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- #61
StealthtireGr
New Member
Understand, but it's going to be next to impossible to do that once the SCROG starts to fill up! It's in a 1 gallon container now, the others are in a 2.25 gallon containers.
STG
STG
Stealth Tire Grow
- Thread starter StealthtireGr
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- #62
StealthtireGr
New Member
Need Help Here Guys and LADY's!
The Leaves are seriously drying out on the 2 sick Plants, they are Brittle to the touch? Humidity is 55% to 65% and the PH of the Soil is 6.5 to 6.8 and are all the DAMN SAME with regards to soil Fertility according to my electronic meter! Finicky ASS Plants!
All use the same soil, Plants were all transplanted to larger pots on 9-1-09. Now 3 are thriving and 2 are not?
The 2 sick plants are on the left in the chamber. Old Girl just like a TIMEX takes a licking and keeps on ticking, she has been transplanted 5 times and look at her!
I did have some Nute Burn early on, and it set them all back a bit. When I flushed 3 days ago, I used Rain Water of Nuteral PH and no nutes!
sickest one
starting to get sick too:
Healthy one:
Healthy #2:
Group Shot of all 5 Plants:
The Leaves are seriously drying out on the 2 sick Plants, they are Brittle to the touch? Humidity is 55% to 65% and the PH of the Soil is 6.5 to 6.8 and are all the DAMN SAME with regards to soil Fertility according to my electronic meter! Finicky ASS Plants!
All use the same soil, Plants were all transplanted to larger pots on 9-1-09. Now 3 are thriving and 2 are not?
The 2 sick plants are on the left in the chamber. Old Girl just like a TIMEX takes a licking and keeps on ticking, she has been transplanted 5 times and look at her!
I did have some Nute Burn early on, and it set them all back a bit. When I flushed 3 days ago, I used Rain Water of Nuteral PH and no nutes!
sickest one
starting to get sick too:
Healthy one:
Healthy #2:
Group Shot of all 5 Plants:
Soil growing is a much slower process than a hydro grow. Plants may take a week or longer to show all their signs of stress. A flush of your plant may not show immediate repsponses from the flush or other fixes.
I'd give it some more time. Watch them carefully and see if the new growth returns to normal. The new growth is the major thing to watch since all the old growth has already been burned/damaged by the over-nute.
Cheers, and luvin the tires!
I'd give it some more time. Watch them carefully and see if the new growth returns to normal. The new growth is the major thing to watch since all the old growth has already been burned/damaged by the over-nute.
Cheers, and luvin the tires!
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- #64
StealthtireGr
New Member
Hey TEAD: Cool Thanks for the feedback and Kudo's!
I've been watching the "New Growth" for 3 days and it seems to be progressing, not digressing, as of yesterday plant #2 did not show any signs of curl! This morning it does! Plant #2 does have the highest soil PH of all the Plants as well!
Also I have a mix of Lights in the STG Chamber, 4 6500k and 3 2700k grow lights, on a 12/12 cycle.
I have read about curl Problems when going from 20/4 to 12/12, just not sure what needs to be done now to save the 2 girls, if it's needed at all!
Also I have not given any Nutes for the last 2 weeks, only Water?
STG
I've been watching the "New Growth" for 3 days and it seems to be progressing, not digressing, as of yesterday plant #2 did not show any signs of curl! This morning it does! Plant #2 does have the highest soil PH of all the Plants as well!
Also I have a mix of Lights in the STG Chamber, 4 6500k and 3 2700k grow lights, on a 12/12 cycle.
I have read about curl Problems when going from 20/4 to 12/12, just not sure what needs to be done now to save the 2 girls, if it's needed at all!
Also I have not given any Nutes for the last 2 weeks, only Water?
STG
CharlieMopps
New Member
Yes, for a couple weeks after a transplant into fresh soil with micronutrients and everything, you only need plain water. If its been like 2 weeks, you should start with a 1/2 strength nute solution. Have you looked into organic food like bat guano and worm castings? You can make a tea with those and the plants can use it immediately. I'll keep stopin in, keep posting pics.
I wasn't sure how to answer that one. Thanks CharlieMopps. I might suggest a bit lighter nute mix tho... since the babies have a history of nute burn.... but I'm paranoid that way.
Cheers!
Cheers!
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- #67
StealthtireGr
New Member
Hey Charlie: I have not used any of the Worm or Bat Nutes, are they available at most Garden centers? If So I will pick some up!
Also they have been transplanted 12 days, and a NEW P Soil/perlite mix was used with the old high Nitrogen P soil/perlite mix.
3 plants are ok, but 2 are not, so I am trying to figure out what the difference is? I can not find any thing different between the transplanted juviniles to say why 2 would be dfferent than the other 2, unless the condition just hasn't shown up yet in the healthy 2?
STG
Also they have been transplanted 12 days, and a NEW P Soil/perlite mix was used with the old high Nitrogen P soil/perlite mix.
3 plants are ok, but 2 are not, so I am trying to figure out what the difference is? I can not find any thing different between the transplanted juviniles to say why 2 would be dfferent than the other 2, unless the condition just hasn't shown up yet in the healthy 2?
STG
- Thread starter
- #68
StealthtireGr
New Member
Thanks Tead: See above, no nutes last 12 days!
STG
STG
CharlieMopps
New Member
Yes, most garden centers will have it. I just know that organic nutes are tolerated much better than miracle grow. I wouldn't feed every time you water either.
Tyrone Hamilton
New Member
Remind me - do you have a fan on them? Sometimes too much air will dry out the leaves and make them curl under in an effort to save water.
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- #71
StealthtireGr
New Member
Hey OBX: Yeah I have a Fan it's dead center on Old Girl in the Center which reachs all the girls about the same!
The problem started a with one plant now 2!
Honestly I have racked my brain to find a difference between the girls that could explain it, but I am stumped!
STG
The problem started a with one plant now 2!
Honestly I have racked my brain to find a difference between the girls that could explain it, but I am stumped!
STG
Tyrone Hamilton
New Member
Sometimes the girls themselves are different enough to where some have problems and others don't in the same conditions...
I'd guess it's transplant shock combined with the fan sucking a bit too much moisture out of the leaves... but could be other things are affecting the health of the plant, but just now showing up with the added stress of a transplant...
Sometimes it helps to have the fan blow around the plants rather than directly on them. Good luck figuring it out! Soil can be particulary hard since you don't know exactly whats happening where you can't see.
I'd guess it's transplant shock combined with the fan sucking a bit too much moisture out of the leaves... but could be other things are affecting the health of the plant, but just now showing up with the added stress of a transplant...
Sometimes it helps to have the fan blow around the plants rather than directly on them. Good luck figuring it out! Soil can be particulary hard since you don't know exactly whats happening where you can't see.
Stickay
New Member
I don't have an author of what I'm going to give you - for all I know it could have came off of this site lol but... read it, save it, and try to remember it. It will basically help you with any problem you run into and help you diagnose your plants - as people say though - give your plant time to show what's wrong with it - If you see a tiny problem in one node out of 15... common sense - don't OD your plant with something it may not need - know your grow, know what you have gave it, then use process of elimination.
Deficiency Signs:
There are a few good clues which your plants will give you if they are being starved of any of the really essential nutrients. The following discussion should be useful as a guide, but before acting upon lead analysis, it is highly advisable to check for soil acidity, which can produce many of the below symptoms by limiting nitrification and promoting excess uptake of toxic salts. Use litmus paper to test for acidity, and simply follow the directions on the package. Litmus paper can be easily obtained at many drug stores and always at chemical supply houses & nurseries.
Nitrogen Deficiency:
This is the most common problem which users of natural soils will encounter. Nitrogen is absolutely essential for the production of many life-sustaining organic materials in Cannabis, particularly chlorophyll.
Cannabis shows a nitrogen deficiency by a yellowing of the older leaves. The young leaves will remain green, except in severe cases, because in the face of starvation the older leaves give up their nitrogen for the young, and the plant sends whatever nitrogen it can draw up from the soil to the youngest leaves first.
Use of organic fertilizers like manure or chicken dung, plus plowing in some nitrogen-fixing plants like beans, will assure that you won't have this problem. Chemical remedies include nitrochalk or nitrate of soda.
Phosphorous Deficiency:
Phosphorous is another essential element for plant health, and its function appears closely linked with nitrogen. It is needed for the plant's metabolism of sugar, from which much of its energy is derived.
The mature leaves of Cannabis will show phosphorous deficiency first, and they will appear dark, dull green, curled up a bit at the edges. The undersides of the leaves, particularly close to the veins, may show a purple tint. Commercially available triple or super-phosphate will remedy this ailment.
Calcium Deficiency:
While calcium is an absolutely necessary mineral, it is used by Cannabis in minute quantities.
The symptoms of calcium starvation are difficult to detect - they consist of an inhibition of buds which are in the progress of becoming leaf clusters, and a wilting of the tips of the fine lateral roots. Most cultivators of Cannabis won't have to worry if their soil is of sedimentary origin. Commercial remedies for calcium deficiencies are readily available, or you can work in bone meal & chicken feathers (but not in large quantities) to soil you suspect of being calcium deficient.
Magnesium Deficiency:
Magnesium is an integral part of the chlorophyll in all green plants, and serves in other important ways as an activator mechanism.
Symptoms occur first on older leaves, and consist of a yellowing tissues around the veins of the leaf. the leaves will develop a generally 'varicose vein' look very quickly, and the yellowing will then spread over the whole leaf.
Many of the magnesium sulphur compounds available in commercial fertilizers can correct this condition; agricultural epsom salts will be most easily available.
Iron Deficiency:
Cannabis requires only trace amounts of this element, though it is an essential link in the photosynthetic process, as well as in respiration.
Deficiency symptoms look the same as those for magnesium deficiency, but they occur on the younger leaves first. Most plant foods contain enough of this trace element to assure no problems with your grass.
Potassium Deficiency:
Relatively large amounts of potassium are needed by Cannabis at certain growth stages, because this element functions as an activator of essential metabolic activities.
Again, the older leaves will show deficiency signs first. There will be a slight yellowing of the leaves initially, followed rapidly by dark spots and edges of the leaves becoming a bronze-gray. Application of sulfate & muriate of potash will help remedy any such problems.
Sulphur Deficiency:
This deficiency is not common, because most soils have plenty of sulfate.
The symptoms usually occur first in the younger leaves, as opposed to the normal pattern for Cannabis, and amount to a slight general yellowing. This condition soon spreads to the rest of the plant. Any commercial sulfate dressing will work well if you have a sulphur problem.
Boron Deficiency:
This element is necessary for the development of strong stem tissues in Cannabis, and there is usually enough in the soil to prevent problems.
The symptoms are a bit difficult to detect unless they are of a critical nature. They include a swelling of the stem near the base, and the stem will crack open and be very dry & rotten-appearing on the inside.
Again, most plant foods have enough borate in them to prevent this sort of problem.
Chlorine Deficiency:
This disease can be confused with many others, because the symptoms are a general yellowing of the leaves, and a gradual turn in color to bronze or bronze-orange. The one sure indicator is if the tips of the lateral root system become swollen, and if they are much shorter than normal 5" to 7" radial spread just beneath the soil surface.
This is a very uncommon problem, and will not occur at all if any care is taken in seeing that the major nutrients have been supplied, as the chloride ion is associated with many of the major nutrient compounds.
Zinc Deficiency:
This disease will begin to show along about the fifth week in Cannabis, and will result in very small leaves which are wrinkled around the edges and which are faintly yellow along the veins. The distance between nodes on the stem will also be greater than you would expect on a normal plant, in some cases only the top knot of leaves will be viable.
Any plant food containing zinc compounds will do the trick if the problem is caught in time.
Molybdenum Deficiency:
Many soils lack the trace amount of this element which is essential for Cannabis in nitrogen fixation.
Symptoms are a yellowing of the sections of the leaves between the major veins, and this yellowing occurs first on those leaves near the middle of the plant, progressing rapidly to the younger leaves at the extremities. The younger leaves will, in addition, become severely distorted and twisted. The yellowing may not occur if you have been using ammoniacal nitrogen fertilizers, but the twisted young leaves will be a giveaway sign.
Be sure to use a plant food containing a trace amount of this essential element.
Deficiency Signs:
There are a few good clues which your plants will give you if they are being starved of any of the really essential nutrients. The following discussion should be useful as a guide, but before acting upon lead analysis, it is highly advisable to check for soil acidity, which can produce many of the below symptoms by limiting nitrification and promoting excess uptake of toxic salts. Use litmus paper to test for acidity, and simply follow the directions on the package. Litmus paper can be easily obtained at many drug stores and always at chemical supply houses & nurseries.
Nitrogen Deficiency:
This is the most common problem which users of natural soils will encounter. Nitrogen is absolutely essential for the production of many life-sustaining organic materials in Cannabis, particularly chlorophyll.
Cannabis shows a nitrogen deficiency by a yellowing of the older leaves. The young leaves will remain green, except in severe cases, because in the face of starvation the older leaves give up their nitrogen for the young, and the plant sends whatever nitrogen it can draw up from the soil to the youngest leaves first.
Use of organic fertilizers like manure or chicken dung, plus plowing in some nitrogen-fixing plants like beans, will assure that you won't have this problem. Chemical remedies include nitrochalk or nitrate of soda.
Phosphorous Deficiency:
Phosphorous is another essential element for plant health, and its function appears closely linked with nitrogen. It is needed for the plant's metabolism of sugar, from which much of its energy is derived.
The mature leaves of Cannabis will show phosphorous deficiency first, and they will appear dark, dull green, curled up a bit at the edges. The undersides of the leaves, particularly close to the veins, may show a purple tint. Commercially available triple or super-phosphate will remedy this ailment.
Calcium Deficiency:
While calcium is an absolutely necessary mineral, it is used by Cannabis in minute quantities.
The symptoms of calcium starvation are difficult to detect - they consist of an inhibition of buds which are in the progress of becoming leaf clusters, and a wilting of the tips of the fine lateral roots. Most cultivators of Cannabis won't have to worry if their soil is of sedimentary origin. Commercial remedies for calcium deficiencies are readily available, or you can work in bone meal & chicken feathers (but not in large quantities) to soil you suspect of being calcium deficient.
Magnesium Deficiency:
Magnesium is an integral part of the chlorophyll in all green plants, and serves in other important ways as an activator mechanism.
Symptoms occur first on older leaves, and consist of a yellowing tissues around the veins of the leaf. the leaves will develop a generally 'varicose vein' look very quickly, and the yellowing will then spread over the whole leaf.
Many of the magnesium sulphur compounds available in commercial fertilizers can correct this condition; agricultural epsom salts will be most easily available.
Iron Deficiency:
Cannabis requires only trace amounts of this element, though it is an essential link in the photosynthetic process, as well as in respiration.
Deficiency symptoms look the same as those for magnesium deficiency, but they occur on the younger leaves first. Most plant foods contain enough of this trace element to assure no problems with your grass.
Potassium Deficiency:
Relatively large amounts of potassium are needed by Cannabis at certain growth stages, because this element functions as an activator of essential metabolic activities.
Again, the older leaves will show deficiency signs first. There will be a slight yellowing of the leaves initially, followed rapidly by dark spots and edges of the leaves becoming a bronze-gray. Application of sulfate & muriate of potash will help remedy any such problems.
Sulphur Deficiency:
This deficiency is not common, because most soils have plenty of sulfate.
The symptoms usually occur first in the younger leaves, as opposed to the normal pattern for Cannabis, and amount to a slight general yellowing. This condition soon spreads to the rest of the plant. Any commercial sulfate dressing will work well if you have a sulphur problem.
Boron Deficiency:
This element is necessary for the development of strong stem tissues in Cannabis, and there is usually enough in the soil to prevent problems.
The symptoms are a bit difficult to detect unless they are of a critical nature. They include a swelling of the stem near the base, and the stem will crack open and be very dry & rotten-appearing on the inside.
Again, most plant foods have enough borate in them to prevent this sort of problem.
Chlorine Deficiency:
This disease can be confused with many others, because the symptoms are a general yellowing of the leaves, and a gradual turn in color to bronze or bronze-orange. The one sure indicator is if the tips of the lateral root system become swollen, and if they are much shorter than normal 5" to 7" radial spread just beneath the soil surface.
This is a very uncommon problem, and will not occur at all if any care is taken in seeing that the major nutrients have been supplied, as the chloride ion is associated with many of the major nutrient compounds.
Zinc Deficiency:
This disease will begin to show along about the fifth week in Cannabis, and will result in very small leaves which are wrinkled around the edges and which are faintly yellow along the veins. The distance between nodes on the stem will also be greater than you would expect on a normal plant, in some cases only the top knot of leaves will be viable.
Any plant food containing zinc compounds will do the trick if the problem is caught in time.
Molybdenum Deficiency:
Many soils lack the trace amount of this element which is essential for Cannabis in nitrogen fixation.
Symptoms are a yellowing of the sections of the leaves between the major veins, and this yellowing occurs first on those leaves near the middle of the plant, progressing rapidly to the younger leaves at the extremities. The younger leaves will, in addition, become severely distorted and twisted. The yellowing may not occur if you have been using ammoniacal nitrogen fertilizers, but the twisted young leaves will be a giveaway sign.
Be sure to use a plant food containing a trace amount of this essential element.
- Thread starter
- #74
StealthtireGr
New Member
Thanks OBX-Charlie-Stickay and to all who have replied!
OBX: I have the Fan on high now, turned it to low and will see if it helps! I did notice the 2 sick plants ARE getting more movement from the fan than the other 2, but hell OLD Girl is taking a direct impact, and she was just TPed 3 days ago!
STG
OBX: I have the Fan on high now, turned it to low and will see if it helps! I did notice the 2 sick plants ARE getting more movement from the fan than the other 2, but hell OLD Girl is taking a direct impact, and she was just TPed 3 days ago!
STG
- Thread starter
- #75
StealthtireGr
New Member
Well Drastic Measures told the tale! I decided to Pull the sickest Girl, "Sacrifice" her to see what was going on with the root system! Well it seems the roots did not like the Transplant (I believe). Roots were very small and brownish. Any idea how to stimulate the roots on the other sick girl? Airation Holes in the Soil Maybe?
My first clue was the Pots were much "wetter" than the 2 healthy girls, so they could not have been taking in as much water, hense the drying/curling leaves.
I built a Cloner as well this weekend and took the Sickest Girl and made 4 Clones. My thoughts.............. if it was just a root issue then hopefully the Clones will sprout and come back as 4 new girls!
STG
My first clue was the Pots were much "wetter" than the 2 healthy girls, so they could not have been taking in as much water, hense the drying/curling leaves.
I built a Cloner as well this weekend and took the Sickest Girl and made 4 Clones. My thoughts.............. if it was just a root issue then hopefully the Clones will sprout and come back as 4 new girls!
STG
BWC BayArea
Member of the Month: 3rd Place Winner
One point I saw no 1 but OBX touch upon. These plants are all different, even if from clones (genetic make up identical). The experiences clones go thru varies and differs from the point of the cut til the cycle is complete. Seeds obviously differ. Both have this in common just as in most all living, reproductive organisms: There are always going to be runts and sickly progeny. In addition u have a number of plants in a small space. They are or fighting for light as we speak. The more vigorous, hardy girls will shade out the weak, slower girls. The weaker ones become more vulnerable to pest and fungal attack, exacerbating existing problems or the potential for problems of plants in close quarters. My 2 cents. spend it well, lol.
CharlieMopps
New Member
If the plants can't get water cause of underdeveloped roots, you can still mist the leaves and it'll get a drink that way.
- Thread starter
- #78
StealthtireGr
New Member
BWC: I agree with you up to a point, but at this time they were not really figting for light as each plant had it's own "Focused" light source, and all 4 of these girls were all about the same size physically/age from seed. Is it enough light? That remains to be seen, but the other 2 Girls seem perfectlly happy and growing. I agree all 4 plants from SEED that came from the same Bag could be from different Plants, so the genetics could also differ.
One other potential problem that could have triggered the roots is LSTing, "rookie mistake here I believe" as I started LSTing them 2 to 3 days after putting them in the 2.25gl pots! The Girl I pulled 50% of the stalk was laying on/in the Soil, could this have brought on some kind of "Ailment" from the soil, maybe a broken stalk edge that introduced something from the soil it did not like? Here again guys I am new and experimenting quite a bit!
Also the sick girl I have left, was the biggest Juvinile of the 4 Plants that I had in the STG Chamber, so that should rule out Genetic's I would believe, please correct me if I am Wrong?
Charlie: I gave the Sick Girl a good Bath today on her Leaves! Rain Water only!
Honestly I know there is way too many plants in the STG Chamber, and was counting on a couple of Males being in the Group, but all were females, good luck I know, but also causes it's own problems!
I'm also still trying to figure out how all these plants turned out to be girls?
Thanks for helping here guys!
STG
One other potential problem that could have triggered the roots is LSTing, "rookie mistake here I believe" as I started LSTing them 2 to 3 days after putting them in the 2.25gl pots! The Girl I pulled 50% of the stalk was laying on/in the Soil, could this have brought on some kind of "Ailment" from the soil, maybe a broken stalk edge that introduced something from the soil it did not like? Here again guys I am new and experimenting quite a bit!
Also the sick girl I have left, was the biggest Juvinile of the 4 Plants that I had in the STG Chamber, so that should rule out Genetic's I would believe, please correct me if I am Wrong?
Charlie: I gave the Sick Girl a good Bath today on her Leaves! Rain Water only!
Honestly I know there is way too many plants in the STG Chamber, and was counting on a couple of Males being in the Group, but all were females, good luck I know, but also causes it's own problems!
I'm also still trying to figure out how all these plants turned out to be girls?
Thanks for helping here guys!
STG
BWC BayArea
Member of the Month: 3rd Place Winner
Oops
My bad. I just realized after goin back and looking that those are all LSTed. I was thinking that the sick one specifically was 2 plants, damn. Nice LST job. Okay so no shading goin on.............................yet.
My bad. I just realized after goin back and looking that those are all LSTed. I was thinking that the sick one specifically was 2 plants, damn. Nice LST job. Okay so no shading goin on.............................yet.
- Thread starter
- #80
StealthtireGr
New Member
BWC: Key word here is YET! LOL! It's coming I'm sure!
Just got my Electric Bill and was I shocked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! $23 more this month than last! That's running a 18,000 btu A/C unit and the 7 x 23W Lights. If I can come out with 5 to 6 ounces from this grow then it will be a success, and very cost effective when compared to $180 an Ounce I usually pay. The amount of increased productivity in the SHOP from the A/C Unit is not even factored in, as I make my living in this shop as well.
STG
LOL! It's coming I'm sure! Just got my Electric Bill and was I shocked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! $23 more this month than last! That's running a 18,000 btu A/C unit and the 7 x 23W Lights. If I can come out with 5 to 6 ounces from this grow then it will be a success, and very cost effective when compared to $180 an Ounce I usually pay. The amount of increased productivity in the SHOP from the A/C Unit is not even factored in, as I make my living in this shop as well.
STG
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