanted to let the peat dry out a little bit. Ill try and follow the directions and see if they get better and report back.

Thanks a ton!

 

[Buds Buddy]

I think i'm gonna go ahead and try some cal mag to cross it out as one of the possible reasons for the deficiency.
I also bought the peat from him, i actually spoke with him a couple days ago and he was the one that told me I should transplant them to bigger pots.
I was just talking with a friend of mine and he pointed out I should be watering as you would water coco, since peat and coco are soilless.
His nutrients tell me to feed part A once a week and part B 3 times a week. I haven't been really following those directions cause i wanted to let the peat dry out a little bit. Ill try and follow the directions and see if they get better and report back.

Thanks a ton!

Dude, not to be an ass, but to let you know first hand.... Emilya is one of the very best growers on this site. She's been at this for.... well, probably longer then 1/2 the members have been alive. She's tried almost every way of growing & also makes her own nutes. So if you're smart & really want to learn to be a good grower, quit doubting her & take her advice & run with it. You will not regret it. I learned from her 4 years ago & I rarely have an issue with my plants nutrition.
Just felt you should know a little more about Emilya. She is one of the best.

 

[MCalata]

Dude, not to be an ass, but to let you know first hand.... Emilya is one of the very best growers on this site. She's been at this for.... well, probably longer then 1/2 the members have been alive. She's tried almost every way of growing & also makes her own nutes. So if you're smart & really want to learn to be a good grower, quit doubting her & take her advice & run with it. You will not regret it. I learned from her 4 years ago & I rarely have an issue with my plants nutrition.
Just felt you should know a little more about Emilya. She is one of the best.

Hey Buds,

I believe you that Emilya is one of the best growers. I'm here to learn from people like her, 013 and you. And i do appreciate you guys checking out my thread!

What i understood from her message was:
1) I have an iron deficiency.

2) If my nutes are designed to be used with soilless peat (they are, the guy that sells them uses them with his own substrate which is the same i used and it works. He has used his nute mix for years and the only difference i can see is he doesnt use RO water).

3) She told me i could try feeding more (I'm gonna try this)

I'm waiting for my nute guy to answer but while I wait I started looking for options for cal mag, the only good/ok brand i could find is AN Sensi CalMag Xtra and if im not mistaken it contains iron. Wouldn't this help my problem?

Once again, appreciate your help.

 

[Roy Growin]

Yes, CalMag +Fe would without a doubt help
I've got a tech chart somewhere showing how the elements interact with its counterpart element, I'll try to dig it out
Could be an excess of x in the mix is causing lockout of y or similar; just a thought

 

[Emilya Green]

I've got a tech chart somewhere showing how the elements interact with its counterpart element, I'll try to dig it out
Could be an excess of x is causing lockout of y or similar

Like this one? Where it says that too much zinc, calcium, manganese, copper, phosphate and molybdenum can cause an iron lockout?

 

[Roy Growin]

Like this one? Where it says that too much zinc, calcium, manganese, copper, phosphate and molybdenum can cause an iron lockout?

Yep, just found it. Like I said, just a thought - don't beat me up again please Emilya ;O))

 

[MCalata]

Like this one? Where it says that too much zinc, calcium, manganese, copper, phosphate and molybdenum can cause an iron lockout?

Yep, just found it. Like I said, just a thought - don't beat me up again please Emilya ;O))

FUCK hahahaha

What would you guys recommend then? I really don't know what to do.

 

[bruno12345]

How are you doing mate?

My take on your problem.

1st Step (an more important one): Call the nutrient factory guy, and as for the composition of the mixture, in terms of NPK, Ca, Mg and microminerals.

The fact that he uses tap water and has success, and you are not, may be because of tap water minerals.
Tap water has many trace minerals, calcium, copper, magnesium, etc.
Some minerals are needed in incredibly minimal quantities, but are NEEDED.
And when you use RO water, you have to assure that your fertilizer can give your plants the whole 17 minerals needed for plant health.

I agree with emylia. i think you have a Calcium deficiency (distorted new growth, narrower basal portion of the upper growth leaflet, slight yellowing of upper growth).
An Iron deficiency, (new growth yellow, and basal portions of upper growth leaves yellowing.
Maybe some othe microminerals deficiencies too. This could include boron, sulfur, etc.

As soon as you know whats in the fertilizer, you will be more prompt to knowing your problem.

And maybe start thinking into changing your nutrients. Try a commercial formula with a known, complete composition.

Also, peat has an very acidic pH. (average 4)
I use peat, vermiculite and dolomitic lime for pH balancing. Dolomitic lime gives your plants Ca and Mg, and buffers pH.
Ask your supplier about medium pH, and if he uses some kind of lime in it.

 

[Roy Growin]

FUCK hahahaha

What would you guys recommend then? I really don't know what to do.

I've hours of discussion on how to interpret this chart
You could add more Fe which would probably help, but...
Fe has a synergy with K, so a dose of high K feed may make more of the existing Fe available to the plant
Excess P would also cause similar results (see the red lines)
Given that you've just up-potted, it may even resolve itself - though I do agree with Bruno re changing nutes for RO water for the reasons he states - you'll work it out!