HID Grow - Revenge of the Kittens

[Steve McStoferson]

Whats up guys? As promised, the new journal is here..

For those who weren't around for my last couple of grows, I will summarize them quickly. The links can be found in my signature also.

Grow #1: 6 bagseed seeds, MG Organic Choice soil, no nutes, 5 gal buckets, ~300W of shop tubes and CFL's. 3 males, 2 females, 1 hermie. Flowered the 2 females and killed the others, got about 1-2oz dried all together.

Grow #2: 9 bagseeds, MG Organic Choice soil, all killed by one of my cats a couple weeks into it.

While rebuilding the grow room to accommodate my new equipment, I noticed the plants that my cat had dug up were a bit bigger than I remembered. I took the best looking one, which had grown about 2 more inches since it was dug up and ripped apart by my cat, then set in a dark pile with no water as scrap. Well, I decided to give it another shot at life, so I planted it in some FF Happy Frog, and threw it under the MH. Within a couple of hours, it had picked up and I was noticing new growth. Just over the weekend since these pictures were taken, I noticed about 1-2" of new growth, and another new node forming. I think I'm going to call her Zena because shes a warrior lol.

Anyway, I went to the hydro store and got some new supplies. My arsenal now includes FF Happy Frog, FF Ocean Forest, 10 3 gal pots, and a digital 600W MH/HPS. They were all out of the standard MH bulbs, so he gave me the upgraded one, which was like $100 instead of $50 at no extra cost. Good guys over at HTG.

I had to patch some light leak on my windows, as you could see light radiating from outside.. This light is BRIGHT! And its only the MH which is pumping out 66,000 lumens. A few pieces of cardboard and some black garbage bags, and we're 100% light proof.

Strain: Random Bagseed, some seed I got off my first bagseed grow.
Soil: Happy frog for the seedlings, will be transplanted into happy frog / ocean forest mix
Pot: foam cups, then 3 gallon
Size of light? 600 watt MH/HPS - Not aircooled.
Temp of Room/cab? 70's
RH of Room/cab? ~30%
PH of media or res? 6.2
Watering Schedule: Daily
Nutrients: None, will be using grow big and tiger bloom

I should give my experience switching from florescent lighting to HID lighting. This thing is nothing short of amazing. I pulled the bulbs out of the box and immediately my jaw dropped. I was blown away by how heavy duty the construction of them were. I said to my girl "that's a serious lightbulb!"

Anyway, I get everything plugged in and ran the light for a day at about 16" above the plants. The next day I bumped it down to about 8" above them. It puts off a decent amount of heat, but my area is very well ventilated and the temps are kind of low, so it is just helping the climate for my babies, and they seem to be loving them.

Almost immediately, I noticed a significant amount of growth on my babies. The combo of a good medium and good lighting really does make a difference in the way your plants grow. I would check them every couple of hours to make sure the temps were good, and each time I went down there, I noticed new growth. The new seedlings are growing a very deep green color, and are forming new nodes very close together. I can't wait to see these things take off under the new light.

That's enough rambling for the first post. Here are a few pics I snapped the next day after I got everything set up. These were taken on the 30th, and when I checked this morning, the big plant has a whole new node set that has developed and 2 new large leaves that sprouted.

I'm amazed that plant came back as well as it did.. I hope she rewards me with luscious bud for saving her life.

Through the mylar

They don't have any nutes as of now. I will be buying some grow big and some tiger bloom once I transplant them. I think I'll wait a week for them to adjust to their new pots, and then I'll start hitting them with the grow big at 1/4 strength.

I'm shooting for at least 2oz dried per plant, so lets hope I get it!

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

I forgot to post all the specs on my new stuff..

Hood - Maxwing reflector
Ballast - Digital Greenhouse 600W Electronic
Bulbs - ArgoMax 600W MH Conversion bulb- 66,000 lumens, GrowBright 600W HPS- 95,000 lumens

They also gave me a 2 year warranty on the bulbs and a 3 year warranty on the ballast.

I can't wait to see the results from this stuff.. It definitely blows away the ~300W I was using before, and only getting less than 10k lumens from it all. I'm so glad I waited a month longer to get the 600W and didn't settle for the 400W.

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Update:

The babies are doing well. I checked my seeds last night and one had about 1/2" of tap root showing, and the other had about 1/4" so I planted them in some happy frog and covered them with an upside down 3 gallon pot until they break soil, then they will go under the MH..

I should have taken pics just to show what has happened in the past couple of days, the seedlings are doing great, they have another 2 sets of leaves and have almost doubled in size. They're still very short, and the nodes are growing very close together, so I'm hoping for a ton of bud sites when she grows up.

Zena is doing okay, I think she's still kind of shocked from the root damage and everything. The temps weren't getting too hot, but it looked like the light intensity was stressing her out a bit so I backed the light off a couple of inches and I'll monitor her from there. The 2 new nodes that were forming have emerged and there is another set of leaves making its way out the top. I figure as long as she is growing, it's worth fighting for.

I'll have to snap some pics tonight, or maybe I'll wait until the other seedlings break soil. Once they do, I will have 5 plants total. In my seed towel there are another 2 that have cracked but aren't showing roots yet. I'm hoping in the next couple of days they start to show a root so I can get them going. I'm anxious to start smoking my own herbs again. I need to get a perpetual grow going.. I figure if i plant a couple of seeds every week or 2, I should have a decent amount of plants in different stages.

My one supplier is looking into getting me some clones of the great strains I have smoked, I''ll be very excited if that goes through. If it does, I need to get my aerocloner setup so I can keep the genetics going.

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

I guess nobody is on board for this round? lol

I did something bad last night..

I noticed it was getting a bit warm in my box, due to it being directly under a furnace vent. This setup worked well when I was running the shop tubes, but it was getting a little too warm with the MH running. I moved the box to the other side of the room and the temps had stabilized.. Silly me, I didn't think to raise the light to compensate for the less amount of air moving. Anyway, after I had everything set up, I left the room for a couple of hours, smoked a good bong, ate some cookies, and then checked it out again.

the two seedlings had slight burns on two of the leaves, so i raised the light to 10" above the plants. I checked on them this morning and there were two more very minor burns on the plants, so i raised the light to 12" above the plants. I don't think the 10" difference caused the burn, it was probably damage that was already done and hadn't shown yet, but i raised them again just to be safe.

I do have a small fan blowing across the plants, but maybe it isn't enough. I know when i put my hand under the light, it feels warm, but it never comes close to burning me.. I guess I just have a higher tolerance than the plants do.

I'll check everything out when I get home tonight and if they are still burning, I'll get another fan for them.

Fortunately the burn wasn't too bad.. It's just a shame because the seedlings were looking so good. I'm sure they will bounce back since I caught it in time.

 

[ilynnboy]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Don't worry about being alone I'm In for the ride.
Good luck.
Also, the babies are just that Babies, I know that your hand didn't feel too hot, but leave it there for 18 hours and see what happens. All kidding aside a non-cooled 600w should be about 16-18 in. away unless you notice too much stretch. At least that is my 2cents. I would rather see a plant stretch a little than get burnt(again just my 2cents).I used to set the light at 18" then when the plant stopped stretching I would measure the distance to the canopy and make this number my preferred distance to the canopy. Highest light strenght with no burning. It is easier if you let the plant tell what it likes, this goes for light,humidity nutes etc;. I am not a pro grower just a dude with 25 yrs growing for the horticultural industry(greenhouse propigation). Everyone has their own opinions,. I always tried to let the plants do the talking, Thay will tell you what they need if you are observant in their actions.

God loves Ganja and so do I, after all He Put on Every Continent that it Would Grow On!!

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

yeah definitely dude.. i did have the light about 8" away from the plants, but i was getting a ton of airflow around it so it never really got hot, and the plants loved it. I backed it off to 12" and we'll see how it goes tonight when I get home.

The burn isn't too bad, but like you said, I'm just trying to let them tell me what they want. Just getting the hang of this HID stuff.

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Checked out the babies this morning, they are doing so well.. The 2 seedlings have another set of leaves. I got the light in the right spot because the burning stopped, and all of the new growth is a nice deep green color. The nodes are growing so close together, I can't wait to see how they bush out.

Zena is doing really well, I think she was suffering from a bit of burn, and also I believe she was pretty close to being root bound. I transplanted her last night into a 3 gallon pot with river pebbles on the bottom and happy frog the rest of the way. I did that last night before I went to bed. The reason I decided to transplant her is because her leaves were drooping slightly, and I know she wasn't over watered in any way. When i took her out of the cup, I got to compare the old roots to the new ones, and I wish I had my camera with me at the time because I would love to show you guys the difference. The roots before were very very thin, and I believe it is because of the soil I was using because during my last harvest, when I pulled the plants, they too had very thin roots. Well, when I pulled her out of the cup, I saw the same thin roots, but there were also thick white roots similar to what you see in hydro setups. These roots had to have been at least 10 times thicker than the original ones, so that's a great sign.

I put Zena in her new home last night, and when I checked on them this morning, the leaves had picked up and were no longer drooping. I'm also noticing fresh new growth at each node, so she has made a remarkable comeback. I'm not going to LST her, just grow her straight up. She's had a decent amount of stress from being dug up by the cat and set in the dark with no light or water for a couple weeks, so I hope she turns female and gives me a decent cola.

As i said before, the 2 seedlings are doing really well, and I just had a new baby break soil this morning and is showing her first leaves. I grabbed 4 new seeds from my most recent bag of mids and threw them in the paper towel, so I'm hoping to get a decent couple of plants from that bag. The weed is really good for it being brick weed, and the bud I grabbed the seeds from weighs about 5 grams alone, so I'm crossing my fingers for a heavy yielder.

On a side note, I'm in negotiations with a clone supplier, they get all their clones from dispensaries in CA, so I'm excited to get some real strains in my garden.

I'll throw a pic update up tonight or sometime this weekend.

 

[ilynnboy]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Glad you got the right height for that lamp, what was the distance? I have grown some of the best smoke from bagseed. Got a 1/4 of jamaican red in fla. good smoke not great.
Grew them next go-round. shitty, spindly looking buds that would put you in outer f ' in space for 4 hours. So you never know what you will end up with, but good luck.

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Glad you got the right height for that lamp, what was the distance? I have grown some of the best smoke from bagseed. Got a 1/4 of jamaican red in fla. good smoke not great.
Grew them next go-round. shitty, spindly looking buds that would put you in outer f ' in space for 4 hours. So you never know what you will end up with, but good luck.

yeah definitely dude.. My last harvest was from bagseed, and the buds weren't that impressive, but the stone from them was amazing, some of the best weed I've smoked to this day.

The light is around 12" from the top of the plants now. I have the fan blowing on top of the plants, and it takes away most of the heat before it gets to the plants. They seem very happy with it.

I have the light on 24/0 right now, I need to get a timer because I only want to run it 18/6 to give the light a bit of a break, but it's not too high of a priority at this time. I'll definitely get the timer before I go 12/12 though.. I hate hurrying home to turn the lights on or off.

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

got some pics for you guys..

I snapped these yesterday morning and it shows how well Zena is making a comeback, along with the babies. I had a new seed break soil, so I included a shot of the new baby.

This morning I transplanted the two larger seedlings into 3 gallon pots with happy frog soil. I'll throw up a pic in a few days to show their growth. I also backed the light off a couple inches to induce a bit of stretching. As you can see from the pics, they are growing very short and there is already undergrowth showing, and nowhere for it to grow to lol.

this MH is serious business. You can see where I burned the plants in the pics. at the time of burning, the burned leaves were the only ones visible.

Anyway, onto the pics!

4 new seeds getting ready to be planted

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Here's an update, 3 days since the last shots were taken. As you can see from comparing them, they have grown quite a bit. The 2 babies are loving their new 3 gallon homes, and Zena is really starting to explode with new growth.

I moved the fan so it is blowing on the light for now, I noticed the reflector was getting pretty hot to the touch. I checked on it this morning, and the temps are much better. I figure if i keep the bulb cool it will last me longer.

I'll let the pics do the talking this time around

This is to compare the growth in 3 days. No nutes, just happy frog soil and a 600w MH.. This is the plant that was killed by the cat and left for dead for a week
Before

After

 

[Doctor Dread]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Lookin good!! That HID is gonna give you some killer nugs man! GL, I'll be posted..

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

thanks for stoppin by bro! Good to have you tuned in

 

[Tyrone Hamilton]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

I've got that exact same light, but I've not got the MH bulb yet - might have to for the next grow! Nice work on saving the kitty ravaged plant. Bad kitty, this is not catnip! +reps

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

nice dude, have you run into any problems with the system? I haven't fired up the HPS bulb yet, I suppose I should make sure it works, but I only plan on vegging for another 2-3 weeks then I'll switch bulbs.

I noticed the ballast fan makes a bit of noise, but it's not so much the fan itself making the noise, rather it's the airflow. I expected it to be a bit quieter because when it was advertised it said it was virtually silent, but I'm not concerned about a noise issue, so it's not a big deal.

Otherwise, I've only been using the system for a little over a week now, and I've had no problems and am very happy with it.

Anyone out there still using CFL's, I must advise you that if you want to get serious about growing, you can't live without a good light. Coming from a CFL background, I didn't think it would make that big of a difference with MH/HPS lighting, but I was wrong, the growth is very noticeable and the plants look and grow so much healthier.

Without nutes or anything, I noticed half an inch of growth yesterday alone. I checked Zena in the morning and she was 7.5" tall, and then I checked again at around 8pm and she was 8" tall.

 

[Tyrone Hamilton]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

The only problem I had was one blown HPS bulb - most likely my fault for letting it "hot start" - definitely wait 20mins after you turn it off to turn it back on. HTG sent me a replacement bulb anyway.

It's definitely the best value out there - they must not make much money on it, but I'm sure it gets them a lot of customers.

It was like night and day when I switched too - much more solid buds. I have to say though, I've been amazed at what some of the Deep Water Culture do with only CFLs.

 

[Steve McStoferson]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Yeah I agree with you, I've seen some crazy bubble / CFL results. With the right amount of lights and the proper spectrum, I've seen some rock hard buds as a result.

I hope I don't have any issues with my HPS, From looking over the bulb, everything appears to be in order.. I'll just wait until I flower to test it, no point in swapping bulbs over and over and risking breaking one. I've seen really good customer service from HTG, so I'm not too worried, at least I know they will take care of me if anything is wrong.

Great guys over there at the store, very knowledgeable and helpful, I'll definitely give them all of my business.

 

[Colum]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

Pulling up a chair and got my popcorn ready.

Looks like a great start.

 

[bongtastic]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

I'm in!

 

[luxx]

Re: CriMson's HID Grow- Revenge of the Kittens

why do cats hate our plants? ill never know. but they dont go near it now (hidden mothballs under the cab) dont know if it works, they havnt seem interested in them lately.

but anyways, ima pull up a chair for this one.

goodluck