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The123321
Well-Known Member
Thanks. Do you use coco for it on there?
Why organic nutrients do not work in coco
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Aero808
Well-Known Member
Yep. I journalled everything in the sour diesel grow in my signature for those interested.
Feel free to share your experience. Lots of folks would like to know
You've tried the Dr Earth powders, have you tried the Dr Earth Life slow release pellets?
Maybe they won't get washed out as easily as the powders.
Maybe they won't get washed out as easily as the powders.
CBD BudMan
Well-Known Member
Hello... If I may jump-in... The BEST advice that I can give U is: Please listen to what these knowledgeable people are sharing with U. Why would U even want to "push your truck to work" like @TorturedSoul has mentioned? @Emilya is spot-on, asking us to remember that organic soil amendments require microorganism's in the soil to break-down these amendments into things that the plant can use. This is the way of our natural world. To do otherwise is much like driving against traffic on the other side of the road. It can be done, but at what cost. And when things go wrong... ?
Slicknick909
Well-Known Member
Yeah I still can't grasp the point of all this overcomplicating of growing in Coco here either. I understand the theory the OP has behind his perpetual grow, but still don't think this is the most user friendly grow method, especially when there's MegaCrop out there. I'm a big believer in the KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) method of doing things, sure you probably can grow dank herb with all these dry amendments and biotabs and whatnot, but at what cost of effort and time going into the grow? Also, will it really be THAT much better than just using a simpler system? Maybe in soil yes where the dry amendments would really kick ass, but doubtful in Coco it will really be that much of an advantage just due to the hydroponic nature of growing in Coco.
Aero808
Well-Known Member
I've had a ton of support from members on this site, and I'm super appreciative of that. But i wouldn't equate doing things differently to pushing a truck. Organic in coco flat out worked for me. It was low maintenance and inexpensive. The plants thrived. Don't know what else to say
HaremMasterOG
Well-Known Member
Still pending tale of the scale, and quality comparisons to some of the same strains from previous grows but, so far - in early week 5 of flower, I'm a believer.. after numerous successful.. yet expensive.. both in time and $.. at least, for my frugality (@1g/W) large plant, soil/bioCanna-based grows, I'm currently trying my first coco/DOA run.. Went even further, though, in this latest 'envelope pushing exercise', by experimenting with Sea-of-Green format on a sub-irrigation bed (a.k.a. SWICK.. a DIY water system - using pure water only in a reusable perlite bed).. to get away from being chained to the grow, mixing nutes and watering buckets every 2-3 days, when I can/should be doing other things.. and, doing supercropping ONLY .. to shorten the few big stretchers in the mix.. 6 different strains, from clone and seed.. significantly reducing time attending the grow and increasing the amount of time available for other things away from the grow.. picture at Fwk5.1 perhaps worth a thousand more words..
More info, here:
SWICK Watering Systems: Letting The Plant Water Itself
In the middle of my first grow I stumbled onto a thread on another site, posted by one Noobwannb, showing how to set up. SWICK. Watering system. It's essentially a wicking system that has a broad surface of wicking material in a deep basin that your pots sit on top of. The concept fired my...
www.420magazine.com
HaremMasterOG
Well-Known Member
ALL the ingredients in Gaia Green.. and many more organic and mineral specialty products.. can you say, 'insect frass', 'glacial rock dust? mycorhizzae? .. are readily available from various sources used by Living Soil growers.. e.g. Build-a-Soil, etc., etc., nothing magical in this.. only the many, many combination(s) and ratio(s) of those ingredients, as being recommended (at best), or even being evangelized about (at worst, IMO). My advice, FWIW (2cents?).. Do your research, then make your decision(s), then get on with your gardening.. always something new to consider, but no subsitute for rolling up your sleeves.
p.s. these forums are a great source of golden info, but come with the obvious downside of having to dig through the mass of suppositions and confirmation bias to find the gold.
HaremMasterOG
Well-Known Member
one does not water to run-off (top-watering) when growing in coco with dry organic slow-release amendments. Alternatively, a DIY sub-irrigation system, using only pure water (pH-adjusted, if need be) is a viable, longer interval, alternative...
SWICK Watering Systems: Letting The Plant Water Itself
In the middle of my first grow I stumbled onto a thread on another site, posted by one Noobwannb, showing how to set up. SWICK. Watering system. It's essentially a wicking system that has a broad surface of wicking material in a deep basin that your pots sit on top of. The concept fired my...
www.420magazine.com
So just to sum up what I've read in this thread.
If you\re going to follow through with your plans;
1. You need to add sufficient microbes, I don't think to much microbials will ever cause you an issue in coco.
In my soil grow I use three different microbial innouclants; miicrobialmass,RAW grow & bloom microbes.
I would add something to go along with your biotabs, probably something with a large variety of microbes. or a least a different set of bacteria than are found in your biotabs. I think the general consensus is that you'll need to add microbes more than you currently are, or at least more often since they'll be dieing quicker than in soil. Consider lowering your dosage and increasing your frequency to twice a week.
2. If you want to add biochar, It HAS to be inoculated.
Adding non inoculated biochar will have the opposite effect and actually pull your microbes away from the rhizosphere until it's reached a level of saturation. I do believe that the biochar has a place though, doing exactly as you say, providing a home for the microbes to live in. For those of you that don't know that is the main purpose of biochar, it's inert, and doesn't decompose. It is NOT potash and won't give you the issues Emilya suggested. One of the issues brought up is the low cation exchange capacity of coco, and biochar appears to me to be a direct solution to that issue.
3. You'll also want to use water soluble organic nutrients, either in the form of compost tea's or bottled organic nutrients. This is really just going to ensure that, even if your plants aren't getting the all the nutrients they need from the microbial interactions, they'll get it directly at least at the time of application.
One thing about your staggered harvest game plan that I don't think you've considered.
How are you going to maintain an even canopy height? Do you have 3 lights to hang at different heights for each stagger in the grow? This is a challenge i'm currently dealing with in my auto grow of 2 different strains.
If you\re going to follow through with your plans;
1. You need to add sufficient microbes, I don't think to much microbials will ever cause you an issue in coco.
In my soil grow I use three different microbial innouclants; miicrobialmass,RAW grow & bloom microbes.
I would add something to go along with your biotabs, probably something with a large variety of microbes. or a least a different set of bacteria than are found in your biotabs. I think the general consensus is that you'll need to add microbes more than you currently are, or at least more often since they'll be dieing quicker than in soil. Consider lowering your dosage and increasing your frequency to twice a week.
2. If you want to add biochar, It HAS to be inoculated.
Adding non inoculated biochar will have the opposite effect and actually pull your microbes away from the rhizosphere until it's reached a level of saturation. I do believe that the biochar has a place though, doing exactly as you say, providing a home for the microbes to live in. For those of you that don't know that is the main purpose of biochar, it's inert, and doesn't decompose. It is NOT potash and won't give you the issues Emilya suggested. One of the issues brought up is the low cation exchange capacity of coco, and biochar appears to me to be a direct solution to that issue.
3. You'll also want to use water soluble organic nutrients, either in the form of compost tea's or bottled organic nutrients. This is really just going to ensure that, even if your plants aren't getting the all the nutrients they need from the microbial interactions, they'll get it directly at least at the time of application.
One thing about your staggered harvest game plan that I don't think you've considered.
How are you going to maintain an even canopy height? Do you have 3 lights to hang at different heights for each stagger in the grow? This is a challenge i'm currently dealing with in my auto grow of 2 different strains.
I was thinking of adding organics to coco and wrote Fox Farm about it and these are exerts from the email,
Coco Loco Potting Mix is a rich blend of aged forest products, triple washed coco coir, perlite, and a ton of organic and natural nutrition to feed your plants for the first 2-3 weeks. Due to the addition of the coco coir, this mix tends to hold more water than peat-based medias, making it an excellent choice for dry, arid areas!
Coco Loco comes amended with dolomite lime, which provides calcium and magnesium, is triple-washed, and pH adjusted right out of the bag, so it’s ready to go without any extra effort on your part!
I was thinking of using DrE Bud and Bloom but I haven't experimented yet.
Coco Loco Potting Mix is a rich blend of aged forest products, triple washed coco coir, perlite, and a ton of organic and natural nutrition to feed your plants for the first 2-3 weeks. Due to the addition of the coco coir, this mix tends to hold more water than peat-based medias, making it an excellent choice for dry, arid areas!
Coco Loco comes amended with dolomite lime, which provides calcium and magnesium, is triple-washed, and pH adjusted right out of the bag, so it’s ready to go without any extra effort on your part!
I was thinking of using DrE Bud and Bloom but I haven't experimented yet.
Dragoond2
Well-Known Member
It really all comes down to what works for you. Experiment with different stuff change things that don't work for you until you find what does. It may not even be coco you may find soil works best for your grow style. I have failed so much but learned from it all and all the nice knowledgeable people here.
Triple R
Well-Known Member
I don't know a lot about it but have you ever seen Me. Cannuk on you tube? He grows in Coco with nothing but dry release fertz. And his outcome is amazing. I watch all his videos and learn a lot. His are better than the average how to grow vids. His seed to harvest should answer a lot of questions about this subject
There is one way to make basic charcoal; using fire and depriving the burning material of oxygen to prevent the complete combustion of what is called the biomass. Level of the temperatures and the amount of oxygen allowed during the process seems to be what determines which of the 3 basic charcoals are produced.
There is the charcoal used for cooking, heating and as a fuel. That is also the type of charcoal that shows up in the wood ashes in a fireplace or campfire and seems to be the type used for fertilizing soil. To much of this type applied to soils can cause problems with high levels of P & K, especially the K (Potassiums).
Then there is the charcoal that is called BioChar. This one is produced by higher temperature fires and less oxygen. The result is less ash and a charcoal that is hard and still porous with a lot of cavities or interior spaces and a lot of surface area. It is a perfect material for the soil micro-organisms to colonize. Even with the amount of study done on this type of charcoal the researchers cannot figure out how long it lasts. It is inert and does not decompose. Some studies have noticed that when first applied/mixed into the soil it does release some P & K plus carbon and carbon dioxide. However, not for any long periods or in large amounts. Certainly not in the amounts as from the first type of charcoal.
The third type of charcoal is what is called activated charcoal or activated carbon. That is the type of charcoal that is used for water and air filters. It is also finely ground and is used for absorbing poisons which were ingested.
This is what has worked for the plants in my perpetual flowering cabinet. The lights are mounted at the same height. When I put the next set of plants into the cabinet they are placed on blocks and elevated so that they are within a productive distance from the lights. As the plants grow taller I can remove some of the blocks lowering the plant and keeping that plants canopy within what I feel is the optimum distance from the light.
Sometimes, by the time the plant is going to be harvested, I have pulled all of the blocks and the pot of soil is sitting on the floor of the cabinet.
Enjoy the day.
I would add some some good compost and use some megacrop
fertilizer,you can use it in hydro or soil.
MEGA CROP – Greenleaf Nutrients
greenleafnutrients.com
This grow uses a combination of compost and hydro with fish.
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The123321
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Thanks. I am a little over 2 weeks into the grow and the plant that has the biochar in the pot does look better. What do you think about biochar that is pre charged vs the raw biochar that is not loaded with microbes on there?
Emilya Green
Well-Known Member
never used either so I don't really know... but knowing what I know about your grow, you need all the microbes you can get.
