HeyWilbur's 1st - White Widow Fem - Soil - Aug 2016

[HeyWilbur]

WillysMom, I really appreciate your encouragement and suggestions. I will say that, outside of the slow growth, they look really healthy, so I'm just going to hang on for the ride - it is their ride after all! Yes, I will definitely add perlite in their next pot - I was thinking maybe 40% Ocean Forest, 30% plain potting soil and 30% perlite. Does this sound reasonable to you? I'll back off the nute's until we get into the 3 gal Smart Pots. Should I back off the CalMag until I up-pot them as well - Even if I'm using RO water? PH, TDS, Temp, Humidity are all in reasonable consistencies.

A Thousand Thank You's!

Wilbur

 

[WillysMom]

WillysMom, I really appreciate your encouragement and suggestions. I will say that, outside of the slow growth, they look really healthy, so I'm just going to hang on for the ride - it is their ride after all! Yes, I will definitely add perlite in their next pot - I was thinking maybe 40% Ocean Forest, 30% plain potting soil and 30% perlite. Does this sound reasonable to you? I'll back off the nute's until we get into the 3 gal Smart Pots. Should I back off the CalMag until I up-pot them as well - Even if I'm using RO water? PH, TDS, Temp, Humidity are all in reasonable consistencies.

A Thousand Thank You's!

Wilbur

Yes, just hang on for the ride! When they get bigger and ready to up-pot, Ocean Forest is good to use (it's too strong for babies). Adding the perlite is perfect. What kind of regular potting soil are you going to add? I'm thinking it may not be necessary because Ocean Forest -should have all the nutes you need for awhile. As far as cal-mag, wait a bit. I don't see any cal-mal deficiencies, and the babies should be getting all their food they need right now.

 

[HeyWilbur]

Maybe it's not necessary to dilute the Ocean Forest. I'm a bit nute shy as I fried some seeds in fertilized soil that was too hot. They look really good today and I think I see some progress in their growth today. I'll just let them lead in the dance and marvel! ;-)

Wilbur

 

[HeyWilbur]

 

[HeyWilbur]

Are those pictures showing up for anyone?

 

[David Bowman]

Hi HeyWilbur,

I've embedded your photos for you. Personally, I use the "My Photos" button at the bottom left side of the text input window to embed photos in my posts. I hope that helps.

Greenest Regards,
David Bowman

 

[Cultivator]

Hi Wilber

Let me start by saying soil is not my speciality although i do know how to grow in it. Your grow does look slow. I doubt its the light that is the issue the 125cfl would have been strong enough to get them going for sure. I have no idea what is in your soil so difficult to comment on that.

What I would do if I were you is to coco into pure coco coir when you pot up. Technically its hydro but very similar to growing in soil in lots of ways but with much faster growth rates. Its real easy to do. But if you insist on soil make sure it has 25% perlite added for extra aeration.


I wouldn't be adding nutes at this point, id say the seedlings aren't liking something in the soil.

Putting the led on now will be fine. I start some seedlings straight under LED with no issue at all, thats providing they have enough blue spectrum.

If the run off is low bump up the ph of the water when you add it too try bring the soil to the correct level. Id also suggest adding some great white mycorrhizae when you transplant to build strong root ball, you could top feed a little now and it will likely help.

 

[HeyWilbur]

When you say top feed are you meaning mild nutes in a watering? Thank you for your input Cultivator. This is all new to me.


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[SweetSue]

Good day Wilber. I grow in a living organic soil and I'm just now playing with bottled nutes with my hempy experiment, so I know next to nothing about the soil you're growing in. I've left a message with a friend, who may be able to stop by later and offer some assistance.

Off hand, I'd say your seedlings are having a time of it growing roots in a soil with inadequate aeration. You should have 1/3 of your soil mix as some sort of aeration component, in your case I'd recommend perlite.

They're photofinishers so you don't have to be overly concerned about the time they're taking. You control when they flower, so they can veg until you're ready to flip them. They're growing roots, the very thing you want them to concentrate on. They don't need any nutes until they're about 4-5 nodes along. Your soil has some kind of fert in it, correct? If not, you'll need someone who works with bottled nutes to advise you on that. Sooner or later that person will stroll into the garden.

They look healthy. Just keep them going as you are. Breathe, they're some of the most resilient plants on the planet. I know, you're gunshy from the demise of too many seeds getting to this point, but it'll be fine. You'll see.

 

[MagicJim]

I just gave them a drink of CalMag and Big Bloom. Cut the CalMag dose in half and the Big Bloom was 1/3 dose just to be safe. Each plant got about 2/3's of a cup of the nutes. Run-off water landed a PH reading of 6.4. Let's see if this has an impact on the growth of these gals - stay tuned.

When you say top feed are you meaning mild nutes in a watering? Thank you for your input Cultivator. This is all new to me.


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High Wilbur. You probably top fed your girls with the CalMag and Big Bloom. Simply pouring water or nute mix onto the soil from the top.

I'm fairly certain you've made the right decision to give them this. The Calmag is usually high in N and I think your HD potting soil was probably deficient. You should see some change in a few days.

About pH. Just make sure the input is ~ 6.2 and adjusted after anything is added to water. Make sure tap water sits out for a day to rid it of chlorine gas. You can enhance water with an aquarium pump and an air stone to add oxygen.

I'm currently aerating my soil with a bamboo skewer because of a lack of proper turning of my soil mix.

Up potting. I'd wait until the plants' health improves. You would also like to see some visible roots at the drain holes in the bottom of your current pots.

I've grown the WW and it's a good one. At some point you may wish to add an oscillating fan to help with stem strength. Any plant growth that gets disrupted early in life may have a later effect like weak colas and branches that just can't hold up those massive buds that you're gonna grow.

 

[Pigeons420]

Hi Wilbur!

Sweetsue sent me over here because you're having some troubles. If I may, I would suggest taking a deep breath. Take a look at those girls and remind yourself that life is great and you're going to do everything possible to figure those girls out.

2nd- I know that there's a lot of information coming your way right now and that's a good thing. However, you need to make small changes at a time to ensure you don't change too much and never come to realize what the problem was.

3rd -MY DIAGNOSIS

I think it's safe to say here that these girls are over stimulated or over fed. At this young stage they don't need any nutrients until the first 3-4 weeks of seedling stage or until they 2-3 nodes (shoots) high.

Seedlings are self contained little starter packs. They don't need anything aside from moisture and TLC (tender loving care).

I don't want to be the barer of bad news but it may be too later for these girls. They're just so damn fragile at this stage. HOWEVER, if there's any plant that can rebound from something dramatic, it's cannabis.

3rd - MY SOLUTUON

I would recommend going through your garden and verifying that the temperatures are consistent, air flow is abundant and that there's no outside influences that could be compromising your seedlings. I say this because, I've been in this exact same position and it was because my temperatures varied too much. I either switched lights too early or had a cold draft come in at night and stunt everything.

I HAVE HAD SEEDLING REBOUND AT THIS STAGE.

So, don't get too worried about what happens next. Maybe consider purchasing another couple seeds to have on reserve should these ones not make it.

I wish you nothing but the best and can't wait to hear how well this all turns around for you!!



Smoke one of these my friend!

 

[Mr. Krip]

Hi Wilbur!

Sweetsue sent me over here because you're having some troubles. If I may, I would suggest taking a deep breath. Take a look at those girls and remind yourself that life is great and you're going to do everything possible to those girls out.

2nd- I know that there's a lot of information coming your way right now and that's a good thing. However, you need to make small changes at a time to ensure you don't change too much and never come to realize what the problem was.

3rd -MY DIAGNOSIS

I think it's safe to say here that these girls are over stimulated or over fed. At this young stage they don't need any nutrients until the first 3-4 weeks of seedling stage or until they 2-3 nodes (shoots) high.

Seedlings are self contained little starter packs. They don't need anything aside from moisture and TLC (tender loving care).

I don't want to be the barer of bad news but it may be too later for these girls. They're just so damn fragile at this stage. HOWEVER, if there's any plant that can rebound from something dramatic, it's cannabis.

3rd - MY SOLUTUON

I would recommend going through your garden and verifying that the temperatures are consistent, air flow is abundant and that there's no outside influences that could be compromising your seedlings. I say this because, I've been in this exact same position and it was because my temperatures varied too much. I either switched lights too early or had a cold draft come in at night and stunt everything.

I HAVE HAD SEEDLING REBOUND AT THIS STAGE.

So, don't get too worried about what happens next. Maybe consider purchasing another couple seeds to have on reserve should these ones not make it.

I wish you nothing but the best and can't wait to hear how well this all turns around for you!!



Smoke one of these my friend!

Hey there, HW! Sue sent me, too and everything P420 says I will 2nd. It's also tough to gauge from the pics how moist/dry your medium is, but Sue's point is also valid and I would make sure the top 1/4" of soil is dry before re-watering. Those size plants don't have much roots to uptake lots of moisture and they need oxygen in the soil. It looks to me like your girls might be a little water-logged. They can likely rebound, but will take some time and TLC.

For what it's worth, over-watering is the leading cause of death of plants for noobs. The tendency is to want to "baby" them and do what we can to rush them. Don't fall into that trap!

Our job as growers is really just to create an environment that will let the plant do what it wants to do naturally!

 

[Cultivator]

All good advice. Def try adding some great white mycorrhizae though. Its not a nutrient, its a bunch of bacterias that will help your roots grow. Especially good when roots may be struggling. its best to mix it into the medium but you can add to a little to water and water on top of soil.

otherwise as suggested it may be worth biting the bullet and starting from scratch. id try the mycorrhizae though, it works wonders. Then when you pot up just make sure the plant goes into weed friendly medium.

 

[HeyWilbur]

The comments, evaluations and suggestions have been abundant and most appreciated for this nooby. To address some of the concerns posted:

1. The soil is a Home Depot "Abundant Harvest" or something like that. It's a Miracle Grow product (did not realize this when I bought it). I fried some seed using a FF seedling soil that was too hot, so I went with the least intimidating packaging I could find. I suspect this soil is the culprit. I did not know any better to add perclite.

2. I don't think watering is the issue. I've been very careful to water only when dry down to one or two knuckles - about every 3-5 days and I am watering to just a bit of runoff. I am using RO water that PH's a steady 6.2. Runoff shows about 6.6 or so. I have fed nute's only once, on my last watering - 1/2 dose CalMag and 1/3 dose Big Bloom and about 2/3's cup of the mixture in each plant. They had no negative response to the feeding. I do not think they are over-fed as the stunting issue was there well before a feeding.

3. Temperature with the CFL was 79-80F consistent and since I switched to the LED it's been a solid 75F. Humidity is a steady 45-50.

4. Air flow is very good. 4" inline fan with carbon filter - oversized fan for the space (only about 29x29) so I could keep the fan on low and minimize noise floor. Also have a 6" clip on fan. Lot's of air movement and new air hitting these guys.

My thought at this point is to re-pot them in the same size containers with 1/3 ocean forest, 1/3 home depot soil mentioned above (to dilute the Ocean Forest a bit as I don't want the soil to be too hot - IS THIS A GOOD IDEA?) and 1/3 perclite. I would gently free the roots from the old soil - not completely but just enough to allow the plants to access the new mixture sooner than later - and, as carefully as I can, re-root them in the new soil mixture. I would plan to do this toward the end of today so as to give them the nighttime to acclimate - hopefully this would ease the shock. I'll also start a couple more WW seeds - I have more of them as well as some other strains from CKS (Hash Plant, Early Miss and Black Indica).

I must confess, I fancy myself as a somewhat competent gardner as I've been growing food for many years. The horses on my property give me ample supplies of incredible composted manure that does magic to soil for my veggies. But this adventure has been challenging to say the least. I killed 4 seeds straight away using a hot soil and now I can't get these guys to budge. Growing in pots is different, for sure. I have been humbled by the Widow! Please let me know your thoughts regarding my plan - is it too risky? Should I just let these guys take their course or should I bail completely and regerminate new seeds?

I love the love expressed by you all. We should all pitch in a rent a cruise ship together on the HIGH Seas! Wouldn't that be a trip?

With admiration for all,

Wilbur

 

[Pigeons420]

Ok so, it's clear you've got a good head upon those shoulders of yours. So, you deserve a pat on the back. (that's the best pat on the back I've got)

I've germinated seeds in time released mediums (miracle gro) and have had minimal issues. I think it's fair to assume that if you've added anything "extra" to the mix you've probably stunted them a bit much.

I say you've got nothing to lose trying to save them. Just keep your expectations low. I'd say throw some new beans in a controlled medium and you're laughing.

Best of luck

 

[AngryBird]

They came to your rescue
And all super advice. I still think your babies will take off. Most probably just need a "playground for the roots".. perlite..

I have some mini ones too and I didn't add perlite.

 

[HeyWilbur]

HEY ALL! I now have an Avatar! YIPPPYYY!

 

[HeyWilbur]

So tonite I'm going to re-pot the girls in the above mentioned soil mix. I'm also going to start germinating my last two WW seeds, just in case. If all goes well, I'll have four plants instead of two. I just can't sit by and do nothing while my girls are shortchanged by my naiveté.

I am Wilbur, Hear Me Roar.

Cheers and Happy Sunday everyone!

Wilbur

 

[WillysMom]

Good luck on the transplant Be gentle and don't overwater them I think it's a good call!

 

[HeyWilbur]

I transplanted my Girls late yesterday in 1/3 ocean forest, 1/3 generic potting soil and 1/3 perlite. I did not rid the roots of the old soil completely as i wanted to minimize shock. The old soil was indeed pretty moistly packed around the roots. It was clearly lacking the ability to oxygenate the roots I think. This would certainly appear to be the "root" of the problem (sorry, couldn't resist). The plants look completely unaware that they should be stressing well over twelve hours after the transplant. I'm not expecting miracles here, but as the roots reach out to the new soil I am hoping to see positive results in their growth. Hopefully by the time I up-pot them to the 3 gallon pots they will be on a good course. My wife is having knee replacement today so I'll update with pix as time allows.

Cheers all!

Wilbur


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