Grandpa's White Widow - 1st grow EVER

[Retired One]

The MG soil has really boxed you in. It works ok for the first few days, but once a few more roots get down it's burnsville. As Pan4Gold said you should transplant them the very instant you get your Fox Farm soil. You could gain some benefit from a major flush, but MG potting soil has a time release formula so all you'll be able to wash out is what has been released already.

Hope that FF soil gets there quick. BTW very nice growing setup, get your soil issues straight and you should be able to pump out some fine buds

 

[Retired One]

On the other hand...I just found a 400 Watt HPS Grow Light for about $120.00 at a site called insidesun.com It would take me about 3 weeks to save up that much money, would it be worth it ? How much more growth would I get ?

If you are having temp trouble with flouros, you are going to have a time with that 400w HPS. Saw you were replacing the vent fans, if you tripled your airflow you should be close to ok...HID lighting is a huge heat generator, so circulation will be critical. As far as growth goes, I have been told that you get much more light penetration with HID over flouros so on that basis alone it is better, but you will turn out fine buds with what you have. Work within the budget you have and if this grow thing works out for you, save your money and upgrade a little at a time.

 

[grandpastoner]

Much thanxxx dude. Yea...just as soon as my soil gets here it's a total transplant. I don't know really how to do it without screwing up the roots. The reason I bought the containers they are in now was because I would have been able to simply place the entire container into the larger planter and the roots would grow thru. Do I have to take the babies out of the MG completely and transplant them into the FF ? How exactly do I do this ?

 

[TorturedSoul]

Yup the MG soil's built-in fertillizer isn't controllable - definitely harsh on the little ones. While you have no choice, try overwatering so you have much runoff; perhaps it will take some of the fertillizer with it. And... If you have any perlite to cut it with, that will help not only "weaken" the MG but also help your plants' roots breathe.

Heat is a killer. While they are so young, One of those twin-bulb lights would suffice if you can find a place to hang it horizontally with all of your seedlings in a row. At this point you don't really need the extra light that having them in a bright white box would provide. On a table or counter with one light fixture hanging would allow the heat from the fixture to rise and you could still place a fan to blow gently across all of the seedlings.

I just took a look at that HPS fixture and yes it is cheap but I would think a "mirror-smooth" chrome reflector would be inviting hot spots. I've always been a fan of "hammered-specular aluminum" types (little round pebbly shapes all over the inside of the reflector." Also, that's not an enclosed reflector so you would have no way to remove the heat from the HPS separately. If that one would take you three weeks to save up for, perhaps you would be able to get a better one instead if you saved for five or six weeks. One with a real hood and glass would not only give you more usable light at your plants, but you could possibly rig up some round "ductwork" and a small fan that would allow you to pull cool air (from outside of your cabinet) across the HPS and right out of your cabinet.

In the meantime I would guess that your vegetative growth under florescents would be slow enough - if using 6500K bulbs and they are placed close enough, you should have tight internodal spacing instead of stretched plants - that you would be able to wait that long before switching to a high-powered HPS for flowering. Besides, I've always felt that there was a lot to be said for flowering mature plants.

And yes, a 400-watt HPS light/fixture will put off more heat than florescents although as you've already found, 320(?) watts of florescent tubes in an enclosed box put off a good bit. Actually, you might find that there is not a great deal more heat (some additional though) with the HPS - it's only 80 more watts and much more efficient.

Probably twice as many lumens and in the flowering spectrum.

 

[TorturedSoul]

How to get the MG soil off your seedlings' roots? Gently squeeze the small containers around the sides while holding upside-down (hand at dirt with stem between two middle fingers) and it will probably fall out easily.

Can then GENTLY rinse or even just put in a shallow bowl of room-temperature water and GENTLY swish plant around.

Key word is "gentle."

 

[Retired One]

How to get the MG soil off your seedlings' roots? Gently squeeze the small containers around the sides while holding upside-down (hand at dirt with stem between two middle fingers) and it will probably fall out easily.

Can then GENTLY rinse or even just put in a shallow bowl of room-temperature water and GENTLY swish plant around.

Key word is "gentle."

Tortured is exactly right...take your time, don't get in a hurry and be damn careful. Dont freak out if your plants get a little off looking for a few days after transplant, the change in soil type and nute content/level is almost guaranteed to shock the plants some. This shock has been known to turn plants male and cause an increased hermie rate so learn from this mistake and always use a good potting soil in the future.

 

[grandpastoner]

Thanxxx so much. I just got finished completing the 2nd cab (except for light tubes). Now just waiting on the Fox Farm soil. An old stoner friend of mine here said I would make MANY mistakes my first time out...but that's how ya learn. I am determined to get thru this first grow with burnable buds...and my 2nd grow will be filled with a LOT less mistakes and bigger, fatter ladies.

Thanxxx again for ALL the help ! I would not be near as knowledgable at this point without all of you.

 

[Retired One]

Thanxxx so much. I just got finished completing the 2nd cab (except for light tubes). Now just waiting on the Fox Farm soil. An old stoner friend of mine here said I would make MANY mistakes my first time out...but that's how ya learn. I am determined to get thru this first grow with burnable buds...and my 2nd grow will be filled with a LOT less mistakes and bigger, fatter ladies.

Thanxxx again for ALL the help ! I would not be near as knowledgable at this point without all of you.

LMAO...I'm currently doing my first hydro grow after being an outdoor grower for for many moons, Kemo Sabe, so I know exactly how you feel. Frankly, I've tried to kill my grow twice in the last week and were it not for Pan4Gold49 I would have been succesful. Mistakes will be made. I'm a hell of a good outdoor gardener and I still goofed once in a while. You'll still grow some awsome buds and can smoke that secure in the knowledge that the next grow will be better.

 

[pan4gold49]

Wow Grandpastoner that's some great info that everyone has given you. All the suggestions made are very good each and everyone.

Just be slow and gentile in the transplant and everything will be fine.

Pan4

 

[grandpastoner]

I know this sounds far fetched...but my overall goal is to move back to Shasta County (Redding area) and get into growing professionally. I fully realize I am a long way from that...but I am also a lot closer than I was a month ago. An ancient Chinese sage once said that the journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. I am taking that first, single step. Without going into details…every damn thing I have set my mind to since I was a child, I have accomplished. And becoming a pro-grower is no different. When I lived in Redding a few years back, I met and befriended several pros and now that I am older and phasing my way out of the music biz…I know this is the career change for me.

With the help and guidance I am receiving from the kind folks here on this site, I know I am one step closer to achieving my goal. My first grow is into its 14th day…and my overall knowledge is so much more extensive than it was when I started. Each day I am one step closer to my goal. And I appreciate every bit of help I get on here from each of you. Henry Ford once said “Think you can, think you can’t. Either way you are right.” And with the help of the good folks on here…I know I can.

 

[TorturedSoul]

You have to watch those ancient Chinese sages. One once said, "May you live in interesting times." I think a few misguided souls thought his words were a blessing lol.

But seriously, I wish you all the luck in the world. Growing professionally - and legally - for others can be a hassle but it sounds like you would be doing what you love so I hope you do accomplish your goal!

 

[SouthernOnt]

try air cooled lights if it gets too got in your cabinet maybe a 250watt would work and give you decent buds if you can't find a 400watt air cooled

 

[grandpastoner]

My cab temp stays around 80 degress which I have read is fine. It is just on those HOT days it seems to get to intense. But I just switched cabs on the plants and now have 2 computer fans running pulling air. The 1st cab is getting the larger fan installed today and tomorrow. New pics up tonite...yellowing seems to be going away and overall growth is picking up.

 

[estranged]

you should notice a big difference once potted to the fox farms from the MG,
as l8tnightskunk did,, and many other,, i used MG to and Shultz,, i had burns and yellowing too,, now that swithced the soil they doing better,,

as tortured soul said if under 6500k lights they will stay short and bushy and allow you time to save for hps and ventilation, if thats what you decide,

almost too much,, im thinking of adding 2700k to my veg, cause so short,(44th day and tallest one is 10" the rest 6-7"), but my temps are not as stable as yours ,im sure the high temps and MG soil stunted them, so maybe yours wont stay as short in veg under just 6500k,,

 

[grandpastoner]

I just finished putting the young-uns in thier newer home...the 2nd cab which has BOTH fans operational which should keep a much better air flow circulating.

On day 15, the overall growth is not bad I think.

Some of the yellowing remains...but it doesn't seem to be spreading.

As you can see from this overhead shot, the yellowing could be a LOT worse. The Fox Farm should make a hell of a difference.

The base stems seem to be healthy and strong...which I like !

This seems to be the worst of them all. But I am confident the Fox Farm will bring even this sickly baby back to good green health.

With 2 fans operational now, the air circulation will be MUCH better. The lights are still on 24/7...and I am watering about once every other day. The Fox Farm will be here this week and then we should see a major change.

Now smoke 'em if ya got 'em damn it ! I'm gonna...

 

[pan4gold49]

Doing good Grandpa.

Your setup looks good and sound.

Give me a holler in the garden.

Pan4

 

[TorturedSoul]

Doing good. Here's hoping for a bumper crop!

But I can't help but feel that much of the output off of those florescent tubes is wasted on those plants since it's not actually ON the plants. To get the amount of light falling on a particular point (the point in question being your plants), you divide a light's lumen output by the square of the distance. So if half of a tube is at least 2' away, then half of the output from that tube is only at best putting 1/4th of its output on the plants.

Err... It's really much easier to figure up a concrete number using lights that broadcast their output from a single (or else small/dense) point such as the traditional MH/HPS or even CFL, but it applies to tubes as well. But you get the picture. One of those double-tube fixtures hung directly over your young plants lined up in a neat row will give them more actual light than all four of those fixtures in their currently-installed orientation. It would also cause less stretching. And use ¼ the electricity.

Of course, after the plants have grown substantially so that they are close to the entire bulbs, it will be different.

 

[grandpastoner]

Yea...I found a smaller flourecent light (about a foot and a half long) that I am considering hanging over the top of them until they grow a bit more and are ready for topping / pruning. It is quite a bit thinner than the ones I have now, but it will be more direct, and it will be over the top of them. Couldn't hurt...right ? Let me know what yall think.

Oh by the way...did anybody see Family Guy tonight ? It was called "Episode 420" and Mayor West legalized marijuana. Damn sweet !

Fire It Up !

 

[Retired One]

Oh by the way...did anybody see Family Guy tonight ? It was called "Episode 420" and Mayor West legalized marijuana. Damn sweet !

Hell yeah..."Everything's better with a bag-o-weed"

 

[L8tNightSkunk]

i like your confidence grandpastoner! Fox farms should cure those babies!