Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon Haze

[Graytail]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Heck, take off the small sucker branches, too. If you do it now, the energy will just go into the upper buds and you won't lose yield.

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Hey bud, sorry that should have said 30% PERCENT Oxygen at the roots. My 5 key is finicky at times lol.

Coco is virtually impossible to overwater, and I've seen growers discuss on a number of occasions, that it will always maintain around 30% oxygen at the roots.
Where with soil, it's very easy to over water.

Just some things to keep in mind when you compare them, and see which medium will work best for you. Soil isn't for everyone, and coco isn't for everyone. It's all a matter of which one fits the grower, and environment best

Your plants look great man!

As for the undergrowth, I try to remove all of it below my main canopy while in Veg. If it's not getting direct light, usually it'll end up being a tiny tiny popcorn bud, which doesn't seem bad until you need to trim them all. I left a bunch of it on my last grow, and it wasn't fun to deal with. So this grow I took the easy route, and I've removed all of it. When I switch to flower, I continue defol up until day 35 (sometimes a little past that), but always removing much less each time than I did in Veg, so I don't put too much of a shock on the plant.

I haven't had a hermy yet, and I'm trying to continue my grows without getting one

No worries Antics, and thanks for clarifying things

The runoff lids were bone dry today and I watered each about 48oz (3 pints). This brought about 20-30% runoff for 3 of the plants, but the one growing in Slacker, Vera, retains the solution much more so I gave it the rest of the batch, an extra 54oz, in addition to the original 48oz, and it still only showed less than 10% runoff! Really amazing what that stuff can hold.

I must admit that I do like the fact that coco cannot really be over watered. That seems like a bonus to me as I feel I have a tendency, probably like many people, to overdo it. There are clearly pluses and minuses to both coco and soil and I totally get what you mean when you say it really depends on the grower and the environment. I guess it's really more of a choice or a preference rather than a straight up comparison of which is better for the plants. In my mind, whatever choice I make has to work well for me too!

You're lucky that you haven't had a hermie, IMHO. In my first grow, which was only one (Blue Dream) plant, it hermied at some point (I believe in flower, but I should go and look again since I forget exactly when it happened), and the seeds ended up accounting for roughly half the dry yield weight! That is a lot of seeds and much more weight than I would've expected or wanted. I know that too much stress or light leaks can cause them to hermie, so I'm really hoping this time the stress isn't too much and they all bloom some beautiful sensemilla buds. That would be really awesome!!! Oh, and I did keep all the Blue Dream hermie seeds, just in case I want to grow it again. My understanding is they should be feminized seeds with the likelihood of them growing into hermies being low. I have some other seeds from the seed bank too and would like to grow it again sometime.

I think there are a number of reasons my last plant could've hermied. My theory is it was one of these, but there is probably no way to know for sure...

1. seed genetics were predisposed toward growing into hermies (apparently this is not uncommon for some clone-only strains)
2. plant was over stressed by fungus gnat situation
3. environment got too hot (into the 90s) for a while until I got ventilation and cooling sorted out
4. there was some light leak when I tried going in during the dark cycle (this may have happened early on in the grow before I got the room and surrounding area insulated from outside light)
5. pH was far off of target since I was initially using a pH kit using test strips and trying to match the color to the bottles - it was nearly impossible for me to get it within +/- 0.5, so pH could've been seriously wrong

All of those issues I believe are now addressed, so hopefully any chance of hermies is much more remote, but that does make me want to keep the high stress activities (such as supercropping) down to a minimum while still being effective. I'll be very curious to see how my supercropping handywork looks in a couple of days.

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Heck, take off the small sucker branches, too. If you do it now, the energy will just go into the upper buds and you won't lose yield.

OK, sounds good. But, how do I determine if they are small enough branches? Are there any rules of thumb?

Some of the lower branches are somewhat thick, or at least strong and rather substantial.

Also, would I just snip them near where they meet the main trunk? Maybe I'll try taking one off and see how the plants does over a couple of day.

BTW, I supercropped 2 top branches on one plants and 1 branch on second plant. I chose the "pre-colas" that were the tallest as I want to try and keep them from growing much taller. I took a bunch of pics and will post them tomorrow. It's getting late here now...

 

[Graytail]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

I had to be talked into doing it on one of my first grows.

Just snip off some of the useless branches and you'll reach an end point that's comfortable for you. If you're using a 600 watt hps? over those plants, you probably want to keep a shallow canopy of 12-18 inches. Anything farther than that from the tops won't bloom well. Judge the lower branches by where their tops are. If they're tall and up with the rest of the bunch, leave 'em, no matter how low on the stem they are. If they're lagging below the others, snip 'em off.

You're only really going to get good buds in the top 12-18 inches.

Oh, and make the cut right at the stem, leaving just 1/16 inch or so (scissor blade width?), to make sure the outer bark isn't disturbed.



[Edit] Tomorrow, I'm going to trim up one of my plants. I'll take pics and post it on my journal.

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

I had to be talked into doing it on one of my first grows.

Just snip off some of the useless branches and you'll reach an end point that's comfortable for you. If you're using a 600 watt hps? over those plants, you probably want to keep a shallow canopy of 12-18 inches. Anything farther than that from the tops won't bloom well. Judge the lower branches by where their tops are. If they're tall and up with the rest of the bunch, leave 'em, no matter how low on the stem they are. If they're lagging below the others, snip 'em off.

You're only really going to get good buds in the top 12-18 inches.

Oh, and make the cut right at the stem, leaving just 1/16 inch or so (scissor blade width?), to make sure the outer bark isn't disturbed.



[Edit] Tomorrow, I'm going to trim up one of my plants. I'll take pics and post it on my journal.

Wow, sounds like I'll be removing a fair amount down below if I only want to keep the top branches. Makes sense though because that is how the awesome manifold/mainline plants look that I've seen which are just big colas and nothing else. This is definitely what I'm going for and will supercrop, LST, and trim the hell out of them next time a lot more in veg now that I understand this a bit more. You're definitely right, because I remember getting a lot of popcorn sized buds from below on my first plant, and it probably isn't worth having branches for those. I just want to be sure not to shock the plants too much by taking off whole branches, ya know?

I'll check out your journal later today for some pics. Graytail !!

 

[Antics]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Always happy to help out, it's a pleasure stopping by to see your plants, they're absolutely gorgeous.

I like to look at the plant from the side, when determining which branches I'm going to lollipop. On most of the plants I've grown, there are usually 4 main branches from the stem that need to be removed. I've been working on a technique that keeps two of those branches using LST, and it worked on the Cotton Candy I'm growing now, but didn't work the last time I tried it.

Usually these branches will be somewhere between 1/4-3/4 of the way to the top of the canopy, but are crowded out by all the other branches and leaves, so their growth rate is much slower from not getting enough light.

The thickness of the branches is also a good indicator of how well they'll do. Branches that are thick like pens, pencils, joints, cigarettes, and larger, are usually the ones you keep. When the thickness is like one of those thin straws for mixing drinks/coffee/tea, usually those are the ones that will be considered for removal.

Just try various techniques you find here, different growers are all doing something different that you can use, or that gives you a new idea of something to try. It's a little bit of a learning curve, but once you get into your groove, you'll be golden!

Any anyone curious about my training technique, in a nutshell: I find my 4 slowest growing branches. Use LST to train them to grow straight out to the edge of the pot. This is where I find the keepers. The keepers will grow out from under the canopy and start getting light. Once they're getting light, I let them go a few more days, then I tie them off with LST on the opposite edge of the pot, instead of pulling them out, and horizontal, I am LST'ing them to grow almost completely vertical, and if it works, when you change the LST to the opposite side of the pot, it should pull their tops into the light just enough that they grow normally with the rest of the plant.

Now I need to wait until harvest to see what these branches yield, and if it's worth the work or not.

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Always happy to help out, it's a pleasure stopping by to see your plants, they're absolutely gorgeous.

I like to look at the plant from the side, when determining which branches I'm going to lollipop. On most of the plants I've grown, there are usually 4 main branches from the stem that need to be removed. I've been working on a technique that keeps two of those branches using LST, and it worked on the Cotton Candy I'm growing now, but didn't work the last time I tried it.

Usually these branches will be somewhere between 1/4-3/4 of the way to the top of the canopy, but are crowded out by all the other branches and leaves, so their growth rate is much slower from not getting enough light.

The thickness of the branches is also a good indicator of how well they'll do. Branches that are thick like pens, pencils, joints, cigarettes, and larger, are usually the ones you keep. When the thickness is like one of those thin straws for mixing drinks/coffee/tea, usually those are the ones that will be considered for removal.

Just try various techniques you find here, different growers are all doing something different that you can use, or that gives you a new idea of something to try. It's a little bit of a learning curve, but once you get into your groove, you'll be golden!

Any anyone curious about my training technique, in a nutshell: I find my 4 slowest growing branches. Use LST to train them to grow straight out to the edge of the pot. This is where I find the keepers. The keepers will grow out from under the canopy and start getting light. Once they're getting light, I let them go a few more days, then I tie them off with LST on the opposite edge of the pot, instead of pulling them out, and horizontal, I am LST'ing them to grow almost completely vertical, and if it works, when you change the LST to the opposite side of the pot, it should pull their tops into the light just enough that they grow normally with the rest of the plant.

Now I need to wait until harvest to see what these branches yield, and if it's worth the work or not.

Thanks Antics! I think the ladies are appreciating all the attention
I'm going to look at the branches more closely tonight and consider which ones are looking like they should be removed. Definitely appreciate the guidance as I'm new to chopping whole branches (aside from harvest time).

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Here are some pics of my supercropping session from last night. I bent over 2 of the tallest branches on one girl and the tallest one on another lady. Hoping I didn't overdo it! Most of these pics show those specific branches, but some are just general bud or full view pics for variety Please enjoy!

First, some bud pics...

And evidence of some supercropping

As can be seen here, there isn't much room left to raise the light!

Some crazy bushy profiles

 

[Subnoise]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Looking good snack.

 

[Antics]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Looks solid to me.

 

[CCOiler]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Nice update snacks, love the super cropping.

Awesome Information on trimming Antics.

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Hello everyone! Hope you're all having a nice weekend

I've been rather busy the last couple of days, but am glad to be able to finally provide an update and some pics.

ENVIRONMENT:
Temps are steady in the low 60s during lights out and the low 70s during lights on. The range has been about 60-73 degrees, which I think is pretty much in the ideal range during flower. RH measurements vary by up to 10% between my two hygrometers, so I'm not exactly sure what the real RH is at any point in time. The range (taking into consideration both hygrometers) is between 44-72% (or 44-52% by hygro1 and 56-72% by hygro2). I know RH can be pretty important, especially during the last couple of weeks of flower, so I'm wondering if it might be worth getting a better (i.e. more expensive) hygrometer.

FUNGUS GNATS:
The count of adult fungus gnats caught on the yellow sticky traps has remained steady at 59 since 5/12, so nearly two weeks. I'm going to continue adding BTi to the nutrient solution and keep the yellow stickies around as well, but am very happy that the gnat situation appears nipped in the bud, so to speak, or at least very much under control.

TRIMMING:
On 5/20 I took off about 6 lower branches from Sadie (front left) and Tori (front right) and on 5/21 I took off about the same amount from Regina (back left) and Vera (back right). This really opened up the bottoms of the stalks and makes it much easier to water actually. I also trimmed off a bunch of leaves that were in the bottom middle area and likely not getting much light at all. I think there are a few more minor sub-branches that can be removed. By sub-branches I mean branches that are not directly connected to the main stem, but come off of one of the main branches. They all look definitely less bushier than before, but budding production is clearly moving along and I don't see any evidence of stress. Trying to encourage some big fat dank main colas!

WATERING:
I'm still watering with a 70% strength mix using the "week 3" flowering schedule on the GH drain-to-waste chart. Also, still adding Hydroguard and molasses to the mix. I put in 3 tbs of molasses for 4 gal of water for this latest mix. I may raise that to 4 tbs when mixing up the next batch, but I don't think I'm supposed to go higher than 1 tbs/gal.

And now for some pics from the last few days...

 

[CCOiler]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Outstanding snacks, very nice update.

 

[Major PITA]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Great looking plants and nice update!
I need to have a spa day for my gals as well.

 

[Graytail]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

TRIMMING:
On 5/20 I took off about 6 lower branches from Sadie (front left) and Tori (front right) and on 5/21 I took off about the same amount from Regina (back left) and Vera (back right). This really opened up the bottoms of the stalks and makes it much easier to water actually. I also trimmed off a bunch of leaves that were in the bottom middle area and likely not getting much light at all. I think there are a few more minor sub-branches that can be removed. By sub-branches I mean branches that are not directly connected to the main stem, but come off of one of the main branches.

That's something I neglected to do. In the next week or two, I'll trim up the side branches (sub-branches). Vera shows it best in this photo. You can trim 6 inches or more off her side branches. Even the offshoot with those two vertical buds in the upper right might be too low in the canopy to bother with.

 

[Hungaluz]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

very nice update bro ... keepem" green

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Thanks for the support everyone!


So, last night I ended up giving Regina a big snip, with the goal of taking off any extraneous branches that weren't directly supporting the top colas or were buds that were more than about 12" from the top of the canopy. It actually turned out to be quite the haircut! I hope I didn't go too far, and that's why I only snipped her, because if it doesn't work out, I won't do the same for her sisters. I guess I'll know within the next few days if she seems happy. If so, I'll apply the same snipping to the others.

From your experience, are there any comments on whether that extensive snipping was wise or not? I can take the brutal truth

Here are some before and after pics. The change is very visible next to her sisters!

Regina before the haircut

A freshly snipped Regina next to her sister Tori

Sadie

All the girls

A couple of other quick notes.

ODOR:
I noticed as of two days ago the odor coming out of the tent has changed. I saw a couple of threads about this so am not terribly concerned, but prior to this, when I opened the tent I got a nice sniff of the wonderful cannabis smell. Now, when I open the tent I get a very small amount of that smell but more a soil and moisture smell or something along those lines. Hopefully it's not mold or something awful like that. Of course, I will monitor things closely over the next few days, but please chime in if you have any comments about that. And thanks!

WATERING:
As far as watering goes, I've been giving Regina and Sadie 32oz each (daily). Vera get 64oz because she's super thirsty; I'm assuming it's due to the different kind of coco mix she's in (the Slacker amended stuff). And Tori is getting 48oz. Those amounts tend to produce about 10-20% runoff.

&

 

[Graytail]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

It'll be good to see how they compare. Vera's buds will be much better - denser and bigger - but yield may be lower. The timing is a bit late for this sort of trimming. But yes - excellent job!

 

[snack420]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

It'll be good to see how they compare. Vera's buds will be much better - denser and bigger - but yield may be lower. The timing is a bit late for this sort of trimming. But yes - excellent job!

I'm also very interested in seeing the differences in bud production between Regina and the others. Vera isn't actually visible in that particular picture (though she is in the back right). That pic has Regina on the left and Tori in front right. Are you saying for denser and bigger buds I should not take off as much as I did for Regina?

Graytail !!

 

[Graytail]

Re: Snacks - DWC Bucket - 600W MH/HPS Grow Journal - Strawberry Diesel & Super Lemon

Oops, misread the plants.

The plant you did the trimming on will have the denser buds. But since it's in full bloom, it may not yield as much, since it likely won't grow many new bud sites. If you trim before the bloom hormones take over, you'll also get added calyx growth in the upper canopy.