Testing New LED Lights vs 1000w HPS

[scumbragger]

I'm glad 420 figured it out and I applaud the members here who took the time and money to grow side by side comparisons using LED-GROW's product.

Complaints about the lights not performing as stated generally start to appear within 6 -8 weeks of delivery.

I'm sure LED's are perfect for that extremely unusual condition where ventilation is restricted but for 90% of the growers HID is still king!

Mr-B

I don't think she's giving panels away...But I do find it strange that someone with limited marketing opportunities for their product goes around getting kicked off of every forum site so easily when it's the only way they are making sales is from these sites!

 

[scumbragger]

Oh, one last thing to think about....... Most of the people who are posting these amazing results with the LED's are usually 1st or 2nd time growers.


B

Where are these amazing results? What I see is lousy results by novices who don't know any better being cheered on by us who don't want to be negative and not offend!

 

[Scooby_Snacks]

I don't think she's giving panels away...

Actually, just like SS got a test unit, several others have as well. I know of at least 3 if not 4.

 

[WarBux79]

So what's been bugging me is this... Why do we need the same amount of watts to get the same results??

Facts:
LED uses targeted light spectrums so you waste no light.
LED vegges well and can keep up with HPS/mh with lower watts in veg.
HPS wastes a lot of light that the plant doesn't use.
HPS flowers better than LED without equal or more watts.


I'm no rocket scientist but my ghetto science tells me the issue with the LED's is that they are either:
1) missing a spectrum or spectrum's necessary for flowering
or
2) doesn't have the right ratio of spectrum's necessary for flowering.

I don't really see any other reason for the LED not keeping up in flowering with less watts. 1000w LED vs. 1000w HPS the plant is using all 1000w of LED and 1000w HPS is NOT. I forget the percentage of light from an HPS that a plants can't use but whatever that percentage is x% is a usable light advantage for the LED. Let's call is 15% although I think it's more. How can the HPS make up for this 15% disadvantage other than it has something the LED does not.

The HGL lights should be used for veg only. The Prosource lights seem to be fairing much better in the LED category.

I'm still hopeful for your grow, Bux. As you point out, there are still a few weeks to go yet...maybe they'll fatten up nicely in that time.

I don't think we'll ever see quite the penetration with LEDs that we have with HPS, but the efficiency will definitely improve. That may mean adjusting our growing style to use these most efficiently...guess we'll see.


Regards,

-TL

They could go long and fatten up but if they end up going long it loses the efficiency bonus of using LEDs.

Oh, one last thing to think about....... Most of the people who are posting these amazing results with the LED's are usually 1st or 2nd time growers.

Some may claim they have been growing for years (25 years ago) or they just fib to boost their egos. Either way, most of the people buying these lights are relatively new growers.
It could be that they totally f***** up their 1st grow and with the knowledge gained did much better on the 2nd grow using LED's.

A new grower may not realize that most indica's take 6-8 weeks for veg so when it takes 8-10 weeks they still give positive results.
When a new grower get's buds from his grow what can he compare it too?
Unless they have experience growing correctly then they are just guessing and elaborating on those results.

That's my 2cents

B

Your dating yourself. You forget about the Internet. A first or second time grower has a ton of material to compare too and can form pretty solid conclusions about a product.

Oh and how about the side by sides?

 

[Keith Lake]

Actually, just like SS got a test unit

setting sun has the light we borrowed.

He has the option to keep it for $300 ($100 off the purchase price at the time), or return it after the grow.

Haight donated their light for this grow.

 

[Scooby_Snacks]

The HGL lights should be used for veg only. The Prosource lights seem to be fairing much better in the LED category.

I'm not totally convinced of that fact just yet. On irishboys grow we have to remember that the PS has a big power advantage (30%) and a big cost disadvantage (+40% $$) . And if scrum actually thinks he can raise his LED yield even close to what he thinks, that would kinda change things in my mind.

All I'm convinced of so far is where the bar should be for these LED's. That they don't live up to the advertised comparisons, well .... we all knew better when we started. Just how much fudge factor we all worked in is the question.


Scrum any idea when you'll know if your able to do another run with 4 units?

 

[WarBux79]

I'm not totally convinced of that fact just yet. On irishboys grow we have to remember that the PS has a big power advantage (30%) and a big cost disadvantage (+40% $$) . And if scrum actually thinks he can raise his LED yield even close to what he thinks, that would kinda change things in my mind.

All I'm convinced of so far is where the bar should be for these LED's. That they don't live up to the advertised comparisons, well .... we all knew better when we started. Just how much fudge factor we all worked in is the question.


Scrum any idea when you'll know if your able to do another run with 4 units?

Well cost aside you said it yourself. Its the spectrum. HGL was obviously ahead in veg growth if it were just wattage that should have an impact on veg too. Prosource even has a 180 degree angle

 

[Scooby_Snacks]

Well cost aside you said it yourself. Its the spectrum. HGL was obviously ahead in veg growth if it were just wattage that should have an impact on veg too. Prosource even has a 180 degree angle

Be careful, I sometimes contradict myself lol jk

When I was referring to the spectrum it was comparing it to HPS.

I'm not saying your wrong, just I'm not sure yet. I still think that more, lower power units are better with HGL's. What would 3-63w units do vs. 1 - 180w or 3 - 126w vs. 2 - 180w do? I don't think it's as simple as saying you got X from 1 - 126w so you should get X*2 for 2 units. If laid out long sides to long sides I think you gain more than 1 units worth of the most intense light. I'm not saying the colas will be bigger. But if I get more tight med size nugs, I don't need a giant one for my ego. He'll have weights soon enough to let us chew on for a bit.

 

[Mr G]

You say yeilding more is not a priority. I'm curious how much an ouce of Med's last you?appx. I ask because you have a plant that might be a foot tall with small bud's that might fetch you an ounce when your done that has taken you 2 1/2 months to grow.So will that ounce last you 2 1/2 months?

"This is my first real grow. I couldn't be happier with the LED setup."
This is a recurring statement from those that couldn't be happier with their LED's. Those that don't know any better have nothing to be dissapointed about!Fact is there's more in one of these colas then what you're going to end up with from your plant MR G.

First, your buds look great! Certainly, there is more than one way of looking at things. I'll be the first to admit I'm brand new to growing and I have no experience and nothing to compare to. I'm not interested in criticizing other methods in praise of my own. I'm not trying to outgrow you or anyone else. For some, it's all about the yield per $ output. Also the quality, the taste/smell, etc., etc. is important to many. Space limitations, privacy issues, heat issues, smell issues, & power consumption {to name a few} are all things that might matter to one and not another. Personally, the $ output for the LED wasn't a big issue for me. I did not begin growing for any other reason than for the fun and gratification of growing a plant to maturity. I'll be thrilled with an oz. of great smoke {lasts me appx. 2 weeks}. That somewhat covers my ca$h output for the light, and the next grow will put me ahead of the game. My plant still has 3+ weeks to go also. I'm here to learn, not teach.

 

[WarBux79]

Be careful, I sometimes contradict myself lol jk

When I was referring to the spectrum it was comparing it to HPS.

I'm not saying your wrong, just I'm not sure yet. I still think that more, lower power units are better with HGL's. What would 3-63w units do vs. 1 - 180w or 3 - 126w vs. 2 - 180w do? I don't think it's as simple as saying you got X from 1 - 126w so you should get X*2 for 2 units. If laid out long sides to long sides I think you gain more than 1 units worth of the most intense light. I'm not saying the colas will be bigger. But if I get more tight med size nugs, I don't need a giant one for my ego. He'll have weights soon enough to let us chew on for a bit.

I think its a spectrum problem. Her lights veg and add girth great. Its been proven time and time again. When it comes to flowers it lags behind. Her light out vegged and out grew the 180w light from prosource. That is pretty much fact. Just look at the photos. If it were about wattage the prosource plant would not have lagged behind in girth like it did. I dont blame you for wanting more proof. Prosource offeres a 90w light too. You cant compare 3 hgl lights to 1 prosource light. You could just as easily buy some lower wattage prosource lights (or HSS depending on outcome of the test) We both got duped. I am filing a complaint today with my credit card company. She still owes me parts and wont answer my refund requests. I have a blinking light and two unopened lights. She owes me at least 1 replacement light for the blinking light she sent me and because I am still within the return policy I want to see if she will even honor her own policies.

First, your buds look great! Certainly, there is more than one way of looking at things. I'll be the first to admit I'm brand new to growing and I have no experience and nothing to compare to. I'm not interested in criticizing other methods in praise of my own. I'm not trying to outgrow you or anyone else. For some, it's all about the yield per $ output. Also the quality, the taste/smell, etc., etc. is important to many. Space limitations, privacy issues, heat issues, smell issues, & power consumption {to name a few} are all things that might matter to one and not another. Personally, the $ output for the LED wasn't a big issue for me. I did not begin growing for any other reason than for the fun and gratification of growing a plant to maturity. I'll be thrilled with an oz. of great smoke {lasts me appx. 2 weeks}. That somewhat covers my ca$h output for the light, and the next grow will put me ahead of the game. My plant still has 3+ weeks to go also. I'm here to learn, not teach.

Have you seen the side by sides? If your looking for LED lights to flower with its pretty obvious that the HGL light is the MH of LEDs.

 

[Mr G]

I just snuck a couple more plants and bulbs in the mix ...

 

[Bolivar]

...I just snuck a couple more plants and bulbs in the mix ...

I knew there was a good reason for saving those Folgers tubs...

 

[WarBux79]

I knew there was a good reason for saving those Folgers tubs...

HAHA I was thinking the same thing.

I just snuck a couple more plants and bulbs in the mix ...

Nice use of the coffee cans. I drink way to much of that shit.

 

[Sonzor]

Books, Coffee cans who says you have to spend a lot of money to set up your grow, use what you got, great job...

 

[WarBux79]

I like the coffee cans! I think I am going to make some grow pots out of some and use them to try dirt.

BTW Ledtester do you guys think that the plants under the LED's could have kept growing or were they finished? I have noticed a lot of people claiming that there grow is going longer under the LEDS.

 

[Be Irie]

warbux, they suck for use as pots.. It is a bitch to get the plant and soil out at transplant time.. To many lips and grooves....

 

[scumbragger]

I think its a spectrum problem. Her lights veg and add girth great. Its been proven time and time again. When it comes to flowers it lags behind. Her light out vegged and out grew the 180w light from prosource. That is pretty much fact. Just look at the photos. If it were about wattage the prosource plant would not have lagged behind in girth like it did. I dont blame you for wanting more proof. Prosource offeres a 90w light too. You cant compare 3 hgl lights to 1 prosource light. You could just as easily buy some lower wattage prosource lights (or HSS depending on outcome of the test) We both got duped. I am filing a complaint today with my credit card company. She still owes me parts and wont answer my refund requests. I have a blinking light and two unopened lights. She owes me at least 1 replacement light for the blinking light she sent me and because I am still within the return policy I want to see if she will even honor her own policies.




Have you seen the side by sides? If your looking for LED lights to flower with its pretty obvious that the HGL light is the MH of LEDs.

Gonna have to disagree with the assesment of the Prosource light....if you checkout Rumpleforskin's journal on another site you'll see how he's already complaining about things lagging behind and not being as big as his HID grows. And he's doing watt for watt test so they can't even keep up then.

 

[scumbragger]

warbux, they suck for use as pots.. It is a bitch to get the plant and soil out at transplant time.. To many lips and grooves....

Yeah they do suck...Maxwell House cans are metal with a tight seal top that are great stashing your meds though.

 

[scumbragger]

I like the coffee cans! I think I am going to make some grow pots out of some and use them to try dirt.

BTW Ledtester do you guys think that the plants under the LED's could have kept growing or were they finished? I have noticed a lot of people claiming that there grow is going longer under the LEDS.

No in fact a couple of the plants the pistils had turned all brown way early and this was one of the clues that all was not right. You can do several things to get the plants done quicker anyways. Keeping the lights off, changing the temps just to name a couple.

 

[WarBux79]

warbux, they suck for use as pots.. It is a bitch to get the plant and soil out at transplant time.. To many lips and grooves....

Good to know there is a place like 420 where people have tried everything anyone has ever thought of to grow there own! Guess I will have to buy some smart pots or something.

Gonna have to disagree with the assesment of the Prosource light....if you checkout Rumpleforskin's journal on another site you'll see how he's already complaining about things lagging behind and not being as big as his HID grows. And he's doing watt for watt test so they can't even keep up then.

Yea I have seen the journal but I took it as proving my point about spectrum. While the prosource light is still behind the HPS it is ahead of the HGL light. If they get all the right spectrum's in the LEDs and go watt for watt the LEDs would have to out perform the HPS. Don't you think?

Yeah they do suck...Maxwell House cans are metal with a tight seal top that are great stashing your meds though.

yea those are nice cans, its to bad I don't like the coffee as much. I have been using those vacuum jars. They work pretty damn good.

No in fact a couple of the plants the pistils had turned all brown way early and this was one of the clues that all was not right. You can do several things to get the plants done quicker anyways. Keeping the lights off, changing the temps just to name a couple.

Ahh well, it was just a thought but obviously you guys already thought of it.