Advice for new growers

[Tedmarx38]

I’ve learned more from this group in just two indoor grows than I could ever share. But, in the spirit of giving back, based on my learning curve, here are three tips that stand above the many others:

1. Avoid snarks on other forums
I won’t name them but something’s happened to those communities and it isn’t good. I started growing outdoors four years ago and those were helpful folks. Maybe it’s just the general decline in decency over the COVID era coupled with lax monitoring, but they are not nice places, esp for newbies. Post a problem pic and you’ll have a few helpful replies, but you’ll also get harassed. My favorite was one guy saying to me “You’re not very good at this.” My advice: stay away from them and if not, be sure to block or ignore the idiots because they can be dIscouraging.

2. Beware going too dry.
The visual impacts of overwatering and underwatering are practically identical. Because so many people water too much, any pic you post of problems (esp on the forums referenced above) will be labeled as overwatering. Turns out I’ve been underwatering and now that I’ve stepped it up, the plants thrive.

3. Embrace the droop
Plants look great in the on cycle but about two hours before the off, they sag and look pathetic. Then after an hour of “on” the next day they look fine again. I spent hours trying to fix this with more water, less water, and the same with nutrients. After much research including some scientific articles, I learned that it’s normal. It’s especially true when your tent’s hot during the on but drops considerably when the lights are off. From what I read, it’s the plants going into a defensive recovery mode in anticipation of less light and cold temps.

Hope it helps. Stay stoned my brothers and sisters.

 

[Bill284]

I’ve learned more from this group in just two indoor grows than I could ever share. But, in the spirit of giving back, based on my learning curve, here are three tips that stand above the many others:

1. Avoid snarks on other forums
I won’t name them but something’s happened to those communities and it isn’t good. I started growing outdoors four years ago and those were helpful folks. Maybe it’s just the general decline in decency over the COVID era coupled with lax monitoring, but they are not nice places, esp for newbies. Post a problem pic and you’ll have a few helpful replies, but you’ll also get harassed. My favorite was one guy saying to me “You’re not very good at this.” My advice: stay away from them and if not, be sure to block or ignore the idiots because they can be dIscouraging.

2. Beware going too dry.
The visual impacts of overwatering and underwatering are practically identical. Because so many people water too much, any pic you post of problems (esp on the forums referenced above) will be labeled as overwatering. Turns out I’ve been underwatering and now that I’ve stepped it up, the plants thrive.

3. Embrace the droop
Plants look great in the on cycle but about two hours before the off, they sag and look pathetic. Then after an hour of “on” the next day they look fine again. I spent hours trying to fix this with more water, less water, and the same with nutrients. After much research including some scientific articles, I learned that it’s normal. It’s especially true when your tent’s hot during the on but drops considerably when the lights are off. From what I read, it’s the plants going into a defensive recovery mode in anticipation of less light and cold temps.

Hope it helps. Stay stoned my brothers and sisters.

Hey @Tedmarx38 hope your having a good day my friend.
I'm glad you got the help you needed here, terrific people.
How is your 3rd grow shaping up?
Happy growing.

Stay safe
Bill

 

[Emilya Green]

I’ve learned more from this group in just two indoor grows than I could ever share. But, in the spirit of giving back, based on my learning curve, here are three tips that stand above the many others:

1. Avoid snarks on other forums
I won’t name them but something’s happened to those communities and it isn’t good. I started growing outdoors four years ago and those were helpful folks. Maybe it’s just the general decline in decency over the COVID era coupled with lax monitoring, but they are not nice places, esp for newbies. Post a problem pic and you’ll have a few helpful replies, but you’ll also get harassed. My favorite was one guy saying to me “You’re not very good at this.” My advice: stay away from them and if not, be sure to block or ignore the idiots because they can be dIscouraging.

2. Beware going too dry.
The visual impacts of overwatering and underwatering are practically identical. Because so many people water too much, any pic you post of problems (esp on the forums referenced above) will be labeled as overwatering. Turns out I’ve been underwatering and now that I’ve stepped it up, the plants thrive.

3. Embrace the droop
Plants look great in the on cycle but about two hours before the off, they sag and look pathetic. Then after an hour of “on” the next day they look fine again. I spent hours trying to fix this with more water, less water, and the same with nutrients. After much research including some scientific articles, I learned that it’s normal. It’s especially true when your tent’s hot during the on but drops considerably when the lights are off. From what I read, it’s the plants going into a defensive recovery mode in anticipation of less light and cold temps.

Hope it helps. Stay stoned my brothers and sisters.

Yes, the nighttime droop is a thing, and it happens because of the dark. The plant's ability to anticipate the dawn and dusk have been arguments for the sentience of these plants for quite some time. Put a time lapse camera on your grow and watch this nighttime process... it really is remarkable.

Now, I am trying hard not to snark here, but I truly am curious about your claim of being an underwaterer, because that is almost impossible to do if you water to runoff each time. Are you trying to guess how much water the plant needs and not watering to runoff? With your warning not to go dry, you sound like an overwaterer actually... because especially during veg, there is no better way to force the plant to grow more roots than making her search for water.

 

[Dwight Monk]

And if you on any of the Facebook groups I wouldn't take much of anything for advice there as it is all over the place moreso than here on this Forum were it is usually just slightly different opinions

 

[Tedmarx38]

Hey @Tedmarx38 hope your having a good day my friend.
I'm glad you got the help you needed here, terrific people.
How is your 3rd grow shaping up?
Happy growing.

Stay safe
Bill

Thanks my friend. It’s going well but I started it too early given how big the three in grow two have become. Going to be a crowded tent until those are ready to cut in a few more weeks. Have a sensational weekend.

 

[Tedmarx38]

Yes, the nighttime droop is a thing, and it happens because of the dark. The plant's ability to anticipate the dawn and dusk have been arguments for the sentience of these plants for quite some time. Put a time lapse camera on your grow and watch this nighttime process... it really is remarkable.

Now, I am trying hard not to snark here, but I truly am curious about your claim of being an underwaterer, because that is almost impossible to do if you water to runoff each time. Are you trying to guess how much water the plant needs and not watering to runoff? With your warning not to go dry, you sound like an overwaterer actually... because especially during veg, there is no better way to force the plant to grow more roots than making her search for water.

Yeah I hear you. My problem was waiting too long between dousing. Letting it get too dry. I do water to runoff but with the vast temp and humidity swings in the room where I have my tent, it’s impossible to have one set schedule, especially this time of the year. Snowy cold and dry last weekend outside, 70s and muggy now lol. Re overwatering, I have a premium soil that drains well and my sacks are on “feet” so they aren’t sitting in the runoff. Interestingly, even with five gallon containers, the roots grew through the fabric and are searching outside for more moisture.

Have a great day.

 

[Tedmarx38]

Yes, the nighttime droop is a thing, and it happens because of the dark. The plant's ability to anticipate the dawn and dusk have been arguments for the sentience of these plants for quite some time. Put a time lapse camera on your grow and watch this nighttime process... it really is remarkable.

Now, I am trying hard not to snark here, but I truly am curious about your claim of being an underwaterer, because that is almost impossible to do if you water to runoff each time. Are you trying to guess how much water the plant needs and not watering to runoff? With your warning not to go dry, you sound like an overwaterer actually... because especially during veg, there is no better way to force the plant to grow more roots than making her search for water.

Diverting to pseudo philosophy…yeah, wildlife intelligence trips me out even in the few moments that I’m not stoned. Recall a few years ago when that bear captured everyone’s attention running through the Midwest on its way to the Missouri woods? They do that a lot, hundreds of miles. How the heck do they know where the woods are? Same thing when I lived in NJ …. Biologists put tracking collars on tranq’d suburban bears around NYC and upon release they universally ended up in the southern pine forest. Baffling. I think our species knows very very little about how science and biology actually work and can’t even comprehend how these dynamics happen.

 

[Emilya Green]

Yeah I hear you. My problem was waiting too long between dousing. Letting it get too dry. I do water to runoff but with the vast temp and humidity swings in the room where I have my tent, it’s impossible to have one set schedule, especially this time of the year. Snowy cold and dry last weekend outside, 70s and muggy now lol. Re overwatering, I have a premium soil that drains well and my sacks are on “feet” so they aren’t sitting in the runoff. Interestingly, even with five gallon containers, the roots grew through the fabric and are searching outside for more moisture.

Have a great day.

I am convinced then that you are not underwatering, but that you are watering slightly too often, not letting them dry out all the way between waterings. In veg, this is how you force root growth, and then in bloom you can keep them wetter, using those roots to force water into the plant. Whatever is working for you however, is the best way to go. Not everyone is as aggressive as I am while in veg.
You have a wonderful day too!

 

[Tedmarx38]

I am convinced then that you are not underwatering, but that you are watering slightly too often, not letting them dry out all the way between waterings. In veg, this is how you force root growth, and then in bloom you can keep them wetter, using those roots to force water into the plant. Whatever is working for you however, is the best way to go. Not everyone is as aggressive as I am while in veg.
You have a wonderful day too!

Read your watering Bible from 2016 just now and I have a q about the flowering period watering. My five gallon comparator sack of totally dry soil weighs 4.4 lbs. In the flowering stage, how dry would you let plants in these get, as in what weight?

 

[Emilya Green]

Read your watering Bible from 2016 just now and I have a q about the flowering period watering. My five gallon comparator sack of totally dry soil weighs 4.4 lbs. In the flowering stage, how dry would you let plants in these get, as in what weight?

I have never weighed a 5 gallon container, so I would not know. Guessing and figuring on water weighing 8 lbs per gallon, I would say that a saturated container can take about 1.25 gallons of water, so that would mean there would be 10 lbs of water in there. Estimating that you would want to water when the weight was down to 20%, I would guess that the point of watering might show 2 lbs on the scale.

That being said, I water differently when I get to bloom. Whatever wet/dry cycle I have established by the end of veg and the 2 weeks of stretch, I shave one whole day off of that and water early. Bloom is where you change strategy and start using the roots you carefully grew during veg, by pushing water at the plant. About every 4th watering, I still let them dry out that extra day, sometimes more, just to pull fresh oxygen down deep into the roots. Royal Queen seeds recommends this strategy... they call it flushing the roots with oxygen.

 

[KingJohnC]

Water 2.2 lb per litre x 3.78 litres per gallon = 8.316 lb per gallon

 

[Tedmarx38]

I have never weighed a 5 gallon container, so I would not know. Guessing and figuring on water weighing 8 lbs per gallon, I would say that a saturated container can take about 1.25 gallons of water, so that would mean there would be 10 lbs of water in there. Estimating that you would want to water when the weight was down to 20%, I would guess that the point of watering might show 2 lbs on the scale.

That being said, I water differently when I get to bloom. Whatever wet/dry cycle I have established by the end of veg and the 2 weeks of stretch, I shave one whole day off of that and water early. Bloom is where you change strategy and start using the roots you carefully grew during veg, by pushing water at the plant. About every 4th watering, I still let them dry out that extra day, sometimes more, just to pull fresh oxygen down deep into the roots. Royal Queen seeds recommends this strategy... they call it flushing the roots with oxygen.

Thank you, very helpful as always!

 

[Roy Growin]

Water 2.2 lb per litre x 3.78 litres per gallon = 8.316 lb per gallon

Hang on KJC - 1L of water = 1Kg = 2.2lb
That equates to a ratio of 1:1 water/medium
Surely you don't mean water a 5 Gallon bucket with 5 Gallons of water?
For me it works out about 1:5 or 1L water for a 5L pot, 2/10 etc

 

[Sueet]

Hang on KJC - 1L of water = 1Kg = 2.2lb
That equates to a ratio of 1:1 water/medium
Surely you don't mean water a 5 Gallon bucket with 5 Gallons of water?
For me it works out about 1:5 or 1L water for a 5L pot, 2/10 etc

He was just supplying the weight of a gallon of water

 

[KingJohnC]

Hang on KJC - 1L of water = 1Kg = 2.2lb
That equates to a ratio of 1:1 water/medium
Surely you don't mean water a 5 Gallon bucket with 5 Gallons of water?
For me it works out about 1:5 or 1L water for a 5L pot, 2/10 etc

I refer to the weight of the volume of water for the calculation of gross weight contribution of the moistened grow medium. You are correct that I refer to the mass of the water and not expressing total volume of water require to saturate whichever grow medium to its saturation capability.