Phlizon LED Grow Light Valentine's Day Giveaway

[7Dust2]

You've obviously never talked to a real old school outdoor grower! Those fuckers are salty as hell!!!

They're like those people that you try and quote fact to but they say their anecdotal experience trumps your scientific fact.

I tried to explain to an old school outdoor grower I used to work for in Northern California the relationship that DLI, VPD and PPFD had and after a lengthy explanation all he said was "Nope" and walked away......

Hey hey I'm not salty. Just refined

 

[Sativa1970]

You've obviously never talked to a real old school outdoor grower! Those fuckers are salty as hell!!!

They're like those people that you try and quote fact to but they say their anecdotal experience trumps your scientific fact.

I tried to explain to an old school outdoor grower I used to work for in Northern California the relationship that DLI, VPD and PPFD had and after a lengthy explanation all he said was "Nope" and walked away......

I learned from a naturalist, a mad scientist and pure green thumb. They couldn't talk shop because they never agreed on anything. Always insisted the others were wrong and won't listen. Each growers plant thrived in a different way. One valued big colas, one valued terpenes, and one valued cannabinoids.
They also grew vary different strains but agreed on one thing. Stating the best conditions for growing marijuana is like the best condition to grow a tree. You can't grow a tropical strain coconut next to a temperate strain apple and expect them both to thrive. Sometimes the science is just too broad of a stroke.

 

[No Pain]

They also grew vary different strains but agreed on one thing. Stating the best conditions for growing marijuana is like the best condition to grow a tree. You can't grow a tropical strain coconut next to a temperate strain apple and expect them both to thrive. Sometimes the science is just too broad of a stroke.

I also agree and thats why it is Important to understand ppfd and DLI and apply it to the strain you are growing. As they where actually agreeing because of the plants DLI potential.

 

[Olddog Newtrick]

As a new grower, I don’t fully understand exactly how DLI and VPD correlate. But, what I have noticed is, that the community as a whole has come up with kind of a set of guidelines that act as guardrails that help keep us successful. Temp, humidity, par, ph, etc. as long as those are kept within tolerance, the other scientific measurements and elements just fine tune our success. Each strain is unique and it’s that fine tuning that helps us get closer to perfection.
The old schooler have just done that without the scientific measures, they learn what works over time with trial and error and are essentially doing the same thing. Technology just lets us quantify it with a value. For me, par, tds, and ph are the only was to know what I’m doing since I don’t have the experience to rely on.
I also think the strains have changed things a ton. Old schoolers often had limited strains and grew the same regional strains over and over where now, we grow strains and hybrids of those strains from all over the world.

I am familiar with resistors in a rheostat type switch. However I never put much thought into it as I don't focus on turning the lights down. I focus on light distance and prior to my current state the lamps were on a pully system for simplicity. I mentioned it because I see a lot of tent growers use the dimmer / % of power switches on lights and I recently had to use mine in an oh crap moment when I had a massive amount of growth with the use of co2 ( this is my first run with it) that was not anticipated. Mine are dimmed via a phone cable daisy chained to all the lamps that runs to the drivers with a small box with a rheostat switch in it. I can do it that way to dim all or I can hook one up to each one and dim them separately.
The past version the switch / dial with a heavy duty box was mounted on each light but it worked the same.

I don't feel that the Dimmer switch is a Deal Breaker. I look at as if I could make a wish and it would make this even better, that's what it would be.

Note that in my current setup even with the same amount of unexpected growth I wouldn't have been looking to use the dimmer switch as with this light. I still would have had plenty of room to continue to move the lamp up as needed.

don't mention it on the light stats. A good light meter should be a staple in any garden just as much as a ph or nutrient meter. Especially if you are using LEDS ...HPS and HID do not transfer into The LED world ..LEDS give off more ppfd per watt as they are more efficient ... There have been a couple of learning curves in the Hobbie since the introduction of them . The first being the blurple and we are currently in the second adjustment phase with more natural light spectrums and even more efficiency per watt than they had in the beginning. Now with this generation of LED lamps we have more of an ability and are drilling down to real growth using PPFD,DLI and VPD and I feel that is because the low heat and high efficiency of LED's has given us an easier ability to focus on the true ingredients for growth when it comes to Lighting and Environment.

For anyone reading this, I will not make Fun of you if You do not know how PPFD ,DLI And Vpd all tie together to supercharge your growth rate and harvest. I will however beg you to research them. It has helped me tremendously! You will need a light meter to dial it in.

well when growing indoors that's what we do is we bring the outside in . As far as the old school outdoor growers maybe what they need to understand is that are actually utilizing ppfd and dli when picking a plot for the amount of sun that it gets as full high noon sun is 2000 ppfd which equates to 7.2 DLI an hour and the rough max without co2 enrichment is around 40-45 during the peak of certain phases ...so what should that mean to the Old School out door grower if his plot received the full strength of the sun for 6 hours that all the sunlight after that is useless to the plant for any kind of further growth for the day outdoors and it might as well be pitch black as far as plant growth is concerned. I feel that is enough information on there to create the opportunity for further investigation by an Old School farmer if they are truly looking to maximize things indoors and even out doors.

I learned from a naturalist, a mad scientist and pure green thumb. They couldn't talk shop because they never agreed on anything. Always insisted the others were wrong and won't listen. Each growers plant thrived in a different way. One valued big colas, one valued terpenes, and one valued cannabinoids.
They also grew vary different strains but agreed on one thing. Stating the best conditions for growing marijuana is like the best condition to grow a tree. You can't grow a tropical strain coconut next to a temperate strain apple and expect them both to thrive. Sometimes the science is just too broad of a stroke.

 

[No Pain]

As a new grower, I don’t fully understand exactly how DLI and VPD correlate. But, what I have noticed is, that the community as a whole has come up with kind of a set of guidelines that act as guardrails that help keep us successful. Temp, humidity, par, ph, etc. as long as those are kept within tolerance, the other scientific measurements and elements just fine tune our success. Each strain is unique and it’s that fine tuning that helps us get closer to perfection.
The old schooler have just done that without the scientific measures, they learn what works over time with trial and error and are essentially doing the same thing. Technology just lets us quantify it with a value. For me, par, tds, and ph are the only was to know what I’m doing since I don’t have the experience to rely on.
I also think the strains have changed things a ton. Old schoolers often had limited strains and grew the same regional strains over and over where now, we grow strains and hybrids of those strains from all over the world.

Understand that know one is being picked on in any of this. What is stated is no different then people not wanting to switch for hid/hps to LED and I was one of them long ago . Yes those guardrails are there to aid us all and in our endeavor's here in this fantastic place and this topic even in this thread falls in line with them as it came up in a statement suggesting how to use this lamp and it applies to all lights .

I have been growing indoors on and off since the mid 90's and I wish I would have had a community and a place to come such as this back then instead of books and just going with my gut. With That said you stated you are a new grower!

First welcome to a fantastic and rewarding Hobbie, to me there is nothing like it!

now let's dig in a little .The first mention of PAR or the focus on the term came into play when LED lamps first entered the industry and it is a measurement of the spectrum. Prior to that in the hid/hps world it was all about wattage and what spectrum the bulb had.

Let's look at it a tad different shall we ...what PAR is to light is what ingredients are to the nutrients that you use and DLI to light is like the strength of your nutrient solution that you are feeding your plants.

So please indulge me for just a moment and read this about DLI and Cannabis it's a very short read probably shorter that my post. lol

Now that you have taken a look inside DLI and cannabis I'm going to explain how it correlates to VPD. When focusing on VPD you are doing everything you can to create the perfect pressure within the plant for optimum growth and under any circumstance if you are successful in your VPD endeavor it will improve plant growth. Now if you focus a tad more energy on what your DLI is you will Maximize your plant to its fullest potential within its current growth environment without adding anything with the exception of adjusting the height or strength of your light via a dimmer or switch.

I hope this helps at least one person as it has exponentially aided me.

 

[Trump]

Perhaps some visual aids will help. I followed VPD, DLI and PPFD in terms of optimizing each and this is what I got.

 

[OGpapa]

I ain't never followed nothing and this is what I got.


But I am intrigued with the article @No Pain pointed out earlier. I have never taken any of it into consideration. Guess it's time to rethink, especially if I can gain some quality and weight.

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• OGpapa
• Jul 30, 2023

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• OGpapa
• Feb 17, 2024

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• OGpapa
• Jan 31, 2024
• 1

 

[Trump]

I ain't never followed nothing and this is what I got.


But I am intrigued with the article @No Pain pointed out earlier. I have never taken any of it into consideration. Guess it's time to rethink, especially if I can gain some quality and weight.

20230611_131029.jpg

• OGpapa
• Jul 30, 2023

20240216_113442.jpg

• OGpapa
• Feb 17, 2024

20230531_132324.jpg

• OGpapa
• Jan 31, 2024
• 1

I was the same way. Grow by intuition and experience. Once I started taking these tools seriously I noticed that I could repeat the high dry weights I was getting because I had a measureable standard to work off of.

You seem to be a highly experienced grower. These tools will just confirm what you're already doing but they may be able to tweak one part of the equation that you may be low or high on and get ALL cylinders firing!! I don't chase any of these tools but they do help me in regard to staying within that zone you want the girls to thrive in. You're going to use your experience and intuition like you always do but you'll also be able to refer back when you're ALMOST sure you're making the right move.

That's how it worked out for me at least.

 

[OGpapa]

I was the same way. Grow by intuition and experience. Once I started taking these tools seriously I noticed that I could repeat the high dry weights I was getting because I had a measureable standard to work off of.

You seem to be a highly experienced grower. These tools will just confirm what you're already doing but they may be able to tweak one part of the equation that you may be low or high on and get ALL cylinders firing!! I don't chase any of these tools but they do help me in regard to staying within that zone you want the girls to thrive in. You're going to use your experience and intuition like you always do but you'll also be able to refer back when you're ALMOST sure you're making the right move.

That's how it worked out for me at least.

Highly experienced! Bwhahaha you just made my day.

 

[Greengoodness]

I ain't never followed nothing and this is what I got.


But I am intrigued with the article @No Pain pointed out earlier. I have never taken any of it into consideration. Guess it's time to rethink, especially if I can gain some quality and weight.

20230611_131029.jpg

• OGpapa
• Jul 30, 2023

20240216_113442.jpg

• OGpapa
• Feb 17, 2024

20230531_132324.jpg

• OGpapa
• Jan 31, 2024
• 1

I think we've done OK with our ignorance of these terms but i'm open to understanding

 

[KeithLemon]

Those are some nice size colas.

 

[OGpapa]

I think we've done OK with our ignorance of these terms but i'm open to understanding

I agree. But I'm open to the idea of more efficient, robust, and higher quality yield. I'm sick of growing schwaggies! Lol wait. No I love them schwags, but it would be nice to have some unicorn nugget runs.

 

[Sativa1970]

 

[Smokey0418]

Just my personal opinion , ppfd then vpd.

As for DLI , I could never give my plants what those silly charts say without burning them up.

Learn from your mistakes and what works and you can have great success.

 

[No Pain]

Just my personal opinion , ppfd then vpd.

As for DLI , I could never give my plants what those silly charts say without burning them up.

Learn from your mistakes and what works and you can have great success.

@Smokey0418 I think you may be confusing DLI with nutrient strength charts on those charts I have burnt a couple in my time also .

ppfd is used to measure what your DLI (Daily light integral) Its really easy to figure if you know your ppfd

i.e you know that your ppfd is 1000 and you are running a 12/12 light cycle because your in flower. Here is how you figure it

(ppfd) 1000 X (hours of light) 12 X (amount of seconds in an hour) / 1,000,000 =DLI

1000x12=12000 , 12000x3600= 43,200,00 , 43,200,00/1,000,000=DLI of 43.2

here is a basic DLI chart

Now I will say that my focus is on the Maximum DLI I can deliver to my plants and be in the co2 range since i supplement with it and not on the weeks as this chart shows. I haven't gotten that deep into it.

I also agree in learning from my mistakes and have made plenty . My mindset is that I find success through my failures.

 

[Trump]

This ones for Autos....

 

[Smokey0418]

@Smokey0418 I think you may be confusing DLI with nutrient strength charts on those charts I have burnt a couple in my time also .

ppfd is used to measure what your DLI (Daily light integral) Its really easy to figure if you know your ppfd

i.e you know that your ppfd is 1000 and you are running a 12/12 light cycle because your in flower. Here is how you figure it

(ppfd) 1000 X (hours of light) 12 X (amount of seconds in an hour) / 1,000,000 =DLI

1000x12=12000 , 12000x3600= 43,200,00 , 43,200,00/1,000,000=DLI of 43.2

here is a basic DLI chart

Now I will say that my focus is on the Maximum DLI I can deliver to my plants and be in the co2 range since i supplement with it and not on the weeks as this chart shows. I haven't gotten that deep into it.

I also agree in learning from my mistakes and have made plenty . My mindset is that I find success through my failures.

Yes the dli guide.

There’s magic and havoc on that page.

I do push at 900 ppfd through flower which will run close to the chart , but in veg I’m way off for best results.

I am working more towards that one could have great results with 26 dli in flower.

 

[Olddog Newtrick]

I’m lazy

Daily Light Integral (DLI) Calculator | Waveform Lighting

With a PPFD input value and total hours of use per day, Daily Light Integral (DLI) values can be calculated using our online calculator.

www.waveformlighting.com

 

[No Pain]

Yes the dli guide.

There’s magic and havoc on that page.

I do push at 900 ppfd through flower which will run close to the chart , but in veg I’m way off for best results.

I am working more towards that one could have great results with 26 dli in flower.

I will agree that people can have great looking flowers at 26 DLI . Heck the florescent tubes I started with back in the 90s gave me nice looking flowers now granted they were like 2 inches away lol . Those plants didn't produce a lot of bud due to the light. I should go pick up a fixture i used two footers and put might light meter under it and do the math ..i would bet the dli would probably be like 10 lol . The biggest problem that you can run into not understanding DLI is giving your plants more light than they will use in a day which you can easily do with LED lights and that is just a waste of electricity and added heat.

Led lamps have come along way there are some out there even for small tents that would require you to run co2 to use all the light you are getting from it at recommended distances ...this is way different than going and buying an hps or hid buld and looking at the box and going hell yeah this puts out 60,000 lumens .

Looking at your DLI gives you the opportunity to increase your harvest weight for the particular strain you are running , the same way hid and hps lamps did when people moved from fluorescent's to them.

Note that this is the first time I have ever put DLI into my grow equation and When it comes to DLI my Focus is to hit 60 DLI since I'm running co2 at 1200 ppm in the room as well as vpd to get everything I can out of my girls and OH My is it working ..Its working so good that its scary . Thats one of the reasons I shared ..to help

 

[Sativa1970]

In nature the suns max summer veg is 950 PPFD and down to 550PPFD at end of flower in fall. That is a DLI of 61.5 veg steadily dropping to below 24 DLI by harvest. Most grower start by trying to get there indoor grow to emulate a natural outdoor grow. If you start fallowing the DLI chart first you are inversing nature and only part of the environment. The chart shows the last step, of an absolute max DLI, on a clinically perfected grow.