Decoding The Holy Grail: Terpene & Cannabinoid Retention: Decarb to Extraction

[Bucudinkydow]

Sweetsue started a thread not long ago on the subject but I’m not sure how to find it. Lot of feedback from adventurous folks. I believe I remember someone that found edibles ineffective actually found good results with this method.

I get better results with the dry dust alone or with a cup of coffee but due to anatomical diversity I think some preferred a mix with a good carrier oil or taking it with various food. I hope you do give it a try but start low and go slow. Some have experienced stronger than expected results. One young gentleman got a bit testy with me because he tried some and went to work. The results were overwhelming to the point he had to return home!!

good luck
BCDD

 

[Pahval]

Ill look it up by myself, tnx... Lol im too old to try new stuff before my job... Ill keep the strength in mind... Yes, sue and cajun also taught me about carrier oil, saturating liver, thc encapsulation... I learn a lot from you guys, tnx...

 

[InTheShed]

Here ya go:

Cannabis Dust: Simple Consumption, Unexpected Potency

Now for something different..... @Bucudinkydow has stumbled on the simple method of consuming ground decarbed bud. He’s been using the method for a while, but finds himself stymied over finding a way to get a consistent dose. Weighing may be an option, if a good scale is available, in which...

www.420magazine.com

 

[Kicknitup1]

Airtight doesn't mean vacuum, so what they are saying is that the terpenes that volatilize during decarb in the sealed cans actually find their way back into the plant material rather than just waiting in the air to escape upon opening? Why would they do that from a physical standpoint?

Does the same thing work with decarbing extracts or only buds?

And vacuum doesn't mean weightless. But it doesn't take much to draft them out when removing the lid. Good discussion on degrade vs volatility. Don't know if anyone ever proved they will settle back on plant. I do know enough heat will kill them.

 

[Bucudinkydow]

And vacuum doesn't mean weightless. But it doesn't take much to draft them out when removing the lid. Good discussion on degrade vs volatility. Don't know if anyone ever proved they will settle back on plant. I do know enough heat will kill them.

Very good point and one that I wrestled with when going from the decarb oven to the freezer while still in a sealed container. Analytically, if molecules have no escape route while in a volatile state and, in fact, do condense in the presence of 0° temp, it seems we would be golden!! During condensation, however, do the Terpenes settle back on the material through gravity or do they stick to the first surface they encounter, I.e. the walls of the jar? When making tincture this is a bit irrelevant since the ethanol will “reclaim” the molecules when we do a wash. This question does rise to greater importance, though, when making “dust”.

And, yes, there’s always the unknown of what effect heat has on Terpenes but if we’re going to decarb I see no way around this.

Still a lot of unanswered questions on this theory but having no route to lab tests I just had to go by personal comparison of decarbed material using conventional open method vs sealed container to freezer method. I found there to be a distinct difference. The sealed container method seem to give a bit deeper, more multifaceted effect.

but who knows?........

 

[Kicknitup1]

Very good point and one that I wrestled with when going from the decarb oven to the freezer while still in a sealed container. Analytically, if molecules have no escape route while in a volatile state and, in fact, do condense in the presence of 0° temp, it seems we would be golden!! During condensation, however, do the Terpenes settle back on the material through gravity or do they stick to the first surface they encounter, I.e. the walls of the jar? When making tincture this is a bit irrelevant since the ethanol will “reclaim” the molecules when we do a wash. This question does rise to greater importance, though, when making “dust”.

And, yes, there’s always the unknown of what effect heat has on Terpenes but if we’re going to decarb I see no way around this.

Still a lot of unanswered questions on this theory but having no route to lab tests I just had to go by personal comparison of decarbed material using conventional open method vs sealed container to freezer method. I found there to be a distinct difference. The sealed container method seem to give a bit deeper, more multifaceted effect.

but who knows?........

If they didn't burn up, and at least some do not, they will settle back to the first available surface. So I guess the less excess surface area, the better. I Just saw a spinoff of this thread on terps. Was from 2018 & I just now saw it. lol. We need more testing for sure.

When Canyon and I ran these tests for Grail, we tested the bud for terps. The bud was decarbed in a Nova (so covered). Pretty sure we tested the bud after decarb. Need to go back & see what % we held on to. Still, that will not tell us how much of it was from "settling back down".

 

[Kicknitup1]

What terpene brand are you guys happy with?

 

[Pahval]

I did a better research of those chemicals... From my understanding, being volatile means it easily evaporates at room temperature, people had success recapturing them with cold traps at freezer temperatures... Check out Isolating cannabis terpenes thread from pangea on icmag, there is one simple and one advance design of recapturing terpenes, you may find some valuable info there... Degradation of terpenes happens due to oxydation, in contact with oxygen terpenes turn to terpenoids, but that may be a good thing, as some terpenoids have shown health benefits as well as terpenes have... I dont know which one, i have my study notes on my laptop but you can check them out by yourself with some google search... You can do like half fresh half cured of total herb you have to get best of both worlds... Man, i wish i lived in america just to try those terpenes... I have heard bad things about true terpenes, and their viscosity liquid which turned out to be mineral oil, which is dangerous to vape, they claim their terpenes come from natural source but they didnt know that was mineral oil cause they never tested it, altough many people say they are tasty...

 

[Bucudinkydow]

What terpene brand are you guys happy with?

Seven friends and I formed a test group and did some extensive testing of most all of the terpene products available from True Terpenes. The efficacy of many of their products were lacking but we were overall pleased with the product. When they got caught with their tit in the ringer over their viscosity content, it gave us pause over their entire product line. That, along with some bogus and vague certification claims, leads me to withdraw my past recommendations.

 

[Kicknitup1]

Seven friends and I formed a test group and did some extensive testing of most all of the terpene products available from True Terpenes. The efficacy of many of their products were lacking but we were overall pleased with the product. When they got caught with their tit in the ringer over their viscosity content, it gave us pause over their entire product line. That, along with some bogus and vague certification claims, leads me to withdraw my past recommendations.

I am trying Kind Skywalker based upon your research.

 

[Pahval]

is there a thread on terp research here? *edit, found it: All About Terpene Supplements: Holy Grail Thread Spin-off

 

[InTheShed]

Thanks Pahval! I've been looking for something to keep QWET extract flowable in vape carts that isn't PEG, VG, or any other oil-based product. The topic of terpenes came up, but I didn't see anything in that thread about whether any of those terpene products were tested for high-temperature inhalation. Most of the terpene products I found don't list their ingredients.

For example, TrueTerpenes says this on their website:
"Exact percentage (concentration) of composition has been withheld as a trade secret."

So you have no idea what percentage is terpenes and what percentage is something else they don't tell you. "All natural" would include vitamin E oil, which is suspected of hospitalizing a number of vapers last year.