2014 HeavyWeights Duke It Out for the Silver Coin

[Greenthumb J]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

I'm tellin ya... it's looking sexy, especially since my girl has been out of town for two weeks! But I prefer my girl be "defoliated"

I'm with ya on that Cap. The only "Jungle bush" should be in the grow room!

 

[shanker65]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Capn's looking tough to beat! That girl looks awesome all bent over!

Can't wait to see slings next update.... The info in this thread is going to be priceless.

 

[Skybound]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Question, are both of you flowering under the same wattage lights? If not, will considerations be made in terms of gram per watt, or does that not matter?

 

[s1ingblade]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Looking good cap, I have my work cut out for me. I noticed some signs of deficiency and fed accordingly last night. Ill get some pics and measurements this week

 

[DRM Ranch]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Question, are both of you flowering under the same wattage lights? If not, will considerations be made in terms of gram per watt, or does that not matter?

g/W as a tie breaker would be acceptable in my opinion.

But that begins the slippery slope, g/$, g/m^2, cbd content, etc.

DRM Ranch

 

[TheCapn]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Question, are both of you flowering under the same wattage lights? If not, will considerations be made in terms of gram per watt, or does that not matter?

We will both flower under a 600W HPS light. Sling is going to slum it with me and my 600W Aside from grow method (Capn Style), nutrients (Rock) and light (600W HPS), anything goes.

If you want to figure GPW, we can. But the coin goes to whoever produces the most with this pheno (within the limits of light). Period. Because after all, isn't that what it's all about? Quality too, of course.

I'm pretty sure I will use a SCROG, but I'm going to keep it low, so I can get some nice, long colas. Right now I'm working on keeping it low and producing as many tops as possible, without stunting growth. I don't want to go in and top it in too many places right now. From here out, I'll take one top off every other day or so. I won't top within 10 days of flower. So that means I've about about 3 more weeks were I can top it.

To get 1 GPW, that would be 21.2 zips. I've done it once before (22), but not with this strain. It is incredibly difficult to break the 20zip mark from a single plant under 600W HPS. I've only done it twice, and I'm not sure it's possible with this pheno. I'm trying to think "out of the box" to see what else I can do, within my space and light source. Any suggestions?

 

[TheCapn]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Looking good cap, I have my work cut out for me. I noticed some signs of deficiency and fed accordingly last night. Ill get some pics and measurements this week

Look who showed up to the party. I was beginning to wonder if you were still playing. You been wittbaggin or what? I took the biggest of my two and I'm babying it. I set the other aside.

I'm interested in the deficiency? On my rock plant, I'm only running the fusion grow, plus the root supercharge, and 3ml/gal cal mag. NOTHING more. It seems fine.

 

[shaft09]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

s1ing / Capn,

What do you use to adjust your ppm's? Do you just adjust with water or do you use something else? Sometimes I can use Flora Blend to adjust down, and at other times it seems to make my solution rise. Trying to get a handle on this before the next grow is up and running. Can you guys shed some light?

 

[DRM Ranch]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

ppm up is simply an increase in your part measure which in turn maintains the nutrient ratio they use.

ppm down is just dilution with RO water.

TheCapn explains this in his blogs and various posts here on 420.

DRM Ranch

 

[TheCapn]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

GH VS ROCK

I feel like I'm bloating my own thread with all these posts, but I'm just trying to keep you in the know.

Of the two plants above, GH on the left, Rock, on the right... I chose the GH plant to move forward with for this contest, and set the Rock plant to the side for now. I'll continue to only feed it Rock for the rest of it's vegetative state, but for now I'm going with the bigger one. And I'll feed it rock too, until the end.

But it wasn't because GH performed better. The GH plant on the left started out as a bigger clone. In addition, one cannot compare ONLY two plants side by side, and determine which is better. These are living things and even though they are the same genetics, sometimes one will naturally excel. For a real test, one would need to grow out at least 4 of each.

That said, after a month, I feel like I can safely make these statements about ROCK VS GENERAL HYDROPONICS.

1. Rock nutrients did not out-perform general hydroponics in vegetative growth.

2. General hydroponics did not out-perform Rock nutrients in vegetative growth.

3. Rock nutrients (in veg) are easier to use than GH. You can literally use the grow + supercharge + any cal/mag supplement, and nothing else is required. Best of all, you can actually follow the recipe on the chart, and it works. It would be good for beginners, or stoners. ha. A beginner picks up GH, and it's a little overwhelming, and the recipe on the chart is too strong (at least for hydro).

3.5. Rock doesn't drop out PH like most other nutrients do. I didn't have to use any PH up after adding the nutrients. VERY NICE! And I don't understand why other nutrient companies don't do this.

4. The GH line is more diverse and customize-able, but more difficult to understand. You can use additives like florablend, which I feel gives me an edge. With GH you can also do a "transition" stage where you slowly change the mix over to a flower recipe. However, I rarely do that anyway. I usually change the recipe from full veg to full flower when I switch to 12/12.

5. Rock is slightly more expensive to run, than GH. However, you only need to start up with three things (grow + supercharge + any cal/mag supplement) so getting started might be cheaper with rock.

6. Rock doesn't have a phone number you can call. I went to their web site and found an email address of admin@. I emailed them and never received a response. Since then, I see they updated their web site with the email addresses of their reps. I have not emailed again.

7. I called GH a few weeks ago. The person who answered the phone was SUPER knowledgeable. I wasn't put on hold, I wasn't transferred. Within 5 minutes I had my answers. That's nice.

8. Rock seems to have a broken web site. If you go here: The Rock Nutrients Journey | Rock Nutrients you will notice many of the links are dead. That doesn't have anything to do with the way the nutrients perform, but it's kind of stoner-ish, not to have a professional website.

9. Speaking of "unprofessional", they are paying this guy to advertise for them. Obviously they are not afraid to appeal to cannabis growers. But what they forget, is not everyone thinks it's cool to act and talk like a gangsta. This guy can't get through one sentence without dropping the F bomb. I would like to imagine my nutrient company has chemists in white lab coats behind the scenes, not stoners mixing up some concoction and slapping a label on it. If this guy is representing the company, that's the picture I get in my head. But hey, I may be totally wrong.

[video=youtube;dCtBlBiXELM]

[/video]

In Summary, And I'm speaking in terms of vegetative growth only, if you're a new grower or casual grower looking to simplify, Rock is simple and it performs just as well as GH. I've run a few other lines and have never had one that is significantly better than the other. It seems they all have the right ingredients in there. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend rock nutrients.

When making a decision about what nutrients you should buy, my suggestion remains the same. Find someone who's grow you respect. Get in touch with that person and see if they will help you. If so, go with those same nutrients they are using. That way, you can get help when you need it.

 

[TheCapn]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

s1ing / Capn,

What do you use to adjust your ppm's? Do you just adjust with water or do you use something else? Sometimes I can use Flora Blend to adjust down, and at other times it seems to make my solution rise. Trying to get a handle on this before the next grow is up and running. Can you guys shed some light?

I'm thinking you meant to say "PH".

We use general hydroponics PH up, and PH down.

 

[shaft09]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

No, have no problem with ph. Parts per million is what I have the problem with. Say for instance in very early veg you are trying for 300 ppm's. Mix water and nutes then check with ppm meter and you have 600. What do you do to get to 300?

 

[Skybound]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Hey Cap, my G/W concern was only valid if you were competing a 600w light vs. a 1k light. To get an upper edge on s1ing, have you considered using supplemental CO2? I got some Dry Ale Yeast from the hydro/homebrew store that when mixed with sugar and water stays bubbling for 7-10 days, and I'd bet adding an air stone when it begins to slow down would squeeze out a few more days of CO2. Maybe even only for the first 3-4 weeks of flower it might give you an upper edge?

I just noticed the guy in the Rock nutes video is Mr Greenthumb, creator of that emDogg. Perhaps Rock is targeting a younger or more urbanized type of grower? I did not know they were also a "pH perfect" nute like AN is said to be.

 

[s1ingblade]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Sorry guys (gals too) no matter what I do the pics I took standing straight up and down come out sideways and I just don't have the time to spend the day figuring it out and editing them.
I feel bad enough I cant be here as much as I used to.
So far it looks like the cap'ns specimens are breaking mine BAD!
I "tipped" them a second time and it seemed as if they spooked a bit but the last day or two Im seeing what looks like a mild Calicum deficiency.

So it's back to the ten year old 2.3 MP Nikon digital camera, it's the iphone5 that's making the pics hang sideways "and that aint cool fool!" lol

 

[TheCapn]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

No, have no problem with ph. Parts per million is what I have the problem with. Say for instance in very early veg you are trying for 300 ppm's. Mix water and nutes then check with ppm meter and you have 600. What do you do to get to 300?

um.... add twice the amount of water? Is this a trick question?

Hey Cap, my G/W concern was only valid if you were competing a 600w light vs. a 1k light. To get an upper edge on s1ing, have you considered using supplemental CO2? I got some Dry Ale Yeast from the hydro/homebrew store that when mixed with sugar and water stays bubbling for 7-10 days, and I'd bet adding an air stone when it begins to slow down would squeeze out a few more days of CO2. Maybe even only for the first 3-4 weeks of flower it might give you an upper edge?

I just noticed the guy in the Rock nutes video is Mr Greenthumb, creator of that emDogg. Perhaps Rock is targeting a younger or more urbanized type of grower? I did not know they were also a "pH perfect" nute like AN is said to be.

Thanks for the suggestion, but CO2 Will get sucked out of my room faster than I can add it. Ask Shanker about CO2 gadgets. He is diligently testing these.

>>>Mr Greenthumb, creator of that emDogg. Perhaps Rock is targeting a younger or more urbanized type of grower?

For sure! That's probably the best route for them. I never claimed to be a marketing guy.

 

[TheCapn]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

>>>Im seeing what looks like a mild Calicum deficiency

I can't see it, they look great to me. Thanks for the update.

 

[ronnie6690]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

maybe mild Mag. def , looks like the leaf ridges are raised some in the pics. Cal/mag is the only def I ever get. Looks good bro . got to remember your girls were in the coffin.


Capn , please bloat away love all the details and the simple precise way you explain things.

 

[Greenthumb J]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

>>> What do you do to get to 300?

Add less nutrients into your water.. Clearly you are adding too much of something to get your PPMs so off.

What kind of nutrients brand are you using?

>>> I just noticed the guy in the Rock nutes video is Mr Greenthumb

Also known as B. Real from Cypress Hill.. Very influential guy who ACTUALLY knows a thing or two about cannabis. Yes he created a couple different strains actually. Their band supposedly has a guy in it whos an actual breeder, or at least he's heavily affiliated with Cypress Hill (supposedly like i said!)

>>> maybe mild Mag. def , looks like the leaf ridges are raised some in the pics

Definitely the beginning stages of Mag deficiency. You can see the petioles starting to purple up.. Check the underside of them and of they are developing a purple tint, you got a Mag def.


Defintely Bloat away Capn.. you always have so much going on, and always just tease us with a little snippet here and there!

 

[DRM Ranch]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

Do purple petioles only indicate Magnesium deficiency? I was under the impression that could indicate a couple things.

From what I've read, and I could be way off, the stems indicate magnesium deficiency and the curled up leaves a phosphorus deficiency.

It would seem that knowing what the deficiencies are is only half the issue though. More important is to know why. I wish I had that knowledge.

In any case it is safe to say that being able to contact your nutrient supplier would be helpful, assuming they are knowledgeable, and the product is consistent in formulation.

I do hope s1ing finds a fix for what is not particularly a pleasant situation.

DRM Ranch

 

[Greenthumb J]

Re: 2014 HeavyWeights Duke it out for the Silver Coin with Rock Nutrients

>>> Do purple petioles only indicate Magnesium deficiency? I was under the impression that could indicate a couple things.
From what I've read, and I could be way off, the stems indicate magnesium deficiency and the curled up leaves a phosphorus deficiency.

It really depends on what stage of growth the plant is in, but you're right, plants with a Phosphorous deficiency can look like the petioles are purple, but if you look closely they will be a bit more a reddish colour.

You will be able to tell the difference between the two. Since the plant doesn't need as much Phosphorous during vegetative growth, its safe to say, that s1ing IS experiencing the beginning of a Magnesium deficiency.

If he was in flower, i would be asking him how much Phosphorous is going into his nutrient mix.

>>> I do hope s1ing finds a fix for what is not particularly a pleasant situation.

I do too, but once you've identified the problem, deficiencies are usually pretty easy to fix if you catch them right away.