The Challenge: Cardboard Flowering Box

[SurfBuddy]

But with the new light, I really *have to* do this because I can't take pics and get accurate color with the Sun blazing in there!

Excuses, excuses LOL

 

[jandre2k3]

Hey... If I can validate my opening 10 minutes to 7, it's all for the better! Besides, would you like to see pictures like this

Or like this:

I leave it to you to decide...

 

[BCBudd]

Excuses, excuses LOL

Hehe you took the words right outta my mouth.

 

[OldMedMan]

They look beautiful jandre......show em off!

 

[SurfBuddy]

I want B, no HPS photos, regardless of when you take them

 

[sfttailpaul]

Hey... If I can validate my opening 10 minutes to 7, it's all for the better! Besides, would you like to see pictures like this

Or like this:

I leave it to you to decide...

Oh the first one is the bestest! I used to have to peek in and acted like ya' did, like the plants can't be left alone. The best part is when I would come in and look at the plants and notice how much some had grown over night. Literally saw 3-4" growth since I last looked in on them. I have finally dulled out to the miracle, and have become desensitized, knowing what to expect. Then this becomes more of a job. Although I still marvel at the vigor some plants show...

 

[SurfBuddy]

Fun job though

 

[jandre2k3]

Oh the first one is the bestest! I used to have to peek in and acted like ya' did, like the plants can't be left alone. The best part is when I would come in and look at the plants and notice how much some had grown over night. Literally saw 3-4" growth since I last looked in on them. I have finally dulled out to the miracle, and have become desensitized, knowing what to expect. Then this becomes more of a job. Although I still marvel at the vigor some plants show...

I don't *have to* peek in. The first night of flower is always kinda stressful for me because the cabinet is completely closed up, and I stress about rising RH... I know my hygrometer has a memory, and I can just check it when lights come on for the peak RH through the nigh, but still sometimes the first night they're locked up makes me a bit itchy, y'know?

Fun job though

Indeed!

 

[jandre2k3]

CLONING TEST MATRIX
and
TEST CONCLUSION
​

Conditions:

• Lighting: 2x 6500K CFL Grow lights under reflective hood, 24/0 cycle, 8" above tops
• Humidity: 95% - 98%
• Temp: 85F
• Nutrients: None
• Rooting Hormone: None
• Rooting Medium: Prepared Rockwool
• Strains Used:

1. 
   [*=1]Green Fluffy Bunnies
   [*=1]Lamb's Bread
   [*=1]Plushberry
   [*=1]Purple Mr. Nice
   [*=1]Purple Widow

Initial condition of mother plants in this test was judged as healthy. Conditions were not optimal for the procedure but were deemed favorable, and it was decided that the test would continue. There were no infestations, infections, or other signs of poor health. Mother plants were Nitrogen starved before the beginning of this test, so there were signs that N was needed quickly. This observation in the mother plants coupled with favorable atmospheric conditions for cloning, led to the decision that the experiment would begin.

Test cuttings were taken on 08-04-2012 at 9:17pm. The only variable for this test is that rooting hormone was not used when placing the cuttings in prepared rockwool. This was done in order to find if rooting time had been lengthened by the rooting hormone itself.

Cuttings made: 36

• 10 Lamb's Bread
• 07 Purple Mr. Nice
• 07 Purple Widow
• 06 Plushberry
• 06 Green Fluffy Bunnies

Purpose:
The purpose of this test was to find the fastest means of rooting in rockwool, and this test is one part of that end goal.


Prediction:
The prediction was that many would fail to root, if any, and this would be after the given 7-day limit.


Procedure:
Everything was sterilized to give the clones the best possible chance of survival and to keep infection to a minimum. Cloning tray and dome were treated with a sanitizer at 100ppm chlorine solution. All cutting, storing, and other contact surfaces were also treated with the same. The jandre2k3 process for cloning was followed as in Cloning: Mad Simple - A Beginner's Guide with the exception of the rooting hormone.


Observations:
Initial condition of cuttings was very good and no problems arose during the processing of cutting, preparing, and placing in rockwool, and those rockwool cubes placed into a humidity dome.

Although precautions were taken to avoid infection and infestation, 1 of the Purple Mr. Nice cuttings was covered in fungus on the stem, from plant base above the rockwool (not below) and to about halfway up, and all nodules in between becoming involved.


Result
Cuttings were checked on 08-12-2012 at 8:19am.
Total time of test: 7 days, 11 hours, 2 minutes

Rooting was observed in some of the cuttings, but not all for them. Although some rooting was achieved within the time limit, most failed to root at all, or even show nodules, or beginnings of roots. Even the lenticels present on some of the cuttings, failed to form even the beginnings of roots. Of the original 36 cuttings made, only 9 formed roots, and will become plants themselves, ending in only 25% rooting success. The biggest surprise was that all of the Purple Mr. Nice clones not infected with fungus rooted, ending in 85% rooting success. All of the Lamb's Bread cuttings failed to root at all ending in 100% loss.

Rooting Success:

• 1 Green Fluffy Bunnies Clone - GFB
• 1 Plush Berry Kush Clone - PBK
• 6 Purple Mr Nice Clone - PMN
• 1 Purple Widow Clone - P.Wid
• 0 Lamb's Bread Clone - LamBrd

Conclusion:
With the failures in mind, it was proven that rooting can be achieved in rockwool with limited success. To the contrary, in previous tests, rooting hormone, has been proven to reduce losses in rooting when attempted in rockwool, as compared to this test. Whether it lengthens the time for rooting has been shown here that it does not. Rather, the presence of the hormone improves the success rate of cuttings that would not have rooted in the given time of seven days. Furthermore, those cuttings that would not have grown roots at all from 7 to 10 days, it seems that rooting hormone helps reduce those losses as well.

Further testing is required on the strains that failed to root in 7 days to find if they would indeed root within a 7-14 day window.

The question, now, is would those cuttings that are encouraged to grow roots by rooting hormone be as strong as those cuttings that grow roots themselves without the help of a hormone?

 

[sfttailpaul]

I want B, no HPS photos, regardless of when you take them

There has to be a filter we can use to take photos with the HPS lights on. I am in San Jose, CA where we have a huge telescope that some rich guy donated to the government around the turn of the last century (1900's). The entire city uses HPS street lights (yes, I've thought about baskets hanging from every street light, LOL). This is to be able to filter that one light spectrum out, so the Astronomers could still see out at night. The entire city is under a haze of that orange/yellow spectrum. Perhaps that's why my hair grows so much at night! Anyway, Jandre2k3, they're sure lookin' super great!!!

 

[jandre2k3]

There has to be a filter we can use to take photos with the HPS lights on. I am in San Jose, CA where we have a huge telescope that some rich guy donated to the government around the turn of the last century (1900's). The entire city uses HPS street lights (yes, I've thought about baskets hanging from every street light, LOL). This is to be able to filter that one light spectrum out, so the Astronomers could still see out at night. The entire city is under a haze of that orange/yellow spectrum. Perhaps that's why my hair grows so much at night! Anyway, Jandre2k3, they're sure lookin' super great!!!

hehehe, Thank you for that... I don't think they look all that great, but, I'm glad they look good to y'all. I guess it's one of those times that I'm my own worst critic.

 

[OldMedMan]

Hi Jandre. About the Cloning Test.

Well done my friend. You should be in a lab somewhere. Based on reading many comparable ways of cloning, you did a fine job. The fact that only one strain did not root was not what I expected. Bravo.

You stated that you thought that using a cloning solution would somehow make the cuttings be weaker. Why is that? Since I never clone, I would use all the help that I could get. Just nosy.

 

[jandre2k3]

Hi Jandre. About the Cloning Test.

Well done my friend. You should be in a lab somewhere. Based on reading many comparable ways of cloning, you did a fine job. The fact that only one strain did not root was not what I expected. Bravo.

You stated that you thought that using a cloning solution would somehow make the cuttings be weaker. Why is that? Since I never clone, I would use all the help that I could get. Just nosy.

HEY OMM! I'm sorry, I didn't intend to imply that rooting hormone would make the cuttings weaker. What I meant to say was that I think that maybe a weaker cutting that I would possibly cull, might be forced to root because of the hormone, and because of that might not turn out to be as vigorous as I would like. I have noticed several cuttings, while making my clone army to drive the SOG, that under perform and lack that "oomph" like I'm looking for in a clone.

What I'm thinking, here, is that maybe if I stop using rooting hormone altogether, I will start off with the strongest cuttings from the gate, and have to selectively cull less when it comes time to transfer to the box. This is an exciting prospect for me because I tend to try to baby those that have stalled and take up precious space in K-8 (veg bin), instead of devoting that space to the strongest and most vigorous. If I could force myself to accept the fact that, either I need to better my method of cutting, or to stop nursing along under performers, I think I would have better success in the box when it comes time to harvest.

 

[OldMedMan]

HEY OMM! I'm sorry, I didn't intend to imply that rooting hormone would make the cuttings weaker. What I meant to say was that I think that maybe a weaker cutting that I would possibly cull, might be forced to root because of the hormone, and because of that might not turn out to be as vigorous as I would like. I have noticed several cuttings, while making my clone army to drive the SOG, that under perform and lack that "oomph" like I'm looking for in a clone.

What I'm thinking, here, is that maybe if I stop using rooting hormone altogether, I will start off with the strongest cuttings from the gate, and have to selectively cull less when it comes time to transfer to the box. This is an exciting prospect for me because I tend to try to baby those that have stalled and take up precious space in K-8 (veg bin), instead of devoting that space to the strongest and most vigorous. If I could force myself to accept the fact that, either I need to better my method of cutting, or to stop nursing along under performers, I think I would have better success in the box when it comes time to harvest.

Arrrrgg Me Hearty! I see where your going. Can you bring yourself to expel the not so hardy ones? Nursing them along is your usual way. Self discipline my good man!
It seems unholy to kill one that might make it, fight your instincts and kill it. Only the best should be left.

 

[jandre2k3]

THE BEGINNINGS SUCCESS!! Those that had stalled in the box are starting to come around... BID with his BIG suggestion that caused a DUH moment for me about the SuperThrive foliar spray got my plants heading in the right direction... Although I did cull a PBK from the box because it was just too far gone. Most of SideB plants are now greening up more and pistils are starting to show all around. Even the purple widow has started moving in parts and has put out 1/2" pistils in places. They all got another ST Foliar Spray tonight, and I will check on them tomorrow night to see how we're progressing

BigIrishDoode, I owe you a BigIrishDrink and a BigFatDoob if ever we meet.

 

[jandre2k3]

Test 3 Complete

Totals Recap

Purple Mr. Nice

Main Plant = 14.2g
​

Shitz&Gigulz = 4.9g
​

TOTAL 19.1g (0.67oz)


Jandre Kush

Harvest 1:​

2.25oz smoke​

5g Grade "A" hash (73 micron bag) dark yellow in color
​

9g Grade "B" hash (160 micron bag) yellowish-green color
​

Harvest 2

75g smoke​

9g Grade "A" hash (73 micron bag) dark yellow in color​

12g Grade "B" hash (160 micron bag) yellowish-green color
​

Harvest 3

18.25g smoke
​

Harvest 4

28.5g smoke​

Harvest 3 and 4 combined​

6g Grade "A" hash (73 micron bag) dark yellow in color​

8g Grade "B" hash (160 micron bag) yellowish-green color


​

jandre Kush Total:
185.75g (6.5oz) total for jandre Kush
20g Grade "A" hash (73 micron bag) dark yellow in color
29g Grade "B" hash (160 micron bag) yellowish-green color

7.17 oz in a 2x4x4 box.... and that's with MITE DAMAGE...
0.71 oz Grade "A" hash (73 micron bag) dark yellow in color
1.07 oz Grade "B" hash (160 micron bag) yellowish-green color

Arguably, the hash total would have been lower if the sparse growth hadn't happened during the infestation, and following treatment.

I could feasibly say that 9-12 oz per box would be the norm in an SOG-type run. Although it takes a little timing, better than I showed, it's a lot easier than everyone else makes it out to be. Sure, I have an automatic watering system set up, and all my lights and fans are on timers, but basically, I only watched them for 2 months with the exception of the 22/45 defoliation.


The 400w HPS performed considerably better than the previous set-up, and I will now go on record as saying:

"HPS by far outweighs the HO T5 in all respects when considering a cannabis growing operation."

The heat output is relatively the same as stacking several HO T5 to get the same lumen/PAR output as a HPS. The only conceivable advantage to stacking T5's is that they can be bought separately ($30 Each 24" fixture) as single fixtures over an extended time, for less than the initial set-up of a HPS rig ($200 for an okay rig), but in the end, you will end up paying a lot more to equal the same strength as the HPS. Also, once you add several HO T5's to get the same Lumen/PAR output as a HPS, your wattage (24w for 24" and 54w for 48" EACH!!!) will be MUCH higher.

"Math!" you say?
24w HO T5 lumen output 1,880
400w HPS lumen output 55,000

To equal just the lumen output, you'd need 30 HO T5's . . . 55,000 divide 1,880 equals 29.25531914893617
Now 30 lights x 24w each equals a whopping 720 watts.

So you'd need and EXTRA 320 watts from the T5 to equal the same output from the HPS.... Need I say more??

That said, if you wish use T5's, you will eventually pay for it in the end in sub-par flower and bud production, and the reduced potency of the THC in what trichomes are created if you stopped adding T5's at 400w, and higher electricity bills by adding T5's to get the same output as a 400w HPS.





The added CO2 received in the transition and early flower(stopped after week 7 as per instructions), really added bulk and strength to the stems. The flowers, however, I noticed very little, if any difference. Since the flowers mature in the final weeks of flower, and therefore received no enrichment in the final stages, there really is no way that it really could have helped much. I can say that CO2 Enrichment did add to the health, and overall vigor of the plants treated. I also noticed a more dense stacking of nodes during the growth in flower, and a lot more flower sites than the previous runs without CO2.

 

[jandre2k3]

Update Highlight:

84.5 days VEG tracking Green Kush Bunnies - GKB




Don't have a whole lot of time, so just a quick pick update. This is a little weird only having two plants to update... so here they are.

Color's a little off because I didn't have time to set up the light properly.

Anyway, here they are.




Side A:



Side B:

 

[Lurch Farmer]

Dude wow, you come along way . I been following ya from the start.
I have a question for you but first.............
I would like to dispose of the round 3 and 5 gal buckets I am using and replace them with 10 gal tote. 1-2 plants each lst/scrog
I intend to run a 60 day veg then what ever the lady needs for flower.Lst from the get go to be approximately 4 - 6" tall but create a 2x2-4x4 canopy
In your opinion would the ebb n flow you use be enough room for a 120+ day grow ?

 

[jandre2k3]

Dude wow, you come along way . I been following ya from the start.
I have a question for you but first.............
I would like to dispose of the round 3 and 5 gal buckets I am using and replace them with 10 gal tote. 1-2 plants each lst/scrog
I intend to run a 60 day veg then what ever the lady needs for flower.Lst from the get go to be approximately 4 - 6" tall but create a 2x2-4x4 canopy
In your opinion would the ebb n flow you use be enough room for a 120+ day grow ?

The Ebb & Flow I use is in the Cardboard Flower Box enough to support 2 plants veg/flower for an entire year. These 2 bustubs each are 19x15x6 (in inches) so in total you're looking at 1710 in³. 1 Gallon [Fluid, US] = 231 Cubic Inches so 1710/231= 7.4 USGal. in volume, and there are two of those tubs in the box. so 15 Gal total volume to hold 2 plants (In a ScrOG configuration).

Does that answer your question?


good question, btw...+rep

 

[Lurch Farmer]

yes it does sir
if you were to look at lurch #3 you can see the first use of the totes I plan on using.